Germany - Body of newborn found in freezer, Baden-Wuerttemberg, May 2008

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Floh

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BERLIN (AP) -- Babies stashed away in freezers. A tiny skeleton found in a fish tank. Infants suffocated in plastic bags.
Germany has been gripped by soul-searching over a series of grisly cases of mothers murdering their babies at a time when the state is pushing legislation to encourage people to have more children.
Many of the suspects have been struggling single women who hid their pregnancy from friends and family, gave birth alone and killed the newborn out of fear or desperation -- increasing calls for support programs for single mothers.
In the latest case, police in the southwestern state of Baden-Wuerttemberg said Wednesday that a 20-year-old woman confessed to putting her newborn infant in the freezer about three or four weeks ago, thinking it was dead.
An autopsy has shown that the child was alive when put into the freezer and the woman, who was not identified, has been taken into custody.

More: http://edition.cnn.com/2008/WORLD/europe/05/28/babies.freezer.ap/index.html

I have no words . . .
 
This is so sad! I just do not even know what to say, on one hand I almost feel sorry for SOME of these women....do you guys have any kind of program for babies to be turned over anonymously if parents cannot or will not care for their babies?
 
This is just AWFUL, and sad.

Floh,
Does Germany (or parts of it) have similar programs to the SafeHaven laws here in the U.S?
 
I have zero pity for any mother who murders their infants. NONE. I think we try to come up with any and every excuse for these women because no way any "normal and sane" person could do something like this.
We blame depression, we blame drugs and we blame a "history of abuse" as excuses why these women just want to get rid of an unwanted child.

We tend to "understand" and "sympathize" with women who kill their kids. We want to say they are not responsible for their actions because they had PPD and their husbands beat them.

Whatever.

There is NO excuse for murder of an innocent child. EVER. PERIOD.

And some of my fellow WS will think of any and every excuse to "feel the pain" of these monsters. I don't get it. We as a society HAVE to protect our kids not protect the women that kill them.
 
Man, I could cry reading this. I would take ANY baby that someone did not want. Why kill them? Gosh, ENOUGH already! Cant we come up with something where these moms just take them somewhere and give them to people who want them. I know its wishful thinking, but one can hope. We have the Safe Haven Law but how many use it? Babies are still being killed.
 
MsPooh said:
This is so sad! I just do not even know what to say, on one hand I almost feel sorry for SOME of these women....do you guys have any kind of program for babies to be turned over anonymously if parents cannot or will not care for their babies?
Click to expand...

Not that i'm aware of. :(
 
StillHoping said:
This is just AWFUL, and sad.

Floh,
Does Germany (or parts of it) have similar programs to the SafeHaven laws here in the U.S?
Click to expand...

As i just replied to MsPooh, not that i know of. i don't think so. :(

they should and will have to, IMO.
 
pixies said:
I have zero pity for any mother who murders their infants. NONE. I think we try to come up with any and every excuse for these women because no way any "normal and sane" person could do something like this.
We blame depression, we blame drugs and we blame a "history of abuse" as excuses why these women just want to get rid of an unwanted child.

We tend to "understand" and "sympathize" with women who kill their kids. We want to say they are not responsible for their actions because they had PPD and their husbands beat them.

Whatever.

There is NO excuse for murder of an innocent child. EVER. PERIOD.

And some of my fellow WS will think of any and every excuse to "feel the pain" of these monsters. I don't get it. We as a society HAVE to protect our kids not protect the women that kill them.
Click to expand...

Count me well out of "understand" and "sympathize"! :furious:

there are so many people here who would ADOPT! who are desperate to adopt!
 
I cant for the life of me understand how someone can hurt a baby unless they are mental.
 
(Source)
At the other end of the spectrum, since 1999, 25 German cities have installed "Babyklappen," or "baby flaps," on the outside walls of buildings that house day nurseries. Positioned to give abandoning mothers some privacy, a baby flap works something like a video tape return slot, with a heated bed inside. When a baby is placed in the bed, an alarm alerts care providers. According to a study by University of London law professor Katherine O'Donovan, the flaps are not explicitly sanctioned by law, but none has yet been challenged in court.
Click to expand...

Obviously 25 cities are not enough.
 
I STAND CORRECTED by my partner.

in every city in at least one German hospital which has what is called, 'Babyklappe'. with pictures.

this is a 'drawer' on a hospital wall - hatches like a night safe idea - where you may place a baby anonymously and leave with no questions, no consequences. an alarm alerts hospital staff to go get the baby immediately.

JUST like Safe Haven.

partner says there is NO 'reason' to kill a baby in this country. these unwanted babies can be left safely.

i did not know this. now i do, it shows how even more apalling these babies deaths are. :furious:

and here is a picture of the one in Hamburg, where i live: http://www.photographybypolly.co.uk/showpic.shtml?c=things&p=babyklappe

translated (not perfect) wikipedia page explaining this baby klappe idea. 'Baby Flap'.

A baby flap allows mothers in need, her newborn anonymously for adoption release. A flap serves as the first aid agency to unwanted children from killing or suspension to protect. Increasingly directed private nonprofit and religious organizations and hospitals baby flaps. Because of unclear legal situation, they are controversial.

More: http://translate.google.com/transla...3Fq=Baby+Klappe&hl=en&client=safari&rls=en-us

Edited to add: i now understand the Safe Haven isn't a baby flap at all. babies can be left anonymously in shelters such as fire stations or hospitals.
 
pixies said:
I have zero pity for any mother who murders their infants. NONE. I think we try to come up with any and every excuse for these women because no way any "normal and sane" person could do something like this.
We blame depression, we blame drugs and we blame a "history of abuse" as excuses why these women just want to get rid of an unwanted child.

We tend to "understand" and "sympathize" with women who kill their kids. We want to say they are not responsible for their actions because they had PPD and their husbands beat them.

Whatever.

There is NO excuse for murder of an innocent child. EVER. PERIOD.

And some of my fellow WS will think of any and every excuse to "feel the pain" of these monsters. I don't get it. We as a society HAVE to protect our kids not protect the women that kill them.
Click to expand...

I understand how illness, drugs, etc might influence a women to do this...but I don't have sympathy for them at all. None.

ETA: It's difficult even coming to this website, b/c it upsets me so much.
 
Welcome Floh. The more info we have the more we understand. I wonder if this woman didn't have access to a Babyklappe?

Dreadfully sad case either way. Cases like this are infuriating because there is always someone who would be more than delighted to welcome an abandoned baby into their family.


Floh said:
You beat me to it! thank you.
Click to expand...
 
blaize said:
Welcome Floh. The more info we have the more we understand. I wonder if this woman didn't have access to a Babyklappe?

Dreadfully sad case either way. Cases like this are infuriating because there is always someone who would be more than delighted to welcome an abandoned baby into their family.
Click to expand...

Yes they would. many couples here very much wanting to give a baby love.
 
blaize:
excellent... good googling!

floh:
in light of the recent horrific cases of infanticide, seems d-land needs to advertise the baby flaps.

everybody:
who do we know in germany that could lead the effort to promote "flaps" with public service announcements, billboards, busses, flyers in conspicuous places, programs at schools & civic organizations, yada yada ? if there was just one key person can make enough noise to get the ball rolling................. i wonder who....
 
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