IA IA - Elizabeth Collins, 8, & Lyric Cook, 10, Evansdale, 13 July 2012 - #10

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http://wcfcourier.com/news/local/ev...cle_18411a90-cd32-11e1-a656-0019bb2963f4.html

http://www.kwwl.com/story/19023342/evansdale-police-searching-for-two-missing-girls

These girls have been missing all afternoon and the search was suspended tonight now that it's dark here. We're a small town next to a larger city but a small police force that has likely never dealt with missing kids.. Bikes found on the trail and purse and phone had been thrown over the fence near the bikes but the other side of the fence is a hill leading to the highway. Right now the search is very disorganized and there aren't any flyers :(.


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Scanner Thread : remember anything in the scanner thread stays in the scanner thread


case map by poster hollye

NCMEC posters:
http://www.missingkids.com/missingk...NCMC&seqNum=1&caseLang=en_US&searchLang=en_US
http://www.missingkids.com/missingk...NCMC&seqNum=1&caseLang=en_US&searchLang=en_US
 
Please remember the following when discussing the case:
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No one has been named by LE or MSM as a POI or suspect in this case.
The parents, whatever you may personally think about them, have not been named.
That means that they, and their families, their neighbors, and their friends and "associates," are not to be sleuthed or badmouthed.

Please continue here...
 
JaimeInLA said:
Grandma saw them at 12:15, then "went to look for them" from 12:30 - 1:30.

Which way were the girls riding on the cctv? I know it was West. But is west TOWARD the Collins home, or away from it?
Click to expand...

The Collins home appears to be South of the last sighting of the girls.

SE_Meyers_Lake_Timeline.jpg
 
respectfully snipped and colored for emphasis Do not sleuth individuals who have not been mentioned in MSM either as persons of interest or as suspects by LE.
 
whew, took some doing getting back in here - thanks imamaze :)
 
Which direction were the bikes facing on the trail? West or East?
 
MNDad said:
Which direction were the bikes facing on the trail? West or East?
Click to expand...

I don't believe its been confirmed. The LE spokesman said that, "when he arrived," they were leaning on the fence. A firefighter is reported to have found the bikes at about 4pm, and presumably the parents went to the spot immediately as well.

Ted Gamerdinger, a local, reported that he'd had to swerve to avoid two bikes on the path sometime shortly before 12:27.
 
MNDad said:
Which direction were the bikes facing on the trail? West or East?
Click to expand...

No one knows. A cyclist said that two bikes were lying on the path, and an officer has said that he saw two bikes leaning against a fence.
 
In the video surveillance footage of the girls, there are some kind of storage containers or something in that parking lot behind Ledermans. Are those things that someone could get inside of?

Last night I had a sudden thought out of nowhere - how terrible would it be if the girls had somehow gotten inside one of those things and couldn't get out? Some other kids come along, find the bikes and purse, ride them to the lake, go thru the purse, toss it over the fence and abandon the bikes, setting off a wild goosechase.

But of course this CAN"T be that simple. Because those have been checked, right? I hope? And I would think someone would hear them hollering from inside whatever one of those is.

Too simple, I'm sure. But boy how that made my stomach drop when I imagined such a thing.
 
GGE said:
In the video surveillance footage of the girls, there are some kind of storage containers or something in that parking lot behind Ledermans. Are those things that someone could get inside of?

Last night I had a sudden thought out of nowhere - how terrible would it be if the girls had somehow gotten inside one of those things and couldn't get out? Some other kids come along, find the bikes and purse, ride them to the lake, go thru the purse, toss it over the fence and abandon the bikes, setting off a wild goosechase.

But of course this CAN"T be that simple. Because those have been checked, right? I hope? And I would think someone would hear them hollering from inside whatever one of those is.

Too simple, I'm sure. But boy how that made my stomach drop when I imagined such a thing.
Click to expand...
Sometimes these things are, unfortunately, that simple. However, dogs tracked the girls scent by the lake so my guess is that HAD to have been there, right? I don't know much about tracking, but I'm assuming the dogs weren't following the scent of the bikes or purse alone, as you would think they would have tracked much farther.
Is anyone here an expert (or close) on how scent dogs track?
 
It just seems so weird that they start of heading north and then end up at the lake.
 
duchessofdork said:
It just seems so weird that they start of heading north and then end up at the lake.
Click to expand...

They did not start off going North. The video shows them going WEST. At any point, they could have just turned south, and rode to the lake. Or they could have rode around the block and gone back east. Nobody knows. We only know that at 12:15-ish, they were going West.
 
Sailorsgirl said:
Sometimes these things are, unfortunately, that simple. However, dogs tracked the girls scent by the lake so my guess is that HAD to have been there, right? I don't know much about tracking, but I'm assuming the dogs weren't following the scent of the bikes or purse alone, as you would think they would have tracked much farther.
Is anyone here an expert (or close) on how scent dogs track?
Click to expand...

There are two verified experts on this board that I've seen post in this thread so far (I mean, old incarnations of this case's threads) - sarx specifically said a LOT of great things that were VERY helpful about this case.

Specifically, something about having listened to recordings of the radio chatter of the dog handlers or LE while searching, sarx got the feeling there was no strong scent found, and it seemed the dogs may have jus been fanning out to check all over at their handler's direction (I'm sorry if I've paraphrased badly, I'll look for corroborating links to sarx's posts when I get a chance in a bit here).
EDIT - LINK TO SARX'S POST REGARDING THIS - Websleuths Crime Sleuthing Community - View Single Post - IA IA - Elizabeth Collins, 8, and Lyric Cook, 10, Evansdale, 13 July 2012 - #7


Also, sarx spoke of the fact that the dogs could have gotten the girls scents from the bikes rather than the girls (IIRC, which I may not, I'll look back shortly here - EDIT - Websleuths Crime Sleuthing Community - View Single Post - IA IA - Elizabeth Collins, 8, and Lyric Cook, 10, Evansdale, 13 July 2012 - #7 - SARX says in this post that "perhaps [they were] picking up residual coming off the bikes"),

and also that they could be picking up "the freshest scent" but that maybe the girls had been there some other day recently but NOT that day, and maybe the dogs still picked it up.

All to the best of my collection and paraphrasing ability.

Also important to note that LE never made an official statement about the dogs and if they did or didn't track the girls there, it was family who was describing what their (unprofessional) thougts were as to what they observed the dogs doing, IMHO, IIRC.
 
duchessofdork said:
It just seems so weird that they start of heading north and then end up at the lake.
Click to expand...

When I look at the map, it seems to me that they left the Collin's home, headed to Lafayette (which leads to the lake trail) and the bikes were found at the lake. They were seen in an alley, so perhaps they rode through the alleys to get to Lafayette.
 
JaimeInLA said:
They did not start off going North. The video shows them going WEST. At any point, they could have just turned south, and rode to the lake. Or they could have rode around the block and gone back east. Nobody knows. We only know that at 12:15-ish, they were going West.
Click to expand...

Yes. I wish someone could go to that ABC news reporter and show him a compass and explain to him that West is NOT the opposite direction of South!!

SO MUCH CONFUSION BECAUSE OF HIS STATEMENT.:banghead:
 
Very helpful! Thank you! I must have somehow missed that discussion as I came into this over a week after the girls went missing. I have been sort of stuck on the dogs so maybe the girls were never there.
 
Someone posted a post on last thread about Who saw the girls last. Who knew the family schedule. Who.... well you get the picture. It was a list. I don't know how to quote from another thread. But my point is the why? What motive could this person have? I will think on this all day because I have been leaning on this side of the fence for awhile.
 
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