IN - Abigail Williams, 13, & Liberty German, 14, Delphi, 13 Feb 2017 #58

tlcya · May 10, 2017

Missing%20Girls_1487042903108_55088620_ver1.0_640_480.jpg

Carroll County Sheriff Toby Leazenby said Abigail Williams and Liberty German were last seen around 1 p.m. when they were dropped off to go hiking at High Bridge, just east of Delphi.

Police ID bodies of Indiana girls

Two bodies found along a northern Indiana stream are those of two teenage girls who went missing Mondayand their deaths are being investigated as homicides, authorities said on Wednesday.

State Police Sgt. Kim Riley said autopsies performed Wednesday determined that the bodies are those of Liberty German, 14, and Abigail Williams, 13, both of Delphi.

Their bodies were found Tuesday afternoon along Deer Creek near Delphi, about 60 miles northwest of Indianapolis. Police said the girls’ bodies were about three-quarters of a mile from an abandoned railroad bridge where they were dropped off Monday to go hiking.

ISP page dedicated to the investigation

Anyone with information about this case, no matter how insignificant, is encouraged to call the Delphi Homicide Investigation Tip Line at (844) 459-5786.

Information can also be reported by calling the Indiana State Police at (800) 382-7537, or the Carroll County Sheriff’s Department at (765) 564-2413.

Information can also be emailed to Abbyandlibbytip@cacoshrf.com

video of press conference of 02/22/17: https://www.facebook.com/NewsCenter1...4728963476130/

ISP page dedicated to the investigation (includes audio of suspect)

Pictures of Abby and Libby
Link to post with all Threads #1-98(Courtesy of margarita25)

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*Media Maps & Timelines*
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Rules Etiquette & Information

Case map by skibaboo updated with the latest grayhuze crime flow video

grayhuze youtube channel

Verified Insiders: None in this case at this time. Verified Professional, Member michael.gartley, is a Verified Expert in Imaging Science.

RULES OF THIS DISCUSSION

1) There are no named POIs or suspects in this case. A search warrant was served upon the owner of the property (RL) where the girls' bodies were found. RL was taken into custody for an unrelated crime during that time. His statements to press and subsequent arrest for the unrelated matters are all open for discussion.

a. You may not outright accuse him of the murders but may make comparisons of his physical appearance and demeanor from MSM to those of the unidentified suspect on the bridge.

b. DO NOT post photos of random individuals to compare to the images of unidentified suspect on the bridge.

2) IF YOU WANT TO POST ABOUT A REGISTERED SEX OFFENDER YOU MUST GET PERMISSION FIRST. Please send a PM to a moderator to gain that permission.

3) Do not sleuth family, PERIOD. This includes previous public records which have nothing to do with this case. They are victims here. Plain and simple.

4) If you feel you have a tip by all means phone it in. Do NOT discuss your tip here. Contact the authorities and give them time to follow your lead.

tlcya · May 10, 2017

ADMIN NOTE: Before posting please be sure to thank post #1 to indicate you have read and understand the parameters and rules of this discussion.

Carry on.

EmmaRose · May 10, 2017

Did any reporters see or record LE removing "evidence" from the actual crime scene? (Not what they got from RL's house).

MistyWaters · May 10, 2017

EmmaRose said:
I worry about that too, but I am glad they are going back over them. At that time, with the volume of tips and so many people fielding them, it may have been easier to overlook the significance of some of them. Maybe the earlier tips might make more sense to them at this point in time because LE has more info now --hopefully. Maybe something will click. I sure hope so. This perp is way too dangerous to be free, serial killer or not.

I agree. Early on they were flooded with tips and having such a huge team that was put together essentially overnight, something critical may have been overlooked. So I also think it makes a lot more sense to revisit what they have, than only asking for more that are likely a lot of duplications anyway. By now any person who wants to come forward with valuable information knows who to contact without being asked.

Let's hope it proves worthwhile.

MistyWaters · May 10, 2017

From the end of the last thread -

Most recent update:
"Asked for an update on the investigation, Leazenby said more analysis of some of the evidence has come in, and detectives are revisiting some of the 18,000 leads they received in the weeks after the killings. Additionally, the detectives now have fewer than 1,000 leads left to sift through, he said."
http://www.jconline.com/story/news/local/2017/05/07/hundreds-reclaim-delphis-trail-peace/101297052/

MistyWaters · May 10, 2017

EmmaRose said:
Did any reporters see or record LE removing "evidence" from the actual crime scene? (Not what they got from RL's house).

No, not that I've noticed and if they did, I'm sure it would've been discussed. However iirc one reporter claimed to notice "girls clothing" in the river, spotted from a heliocopter.

Alethea · May 10, 2017

I haven't thought about the billboards in a while. Why go through that trouble and dig through the thousands of tips nationwide? I am starting to think SK.

Joesph Duncan III admitted (once he was in prison for the murder of the Groene family and the kidnapping and brutal abuse of Shasta, and the murder of Dylan) to murdering Anthony Martinez in California and Sammiejo White and Carmen Cubias together in Seattle. He says he has done other "terrible things" but hasn't admitted yet to others. No one suspected him and those cases went cold until he was caught with Shasta and started blabbing.

A little OT but a serial killer here could be related to a case we think was too far or too dissimilar to this too. It's interesting.

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Burnt Toast · May 10, 2017

EmmaRose said:
Did any reporters see or record LE removing "evidence" from the actual crime scene? (Not what they got from RL's house).

it sounds like they found quite a bit.

Police collected a significant amount of evidence from the scene, but police aren't specifically saying what that evidence is. It's being analyzed, Leazenby said, and Carroll County sheriff's Detective Kevin Hammond said most of the evidence went to the Indiana State Police lab, but some went to the FBI lab.
“We’ve gotten some (analysis) back, but we can’t really discuss what we’ve gotten back,” Hammond said. “There’s a large amount of stuff to be tested.”

http://www.jconline.com/story/news/...rs-shift-through-analysis-evidence/100347324/

mistywater posted a link this morning in the last thread that is a article that is from just a few days ago that supports they are still waiting on some of the testing results. however, we don't know where the evidence they are waiting on was collected from.

Alethea · May 10, 2017

EmmaRose said:
Did any reporters see or record LE removing "evidence" from the actual crime scene? (Not what they got from RL's house).

I'm sure they blocked it off. In other cases the media has been banned and tents or blockades set up due to the sensitivity of the situation.

puppyraiser · May 10, 2017

Burnt Toast said:
it sounds like they found quite a bit.

Police collected a significant amount of evidence from the scene, but police aren't specifically saying what that evidence is. It's being analyzed, Leazenby said, and Carroll County sheriff's Detective Kevin Hammond said most of the evidence went to the Indiana State Police lab, but some went to the FBI lab.
“We’ve gotten some (analysis) back, but we can’t really discuss what we’ve gotten back,” Hammond said. “There’s a large amount of stuff to be tested.”

http://www.jconline.com/story/news/...rs-shift-through-analysis-evidence/100347324/

mistywater posted a link this morning in the last thread that is a article that is from just a few days ago that supports they are still waiting on testing results.

That's interesting. I thought at first they weren't sure if it was a double homicide yet they got a significant amount of evidence from the crime scene?

St. Anthony2017 · May 10, 2017

Alethea said:
I haven't thought about the billboards in a while. Why go through that trouble and dig through the thousands of tips nationwide? I am starting to think SK.

Joesph Duncan III admitted (once he was in prison for the murder of the Groene family and the kidnapping and brutal abuse of Shasta, and the murder of Dylan) to murdering Anthony Martinez in California and Sammiejo White and Carmen Cubias together in Seattle. He says he has done other "terrible things" but hasn't admitted yet to others. No one suspected him and those cases went cold until he was caught with Shasta and started blabbing.

A little OT but a serial killer here could be related to a case we think was too far or too dissimilar to this too. It's interesting.

Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

Yes but this time they have a photo and voice clip to compare to tips of suspects. I hope this killers luck has run out and that he will soon be brought to justice. If no DNA in system they can get Court order to get a test done. The fact that this killer is middle aged may mean he was never swabbed before. So glad more states are swabbing all felons. Libby truly was a hero getting first picture and voice of this SK imo.

cluciano63 · May 10, 2017

puppyraiser said:
That's interesting. I thought at first they weren't sure if it was a double homicide yet they got a significant amount of evidence from the crime scene?

I do not believe that is true. Once they found the two bodies, I am pretty sure they knew it was no accident. But with any death(s) of unknown cause or circumstances, LE would gather up whatever they find in the general area. Much of what they sent for testing may not be related to the crimes at all, but they still gather and submit. Jmo

Burnt Toast · May 10, 2017

puppyraiser said:
That's interesting. I thought at first they weren't sure if it was a double homicide yet they got a significant amount of evidence from the crime scene?

what they said was "they suspect foul play" which is pretty standard language upon the discovery of bodies. from the bridge to the CS is a pretty large area where potential evidence could be.

MistyWaters · May 10, 2017

puppyraiser said:
That's interesting. I thought at first they weren't sure if it was a double homicide yet they got a significant amount of evidence from the crime scene?

Unless you have a media link suggesting investigators weren't sure it was a double homicide at the onset, that's an example of how misinfirmation spreads to the point of it becoming an incorrect fact. This was also a discussion on thread #57 where you can find LE quotes from the early interviews. Nowhere did they suggest they weren't sure what had occurred,

St. Anthony2017 · May 10, 2017

I have gone to the Zodiac Killer thread on Websleuths because we can't discuss him here but if you go on that thread it's pretty interesting to see the fascination with the number 13 and other things. The Delphi killer could be a copycat. See you on the Zodiac thread!

Maplesyrup · May 10, 2017

I also think SK. When the ISP superintendent spoke and asked why Libby, why Abby, why Delphi and why Carroll County that caught my intention. I have to wonder even at that point did they suspect a SK from out of the area. As previous posters have mentioned, SK's often leave leave a calling card, something LE won't release to the public but with their training and experience, they recognize it quickly. Calling in the FBI, the billboards, etc all make me think they didn't think this was a first time offense for this killer. Maybe why they didn't think the people of Delphi were in immediate danger as they "knew" from seasoned LE higher up the chain of command that this killer would hit and run and be long gone. Let's hope that THIS time dear sweet Libby beat him at his game by capturing his voice and his photo/video. I look forward to the day he shuffles along in handcuffs, wears leg irons and his wardrobe consists of Halloween orange jumpsuits. IMO

ninij9 · May 10, 2017

Just checking in. Super sad this has gone on so very long. Everyone here doing an awesome job keeping the fires going though.

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Burnt Toast · May 10, 2017

MistyWaters said:
From the end of the last thread -

Most recent update:
"Asked for an update on the investigation, Leazenby said more analysis of some of the evidence has come in, and detectives are revisiting some of the 18,000 leads they received in the weeks after the killings. Additionally, the detectives now have fewer than 1,000 leads left to sift through, he said."
http://www.jconline.com/story/news/local/2017/05/07/hundreds-reclaim-delphis-trail-peace/101297052/

i am curious as to what forensic testing has come back, and what they are LE still waiting on? And, does "more" analysis mean that they are doing additional or further testing on things that have been tested?. given how tight lipped LE has been throughout this case, i am grateful they shared the statement about the evidence. it was time for some kind of update.

Peace777 · May 10, 2017

Found this video of a lady being interview (friend of RL) after his sentencing. Listen to what she says at the .34-.35s mark.
[video=youtube;8nT0vKaIPoc]https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=8nT0vKaIPoc[/video]

Confusion · May 10, 2017

Posted by Han
Texas is a big state. Do you know how close together they lived?

They were about 600 miles apart, but for a truck driver that doesn't seem so far. It was either El Paso or Fort Bliss at the time, I think. I know he lived in both places, but I can't remember which one was on which dates.

Posted by Shiressleuth
Are you able to post your opinions about this theory, within TOS of course?

He is 40, was wanted for child molestation but had no previous record of it, he lived within an hour or so of Delphi, ~400 miles from Evansdale when those girls were murdered (there are/were also elderly people in that area with the same last name, but I never found out if they were related), ~600 miles from Amber when she was murdered, had been wanted since 1-30-17 but hadn't posted on SM since 2-11-17, had a body and coloring that I thought fit BG, had a fairly extensive criminal record, and a few other things. I did call in about him, but he was arrested a while later and nothing was ever said about him being related to this case.

IN - Abigail Williams, 13, & Liberty German, 14, Delphi, 13 Feb 2017 #58

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