CA CA - Los Angeles Co, WhtFem UP4396, 40-60, maybe name Julie or Juliette Young, Oct'79

Romulus · Apr 7, 2017

NamUs UP 4396

https://www.identifyus.org/en/cases/4396

Unidentified Body/Remains (White Female)
Found October 7, 1979 in Los Angeles County, CA
Body Condition: Recognizable face
Probable year of death: 1979 to 1979

Vital Statistics
Estimated age: 40-60 (Adult - Pre 70)
Approximate Height: 65 estimate
Approximate Weight: 99 estimate
Hair Color: Grey
Eye Color: Brown
Scars and marks: nothing

Clothing & Accessories
Clothing: dark blue slacks size 10; white blouse; white bra size 34B; white panties, black suede shoes
Jewerly: nothing
Footwear: nothing
Accessories: nothing

Identifiers
Fingerprints: Fingerprint information is available and entered
Dentals: Dental information / charting is available and entered
DNA: Sample is currently not available

Case History: On 10/7/1979 @1300 hours the decdent was found unresponsive behind a loading dock area @ 563 S. San Pedro St. in L.A. Paperwork found near her had a possible name of Julie or Juliette Young, possibly from Dallas TX. Not able to confirm ID

DOE NETWORK LINK CASE
http://www.doenetwork.org/hot/hotcase1457.html

Romulus · May 23, 2017

Porchlight USA link

http://z13.invisionfree.com/PorchlightUSA/index.php?showtopic=17087

I hope that soon they will sketch this woman as the face for namus is recognizable.

alawaysslueth · May 23, 2017

Could this be Stephania Andrews

http://www.doenetwork.org/cases/2096dfil.html

She is the only female I could find that fits the descripton..she may be a little older then the UID but its worth a shot

Romulus · Jun 1, 2017

alawaysslueth said:
Could this be Stephania Andrews

http://www.doenetwork.org/cases/2096dfil.html

She is the only female I could find that fits the descripton..she may be a little older then the UID but its worth a shot

Interesting, maybe Julie or Juliette Young is an alias.

Romulus · Feb 7, 2018

Doe Network update the link case

http://www.doenetwork.org/cases/1366ufca.html

[h=1]1366UFCA - Unidentified Female[/h]

Date of Discovery: October 7, 1979
Location of Discovery: Los Angeles, Los Angeles County, California
Estimated Date of Death: Recent
State of Remains: Recognizable face
Cause of Death: Unknown
[h=2]Physical Description[/h]Estimated Age: 40-60 years old
Race: White and/or Hispanic
Sex: Female
Height: 5'5"
Weight: 99 lbs.
Hair Color: Brown, graying
Eye Color: Brown
Distinguishing Marks/Features: Possible smoker.
[h=2]Identifiers[/h]Dentals: Available.
Fingerprints: Available.
DNA: Not available.
[h=2]Clothing & Personal Items[/h]Clothing: Blue pants size 10, white blouse size M, white bra size 34B, white panties, black shoes
Jewelry: Unknown
Additional Personal Items: Misc. cosmetics, a pocket knife, cigarette lighter, keyring containing three keys, medical alert bracelet and two "keepsake" coins.
[h=2]Circumstances of Discovery[/h]The decedent was discovered unresponsive near a trash bin behind the loading docks of 563 S. San Pedro St.
Paperwork found near the woman indicated she may have been a transient from Dallas, Texas and used the name Julie or Juliette Young and was likely new to the area.
[h=2]Investigating Agency(s)[/h]Agency Name: Los Angeles County Coroner
Agency Contact Person: Daniel Machian
Agency Phone Number: 323-343-0512 or 323-343-0754
Agency E-Mail: dmachian(at)coroner.lacounty.gov
Agency Case Number: 7912501
Agency Name: California Department of Justice
Agency Contact Person: Jeannine Willie
Agency Phone Number: 916-227-3405
Agency E-Mail: N/A
Agency Case Number: Unknown
NCIC Case Number: U034749949
NamUs Case Number: 4396
Former Hot Case Number: 1457
[h=2]Information Source(s)[/h]NamUs
Los Angeles County Coroner

digitective · Apr 22, 2018

There was a Juliette Young who married Adrian Murphy Talmadge in Harris County, Texas (Houston area) on June 24, 1963. The bride was 37 years old at the time, which would make her 53 years old in 1979.

digitective · Apr 22, 2018

Hmm, it sounds like Stephania is a wealthy lady from Chicago, not a homeless transient from Texas. Where the body was found is the Skid Row area in Downtown LA, so it makes sense that Jane Doe would be a transient.

MelmothTheLost · Apr 23, 2018

Romulus said:
Interesting, maybe Julie or Juliette Young is an alias.

Or maybe it's completely unrelated. The details say the paperwork was found near the body, not on it. Besides, they don't seem entirely sure of the name on the paperwork. It sounds as though it wasn't entirely legible.

Giuc0 · Apr 23, 2018

And she has a medical alert bracelet per DN.
However, I find nothing about this medical bracelet on NamUS.

1) For what condition did she wear it ?

2) Any serial number on it ? Or ID... whatever you call it.

3) What brand ?

4) Issued in what year ?

Giuc0 · Apr 23, 2018

Ok, thinking out loud.

Assuming Jane Doe was wearing a medical alert bracelet, she wore it because of a chronic medical condition. I don't see any reason for wearing a medical bracelet for the sake of having fun :-/
Medical alert bracelet is for getting the right treatment when in life-threatening situation.

Therefore, assuming that the medical alert bracelet info is accurately related to JD, it makes sense to go with potential matches with chronic illnesses.
If our potential match is said "she has no medical history", "healthy" or words to that effect, then, it can't be her.
Let pause and think. If JD has a medical alert bracelet, her family knows about the health issue. I mean, if JD has a medical alert bracelet, it means that her issues can be life-threatening. How can a family not know, or at least notice, that something is not right health-wise ? Or not knowing at all about the potentially life-threatening illness ?
If she had a medical alert bracelet, JD has seen a doctor at some point in her life. Before disappearing, she probably had some form of follow-up by a doctor.

That's quite an important detail to solve the case.

Carl, what do you think ? Since you are our expert

Giuc0 · Apr 23, 2018

digitective said:
There was a Juliette Young who married Adrian Murphy Talmadge in Harris County, Texas (Houston area) on June 24, 1963. The bride was 37 years old at the time, which would make her 53 years old in 1979.

Makes sense. However, do you have clues about her having a chronic illness ? Because our JD had a medical alert bracelet.

So, if she never saw a doctor in her life, it can't be her.

Giuc0 · Apr 23, 2018

MelmothTheLost said:
Or maybe it's completely unrelated. The details say the paperwork was found near the body, not on it. Besides, they don't seem entirely sure of the name on the paperwork. It sounds as though it wasn't entirely legible.

Per DN :

Additional Personal Items: Misc. cosmetics, a pocket knife, cigarette lighter, keyring containing three keys, medical alert bracelet and two "keepsake" coins.

Italic & underlined by me

A medical alert bracelet of someone else ?!? Eh..... :waitasec:

Giuc0 · Apr 23, 2018

alawaysslueth said:
Could this be Stephania Andrews

http://www.doenetwork.org/cases/2096dfil.html

She is the only female I could find that fits the descripton..she may be a little older then the UID but its worth a shot

I'm not too concerned with the age difference, as they are estimated.
The becoming a transiant is a possibility if she was suddenly having mental illness. Unlikely, but why not ? Stranger things happen.

However, I'm most bothered with the lack of clues pointing towards a chronic illness you wear a medical bracelet.
I know not all people with chronic illness wear one, but a MP report without any clue for a chronic illness potentially life-threatening is a too strong inconsistency to dismiss.

For me, not a match at all.

Giuc0 · Apr 23, 2018

Ok, on NamUS, it says :

Weight (pounds) 99, Measured
Height (inches) 65, Measured

https://www.identifyus.org/en/cases/4396

MelmothTheLost · Apr 23, 2018

Giuc0 said:
Per DN :
Italic & underlined by me

A medical alert bracelet of someone else ?!? Eh..... :waitasec:

As I understand it, in the US MedicAlert bracelets are personalised with the name of the owner and details of the reason for having the bracelet, eg an allergy or medical condition. If this bracelet is personalised but hasn't led to the identification of the wearer then either MedicAlert's records are incomplete or the bracelet does indeed belong to someone else.

The other possible explanation is that this woman was not American as the MedicAlert scheme is also active in a number of other countries, though it's possible the same degree of personalisation may not apply outside the US.

There's a list of the other countries in the scheme on Wikipedia:

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/MedicAlert

As you can see, other than Iceland and the US they are all members of the Commonwealth.

Giuc0 · Apr 23, 2018

Ok.

I am waiting for more info about the medical alert bracelet by the case manager. IF I hear something back, which is not a given.

However, apart the US, when did each country join the MedicAlert scheme ? Because if, for example, country X joined the scheme in 1986, it rules out our JD being from said country (since she was found in 1979).
We can't proceed further without this info

Giuc0 · Apr 23, 2018

From https://www.medicalert.co.nz/content/about-medicalert/medicalert-worldwide.aspx

[FONT=&amp][FONT=&amp]USA : 1958[/FONT][/FONT]
[FONT=&amp][FONT=&amp]Cyprus : 1975[/FONT][/FONT]
[FONT=&amp][FONT=&amp]Canada : 1961[/FONT][/FONT]
[FONT=&amp][FONT=&amp]Zimbabwe : 1968[/FONT][/FONT]
[FONT=&amp][FONT=&amp]South Africa : 1964[/FONT][/FONT]
[FONT=&amp][FONT=&amp]Australia : 1971[/FONT][/FONT]
[FONT=&amp][FONT=&amp]Iceland : 1984[/FONT][/FONT]
[FONT=&amp][FONT=&amp]NZ : 1962[/FONT][/FONT]
[FONT=&amp][FONT=&amp]UK : 1964[/FONT][/FONT]
[FONT=&amp][FONT=&amp]Malaysia : 1967

it rules out our JD being from Iceland, as our JD was found in 1979, years before the scheme was implemented in Iceland.
[/FONT][/FONT]

[FONT=&amp]
[/FONT]

Giuc0 · Apr 23, 2018

Based on the cosmetics and the keys found with her + the medicalert bracelet, I doubt she was a transiant.
And what would be the motive to wear someone else's MedicAlert ?

More likely, the perp dumped her there because he knew the place and it'll make ID difficult.

Giuc0 · Apr 23, 2018

Interesting !! ME thinks that she is 50+ : http://mec.lacounty.gov/wps/portal/...il?unidentified=1&getPic=1&CaseNum=1979-12521

Giuc0 · Apr 23, 2018

Ok, I've just heard back from the medical officer.

The MedicAlert bracelet was for diabetes. He has no idea from which country, no serial number reported (I think from sloppy record keeping), and no owner name was reported. Once again, sloppy record keeping or very basic medical alert bracelet.

I asked him some other questions to clarify some aspects.

Meanwhile, we must search missing persons with diabetes to get a match.

CA CA - Los Angeles Co, WhtFem UP4396, 40-60, maybe name Julie or Juliette Young, Oct'79

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