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  1. #136
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    Jul 2014
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    Quote Originally Posted by Kano View Post
    Most likely not related at all but I remember a fairly well known family in Oklahoma named Nickles. One was a senator for quite awhile
    I believe I found his Wikipedia page. He was from a small north-central OK town, and the word "Tulsa" didn't even appear on the page.

  2. #137
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    Sep 2009
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    Quote Originally Posted by creepedout View Post
    I believe I found his Wikipedia page. He was from a small north-central OK town, and the word "Tulsa" didn't even appear on the page.
    More over the Nickles family was fairly welltodo in Oklahoma through those years. My sister was actually best friends with the senators niece in the early 1980s.

  3. #138
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    Jul 2014
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    572
    I'm following a trail on Ancestry.com, and it may be completely unrelated, so I'm going to post limited information about it, but I'm seeing some things that of interest. Anyone with an active Ancestry subscription should also be able to find this.

    I searched for individuals with the last name Nichols who lived in Oklahoma in the 1940s. A result came up for a person born in 1932 (consistent with Chandler's age). It appears as though in both 1935 and 1940, the person lived in Fort Towson, OK. This is only ~100 miles from Sherman, TX, where the real Chandler died in the car accident in 1945.

    I then queried Ancestry for individuals with this same name who lived in Rapid City in the 1970s. To my surprise, I got an exact match down to the birth year. It shows an address in Rapid City along with two mail drops in Eureka, Montana.

    Here's where things get weird. The Rapid City address listed in Ancestry appears to be fictitious. Entering it on Google maps drops you onto a railroad crossing. The building on the northwest side of the crossing has an address two digits lower, and none of the other buildings around have similar addresses. Entering the address on https://smartystreets.com/products/single-address generates a "Primary number invalid" error.

    I'm not going to get any more specific at the moment because it may be completely unrelated. But this seems a little too coincidental to not at least take a further look at.

    Opinions requested please.

  4. #139
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    Jun 2016
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    Quote Originally Posted by creepedout View Post
    I'm following a trail on Ancestry.com, and it may be completely unrelated, so I'm going to post limited information about it, but I'm seeing some things that of interest. Anyone with an active Ancestry subscription should also be able to find this.

    I searched for individuals with the last name Nichols who lived in Oklahoma in the 1940s. A result came up for a person born in 1932 (consistent with Chandler's age). It appears as though in both 1935 and 1940, the person lived in Fort Towson, OK. This is only ~100 miles from Sherman, TX, where the real Chandler died in the car accident in 1945.

    I then queried Ancestry for individuals with this same name who lived in Rapid City in the 1970s. To my surprise, I got an exact match down to the birth year. It shows an address in Rapid City along with two mail drops in Eureka, Montana.

    Here's where things get weird. The Rapid City address listed in Ancestry appears to be fictitious. Entering it on Google maps drops you onto a railroad crossing. The building on the northwest side of the crossing has an address two digits lower, and none of the other buildings around have similar addresses. Entering the address on https://smartystreets.com/products/single-address generates a "Primary number invalid" error.

    I'm not going to get any more specific at the moment because it may be completely unrelated. But this seems a little too coincidental to not at least take a further look at.

    Opinions requested please.
    I think I found your trail. First initial R and middle initial L on the Rapid City address? And living with his grandparents RN and AN and KN and possibly a sister PD in the 1940 Fort Towson, OK Census? You are right that the Rapid City address does not seem to exist. I looked for it in the property records here: http://www.pennco.org/index.asp?SEC=...3-1C43CA113B46 And came up with nothing. However, the date he had that address was 1977 and the road now appears to be a main HWY. Possibly it was not a main HWY in the 1970's. Perhaps the land was bought by the state to build the HWY and that is why the address does not exist today. When I search ancestry for the man by his first name, middle initial, last name with his exact date of birth as it appears on the Rapid City address record I find that 3 people have him listed in their family trees. He died in 2009 in Rapid City. And the RLN who lived in Rapid City in the 1970's does not appear to be the same as the one who lived in Fort Towson, OK in 1940, despite the same name and the the birth year being the same as the 1940 census. The RLN in Rapid City was Native American according to his family trees and the census records they linked, which is a different 1940 census from the Fort Towson one. The RN who lived in Fort Towson in 1940 was listed as white. They have different parents and are different people. I can't find what happened to the 8 year old RN after 1940. His mother, KN, died in Dec 1971. Since RN is a very common name, he might have moved anywhere in the country after 1940. Not sure how to track him down to rule out further unless someone finds his sister or a 1971 obituary for his mother (she was listed as a widow in the 1940 census).

  5. #140
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    Sep 2009
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    2,355
    Quote Originally Posted by Gardener1850 View Post
    I think I found your trail. First initial R and middle initial L on the Rapid City address? And living with his grandparents RN and AN and KN and possibly a sister PD in the 1940 Fort Towson, OK Census? You are right that the Rapid City address does not seem to exist. I looked for it in the property records here: http://www.pennco.org/index.asp?SEC=...3-1C43CA113B46 And came up with nothing. However, the date he had that address was 1977 and the road now appears to be a main HWY. Possibly it was not a main HWY in the 1970's. Perhaps the land was bought by the state to build the HWY and that is why the address does not exist today. When I search ancestry for the man by his first name, middle initial, last name with his exact date of birth as it appears on the Rapid City address record I find that 3 people have him listed in their family trees. He died in 2009 in Rapid City. And the RLN who lived in Rapid City in the 1970's does not appear to be the same as the one who lived in Fort Towson, OK in 1940, despite the same name and the the birth year being the same as the 1940 census. The RLN in Rapid City was Native American according to his family trees and the census records they linked, which is a different 1940 census from the Fort Towson one. The RN who lived in Fort Towson in 1940 was listed as white. They have different parents and are different people. I can't find what happened to the 8 year old RN after 1940. His mother, KN, died in Dec 1971. Since RN is a very common name, he might have moved anywhere in the country after 1940. Not sure how to track him down to rule out further unless someone finds his sister or a 1971 obituary for his mother (she was listed as a widow in the 1940 census).
    Just two things. We did have an address in South Dakota where the birth certificate was sent. It should be in the thread somewhere. And two, the UID did claim to have a sister in Columbus, Ohio.

  6. #141
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    Oct 2014
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    161
    Quote Originally Posted by Gardener1850 View Post
    ...When I search ancestry for the man by his first name, middle initial, last name with his exact date of birth as it appears on the Rapid City address record I find that 3 people have him listed in their family trees. He died in 2009 in Rapid City....
    Obviously the people listing the same man as dying in 09, then they likely were related and not our UID.

    However, in my experience, especially using other's Ancestry trees, if someone doesn't have info but another does, if the person shares the other's data without proof it's their kin then incorrect info can be spread. Such as, I was looking for Louis Kolar with a birthday, but could only find Louis Kohler born a year off and the day was wrong. It's likely him, as records were handwritten and could be inaccurate from back in 1900; but if there were 5 others using this data they'll put my ancestors in their tree and boom, who is whose Louis? (Go back to 1680 and imagine my research nightmare...)

    Also, many families used the same names throughout generations. Maybe one of these guys you're finding is a nephew or something. Because sometimes people drop off the radar or are forced. So for decades there's no mention and you get a young adult researching genealogy and they literally would have no clue because everyone already died.

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  7. #142
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    Oct 2014
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    161
    Quote Originally Posted by Owutatangledweb View Post
    Just two things. We did have an address in South Dakota where the birth certificate was sent. It should be in the thread somewhere. And two, the UID did claim to have a sister in Columbus, Ohio.
    haven't those addresses proven to be non existent or vacant at time?

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  8. #143
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    Sep 2009
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    2,355
    I think the address was real. We were researching a list of former tenants at the time. Maybe we need to look at that list again and see if there is a Nichols or Nicholas. It's somewhere around here in the thread: https://www.websleuths.com/forums/sh...s#post12169101

  9. #144
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    Sep 2009
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    Reposting Lola's post #63 which contains the links to investagotory documents. The address is in there somewhere with the list of former tenant names. I didn't find it yet. But reading his application for an apartment in Ohio, I noticed he has very unusual capital "M"s.

    Quote Originally Posted by lola2923 View Post
    A few more links to case files and other correspondence with regards to this case I have just come across..

    <ADMIN NOTE: WARNING: GRAPHIC IMAGES AT LINKS>

    Case Part 1: http://www.scribd.com/doc/267598309/...II-Case-part-1
    Case Part 2: http://www.scribd.com/doc/267598508/...II-Case-part-2
    Case Part 3: http://www.scribd.com/doc/267598502/...II-Case-part-3
    I do have the unedited crime scene photo links, but did not post them due to the graphic nature... I am new here and not sure what is allowed and what is not.
    Last edited by sillybilly; 01-14-2018 at 12:54 PM. Reason: PHOTOS ARE THERE AND ARE VERY GRAPHIC.

  10. #145
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    Sep 2009
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    2,355
    Address where social security card went:

    2326 1/2 Canyon Lake Drive, D
    Rapid City, South Dakota.

    I can't access the other documents due to some membership requirement for Scribd.

    One weird thing in studying what I could access. He purchased the gun in 2002 according to a receipt they found. The gun was originally purchased in Seagon, TX in 1966. His supposed resume begins in CA. in 1966. Coincidence? Or, do we not know enough about this gun? It appears to me the receipt was found in his belongings. Did he own the gun, hock it and buy it back? Is the receipt phony? But handwriting on receipt doesnt look like his. Too many missing pieces in this part of the investigation. Did he buy the gun in Texas and then reestablish in CA.? Is this guy originally from Texas?


  11. #146
    Join Date
    Jun 2016
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    Quote Originally Posted by Owutatangledweb View Post
    Just two things. We did have an address in South Dakota where the birth certificate was sent. It should be in the thread somewhere. And two, the UID did claim to have a sister in Columbus, Ohio.
    Quote Originally Posted by Owutatangledweb View Post
    Address where social security card went:

    2326 1/2 Canyon Lake Drive, D
    Rapid City, South Dakota.

    I can't access the other documents due to some membership requirement for Scribd.

    One weird thing in studying what I could access. He purchased the gun in 2002 according to a receipt they found. The gun was originally purchased in Seagon, TX in 1966. His supposed resume begins in CA. in 1966. Coincidence? Or, do we not know enough about this gun? It appears to me the receipt was found in his belongings. Did he own the gun, hock it and buy it back? Is the receipt phony? But handwriting on receipt doesnt look like his. Too many missing pieces in this part of the investigation. Did he buy the gun in Texas and then reestablish in CA.? Is this guy originally from Texas?
    Thanks for bringing that forward, that is NOT the address I was referencing above. I was discussing an address found on Ancestry by Creepedout. That address found by Creepout no longer exists but the person listed was real (died in 2009) and therefore not JNC.

  12. #147
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    Jun 2016
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    14,958
    Quote Originally Posted by ice190 View Post
    Obviously the people listing the same man as dying in 09, then they likely were related and not our UID.

    However, in my experience, especially using other's Ancestry trees, if someone doesn't have info but another does, if the person shares the other's data without proof it's their kin then incorrect info can be spread. Such as, I was looking for Louis Kolar with a birthday, but could only find Louis Kohler born a year off and the day was wrong. It's likely him, as records were handwritten and could be inaccurate from back in 1900; but if there were 5 others using this data they'll put my ancestors in their tree and boom, who is whose Louis? (Go back to 1680 and imagine my research nightmare...)

    Also, many families used the same names throughout generations. Maybe one of these guys you're finding is a nephew or something. Because sometimes people drop off the radar or are forced. So for decades there's no mention and you get a young adult researching genealogy and they literally would have no clue because everyone already died.

    Sent from my SM-G930V using Tapatalk
    Yes, I get what you are saying and agree that family trees can be wrong. In this instance (talking about the RN person Creepedout found) the family trees have additional documentation attached showing the man and his parents were Native Americans who lived in Rapid City and he had a Social Security Death record for 2009 with a birthdate matching (day/month/year) the birthdate attached to the no-longer-existing-address from the 1970's. So he was not JNC.

    In regards to the actual address that we know JNC used it might have been one that formerly existed but is no longer in use. But I have not researched that address. I follow this case somewhat sporadically.

  13. #148
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    Jul 2014
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    572
    In part two of the case file above, just a few pages down, is a rental application, where he listed his closest relative as "Mary R. Wilson", no phone number, 1823 Center Street, Columbus, OH, no zip code. Noted elsewhere in the case file (can't find at the moment) is something about "Address not located", and that's because it's completely fictitious. Google maps first asks which zip code, 43213 or 43219. Clicking on either lands you on a "Center Street" but nowhere near the correct house number.

  14. #149
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    Oct 2012
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    Dallas-Fort Worth, Texas
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    508
    Quote Originally Posted by Owutatangledweb View Post
    Address where social security card went:

    2326 1/2 Canyon Lake Drive, D
    Rapid City, South Dakota.

    I can't access the other documents due to some membership requirement for Scribd.

    One weird thing in studying what I could access. He purchased the gun in 2002 according to a receipt they found. The gun was originally purchased in Seagon, TX in 1966. His supposed resume begins in CA. in 1966. Coincidence? Or, do we not know enough about this gun? It appears to me the receipt was found in his belongings. Did he own the gun, hock it and buy it back? Is the receipt phony? But handwriting on receipt doesnt look like his. Too many missing pieces in this part of the investigation. Did he buy the gun in Texas and then reestablish in CA.? Is this guy originally from Texas?
    Do you mean Seagoville, Dallas County and partially Kaufman County, Texas for the gun purchase? Dallas suburb? There is no Seagon that I find.

    Big prison there.
    Last edited by Philigumbo; 01-14-2018 at 03:34 PM.
    If you listen closely enough, people will tell you exactly who they are...

  15. #150
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    May 2015
    Location
    North Carolina
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    Quote Originally Posted by creepedout View Post
    In part two of the case file above, just a few pages down, is a rental application, where he listed his closest relative as "Mary R. Wilson", no phone number, 1823 Center Street, Columbus, OH, no zip code. Noted elsewhere in the case file (can't find at the moment) is something about "Address not located", and that's because it's completely fictitious. Google maps first asks which zip code, 43213 or 43219. Clicking on either lands you on a "Center Street" but nowhere near the correct house number.
    What if the address was written incorrectly by accident or even on purpose. What if the person is real and he just put her maiden name to avoid detection or she was a friend, neighbor, or name he found in the phone book, etc.

    Unlikely, but just dreaming she could be a lead.

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