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  1. #1696
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    Apr 2011
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    Quote Originally Posted by WINDSOR View Post
    Why do Pimps beat and kill the women that earn for them?
    Power
    Control
    Discipline
    As an example to other girls
    As an emotional release and thrill
    Because they can, and they know in most cases nobody cares.
    Because the girl has become too much of a hassle.
    Just because
    There are scores of new young girls they can lure into the trade
    This girl is getting old and not earning like she should
    They do not need a reason


    BTW I am not saying Pak actually killed anybody, just I think he was 'involved' in Shannan's death.
    Was Pak a pimp? We know he transports women for the sex trade. A PIMP? No way. I can't see it. I think in his videos he is somewhat effeminate, and he's a little guy - leading me to believe that he's not interested in women sexually. He was just trying to make easy money IMHO I could be wrong of course!

  2. #1697
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    Dec 2012
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    N.C.
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    140
    Quote Originally Posted by WINDSOR View Post
    Why do Pimps beat and kill the women that earn for them?
    Power
    Control
    Discipline
    As an example to other girls
    As an emotional release and thrill
    Because they can, and they know in most cases nobody cares.
    Because the girl has become too much of a hassle.
    Just because
    There are scores of new young girls they can lure into the trade
    This girl is getting old and not earning like she should
    They do not need a reason


    BTW I am not saying Pak actually killed anybody, just I think he was 'involved' in Shannan's death.
    To play devils advocate most of your reasoning is purely speculation and has not been reported by any media outlet. There has been no reports of him getting tired of her or her not pulling in as much money. So itís purely speculation on your part that any of this happened. While those scenarios do happen with the traditional pimp prostitute relationship I think most would agree Shannon and Michaelís was not a traditional pimp/hooker relationship. In contrast LR1 used Information that has been reported to try and hypothesize a logical reason why he left. But still people just have tunnel vision no matter what the evidence suggests.

  3. #1698
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    Dec 2011
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    540
    Quote Originally Posted by OnTheCase27 View Post
    To play devils advocate most of your reasoning is purely speculation and has not been reported by any media outlet. There has been no reports of him getting tired of her or her not pulling in as much money. So itís purely speculation on your part that any of this happened. While those scenarios do happen with the traditional pimp prostitute relationship I think most would agree Shannon and Michaelís was not a traditional pimp/hooker relationship. In contrast LR1 used Information that has been reported to try and hypothesize a logical reason why he left. But still people just have tunnel vision no matter what the evidence suggests.
    .

    Okay On the Case, let us follow your theory that Shannan and Pak had a 'special' relationship, and it was not exploitive like the traditional sex-trade/pimp relationship.

    1) If this was the case and Pak truly cared about Shannan would he be upset that Gus called the cops after Shannan had as well? Or was he only thinking of the consequences to himself?

    2) Would Pak have left Oak Beach without Shannan that morning if he really cared about her well being? Or was he only interested in saving himself?

    3) Has Pak done anything before or after Shannan's disappearance that shows a 'special' relationship beyond what would one expect?

    There is nothing wrong with speculating about what happened, this is how cases are solved. The sleuth comes up with potential hypothesis and then works to prove or disprove them.

    This is not speculation: Shannan called 911 and said someone is trying to kill her. Pak was chasing her, Shannan is dead.

  4. #1699
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    Dec 2011
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    540
    Quote Originally Posted by twocuriouscats View Post
    Was Pak a pimp? We know he transports women for the sex trade. A PIMP? No way. I can't see it. I think in his videos he is somewhat effeminate, and he's a little guy - leading me to believe that he's not interested in women sexually. He was just trying to make easy money IMHO I could be wrong of course!
    Pimp, procurer, facilitator; does it really matter what label is used. being involved in the sex trade for any benefit, money, drugs or whatever is what is a fact. Did not Brewer state he arranged for Shannan's services with PAK? Really the label you use on Pak is irrelevant to solving this case.

    Sexual orientation and physical stature has nothing to do a person being in the sex trade. Many LGBTQ are active in the sex trade. Look at the ads.

  5. #1700
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    May 2017
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    22
    Quote Originally Posted by WINDSOR View Post
    .

    Okay On the Case, let us follow your theory that Shannan and Pak had a 'special' relationship, and it was not exploitive like the traditional sex-trade/pimp relationship.

    1) If this was the case and Pak truly cared about Shannan would he be upset that Gus called the cops after Shannan had as well? Or was he only thinking of the consequences to himself?

    2) Would Pak have left Oak Beach without Shannan that morning if he really cared about her well being? Or was he only interested in saving himself?

    3) Has Pak done anything before or after Shannan's disappearance that shows a 'special' relationship beyond what would one expect?

    There is nothing wrong with speculating about what happened, this is how cases are solved. The sleuth comes up with potential hypothesis and then works to prove or disprove them.

    This is not speculation: Shannan called 911 and said someone is trying to kill her. Pak was chasing her, Shannan is dead.

    Pak left Shannan to rot and die in a marsh when she was petrified for her life. He never helped Mari or the family hold a presser for her.
    He never attended a presser for Shannan. He has been in hiding for years. He did NOT meet 48 Hours in person, he did NOT go to their news studio
    for an interview, he did not allow 48Hours into his home for an interview; he merely texted them and stated that he never touched her. (remember?)
    It's in the first 48 Hours of July 12, 2011.

    He was interviewed by Louise Ormond only because he was paid money. He was paid because she was not American media.

  6. #1701
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    Dec 2011
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    540
    Still working on this case, but I have questions that maybe some of you can help with

    1) Had Pak ever met or spoken to Dr. Hackett prior to the night of Shannan's disappearance?

    2)The night Pak was chasing Shannan, did he meet with Dr. Hackett? Was it before or after Pak left Gus's house?


    Thanks

    WINDSOR
    Last edited by WINDSOR; 12-05-2017 at 12:36 PM.

  7. #1702
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    Dec 2012
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    N.C.
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    Quote Originally Posted by WINDSOR View Post
    Still working on this case, but I have questions that maybe some of you can help with

    1) Had Pak ever met or spoken to Dr. Hackett prior to the night of Shannan's disappearance?

    2)The night Pak was chasing Shannan, did he meet with Dr. Hackett? Was it before or after Pak left Gus's house?


    Thanks

    WINDSOR
    1. From all the MSM articles Iíve ever read Pak met Dr. Hackett when he and Alex went back to Oak Beach days after Shannon disappeared to look for her.

    2. I even though I disagree with the wording that Pak chased Shannon I donít know of any report that states Pak saw, spoke to or even knew of Dr Hackett before he went back to Oak Beach with Alex Diaz. Someone else may have more information on that night but from everything Iíve ever read or documentaries that I watched Hackett and Pak met I believe about 2-3 day after Shannonís initially disappeared.

  8. #1703
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    Oct 2017
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    216
    For someone who has worked in this industry and has experiencial knowledge of this industry not what I read online or heard actual knowledge lol, although rare SG death is not surprising to me from a certin point of view people would be surprised how a lot of these girls can react they tend to have emotional issues and then on top you add the elements Pax did everything he could that night for SG, iam sure a fascist femmenist or LE would love to say he didn’t to take the focus of themselfs and there mistakes but there is no evidence whatsoever that Pax killed SG that has been made aware to the public. It’s not uncommon for some of these girls to go Bat **** crazy and have a breakdown, then you add the elements and you have a recipe for disaster. It also just so happened to occur in a area that is by a Main Highway that was used as a dumping ground. If SG let’s say went missing in massapequa then bodies where found ten miles away in a park I’d say maby the culprit is someone she meet that night, but OB you live behind a main road a typical place where a serial killer dumps. This is probly one of the most bizarre cases in history and the profile of KS states but I think that Profiler on Killing season is right about the SG aspect of this case. All this is speculation ofcouse I wasn’t there but before you people go accusing someone of homicide have actual evidence not speculation.<modsnip>
    Last edited by Coldpizza; 12-07-2017 at 08:17 AM. Reason: Rude

  9. #1704
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    Dec 2011
    Posts
    540
    "character of some of you bozos"

    So A19, since you believe there is no evidence, you think Pak is innocent. You are entitled to your opinion. I am sure Mr.Pak if he is not your friend already, appreciates your support.

    It appears that you feel Shannan's death was her fault, she made choices and they did not work out for her. That's life.

    If you think no crime has been committed why are you posting on WebSleuths?

  10. #1705
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    Oct 2017
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    216
    If SG had a breakdown like LE is saying she is not responsible for her own death no one is it’s a horrible tragedy a lot of you people are looking for a villian becuase it is easier for you to accept that instead of a tragedy. And somebody is responsible for a horrific crime that’s the GB4 and other homicides, I don’t know for certin what happened to SG but we don’t have any evidence MP was involved not even circumstantial I love this whole thing a lot for you subsicbe to on how the call to JB came from MP phone guess what it probly did and you know why simple her phone may have died she don’t feel like useing her phone for whatever reason maby she didn’t have her trap phone that night only her regular phone. No one here has givein any evidence of MP involvent im a homicide not even circumstantial all that has been said is basically by people who want to blame him becuase they feel with out evidence that he was forceing SG into escorting which I sincerely doubt.


  11. #1706
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    Dec 2012
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    N.C.
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    Quote Originally Posted by WINDSOR View Post
    "character of some of you bozos"

    So A19, since you believe there is no evidence, you think Pak is innocent. You are entitled to your opinion. I am sure Mr.Pak if he is not your friend already, appreciates your support.

    It appears that you feel Shannan's death was her fault, she made choices and they did not work out for her. That's life.

    If you think no crime has been committed why are you posting on WebSleuths?
    You didnít ask me but I will respond since I think the evidence suggests Shannonís death may have been an accident. There are still a dozen victims of one or multiple serial killers. As far as we know these killers are still out there. I donít judge Shannon for the work she did, I just donít think she was murdered. I donít judge any of the other dozen victims either for the work they did. I think itís a travesty that justice hasnít been served for them, so I spend a little bit of my time to help out in anyway possible. I have invested countless hours on sleuthing this case Iím invested even if I donít think Shannon was murdered. There are other victims into which this sub forum is also dedicated.

  12. #1707
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    Jul 2012
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    L.I.,N.Y.
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    Quote Originally Posted by OnTheCase27 View Post
    You didnít ask me but I will respond since I think the evidence suggests Shannonís death may have been an accident. There are still a dozen victims of one or multiple serial killers. As far as we know these killers are still out there. I donít judge Shannon for the work she did, I just donít think she was murdered. I donít judge any of the other dozen victims either for the work they did. I think itís a travesty that justice hasnít been served for them, so I spend a little bit of my time to help out in anyway possible. I have invested countless hours on sleuthing this case Iím invested even if I donít think Shannon was murdered. There are other victims into which this sub forum is also dedicated.
    Well said.

  13. #1708
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    Dec 2011
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    540
    Remember before there was any real evidence, without even finding Shannan's body, the SCPD said it was an accidental death by drowning.

    Now it is still an open case, being investigated by the FBI, and several other agencies. They do not think it was an accident. So maybe, just maybe, they have some evidence that has not been publicly released that makes the FBI believe it was not an accident. Perhaps what is on the 911 tape, that none of us have heard, may have some evidence that keeps the FBI going.

    I could be wrong though, the FBI could be wrong, and the SCPD who could not find Shannan's body for months, or never realized that a serial killer was operating in their midst for years could be right, and you could be right too..

    Anything is possible.

  14. #1709
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    Oct 2017
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    216
    No I think SCPD knew about a SK for a very very long time I also belive they where tipped off about the GB4

  15. #1710
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    137

    re: your investment of countless hours sleuthing this case

    Quote Originally Posted by OnTheCase27 View Post
    You didnít ask me but I will respond since I think the evidence suggests Shannonís death may have been an accident. There are still a dozen victims of one or multiple serial killers. As far as we know these killers are still out there. I donít judge Shannon for the work she did, I just donít think she was murdered. I donít judge any of the other dozen victims either for the work they did. I think itís a travesty that justice hasnít been served for them, so I spend a little bit of my time to help out in anyway possible. I have invested countless hours on sleuthing this case Iím invested even if I donít think Shannon was murdered. There are other victims into which this sub forum is also dedicated.

    May I ask you what your conclusion of Shannan's death regarding your investment of countless hours sleuthing this case?

    I ask, because, there is a lawsuit against CPH regarding Shannan's death. The judge has allowed the following to be litigated regarding Shannan's death:

    "Still allowed to proceed are claims that Hackett misled Gilbert into believing he'd take care of her at his so-called home for wayward girls and that his medical malpractice and other actions led to her eventual death and caused pain and suffering to her and her family."

    https://www.newsday.com/long-island/...udge-1.6642829

    May all the victims, who died so tragically find peace and rest and love on the other side.

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