Identified! MN - Isanti, WhtMale 20-28, UP8832, watch, blanket material, Aug'03 - Donald Rindahl

webrocket · Jun 14, 2011

the skeletal remains of a white male age 20-28 were found on Aug 17, 2003 in Isanti, MN. The UID was estimated to be 5'10". only skeletal finding was a prior healed fractured rib.

UID was estimated to have been dead for 2 years.

https://identifyus.org/cases/8832

webrocket · Jun 14, 2011

on Nov. 10, 2002, a 20 y.o. college student named Joshua Guimond was last seen in St. Joseph, MN. per his namus profile, Joshua was 5'10". no reference to a rib fracture:

https://www.findthemissing.org/cases/312/2/

I looked at mapquest and the distance between the two locations is 60 miles.

not a whole lot to go on especially since the UID was just skeletal, but given the height, age and general proximity, you'd think they would have checked this possibility out already.

buffetoflies · Jun 17, 2011

huh. I remember reading about this when these remains were found. The county paper had the same reconstruction as the DN has, so i figured the remains were of a native american.

The dates regarding how old the remains are seem to have changed a bit. In this link: http://s10.invisionfree.com/usedtobedoe/ar/t17213.htm from early 2007 says the estimated date of death is between 3-28 years prior to discovery, and the current page for DN says between 24 and 33 years. The first link also has the age range listed as 25-35 years old instead of 20-28.

Also, the big thing one these remains is that the teeth had an odd pattern. If the reconstruction of the mouth is accurate then the deceased had a large gap between what I think should be the left front and 1st left canine (#6 & #7 if I am looking at the dental chart right). There is one picture of JG smiling where I can see his top teeth, and too me they look pretty well aligned with one another.

webrocket · Jun 17, 2011

thanks buffetoflies. did not realize there was a reconstruction at Doe Network. here is the link:

http://doenetwork.org/cases/499ummn.html

he does look Native American and they claim he might have been buried for up to 28 years.

as for the hair color, etc., this is what DN had to say:

Other facial details, such as the size of the ears and nose, and hair and eye color, are not known and reflect the best guess of the artist.

so the key things are the shape of the head and the teeth.

ThePhantom · Jun 17, 2011

Darn...oh well...

Thank you for thinking of Joshua, Webrocket, and thank you for caring...

webrocket · Jun 17, 2011

I tried to look at Joshua's teeth versus the UID's as found on the DN reconstruction. it looks like the UID has a significant gap between tooth #9 and #10. Joshua looks like he has a gap between tooth #10 and #11.

I have no luck zooming images and posting them here.

CarlK90245 · Jun 17, 2011

webrocket said:
I tried to look at Joshua's teeth versus the UID's as found on the DN reconstruction. it looks like the UID has a significant gap between tooth #9 and #10. Joshua looks like he has a gap between tooth #10 and #11.

I have no luck zooming images and posting them here.

Upper teeth are numbered right-to-left (1 to 16).

The UID's gap is on his right side, and appears not to be a "gap", but rather, a missing tooth (#7) between the right-canine (#6) and a right-central incisor (#8). The tooth on his right (or viewer's left) side of the gap is a pointed tooth, so I am thinking it's a canine (#6), and not a lateral incisor (#7).

The dental chart indicates that #7 is missing postmortem, but I think that's a mistake. I don't think that they would show a model of the person's teeth showing that empty space if the tooth was lost after death.

Joshua does appear to have a gap on the right side, but it looks to me like it's between #6 and #7. He could have lost the #7 after death (or after the photo was taken), but it looks to me like it would have left a bigger space if he did.

webrocket · Jun 17, 2011

CarlK90245 said:
Upper teeth are numbered right-to-left (1 to 16).

The UID's gap is on his right side, and appears not to be a "gap", but rather, a missing tooth (#7) between the right-canine (#6) and a right-central incisor (#8). The tooth on his right (or viewer's left) side of the gap is a pointed tooth, so I am thinking it's a canine (#6), and not a lateral incisor (#7).

The dental chart indicates that #7 is missing postmortem, but I think that's a mistake. I don't think that they would show a model of the person's teeth showing that empty space if the tooth was lost after death.

Joshua does appear to have a gap on the right side, but it looks to me like it's between #6 and #7.

I must have looked at the dental chart facing the wrong way.

CarlK90245 · Jun 17, 2011

webrocket said:
I must have looked at the dental chart facing the wrong way.

Dental charts read from the viewer's perspective, not the charted person's perspective.

So the UID's upper-right teeth (1-8) would be on the viewer's left.

Kind of confusing.

webrocket · Aug 29, 2013

for what it is worth, there is but one rule out on this case and it is Joshua Guimond. so maybe LE or the ME's office checks out this page.

can't hurt if others are suggested.

hayaletcatcher · Mar 22, 2016

Christopher Kerze has been ruled out

catherine. · Mar 23, 2016

Kenneth Tank
http://www.charleyproject.org/cases/t/tank_kenneth.html

William Underhill
http://www.charleyproject.org/cases/u/underhill_william.html

I though their facial structure was similar to the UID, but unfortunately they don't show their teeth or have a lot of info on them. I felt that I kind of owed it to the guy to take some time and look.

creepedout · Mar 23, 2016

Wondering about this one:

https://www.findthemissing.org/en/cases/13136/

A larger photo is available here, and you can see the teeth pattern:

https://www.findthemissing.org/en/photos/full/36799

Otterly · Jan 30, 2017

creepedout said:
Wondering about this one:

https://www.findthemissing.org/en/cases/13136/

A larger photo is available here, and you can see the teeth pattern:

https://www.findthemissing.org/en/photos/full/36799

He looks good to me, he's from the St. Paul and the highway that the remains were found (47) on is an artery out of the Twin Cities. The heights are also very close, 5'9" vs estimated 5'10". I'd guess LE would have thought of this case before because of the close geographic location, but you never know.

Although Bernard's teeth look better than the UID's, the picture we have of him is obviously from high school as he's wearing a JROTC uniform. In addition, the two shoulder stripes indicate two years in the JROTC program. This likely means that this photo was taken his Sophomore year of high school (not to meantion he seems to be 15-16 in the photo in my opinion). This allows for 5-6 years of decay and dental changes to his teeth until he went missing in 1983. Maybe his dental hygene decreased in the intervening years after high school? I'd definitely turn it in.

namstache · Aug 31, 2017

Actually, has William Underhill been ruled out? Check out his teeth, lips, facial structure in these pics. Very similar. Also he disappeared around that time and was thought to be traveling toward Lake Superior from Minneapolis at the time of his disappearance, which would make sense for his location. Height is off (he was tall, over 6' I think) but it says it's an estimate anyway.

https://www.facebook.com/William-Campbell-Underhill-Missing-Person-721412491335958/

catherine. said:
Kenneth Tank
http://www.charleyproject.org/cases/t/tank_kenneth.html

William Underhill
http://www.charleyproject.org/cases/u/underhill_william.html

I though their facial structure was similar to the UID, but unfortunately they don't show their teeth or have a lot of info on them. I felt that I kind of owed it to the guy to take some time and look.

theshadow45 · Sep 9, 2017

Welcome to Websleuths, namstache :welcome:! If you think this UID is William Underhill you should submit him. Harold Haynes has been added to the rule out list, but not WU.

theshadow45 · Sep 9, 2017

A few possibilities: one that I really like is John Deeny http://www.charleyproject.org/cases/d/deeny_john.html who has been missing from Janesville, MN since 1973. At the time, he was about to turn 20, 5'8" tall and 175 pounds, and had surgical scars on his thighs. Christopher Freeman http://www.charleyproject.org/cases/f/freeman_christopher.html and his friend Geno Ranelli http://www.charleyproject.org/cases/r/ranelli_geno.html both went missing from St. Paul, MN within a few weeks of each other in 1977. David Thomson http://www.charleyproject.org/cases/t/thomson_david.html has scoliosis and several previous fractures. Calvin Anderson http://www.charleyproject.org/cases/a/anderson_calvin.html is believed to be a murder victim. Dermot Kelly http://www.charleyproject.org/cases/k/kelly_dermot.html possibly left home of his own accord. Orin Anderson http://www.charleyproject.org/cases/a/anderson_orin.html has little information available.

carbuff · Sep 9, 2017

John Deeny looks very close to me. He even has high flat cheekbones and the same general shape of head and jaw.

theshadow45 · Sep 9, 2017

Side-by-sides of Isanti County John Doe and John Deeny:

.

Otterly · Sep 9, 2017

John Should definitely be looked into by LE if he hasn't been already. According to google maps (of course this is by today's roads) Janesville is about 2 hours away from Isanti Co. That doesn't seem an unreasonable distance to dump a body, which I assume is what happened since this UID was found in a shallow grave.

Identified! MN - Isanti, WhtMale 20-28, UP8832, watch, blanket material, Aug'03 - Donald Rindahl

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