MO - Misty Horner & baby die in home birth, Lees Summit, 8 Dec 2006

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Wow, so sad. It's interesting that this man is a police officer and that his religion doesn't believe in any kind of medical interventions. What happens when he comes across a car accident or crime scene with victims with injuries? By law, he is supposed to summon paramedics and render aid if possible until paramedics get there. Does he not do that in his job? If not, he needs to be fired from the force. If he does do that and neglects his so-called religious beliefs, then that is very telling to me. I just don't see how he can be a police officer and not believe in medical interventions.

Plus, his wife was a former police dispatcher, so she obviously had enough intelligence (I would think) to know that she was in need of medical help. Why didn't she summon help herself??

Strange story.
 
I'm guessing she didn't summon help for herself because she has the same belief as her husband? I mean, if they chose to have a child together, this is something they had to have taken into consideration before hand, yes? It is everyone's personal right to believe what they want. Who are we to tell these folks their belief is wrong? Why would it be murder? If the guy intended to kill his wife and child via medical neglect, now that might be murder but this sounds like a dreadful set of circumstances to me.
 
californiacarrie said:
Who are we to tell these folks their belief is wrong?
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Who will tell them if we don't?

But I don't see how the husband can be charged with murder if the woman decided not to seek medical care.
 
californiacarrie said:
I'm guessing she didn't summon help for herself because she has the same belief as her husband? I mean, if they chose to have a child together, this is something they had to have taken into consideration before hand, yes? It is everyone's personal right to believe what they want. Who are we to tell these folks their belief is wrong? Why would it be murder? If the guy intended to kill his wife and child via medical neglect, now that might be murder but this sounds like a dreadful set of circumstances to me.
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Well, it IS everyones personal right to believe what they want. However, if his "beliefs" are impeding on his ability to his job, then his right is overstepping boundaries. I know that nothing in the article indicated that, but the fact that he is a police officer & doesn't believe in medical intervention, then at the least, his job performance needs to be investigated to ensure that he isn't carrying his beliefs into his job duties. I know that if I was injured and needed medical assistance, I wouldn't want the first responder to be someone whos religious beliefs dictated that I didn't need medical intervention.

I also believe that someones rights go to far when they impede on another persons life. Do they have other children? What if a child, a toddler or older child, died as a result of not receiving medical care because the parents didn't "believe" in it? There have been many cases where parents have been jailed because their religious beliefs meant that their child died, because they failed to secure medical intervention when the childs life depended on it. So, yes, in that aspect people DO have a right to believe what they want, but only as long as innocent people don't die because of it.
 
californiacarrie said:
By the way, does anyone know what the name of the religion is?
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I think its Christian Scientists who don't believe in medical treatment, generally speaking,and its Jehovah's Witness' who don't believe in blood transfusions/--Perhaps this cop belonged to an "offshoot" religion related to these---
 
I'll never understand the concept of believing in God and at the same time refusing medical treatment--Why would God not want anyone to seek medical treatment?After all, He gave us a brain to help ourselves
 
julianne said:
Wow, so sad. It's interesting that this man is a police officer and that his religion doesn't believe in any kind of medical interventions. What happens when he comes across a car accident or crime scene with victims with injuries? By law, he is supposed to summon paramedics and render aid if possible until paramedics get there. Does he not do that in his job? If not, he needs to be fired from the force. If he does do that and neglects his so-called religious beliefs, then that is very telling to me. I just don't see how he can be a police officer and not believe in medical interventions.

Plus, his wife was a former police dispatcher, so she obviously had enough intelligence (I would think) to know that she was in need of medical help. Why didn't she summon help herself??

Strange story.
Click to expand...

That's one of the questions that locals are talking about...concerning his job and his religious beliefs.

Tonight her mom and dad are going to talk about this. They said that they didn't come forward for fear that he'd ban them from her funeral.

I believe they said she went into labor on a Staurday, and she didn't deliver until the next Friday, but I need to check on this. I also believe they said that she was ill for 3 weeks after giving birth. The dead woman's friend was on camera today saying that the dad used a pair of dirty scissors to make a cut (so the baby could come out-I believe it was breech).

It sounds like she was very ill and died. I'm not sure she would have been able to get help, had she even tried. She was "surrounded" by other followers of this religion.

It's hard for me to believe this woman could have been so brainwashed, but I've seen it in my own family. I have a cousin who married a guy, and she completely tossed aside any of her religious beliefs, and now follows his and that of his family. I'm not sure exactly what the relgion is...but they also don't believe in medical intervention...and a host of other things. We're all stunned that she's gone in this direction...and it sounds like the woman who died came from a family that is equally puzzled as to how she fell for this religion.

I just think they should all be charged with murder. They allowed the baby to die. Then they all allowed the mother to die. All in the name of religion.
 
The reason I think they should be charged with murder, is because I believe they allowed her to die. They did nothing for her. Yes, it sounds like she went along with this religion, but at the point where she was obviously dying, something should have been done (actually, long before that, IMO).

So if my hubby has a heart attack, and I just let him die in front of me, and make no effort to get help, then I essentially killed him. Yes, he may have died anyway, but I allowed it to happen. That's murder, IMO.

People can believe in whatever they want...they can pray to the God of Saran Wrap for all I care, but when you allow another human being to die, in the name of religion...that's murder. At least in my book.

It will be interesting to see what happens in this case. I am always amazed how people can get hooked into these nutty beliefs. IMO, religion is used too much for personal freedom choices. In this case, it cost this woman her life, and the life of the baby. She made a bad choice going along with this religion...but they made a criminal choice when they allowed her to linger for weeks and then die. They knew she was dying. But they don't believe in medical intervention.

We can send Jack Kevorkian to prison for aiding people with suicides, but this guy and his followers can get off because this is their religion?
 
californiacarrie said:
By the way, does anyone know what the name of the religion is?
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They keep showing this...I'll pay attention and write it down. They are doing another story on this later tonight. It's not a religion that I've heard of. I don't know if there are a lot of followers, or just him and his family.

I know his former sister-in-law has been talking to the media and she's not got a lot of nice things to say about this religion.
 
californiacarrie said:
I'm guessing she didn't summon help for herself because she has the same belief as her husband? I mean, if they chose to have a child together, this is something they had to have taken into consideration before hand, yes? It is everyone's personal right to believe what they want. Who are we to tell these folks their belief is wrong? Why would it be murder? If the guy intended to kill his wife and child via medical neglect, now that might be murder but this sounds like a dreadful set of circumstances to me.
Click to expand...

No dreadful set of circumstances...it's not like they did everything they could do to try and save her and the baby. The husband and the other followers of this religion did nothing but allow them to die.

They kept her family out. She lingered for weeks (I believe), and then died. He refused to seek medical help. It's not like this happened in an afternoon. She went into labor on a Saturday, and didn't deliver until the following Friday. And if it is true about him using the dirty scissors to make the incision, then I think this guy should be held criminally.

Her family is not going to let this go. And I don't blame them.
 
Peter Hamilton said:
I'll never understand the concept of believing in God and at the same time refusing medical treatment--Why would God not want anyone to seek medical treatment?After all, He gave us a brain to help ourselves
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Exactly.
 
Mygirlsadie said:
Maybe their religion didnt believe in God?
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Apparently Misty joined in order to be closer to G_d.
 
How many of us would be dead right now if we didn't believe in doctors, etc. I know I would have been - I had an ectopic pregnancy in my early 30's - without medical intervention (surgery), I'd have been a goner......
 
The religion: what i found out. if true, it makes my blood boil even more:

The husband, Caleb Horner a Lee's Summit Police officer for 9yrs and his wife Misty Horner, were part of a religion allegedly started by his brother John Horner who believe in old time faith healing. Misty Horner's family thinks that this is a cult and that their daughter wanted so badly to be close to god that she was mislead and brainwashed by the religion of John Horner. He has written a book saying "those who buy drugs, have surgery, or get a doctor's advice are doing so because they reject Jesus as a healer."

http://30framesasecond.blogspot.com/2007/01/getting-close-to-god-can-be-deadly.html

i'm off to search for more about John Horner and his little book! :furious:
 
Hello dear poco, and how are you?


I do not understand when people choose to believe it is somehow, "not right" to receive medical intervention--especially when it is the only way a life may be saved. I believe in a very different God. Generally, I respect other people's belief's however different they are from mine; but, not in a case like this.

To me, this is another example of twisted thinking, and this time it is in the name of religion. It is such a shame. The tiny newborn baby never had a choice--maybe she could have been saved. Now she will never walk this earth because of a bad decision made by her parents.

Lion
 
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