Staging?

shiloh

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If the Ramseys are responsible for JBR's death, and her death was solely the result of a head injury, there would have been no need to tie her up, hide her in the basement, sexually abuse her or wipe her down, put duct tape over her mouth, or concoct an elaborate kidnapping scenario, because that creates an even harder situation to explain away. A death resulting from a head injury, even a severe one, could easily have been accidental, and they could have denied any knowledge of prior sexual abuse.

I don't believe that the sexual abuse was staging at all, but was the primary motivating factor which set off the rest of the chain of events that occurred that night.
 
The Ramseys didn't co-operate with the police investigation into an alleged intruder killing their daughter - what makes you think they'd be more co-operative if they'd actually been involved?
 
Jayelles said:
The Ramseys didn't co-operate with the police investigation into an alleged intruder killing their daughter - what makes you think they'd be more co-operative if they'd actually been involved?
I don't.

Or, did you mean cooperation with each other? They have been very cooperative with each other from the start. They weren't cooperative with the police, other than giving some hair and blood samples.
 
shiloh said:
I don't.

Or, did you mean cooperation with each other? They have been very cooperative with each other from the start. They weren't cooperative with the police, other than giving some hair and blood samples.
So why do you think the Ramseys wouldn't have performed staging if they had been involved? Everything we've seen of them suggests that they have distanced themselves from the investigation. They were very status and image conscious. The staging is the ONE thing that I believe points to an insider. An outsider would have no need to stage anything.
 
I mean... (sorry I need coffee!) The staging has worked for whomever killed JonBenet because it muddied the waters so much that nothing makes sense.
 
Jayelles said:
So why do you think the Ramseys wouldn't have performed staging if they had been involved? Everything we've seen of them suggests that they have distanced themselves from the investigation. They were very status and image conscious. The staging is the ONE thing that I believe points to an insider. An outsider would have no need to stage anything.

Good old selfishness, shiloh. That, combined with self-preservation can be a powerful thing.
 
Jayelles said:
I mean... (sorry I need coffee!) The staging has worked for whomever killed JonBenet because it muddied the waters so much that nothing makes sense.
But don't you see, no staging would have been necessary if she were simply hit on the head, and that alone was the cause of her death, regardless of whether or not someone in the family had been sexually abusing her previously, because that could have easily been dealt with by a simple denial of knowing anything about it.

But if she was being bound and sexually abused at the time of her death, and the cause of death was the strangulation (which is in accordance with the findings of Dr. Meyers), then they would be unable to call the police and report her death as an accident, and would have to concoct an intruder theory. A kidnapping scenario was fresh in their minds, since they had watched the movie Ransom at the White's house that evening.

The head blow would have been done out of sheer rage at JBR for putting him in that situation by dying. I maintain that she was already at the point of death by the time she was hit on the head. This is the only scenario which makes any sense to me at all, no matter who the actual perpertrator was.
 
Somehow I doubt their denials of sex abuse would have lasted, shiloh.
 
Really?

The sexual abuse of JonBenet is a FACT. The existence of fibers from JR's shirt in JBR's underwear is apparently also a fact, according to forensic evidence obtained by Bruce Levin. Blood in her vagina and on her perineum was not caused by bubble baths. There's plenty of reason for denial.
 
shiloh said:
Really?

The sexual abuse of JonBenet is a FACT. The existence of fibers from JR's shirt in JBR's underwear is a FACT. Blood in her vagina and on her perineum was not caused by bubble baths. There's plenty of reason for denial.

Right! That's what I mean. How could they not know?
 
shiloh said:
I don't believe that the sexual abuse was staging at all, but was the primary motivating factor which set off the rest of the chain of events that occurred that night.
I agree. But IMO the abuse wasn't "sexual" in nature.
 
shiloh said:
But if she was being bound and sexually abused at the time of her death, and the cause of death was the strangulation (which is in accordance with the findings of Dr. Meyers), then they would be unable to call the police and report her death as an accident...
Agreed, though IMO "bound and sexually abused" was: gripped by the shirt/neck to the point of choking while being vaginally abused.
 
SuperDave said:
Good old selfishness, shiloh. That, combined with self-preservation can be a powerful thing.
Yep. Creating a phony crime scene is only done by a perp who has some 'splainin' to do.
 
Britt said:
I agree. But IMO the abuse wasn't "sexual" in nature.
Vaginally abused but not sexual in nature??? I haven't read your theory. What is it?
 
I think Britt means that the abuse was not done for sexual reasons.
 
Exactly, SuperDave. Punitive vaginal abuse, not done for the sexual gratification of the perp.
 
shiloh said:
Vaginally abused but not sexual in nature??? I haven't read your theory. What is it?
Briefly... IMO the feces-soiled jeans on JB's bathroom floor and the red turtleneck sweater balled up on the counter are major clues. I think Patsy attacked JonBenet after a soiling accident.

I think, late that night JB was dressed in her next-morning clothes in prep for the early morning trip - her red turtleneck sweater and jeans, so Patsy wouldn't have to deal with that in the a.m.

IMO Patsy strangled JB by gripping her sweater around her neck, and that she vaginally punished her. "Toilet rage," I think they call it. She either then bashed her with the maglite or threw her against something causing the head blow.

Then, of course, came the exotic staged crime.
 
shiloh said:
Really?

The sexual abuse of JonBenet is a FACT. The existence of fibers from JR's shirt in JBR's underwear is apparently also a fact, according to forensic evidence obtained by Bruce Levin. Blood in her vagina and on her perineum was not caused by bubble baths. There's plenty of reason for denial.

Ah, but according to Nedra, she was only abused a "little bit."

There's a lot of denial going on in that family. My guess is there's a lot of deep, dark secrets.



There could be two different things going on...

JonBenet could have been being sexually abused, and Patsy knew this.

JonBenet was killed accidentally when she had a bedwetting accident.

So...

Then when the cover up began, she had to cover up the prior sexual abuse to point the finger away from the family (or whoever did this). So she used the broken end of the paintbrush. But the problem with this is, this would do nothing to hide the old abuse, which I think she was worried they would find (and they did).

It's like when a kid shows up at the ER and old broken bones show up on the X-ray, in addition to the current injury. Many times the kids who are abused are not taken to the hospital until they are near death. I would imagine the parent's are afraid these old injuries will show up...so they wait until they absolutely have to go...and many times rather than take their kid for help, they let them die. You see this a lot.

That may have been what was going on in Patsy's mind. She may have know that JonBenet had been sexually abused before and how on earth would they explain that? So the elaborate cover-up began.

I've always wondered why Patsy's dad flew out of town on standby the day before Xmas. Am I correct in this? It's been such a long time ago, my memory is fading a bit.

So this is why I think there was all the staging. Patsy was trying to hide the abuse. So she made it look like a intruder/kidnapping/rape thing to deflect away from the family. But the big problem is that the prior abuse would still be found in the autopsy.

And then you add in their money and connections, and the fact that they lawyer-up early, and had the good luck to have Ardnt on the scene, and there you go....

This of course is just speculation....
 
I agree with John Ramsey as to the order of the events that night. I don't know who he is referring to as "the world's best forensics experts," but as far as I can tell, they seem to have gotten it right.

"We have had some of the world's best forensics experts look at evidence. They have told us that JonBenet was strangled to death. The last act that this creature did to our daughter was a vicious blow to the head. That is irrefutable."

This would rule out Patsy, IMO, but does not necessarily rule in an intruder.
 
It doesn't seem like the Ramsey's ever really wanted to address the issue of the sexual assault that night, the wiping down, and large size panties being placed on JonBenet. John originally said that it was an "inside job" and there was the 118,000 ransom amount being the same as his bonus. The staging also included the possibility of an inside job and John sure did focus on that before anything else.
 

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