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Nehemiah

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Even though I'm all about some *southern hospitality*, I find it somewhat odd that the Ramseys stayed with the Stines for such a length of time, or even at all for that matter.

Either:
A.John misled during his depos and the Rs/Stines were very good friends; or,

B.they were really not that close friends before the murder and the Rs moved in with them, making the situation more strange.

The Rs were wealthy people and could have afforded to do most anything in regards to living arrangements. Don Paugh had an apartment in Boulder and he was family. Seems that the Rs would have bunked up there, or rented another place, with friends coming in/out to check on them, bring meals, etc...

Any thoughts?
 
Nehemiah said:
Even though I'm all about some *southern hospitality*, I find it somewhat odd that the Ramseys stayed with the Stines for such a length of time, or even at all for that matter.

Either:
A.John misled during his depos and the Rs/Stines were very good friends; or,

B.they were really not that close friends before the murder and the Rs moved in with them, making the situation more strange.

The Rs were wealthy people and could have afforded to do most anything in regards to living arrangements. Don Paugh had an apartment in Boulder and he was family. Seems that the Rs would have bunked up there, or rented another place, with friends coming in/out to check on them, bring meals, etc...

Any thoughts?
Click to expand...


Nehemiah,

I'm convinced the Ramseys and the Stines were close friends both before and after the murder. John's denial of the friendship during a sworn deposition was revealing because it was obviously blatantly false.

For example, before the killing the Ramseys and the Stines were together in New York during the weekend while JonBenet rode in a Boulder parade on December 6, 1996. And after the killing the Ramseys and the Paughs moved into the cramped single family Boulder home of the Stines and stayed for five months before moving to Atlanta. And the Stines were one of only three stops the Ramseys planned to make on Christmas night to drop off gifts to friends while returning from the White's dinner party.

When someone is blatantly lying it's a signal to look in the opposite direction of what they are saying to uncover the truth. IOW, the Ramseys are obviously VERY good friends of the Stines, but publicly they want to distant themselves from them. So why are they doing this? Was a Stine family member somehow involved in the killing of JonBenet and therefore they want to keep a low profile on the relationship?

BlueCrab
 
But, by moving in with them, they are not distancing themselves. They are very much calling attention to the fact that are/were together.
 
Well either the truth is being told, and their stay was simply a matter of convenience.

Or as BlueCrab suggests a Stine family member is involved!


Else a more secretive friendship endured possibly embracing a liberal lifestyle, which after JonBenet's death, entailed denial of any close friendship?

We also know not only about ST socializing with the Ramsey's, but with her determination to act as their invisible press agent by proxy.

So IMO the most charitable interpretation is that the Stines were good friends who stuck by the Ramseys, but this contradicts what JR stated!
 
Don't forget Judith Phillips also stated the Ramseys and Stines weren't close friends.
 
tipper said:
Don't forget Judith Phillips also stated the Ramseys and Stines weren't close friends.
Click to expand...

Yes, and I think she would know as she was *friends* with both. That makes the situation of staying with the Stines even more perplexing and odd.
 
Nehemiah said:
Yes, and I think she would know as she was *friends* with both. That makes the situation of staying with the Stines even more perplexing and odd.
Click to expand...
Not really. I think Susan Stine saw this as her chance to get close to Patsy. I'll bet she was the one who brought it up.
 
Okay, this is a super dumb question but why did JR deny his

friendship with them if everyone knew they stayed with them??

What was his motive for lying about their friendship. I don't know

much about the stines.
 
tipper said:
Not really. I think Susan Stine saw this as her chance to get close to Patsy. I'll bet she was the one who brought it up.
Click to expand...
Well, I don't doubt that but, still...it is very odd that they would bunk up with people who are not close friends and stay with them an extended period of time. There has to be more to the situation. Like I said, Grandpa had an apartment in Boulder. They could have afforded to stay anywhere in Boulder, so to go to someone's home and live for months...very strange.
 
Nehemiah said:
Well, I don't doubt that but, still...it is very odd that they would bunk up with people who are not close friends and stay with them an extended period of time. There has to be more to the situation. Like I said, Grandpa had an apartment in Boulder. They could have afforded to stay anywhere in Boulder, so to go to someone's home and live for months...very strange.
Click to expand...


Nehemiah,

Possibly not so strange, if you have an agenda to fulfill and make sure any chronology, e.g. prior night time visits, are synchronized, along with any loose ends that need tidied up, are all attended to!
 
I remember reading that interview,and was more than willing to accept Johns'explanation of not being "close" friends with the Stines,until after the murder.

Until,I kept reading, and noticed how the LE loosened his interpretation of "close friends",to (paraphrasing),people you invite over for dinner,etc.,John mentioned every one he possibly could,but stayed away from the Stine's.It was at this point,IMO,that it dawned on the LE that John was purposely leaving out the Stine's,and John at this point,knew the LE was trying their damnest to have John mention the Stine's as friends. Not close friends,but at the very least friends.John wouldn't budge.

It was a cat and mouse game.Until the LE had to come right out and name the Stine's.This was when John proclaimed they were not "close friends" with the Stine's until after the murder,still not commiting to the fact,that the Stine's,were maybe not close friends,but indeed friends,before the murder.
 
Nehemiah said:
Well, I don't doubt that but, still...it is very odd that they would bunk up with people who are not close friends and stay with them an extended period of time. There has to be more to the situation. Like I said, Grandpa had an apartment in Boulder. They could have afforded to stay anywhere in Boulder, so to go to someone's home and live for months...very strange.
Click to expand...
I don't think the apartment was very big. Can't remember where I read that, maybe one of Patsy's interviews. I expect it was also healthier for Burke to stay where he had a friend to play with.
 
capps said:
I remember reading that interview,and was more than willing to accept Johns'explanation of not being "close" friends with the Stines,until after the murder.

Until,I kept reading, and noticed how the LE loosened his interpretation of "close friends",to (paraphrasing),people you invite over for dinner,etc.,John mentioned every one he possibly could,but stayed away from the Stine's.It was at this point,IMO,that it dawned on the LE that John was purposely leaving out the Stine's,and John at this point,knew the LE was trying their damnest to have John mention the Stine's as friends. Not close friends,but at the very least friends.John wouldn't budge.

It was a cat and mouse game.Until the LE had to come right out and name the Stine's.This was when John proclaimed they were not "close friends" with the Stine's until after the murder,still not commiting to the fact,that the Stine's,were maybe not close friends,but indeed friends,before the murder.
Click to expand...
I can't remember, what did they ask Patsy about the Stines?
 
Even more strange to me, is why the Ramseys would stay with anyone there in boulder if they could possibly be putting some other family with children into danger from either a revenge seeking insider, a foreign faction, or some sadistic serial killer. There is no way I would put my children into that type of danger for some friend.
 
ellen13 said:
Okay, this is a super dumb question but why did JR deny his

friendship with them if everyone knew they stayed with them??

What was his motive for lying about their friendship. I don't know

much about the stines.
Click to expand...
http://websleuths.com/forums/showthread.php?t=28215&page=1&pp=25&highlight=fernies+close+friends

Start about #8
 
UKGuy said:
Nehemiah,

Possibly not so strange, if you have an agenda to fulfill and make sure any chronology, e.g. prior night time visits, are synchronized, along with any loose ends that need tidied up, are all attended to!
Click to expand...






-----------The first odd musical note was when Ms. Stine answers the Ramsey family door to BPD who responded to the odd 911 call on the 23rd. Would you answer someones door to the police, when you had been invited as a guest for a party in their home, odd. I find the word presumptuous useful here.

I tend to agree with UKGuy on the synchronization of 'vital choreography' for Dec 25/26. Two little guys who are close buddies, are a 'good' reason to bring them closer together to help ease the loss of JonBenet for Burke. But the grandparents as well ?? when they had their OWN apartment in town, now that is ODD. Awkward is another word that comes to my mind.

The truth has never been told for the many months long living liason.



.
 
Judith Phillips was friends with Patsy before the murder and is not anymore. What do you make of this? Could Judith Phillips have been involved in the coverup? Or the murder? The fact that Patsy won't speak to Judith Phillips makes it even more suspicious. I wouldn't speak to someone I thought had murdered my daughter. Has anyone checked out Judith Phillips?
 
tipper said:
Not really. I think Susan Stine saw this as her chance to get close to Patsy. I'll bet she was the one who brought it up.
Click to expand...


Oh yes! SS probably figured (hoped?) Patsy would need someone to bathe her and wash her hair..............!lol!
 
Camper said:
------------>My memory is fading, but I seem to recall that the Stines lived 6 blocks from the Ramseys. A distance that would have been easy driving distance the morning of the 26th, to return an overnight young guest. I would also guess that a young guest had his own cell phone to have made a phone call from the R's.

WE=WS'ers, had speculated in earlier sleuth years, that an overnight guest could have 'gone home in the night' via a bicycle, er been picked up by someone. Recall if you will, Mr. Stine did not arrive with the entourage the morning of the 26th, am I right BlueCrab? As I recall Ms. Stine was present, yes or no?

So, IF I am right on my recall, someone would have had to stay with the young Stine boy at their home. Where was NI, did he go 'home' for Christmas, er?

PS: I had another speculation about the missing video Christmas morning. Could the young Stine have come over and arrangements made on the video to stay overnight. Just a wild hair, that popped into my head.

.
Click to expand...


Camper,

Revealingly, no one from the Stine's household were called to come over to the Ramsey's home on the morning of the 26th, even though the Stine's lived the closest (six blocks away). Patsy instead called the Whites (one mile away) and the Fernies (about five miles away).

I'm not sure about NI's whereabouts that morning. He may have been in the Stine's house (he lived there) or he may have gone home to California for the holidays. NI was a senior at CU and a member of Asian Pacific American Coalition, a pro-active liberal political organization on campus. APAC mysteriously folded just weeks after JonBenet was murdered. NI has managed to keep a low profile in this case and not even the cops were aware of his presence until the year 2000. A WS poster e-mailed NI and reported that NI told him he was in California on Christmas. NI lived with the Stines and regularly drove JonBenet, Burke, and Doug to school. How the cops nor the media knew anything about him is indeed strange. For instance, despite about 500 names listed in the name index of Larry Schiller's book PMPT, NI is not mentioned. I exposed his name to the internet several years ago.

BlueCrab
 
BlueCrab said:
[...]
IMO the reason for turning the house into a fortified commune was control of the children. The Ramseys, Paughs, and Stines were in a seige mode and Susan Stine was in charge of the draw bridge over the moat. The media referred to Susan as "the gatekeeper" and the cops called her "Patsy's pit bull". Children can innocently blurt out the truth about almost anything when engaged in conversation. Therefore, the main goal appeared to be to keep control of the two 10-year-old boys and not let anyone get close enough to talk to them. The tight control worked because not as much as one quote was obtained by the media from Burke or Doug during those five months.

BlueCrab
Click to expand...
And yet they sent the boys to school everyday?

I can't find information on the Paughs staying at the Stines (other than posts by you.) Can you give a source on that?
 
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