The only theory that makes any real sense.

[horatio]

I used to be a full on "PR did it!" supporter, but when you think long and hard about it, it doesn't really add up. If it's an accident, you call the police. If PR or JR is the intentional culprit, there's just no compelling rationale for why they cover for the other. Again, you call the police.

The only way they work together crafting a ransom note and staging the elaborate kidnapping is if the risk (being caught covering up a murder) is worth the reward. What could that valuable reward be, except for the protection of their other child.

A BDI theory is the only one that really makes sense. He kills JBR and the parents realize that his life is now ruined. This one act has taken both their daughter AND their son away from them.

Panic sets in and suddenly the idea of being able to save their child from prosecution doesn't seem so crazy. If there's an outside chance that the charade will work, the R's decide to risk it so that they won't lose their son and he can have a shot at a 'normal' life.

Suddenly all the evidence makes sense. It is just a smokescreen. If the R's did do it, this is really the only logical explanation for the whole entire ruse.

Another thought on this:

Why not stage the scene as an accidental fall instead of a kidnapping? Because the body was strangled with the garrote. This is literally the only reason that the ransom note exists. It's because the R's knew that while the police/M.E. might buy an accidental fall, there's absolute no way to explain the strangling marks.

If BR did it and the R's both cover to save him, they would have to explain the scene in a way that makes sense. The garotte and other marks on the body had to be explained in an alternative way and thus the RN & phony kidnapping.

I honestly think it's that simple.

 

[Chelly]

Another thought on this:

Why not stage the scene as an accidental fall instead of a kidnapping? Because the body was strangled with the garrote. This is literally the only reason that the ransom note exists. It's because the R's knew that while the police/M.E. might buy an accidental fall, there's absolute no way to explain the strangling marks.

If BR did it and the R's both cover to save him, they would have to explain the scene in a way that makes sense. The garotte and other marks on the body had to be explained in an alternative way and thus the RN & phony kidnapping.

I honestly think it's that simple.

Why not stage the scene as an accidental fall instead of a kidnapping?
1) Because JonBenet was still alive after the head injury and needed to be helped along to her death. Thus the strangulation.
2) Because the R's have to cover the prior sexual abuse with a vaginal violation.

 

[Chelly]

Another thought on this:

Why not stage the scene as an accidental fall instead of a kidnapping? Because the body was strangled with the garrote. This is literally the only reason that the ransom note exists. It's because the R's knew that while the police/M.E. might buy an accidental fall, there's absolute no way to explain the strangling marks.

If BR did it and the R's both cover to save him, they would have to explain the scene in a way that makes sense. The garotte and other marks on the body had to be explained in an alternative way and thus the RN & phony kidnapping.

I honestly think it's that simple.

Why not stage the scene as an accidental fall instead of a kidnapping?
1) Because JonBenet was still alive after the head injury and needed to be helped along to her death. Thus the strangulation.
2) Because the R's believe they must cover the prior sexual abuse with a vaginal violation.

 

[Ausgirl]

I just have to say -- I feel REALLY sorry for Burke.

Not only did he live in his little sister's shadow, he has been forced to stay there, year after year following her death, watching his family fall apart. And has had to deal with so much pressure and drama and viciousness, I doubt I'd be strong enough to deal with it - I can't fathom what life has been for a young boy growing up in the middle of it all.

Never mind being accused of murdering his sister, at age 9. And because the person who killed his sister has not been and probably never will be convicted, he will ALWAYS be a suspect to some... Whatever happened to Jonbenet, Burke will never be out from under that cloud -- a cloud founded in what? A bunch of pure speculation, IMO, from the utter lack of any actual evidence at all pointing definitively at him.

So what if (as is extremely probable) he is 100% innocent? Nothing can give him back the childhood stolen by this heinous crime and the mad circus of Jonbenet's murder investigation. Until I see some solid evidence, I choose to leave him the heck alone.

Idk. It's just really messed up. Poor kid.

 

[DeeDee249]

Another thought on this:

Why not stage the scene as an accidental fall instead of a kidnapping? Because the body was strangled with the garrote. This is literally the only reason that the ransom note exists. It's because the R's knew that while the police/M.E. might buy an accidental fall, there's absolute no way to explain the strangling marks.

If BR did it and the R's both cover to save him, they would have to explain the scene in a way that makes sense. The garotte and other marks on the body had to be explained in an alternative way and thus the RN & phony kidnapping.

I honestly think it's that simple.

Wouldn't work. A coroner can tell whether she really did fall. The injuries would be different. How many times have you read or heard about parents bringing a child that has been beaten to the hospital and saying the child "fell down the stairs". They always get caught.

 

[horatio]

Wouldn't work. A coroner can tell whether she really did fall. The injuries would be different. How many times have you read or heard about parents bringing a child that has been beaten to the hospital and saying the child "fell down the stairs". They always get caught.

True enough, but the point I'm making is that, if not for the garrote and strangulation marks, an accident is at least somewhat within the realm of possibility.

The fact that the garrote IS there though complicates things greatly for the guilty partie(s). There's no way it can be an innocent accident anymore. The culprit(s) had to explain it presence somehow without incriminating themselves, hence the RN & phony kidnapping.

 

[Ausgirl]

I am not too sure how misogynistic rants regarding the female posters here are helping this discussion along any. And I am sure it's probably a breach of TOS.

But fwiw, I agree that the Ramseys violating and garrotting the body of their own daughter in a bid to cover up her COD is a bit far-fetched for me.

 

[Stef88]

Hasn't it kinda been established that the blow that rendered JonBenet unconscious was too strong to have been Burke? Correct me if I'm wrong as I'm not as well caught up with the case as others here.

I think he knows something though, and we can only hope when JR passes away that Burke may say something...unlikely but possible.

 

[questfortrue]

True enough, but the point I'm making is that, if not for the garrote and strangulation marks, an accident is at least somewhat within the realm of possibility.

The fact that the garrote IS there though complicates things greatly for the guilty partie(s). There's no way it can be an innocent accident anymore. The culprit(s) had to explain it presence somehow without incriminating themselves, hence the RN & phony kidnapping.

True, but the garrote did give credence to an intruder. The Intruder gave credence to the sexual aspect of the crime, in case the coroner found that she had been molested. Many posters here think the sex aspect of the crime was the motivation for the elaborate cover up. (Incest definitely deminishes one's stature in the community.)

 

[Ausgirl]

I would think, on the other hand, it far more logical to conclude that the home in which the incest occurred (if it did, which I don't think it did) would be the LAST place anyone'd leave a body, let alone elaborately stage the crime scene, violating their daughter further to achieve it.

Going on the premise that Burke molested/killed his sister, that is. I rather think if one child did that to another, the people attempting to cover it up would want to put as much distance between the offending child and the murdered child as humanly possible.

 

[Chelly]

I used to be a full on "PR did it!" supporter, but when you think long and hard about it, it doesn't really add up. If it's an accident, you call the police. If PR or JR is the intentional culprit, there's just no compelling rationale for why they cover for the other. Again, you call the police.

The only way they work together crafting a ransom note and staging the elaborate kidnapping is if the risk (being caught covering up a murder) is worth the reward. What could that valuable reward be, except for the protection of their other child.

A BDI theory is the only one that really makes sense. He kills JBR and the parents realize that his life is now ruined. This one act has taken both their daughter AND their son away from them.

Panic sets in and suddenly the idea of being able to save their child from prosecution doesn't seem so crazy. If there's an outside chance that the charade will work, the R's decide to risk it so that they won't lose their son and he can have a shot at a 'normal' life.

Suddenly all the evidence makes sense. It is just a smokescreen. If the R's did do it, this is really the only logical explanation for the whole entire ruse.

horatio, These days the BDI theory is the one that works for me. Of course that could change with additional evidence. Many followers of this case believe that BR wasn't strong enough to deliver the head blow that fractured JB's skull. However, I think he did. I think that JB was in the process of fleeing from BR when he whacked her.

Here is my question to anyone who has the answer. Does the evidence show that JB was hit from behind?

 

[Venom]

True, but what if one wouldn't have the means/time to dump the body elsewhere from where the incest occured?


Edited to add: in replay to AusGirl (I have no idea how to add a quote)

I would think, on the other hand, it far more logical to conclude that the home in which the incest occurred (if it did, which I don't think it did) would be the LAST place anyone'd leave a body, let alone elaborately stage the crime scene, violating their daughter further to achieve it.

Going on the premise that Burke molested/killed his sister, that is. I rather think if one child did that to another, the people attempting to cover it up would want to put as much distance between the offending child and the murdered child as humanly possible.

 

[Venom]

horatio, These days the BDI theory is the one that works for me. Of course that could change with additional evidence. Many followers of this case believe that BR wasn't strong enough to deliver the head blow that fractured JB's skull. However, I think he did. I think that JB was in the process of fleeing from BR when he whacked her.

Here is my question to anyone who has the answer. Does the evidence show that JB was hit from behind?

I haven't come across anything that states she was struck from behind. If I remember right, the head wound was on the side of her head. (Don't quote me on that though)

Good point in her attempting to flee, maybe the sexual abuse had just recently started and she had had enough.

 

[Ausgirl]

True, but what if one wouldn't have the means/time to dump the body elsewhere from where the incest occured?

They had all night, and several vehicles available. Heck, they could've just walked her out to the yard at 4am, and left her there - wayyyy easier than all the bother of elaborate and time-consuming staging and way less risky than leaving her inside the home where the crime occurred.

A parent who would be capable of a/ covering up and/or b/ committing the crime in total, tying a garrotte around the throat of their own tiny daughter, etc, would be more than capable of dumping her body outside and claiming a failed abduction. The level of callousness is about equal.. and they'd have to be pretty cold and cool-headed to do any of it in the first place... so if Burke did this, why wouldn't the Ramseys have opted for the way easier, way less self-incriminating option?

The BDI theory just doesn't gel with me at all.

 

[txsvicki]

Even after reading all the arguments for BDI, I just can't get past PDI. I can see how it could be, but am convinced that she wrote that ransom note in an attempt to get J out of the house and herself and B on a plane out of there.

 

[horatio]

... so if Burke did this, why wouldn't the Ramseys have opted for the way easier, way less self-incriminating option?

One could argue that leaving the body outside makes about as much sense as inside. What kidnapper successfully gets the child out of the house, but then kills them on the front/back lawn? And then on top of that, with no danger/witnesses, doesn't take the body to dump elsewhere?

If the body is found inside the house, any DNA, clothes fibers, etc. determined to be left on the body post-killing, could always be argued to have been residual DNA/fibers from the house or when JR or PR touched the body after it was "found". Isn't convenient that JR is the first person to find and handle the body? Or how about this

Arndt lifted JonBenét's body and placed it under a Christmas tree ... Patsy Ramsey collapsed on top of the body

If the body is discovered outside in the snow by the police and immediately quarantined there's less forensic contamination.

 

[deca]

And as soon as you venture outside with a body, you open yourself up to footprints left in the dirt or snow, neighbor witnesses (and nowadays cameras).

 

[horatio]

And as soon as you venture outside with a body, you open yourself up to footprints left in the dirt or snow, neighbor witnesses (and nowadays cameras).

Exactly. The risk of getting of moving the body outside is great. You can't explain away a neighbor seeing you dump the body. But, with the body inside the home, you point to a broken window and say "An intruder must have gotten inside". Not everyone will buy it, but couple it with a ransom note and it's at least enough to create doubt.

 

[DeeDee249]

True, but what if one wouldn't have the means/time to dump the body elsewhere from where the incest occured?


Edited to add: in replay to AusGirl (I have no idea how to add a quote)

I would think, on the other hand, it far more logical to conclude that the home in which the incest occurred (if it did, which I don't think it did) would be the LAST place anyone'd leave a body, let alone elaborately stage the crime scene, violating their daughter further to achieve it.

Going on the premise that Burke molested/killed his sister, that is. I rather think if one child did that to another, the people attempting to cover it up would want to put as much distance between the offending child and the murdered child as humanly possible.

Venom- on the bottom right of every post there are two blue "boxes". One says "thanks" and the other days "quote". When you want to quote someone's post, simply click on the "quote" box on THIER post post and it will open in a window showing their words with

at the beginning and end of what they said. Simply add your own comments AFTER their comments. making sure you start writing after the

at the end of their comment. Then click "submit" just as you do with any other post.

 

[Chrishope]

Exactly. The risk of getting of moving the body outside is great. You can't explain away a neighbor seeing you dump the body. But, with the body inside the home, you point to a broken window and say "An intruder must have gotten inside". Not everyone will buy it, but couple it with a ransom note and it's at least enough to create doubt.

Except JR didn't point to the window and say intruder. He told the police, as well as FW that he himself broke that window months earlier when he supposedly forgot his key and had to break into his own house. He also told the police all the doors and windows were locked. The police report states there was no sign of forced entry.

Just to clear something up - I don't believe anyone is suggesting that JR (and/or PR) would dump the body on the front lawn, or the back lawn, or the alley - IOWs no one is suggesting the body would be dumped near the house. If the plan was to dump the body, then the body would be placed in a car, then the car would be driven to look for a place to dump the body. The RN says the delivery of the ransom will be "exhausting" implying that it will take a long time - e.g. the perfect excuse to be driving around.