Allison Baden-Clay - GENERAL DISCUSSION THREAD #36

[Maigret]

What do we really know about the BC family's relationship with TM and particularly knowledge about GBC's and TM's long term affair? I feel I don't have much info on this at all.

Someone said they had seen that they had photos of GBC and TM together on OW's Facebook

 

[minni]

What do we really know about the BC family's relationship with TM and particularly knowledge about GBC's and TM's long term affair? I feel I don't have much info on this at all.

I think we have heard she went to family bbq's. I think she was on facebook in photos, cleaning up at the seniors after the floods jan 2011. IMO they knew and have known for well over a year.

 

[enthralled]

Hi enthralled, I know what you mean - this is also my first time on a forum and I think perhaps this is the same for many of us here. There is just something about Allison that has brought us all here. I think about her every single day as I'm going about my daily routine - I can't explain it. But yes, it takes time and experience to discern how these forums work! Hopefully by the time I write this someone has assisted you with the photos

Hi Thinking, nice to know I am not the only novice.

Thank you Mani for posting those threads for the pics.

The pics of Little Ugly Creek really made me squirm. Sounds really silly but I felt like the hairs on the back of my neck stood up on those particular pics. If gbc did this (which I am sure he did) and if he did put her in that creek I hope he rots in hell.

Makara your tribute was absolutely beautiful. I think if Allison and her Grandmother can see it from where they are they must be very touched. Thank you

 

[enthralled]

This case surprised me in that she managed single handedly to get him downstairs, into the back of her station wagon and dump him in the neighbours field.

It is amazing how strong we can get when pumped with adrenalin. I remember once, when I was furious with my ex, picking up a four burner bbq and putting it in the back of my car. When I had got home and calmed down I couldnt lift it out of the back of the car. I am by no means an Amazon and it amazes me still to this day that I could pick it up and put in the back of the station wagon.

 

[Mani]

Hi Thinking, nice to know I am not the only novice.

Thank you Mani for posting those threads for the pics.

The pics of Little Ugly Creek really made me squirm. Sounds really silly but I felt like the hairs on the back of my neck stood up on those particular pics. If gbc did this (which I am sure he did) and if he did put her in that creek I hope he rots in hell.

Makara your tribute was absolutely beautiful. I think if Allison and her Grandmother can see it from where they are they must be very touched. Thank you

Thank you Enthalled - the culvert at the Little Ugly Creek had my hair standing on end too. MOO

 

[alioop]

TM was part of the century 21 team for a while and could have been close to all the BC's because of that association. We don't know if GBC's family knew they were having a long term affair or if they did, when did they find out. He was able to keep it secret from Allison for years it seems.

I think we have heard she went to family bbq's. I think she was on facebook in photos, cleaning up at the seniors after the floods jan 2011. IMO they knew and have known for well over a year.

 

[minni]

This case surprised me in that she managed single handedly to get him downstairs, into the back of her station wagon and dump him in the neighbours field.

It is amazing how strong we can get when pumped with adrenalin. I remember once, when I was furious with my ex, picking up a four burner bbq and putting it in the back of my car. When I had got home and calmed down I couldnt lift it out of the back of the car. I am by no means an Amazon and it amazes me still to this day that I could pick it up and put in the back of the station wagon.

haha I can just imagine it, "fine! do what you want, but Im taking the barbie! my mum gave it to us, so its mine!! (stamps foot)

 

[Maigret]

Hi Thinking, nice to know I am not the only novice.

Thank you Mani for posting those threads for the pics.

The pics of Little Ugly Creek really made me squirm. Sounds really silly but I felt like the hairs on the back of my neck stood up on those particular pics. If gbc did this (which I am sure he did) and if he did put her in that creek I hope he rots in hell.

Makara your tribute was absolutely beautiful. I think if Allison and her Grandmother can see it from where they are they must be very touched. Thank you

The pics of Kholo bridge made the hairs on my arms stand up

 

[Thinking]

That would definitely be him then. He looked strongish and fit for someone his age, though not that muscular, more wirey. I was getting confused when people said he looked frail.

Hi nads, I feel bad because I keep repeating this and people are probably tired of reading it - but to reassure you, when I saw Nigelaine in June at the shops (Mt Ommaney for locals - and yes, there was a hearing aid in his left ear but I can't vouch for his right) I was also taken by his height and he didn't appear frail to me - I walked behind them for a few minutes. I thought he looked in good condition for his age too.

 

[minni]

TM was part of the century 21 team for a while and could have been close to all the BC's because of that association. We don't know if GBC's family knew they were having a long term affair or if they did, when did they find out. He was able to keep it secret from Allison for years it seems.

No we cant possibly know any of the dynamics of any of their relationships. We don't know whether GBC dotes on OW, or whether he looks upon her as an annoying sister. We don't klnow whether he has any type of relationship with his brother. Or if they are close and talk regularly. We don't know whether EBC is the matriach, or NBC is the ruler. We dont know whether GBC doesnt make a decision without talking to mummy or daddy, or whether their lives are suitably separate (from the info I have gleaned online, they are pretty deeply embedded in his life)

Basically, we can only assume. But, personally, I think they knew.

 

[Maigret]

No we cant possibly know any of the dynamics of any of their relationships. We don't know whether GBC dotes on OW, or whether he looks upon her as an annoying sister. We don't klnow whether he has any type of relationship with his brother. Or if they are close and talk regularly. We don't know whether EBC is the matriach, or NBC is the ruler. We dont know whether GBC doesnt make a decision without talking to mummy or daddy, or whether their lives are suitably separate (from the info I have gleaned online, they are pretty deeply embedded in his life)

Basically, we can only assume. But, personally, I think they knew.

The fact that they moved to be in close proximity says heaps

 

[Fly on the Wall]

Evening everyone. I just wanted to say thank you for all your posts. Even though nothing is happening in the media with this case, it is always lovely to come on here & read people's thoughts. I am very busy workwise being post Financial year end, so appreciate the distraction at the end of a long day to unwind.

 

[enthralled]

I watched it a month or two ago. She had her washing machine going when detectives arrived at 10pm that night.
She tied his shoe laces from standing in front of him (timmy, you'll love that one!), so they were backwards, she dressed him after she killed him, some of his scalp I think was inside his shirt.
She was the one with money, and she found out he wanted a divorce, found out how much alimony she was going to have to pay, ($50,000 a year I think) so she thought, bugger that, and killed him. When the tranq didnt work, she hammered him to death.

This case surprised me in that she managed single handedly to get him downstairs, into the back of her station wagon and dump him in the neighbours field. I watched this at the time I was heavily pushing the theory that GBC may have gone to Kenmore to temporarily dump Allison and or blankets in the industrial bins. There was a fairly unanimous NO from most sleuthers, and most of it was because he couldnt get her in and out of the bin...too heavy. This case told me otherwise.

haha I can just imagine it, "fine! do what you want, but Im taking the barbie! my mum gave it to us, so its mine!! (stamps foot)

Not quite the way it happened but you had me laughing. thank you :floorlaugh::floorlaugh::floorlaugh::floorlaugh::floorlaugh:

 

[Woof]

Someone said they had seen that they had photos of GBC and TM together on OW's Facebook

The photos of TM at the cleanup were removed from OW's FB page immediately after TM was outed as GBC' mistress.

MOO

 

[Woodstock]

From minni: “This case surprised me in that she managed single handedly to get him downstairs, into the back of her station wagon and dump him in the neighbours field. I watched this at the time I was heavily pushing the theory that GBC may have gone to Kenmore to temporarily dump Allison and or blankets in the industrial bins. There was a fairly unanimous NO from most sleuthers, and most of it was because he couldnt get her in and out of the bin...too heavy. This case told me otherwise.”

From enthralled: ”It is amazing how strong we can get when pumped with adrenalin. I remember once, when I was furious with my ex, picking up a four burner bbq and putting it in the back of my car. When I had got home and calmed down I couldnt lift it out of the back of the car. I am by no means an Amazon and it amazes me still to this day that I could pick it up and put in the back of the station wagon.”

Thanks minni and enthralled, this is interesting. I wonder how long an adrenalin rush lasts – any ideas, Dr Watson or other professionals? Did GBC manage to kill Allison, load her into the Captiva, temporarily dump her somewhere, and then run out of steam (and ideas) and have to make the self-incriminating FaceTime call to NBC?

The fact that the call that the prosecution has mentioned lasted only 1min23sec continues to puzzle me. I know it’s a bloke-to-bloke call that will be much shorter than my typical girly conversations, but assuming it was a call for help is this enough time (however quickly he spoke) for GBC say what has happened, persuade NBC to participate in a hugely risky rescue operation, and work out how and where to meet? Or did GBC say the minimum possible to get NBC to come out? Wouldn't NBC want to know quite a bit about what he was getting involved in before coming out in the middle of the night? (This also assumes that NBC answered the call himself; some Websleuthers have speculated that someone else in the house may have taken the call because NBC wears a hearing aid, and this scenario raises questions about who else knew what, and when, and what other calls may have been made that night.)

 

[minni]

Thanks minni and enthralled, this is interesting. I wonder how long an adrenalin rush lasts – any ideas, Dr Watson or other professionals? Did GBC manage to kill Allison, load her into the Captiva, temporarily dump her somewhere, and then run out of steam (and ideas) and have to make the self-incriminating FaceTime call to NBC?

The fact that the call that the prosecution has mentioned lasted only 1min23sec continues to puzzle me. I know it’s a bloke-to-bloke call that will be much shorter than my typical girly conversations, but assuming it was a call for help is this enough time (however quickly he spoke) for GBC say what has happened, persuade NBC to participate in a hugely risky rescue operation, and work out how and where to meet? Or did GBC say the minimum possible to get NBC to come out? Wouldn't NBC want to know quite a bit about what he was getting involved in before coming out in the middle of the night? (This also assumes that NBC answered the call himself; some Websleuthers have speculated that someone else in the house may have taken the call because NBC wears a hearing aid, and this scenario raises questions about who else knew what, and when, and what other calls may have been made that night.)

Woodstock, I think this is right on the money here.

The roundabout is a crucial piece of evidence for QPS.
Imagine NBC's state of mind, having been woken in the middle of the night to meet his son at the Village carpark, with the body of his daughter in law. I too might go for a walk, then sit down and rest my head in my hands. :what: far out, it would take a minute to collect yourself I imagine.

because we dont know if evidence was ever collected from bins and have never heard anything like that, maybe he went with the intention of using the bins, couldnt manage it, or hesitated and rang dad?


Possibly it happened like this:

GBC drives to Kenmore with the intention of dumping her, but not thinking clearly at all, mostly just erratic frantic adrenalin based panic. He has to call his father because he cant get the chains off to get into the car park, and needs bolt cutters. the phone call might have been a bit hysterical which would have NBC coming, even if he was unaware exactly what was going on. Once there, NBC could have seen what happened, walked for a bit and sat for a bit, calmed down, thought it through and then taken over. this is why he could have sat at the bus stop. ( when things are going crazy at my house, I ALWAYS have to go for a walk, or lock myself in my room, because I cant think with all the distraction), so same thing for most people I guess?
NBC could (and should) have discarded the bin idea as stupid.

I like this idea because it ties in the roundabout, NBC cradling his head at the bus stop, the facetime call, and the searching of NBC's garden shed.

It also links the chain theory, which may or may not have any part in this, but I was told the Coles trolley boy recorded that into his log book. (Not Indro's trolley boy, but another) could be fact or rumour, just what I heard.

 

[Mani]

Woodstock, I think this is right on the money here.

The roundabout is a crucial piece of evidence for QPS.
Imagine NBC's state of mind, having been woken in the middle of the night to meet his son at the Village carpark, with the body of his daughter in law. I too might go for a walk, then sit down and rest my head in my hands. :what: far out, it would take a minute to collect yourself I imagine.

because we dont know if evidence was ever collected from bins and have never heard anything like that, maybe he went with the intention of using the bins, couldnt manage it, or hesitated and rang dad?


Possibly it happened like this:

GBC drives to Kenmore with the intention of dumping her, but not thinking clearly at all, mostly just erratic frantic adrenalin based panic. He has to call his father because he cant get the chains off to get into the car park, and needs bolt cutters. the phone call might have been a bit hysterical which would have NBC coming, even if he was unaware exactly what was going on. Once there, NBC could have seen what happened, walked for a bit and sat for a bit, calmed down, thought it through and then taken over. this is why he could have sat at the bus stop. ( when things are going crazy at my house, I ALWAYS have to go for a walk, or lock myself in my room, because I cant think with all the distraction), so same thing for most people I guess?
NBC could (and should) have discarded the bin idea as stupid.

I like this idea because it ties in the roundabout, NBC cradling his head at the bus stop, the facetime call, and the searching of NBC's garden shed.

It also links the chain theory, which may or may not have any part in this, but I was told the Coles trolley boy recorded that into his log book. (Not Indro's trolley boy, but another) could be fact or rumour, just what I heard.

Min, I have had a problem wondering why the BCs would go anywhere near a shopping centre as so many shops now have cameras on the outside and the BCs would run the risk of being caught on camera. NBC at the bus stop has equally banjaxed me as it seems so exposed and would draw attention (and it did) late on a night when your DIL has gone missing - so not a good look.

However, you make a good point about adrenaline and together with panic - rational thinking may well have been the furthest thing from GBCs mind.
We are all trying to figure out things from our 'unpanicked' rational minds, so we are not in the same position as he was on that night and that is the problem (well it is for me) as we can't think like him - we have not just committed murder.......MOO

So maybe all bets are off and he did do some stupid things that had the probability of placing him late at night/in the wee hours of the next morning at places that he shouldn't have been. This goes against my thinking of him acting secretive and trying to be as invisible as possible so as not to be seen - however that is coming from a rational mind, not one that is in a flat panic! So you might have a good point regarding the adrenaline.

IMO

 

[minni]

Min, I have had a problem wondering why the BCs would go anywhere near a shopping centre as so many shops now have cameras on the outside and the BCs would run the risk of being caught on camera. NBC at the bus stop has equally banjaxed me as it seems so exposed and would draw attention (and it did) late on a night when your DIL has gone missing - so not a good look.

However, you make a good point about adrenaline and together with panic - rational thinking may well have been the furthest thing from GBCs mind.
We are all trying to figure out things from our 'unpanicked' rational minds, so we are not in the same position as he was on that night and that is the problem (well it is for me) as we can't think like him - we have not just committed murder.......MOO

So maybe all bets are off and he did do some stupid things that had the probability of placing him late at night/in the wee hours of the next morning at places that he shouldn't have been. This goes against my thinking of acting secretive and trying to be as invisible as possible so as not to be seen - however that is coming from a rational mind, not one that is in a flat panic!

IMO

Exactly Mani, I watch a lot of crime shows, and the amazing thing about a lot of them is just how stupid these people are. Now, maybe they aren't always stupid, but in the aftermath of murdering someone (not so much with premeditated murder as they have at least thought it through for some time, but in an act of rage) they make rash decisions in the spur of the moment when there is adrenalin, fear, excitement, panic etc coursing through their body. They just arent thinking on a normal level at all.

So the reports of the prado (i think) driving erratically down brookfield rod, the facecall the going to the roundabout (which seems so stupid to us at first glance) all makes sense to me.

 

[frustrated detective]

It seems incredible that only four months ago GBC had so much of what really matters in life and then, alegedly, he deliberately destroyed all of that by stealing the gift of life from Allison.

This begs the question, why? The only answer I can come up with is simply greed. Not being satisfied with what he had and wanting more.

Then inevitably came the bad decisions to try and feed the greed.

All so pathetic and pointless. One wonders, if he had succeeded in his goals (whatever they were exactly) would he ever have felt satisfied. I doubt it. No doubt he would still have hankered for more and made more bad decisions to try to get more.

I wonder what his goals are now? If he had been able to value what he had, this whole tragedy would never have happened.

 

[Nads]

It seems incredible that only four months ago GBC had so much of what really matters in life and then, alegedly, he deliberately destroyed all of that by stealing the gift of life from Allison.

This begs the question, why? The only answer I can come up with is simply greed. Not being satisfied with what he had and wanting more.

Then inevitably came the bad decisions to try and feed the greed.

All so pathetic and pointless. One wonders, if he had succeeded in his goals (whatever they were exactly) would he ever have felt satisfied. I doubt it. No doubt he would still have hankered for more and made more bad decisions to try to get more.

I wonder what his goals are now? If he had been able to value what he had, this whole tragedy would never have happened.

I wouldn't call it greed as such, as I think by the time he paid off all his debts he wouldn't have much money left. But I would call it self preservation. And a belief that he was more important than his wife. And he believed he deserved to be happy. God knows what he thought Allison deserved, the way he allegedly treated her. I feel if he did it, he had absolutely no empathy at all, no bloody idea of what is important in life.