Cell phones. Privacy vs justice for Caylee

New Posts

butwhatif?

butwhatif?

Well-Known Member
Joined
Sep 24, 2008
Messages
3,598
Reaction score
39
I havent seen alot of discussion about the players who are refusing to hand over cell records. Mods feel free to merge if there is already a thread relating to this topic.

My intent is not to throw anyone under the bus, but to discuss the idea of the right to privacy vs justice for Caylee.

Firstly nobody would want to have their cell records released for the world to see the most personal details of your life. But these are not ordinary circumstances.
IMO, providing cell records will serve two purposes. 1: tracking Kc's movements, and any contact she had with them in order to bolster the case against her. 2. proving that you have nothing to hide regardless of its its involvment or knowledge of the crime, or even making money off of Caylees death.

Some of these are people who claim to have loved Caylee, so why would they value their privacy more than helping to get justice for her?

What are the motives for holding them back?

In RM's case it seems $$$$$$ was the motivater for deleting emails from his PC. And in one of his interviews they say something along the lines of "Now ,you gave us permission to download your cell phone data, but that didnt work out too well, did it?" So its possible he also deleted everything on his cell. But why?

JG's cell records that have been released only show calls and no text content.
His dad repeatedly mentioned in his interview with LE the financial strain he was under because of the case.

So the motivater for refusing to hand them over could be that they, and all the others who are not willing to hand them over, dont want the public to know that they have gained financially by selling pics or their stories to media.
If thats the case, do you think that the public has a right to know who made money from caylees death, and who could have leaked info before the docs were released?
If they sold their story, then just 'fess up!! At least it will prove that they are completely forthcoming and holding nothing back.

Also, if they are keen to hide these details, does it make you wonder what else they could be hiding?

What is the A's PI hiding? Why not jump at the oportunity to prove to the world you are not lying about anything?
And RK, the hero.....why not live up to that title?

If I were a player in the case, and my records were requested, even if they were humiliating for me, I would hand them over because justice for a murdered child outweighs my possible embarrasment.
Who cares about raunchy texts, or people reading your text arguments? Isnt justice for caylee more important?
The 'I dont want all my friends and relatives brought into this' excuse doesnt fly, since we all know the numbers are redacted.And even if they werent, again, isnt justice for caylee more important?
Am really interested to hear other peoples perspective on this.
 
The Anthony's PI is not giving his cell phone records to Casey's defense. Amy says giving her cell phone records to Casey's defense team is a violation of her privacy too. Same for JG. And RK.

Local and federal LE are the agencies responsible for investigating Caylee's death. They can and have subpoenaed records. They have tapped phones. Information that came out as part of the investigation will be given to the defense and eventually be made public. Hundreds of pages have been given to Casey's defense within the last couple of months that have not yet been made public.

Casey's defense team was hired to defend Casey. Any information deemed by a judge to be relevant to this cause they will get.

JM
 
I personally would have a problem with handing over ALL of my cell records. It's an invasion of privacy. Now if they asked for a specific time period, say May, June, July, I would have no problem. The issue isn't that they don't want to help, it's that handing over ALL records is way too broad.
 
I would turn in all mine to LE/FBI----to the defense I would say---> Pllllltttttttt!

Defense is trying to find somebody to throw under the bus---not trying to bring justice for Caylee but to try and get her killer set free. MO
 
nephers said:
I personally would have a problem with handing over ALL of my cell records. It's an invasion of privacy. Now if they asked for a specific time period, say May, June, July, I would have no problem. The issue isn't that they don't want to help, it's that handing over ALL records is way too broad.
Click to expand...

I would want any of "my" records not important to the case to be redacted. Other than this request/demand, they could have any info I have that would help this case.

I have always told my adult kids and grandkids, if you can't show and tell it to me, then you shouldn't be uploading and talking about it on the internet. And I am pretty open minded.

Good grief, this group of kids put worse info on their public web sites than what their phone records will show.
 
Just a thought, maybe CA, GA and LA should make all of their cell records from say Jan 2008 to present public...you know, just to set a good example.
 
well I would not hand anything over in FL. The Sunshine laws reveal private information about innocent people that want to remain anonymous. The point of the laws were to keep govt transparent, not to release carelessly redacted, personal documents all over the internet.
Unless I had key information that was absoultely critical to the case, i would not hand over anything if i didn't have to.
I am still blown away by the amount of information that has been revealed by these laws and subsequent abuse by the media.

JMHO of course. :)
 
JBean said:
well I would not hand anything over in FL. The Sunshine laws reveal private information about innocent people that want to remain anonymous. The point of the laws were to keep govt transparent, not to release carelessly redacted, personal documents all over the internet.
Unless I had key information that was absoultely critical to the case, i would not hand over anything if i didn't have to.
I am still blown away by the amount of information that has been revealed by these laws and subsequent abuse by the media.

JMHO of course. :)
Click to expand...

I hear ya about the amount of info revealed by the Sunshine Law. No way would my state even give a nano-second of consideration to do this. We are so behind in our state laws in some areas it isn't funny. It is sad.
 
nephers said:
I personally would have a problem with handing over ALL of my cell records. It's an invasion of privacy. Now if they asked for a specific time period, say May, June, July, I would have no problem. The issue isn't that they don't want to help, it's that handing over ALL records is way too broad.
Click to expand...

I get that people have a legal right to privacy, but I'm talking more about moral duty here.
See, I wouldnt care if they asked me to hand over every cell record over the last 10 years. Would I be ahamed of some of those texts from so long ago?

Absolutely! It would paint me as a lying , cheating,skanky drugtaking loser, which is not who I am today, but it was me 10 years ago. And I'd still hand them over without question if it meant helping to get justice for a murdered child. Geez, even if it was for something way less serious, I'd do it.
Would I be concerned that the def would try to use those things against me? Yep. But since I know I have nothing to hide, I'd do it anyway, knowing I had truth on my side.

If they are worried that handing over records could help the defense, then so be it! They arent helping the state either. We are after the truth here, and how can we get to the truth when KC has lied about so much, and key players are holding back?
We've seen the significance of cell records that have been released so far. They hold alot of clues that can piece the puzzle together, since kc refuses to tell the truth.
jmo
 
JBean said:
well I would not hand anything over in FL. The Sunshine laws reveal private information about innocent people that want to remain anonymous. The point of the laws were to keep govt transparent, not to release carelessly redacted, personal documents all over the internet.
Unless I had key information that was absoultely critical to the case, i would not hand over anything if i didn't have to.
I am still blown away by the amount of information that has been revealed by these laws and subsequent abuse by the media.

JMHO of course. :)
Click to expand...

ITA! Though, I wouldn't have any problem giving my cell phone records. I don't text, but if I did, I wouldn't want to give my text messages. Not to protect myself, but to respect the privacy of the people who texted me.

There has already been too much personal information about innocent people released in this case.
 
I believe in privacy, but with the murder of a baby..........everything counts including cell phone records for trial! Florida sunshine laws should not give out info on innocent people, though public record???
 
I really don't have a problem with the Sunshine Law. If my records might help in a murder investigation then I would hand them over to the investigators. Defense isn't LE/FBI. My records have already been looked at by LE/FBI---if the Judge told me to hand them to the defense then I would have to hand them over but the Judge would probably put me in jail because I would have some bad language goin on in the direction of the defense.
 
missy8394 said:
Just a thought, maybe CA, GA and LA should make all of their cell records from say Jan 2008 to present public...you know, just to set a good example.
Click to expand...

The defense DID request CA's & GA's cell phone records.

They did not object.

The judge ordered the records to be released to the defense.
 
butwhatif? said:
I get that people have a legal right to privacy, but I'm talking more about moral duty here.
See, I wouldnt care if they asked me to hand over every cell record over the last 10 years. Would I be ahamed of some of those texts from so long ago?

Absolutely! It would paint me as a lying , cheating,skanky drugtaking loser, which is not who I am today, but it was me 10 years ago. And I'd still hand them over without question if it meant helping to get justice for a murdered child. Geez, even if it was for something way less serious, I'd do it.
Would I be concerned that the def would try to use those things against me? Yep. But since I know I have nothing to hide, I'd do it anyway, knowing I had truth on my side.

If they are worried that handing over records could help the defense, then so be it! They arent helping the state either. We are after the truth here, and how can we get to the truth when KC has lied about so much, and key players are holding back?
We've seen the significance of cell records that have been released so far. They hold alot of clues that can piece the puzzle together, since kc refuses to tell the truth.
jmo
Click to expand...

Who filed motions to keep federal or local LE from getting whatever they needed?

To my knowledge not a SINGLE person filed for an order of protection to keep an investigating agency from access to cell phone records or an interview or anything else.
 
butwhatif? said:
I havent seen alot of discussion about the players who are refusing to hand over cell records. Mods feel free to merge if there is already a thread relating to this topic.

My intent is not to throw anyone under the bus, but to discuss the idea of the right to privacy vs justice for Caylee.

Firstly nobody would want to have their cell records released for the world to see the most personal details of your life. But these are not ordinary circumstances.
IMO, providing cell records will serve two purposes. 1: tracking Kc's movements, and any contact she had with them in order to bolster the case against her. 2. proving that you have nothing to hide regardless of its its involvment or knowledge of the crime, or even making money off of Caylees death.

Some of these are people who claim to have loved Caylee, so why would they value their privacy more than helping to get justice for her?

What are the motives for holding them back?

In RM's case it seems $$$$$$ was the motivater for deleting emails from his PC. And in one of his interviews they say something along the lines of "Now ,you gave us permission to download your cell phone data, but that didnt work out too well, did it?" So its possible he also deleted everything on his cell. But why?

JG's cell records that have been released only show calls and no text content.
His dad repeatedly mentioned in his interview with LE the financial strain he was under because of the case.

So the motivater for refusing to hand them over could be that they, and all the others who are not willing to hand them over, dont want the public to know that they have gained financially by selling pics or their stories to media.
If thats the case, do you think that the public has a right to know who made money from caylees death, and who could have leaked info before the docs were released?
If they sold their story, then just 'fess up!! At least it will prove that they are completely forthcoming and holding nothing back.

Also, if they are keen to hide these details, does it make you wonder what else they could be hiding?

What is the A's PI hiding? Why not jump at the oportunity to prove to the world you are not lying about anything?
And RK, the hero.....why not live up to that title?

If I were a player in the case, and my records were requested, even if they were humiliating for me, I would hand them over because justice for a murdered child outweighs my possible embarrasment.
Who cares about raunchy texts, or people reading your text arguments? Isnt justice for caylee more important?
The 'I dont want all my friends and relatives brought into this' excuse doesnt fly, since we all know the numbers are redacted.And even if they werent, again, isnt justice for caylee more important?
Am really interested to hear other peoples perspective on this.
Click to expand...

I myself would give whoever whatever they wanted. I'd take a lie detector test, a piss test, a criminal background check- anything! I would do whatever it took for people to know that I am telling the truth about whatever it is I have said.

But I have no secrets.

Many people have all kinds of secrets they keep from the people in their lives. I recently found out about the new craze of people sending nudes back and forth and engaging in "text sex" (remember "Cybersex"? ugh!) via their cell phones. A spouse could be cheating- or using an escort service or calling a drug dealer. There are all kinds of reasons people would not want to hand over their phones, I sure hope it is something like the things I listed above that they are fighting this for because otherwise I have an issue with it and will have a harder time taking the things they say as being truthful. But that's just me and the way that I am.
 
butwhatif? said:
I get that people have a legal right to privacy, but I'm talking more about moral duty here.
See, I wouldnt care if they asked me to hand over every cell record over the last 10 years. Would I be ahamed of some of those texts from so long ago?

Absolutely! It would paint me as a lying , cheating,skanky drugtaking loser, which is not who I am today, but it was me 10 years ago. And I'd still hand them over without question if it meant helping to get justice for a murdered child. Geez, even if it was for something way less serious, I'd do it.
Would I be concerned that the def would try to use those things against me? Yep. But since I know I have nothing to hide, I'd do it anyway, knowing I had truth on my side.

If they are worried that handing over records could help the defense, then so be it! They arent helping the state either. We are after the truth here, and how can we get to the truth when KC has lied about so much, and key players are holding back?
We've seen the significance of cell records that have been released so far. They hold alot of clues that can piece the puzzle together, since kc refuses to tell the truth.
jmo
Click to expand...

Right on! Me too, mee too! I couldn't look at myself in the mirror if I did any less.
 
I dont blame them from objecting to what the defense requested. The inquiry isnt
about bringing justice for Caylee. The defense needs someone credible to blame other than the prisioner.
 
butwhatif? said:
I havent seen alot of discussion about the players who are refusing to hand over cell records. Mods feel free to merge if there is already a thread relating to this topic.

My intent is not to throw anyone under the bus, but to discuss the idea of the right to privacy vs justice for Caylee.

Firstly nobody would want to have their cell records released for the world to see the most personal details of your life. But these are not ordinary circumstances.
IMO, providing cell records will serve two purposes. 1: tracking Kc's movements, and any contact she had with them in order to bolster the case against her. 2. proving that you have nothing to hide regardless of its its involvment or knowledge of the crime, or even making money off of Caylees death.

Some of these are people who claim to have loved Caylee, so why would they value their privacy more than helping to get justice for her?

What are the motives for holding them back?

In RM's case it seems $$$$$$ was the motivater for deleting emails from his PC. And in one of his interviews they say something along the lines of "Now ,you gave us permission to download your cell phone data, but that didnt work out too well, did it?" So its possible he also deleted everything on his cell. But why?

JG's cell records that have been released only show calls and no text content.
His dad repeatedly mentioned in his interview with LE the financial strain he was under because of the case.

So the motivater for refusing to hand them over could be that they, and all the others who are not willing to hand them over, dont want the public to know that they have gained financially by selling pics or their stories to media.
If thats the case, do you think that the public has a right to know who made money from caylees death, and who could have leaked info before the docs were released?
If they sold their story, then just 'fess up!! At least it will prove that they are completely forthcoming and holding nothing back.

Also, if they are keen to hide these details, does it make you wonder what else they could be hiding?

What is the A's PI hiding? Why not jump at the oportunity to prove to the world you are not lying about anything?
And RK, the hero.....why not live up to that title?

If I were a player in the case, and my records were requested, even if they were humiliating for me, I would hand them over because justice for a murdered child outweighs my possible embarrasment.
Who cares about raunchy texts, or people reading your text arguments? Isnt justice for caylee more important?
The 'I dont want all my friends and relatives brought into this' excuse doesnt fly, since we all know the numbers are redacted.And even if they werent, again, isnt justice for caylee more important?
Am really interested to hear other peoples perspective on this.
Click to expand...

I agree, and thanks for the thread. I don't see any reason why anyone should receive preferential treatment, all of their phone records, texts etc should be examined in the same detail as Casey's. Why not? (This information is obviously crucial.)
I don't see how/why any innocent person would object, due to the seriousness of the case and out of any concern for justice for Caylee, plus as you say, the records will obviously be redacted. And even if they weren't and some folks wind up needing to change their number, big deal, as if people haven't probably done that a couple times by now anyway.
Supposedly most of the players whose records were subpoenaed did NOT object, right, only Amy, Roy K, and JG ?
 
JBean said:
well I would not hand anything over in FL. The Sunshine laws reveal private information about innocent people that want to remain anonymous. The point of the laws were to keep govt transparent, not to release carelessly redacted, personal documents all over the internet.
Unless I had key information that was absoultely critical to the case, i would not hand over anything if i didn't have to.
I am still blown away by the amount of information that has been revealed by these laws and subsequent abuse by the media.

JMHO of course. :)
Click to expand...

I started a thread a long while back about the Sunshine Laws. I think I am going to bump it up. I think that the defense is looking for calls that they could use to frame, blame, or otherwise divert attention from his client to another person for the purpose of reasonable doubt. That IMO is not a good enough reason to subpeona them. The motive behind his mining expedition is obvious. We have seen toooooooooooooooooooo many people of little importance to this case sleuthed, and in many cases accused of involvement where there was none. I for one wouldn't turn over my records willingly. Am I hiding anything???? No, but anyone can "misconshtrue" anything. I firmly believe that the sunshine laws will be revamped after this case is over.
 
Privacy vs justice for Caylee?

First, let me say that I totally totally totally agree with JBean about not handing over anything I didn't have to with FL Sunshine Laws.

Second, I would add that whether records are subpoenaed by LE or the defense, there must be a just cause for the subpoena to be issued and a defense attorney grasping at straws or the defendant making some wild accusations to try to divert suspicion is NOT just cause. (Also, how can phone records from before a witness ever met or heard of KC be relevant to the case?)

Third, the right to privacy being discussed here is primarily that of the witnesses - though in the case of AH she is both a witness and a victim of theft. Anyway, my point is that a witness should not be required to give up their right to privacy just because they are a witness to a crime. The information being sought must be relevant, but how could someone's intimate texts to their significant other be relevant in a case where a mother is charged with killing her child? How could the ping locations of AH - a witness who no one disputes didn't see KC for days before or after Caylee disappeared - be relevant to either the LE or the defense? How could the phone numbers a witness called or received calls from be relevant except those to and from the defendant? So why should any of the rest of it be anyone's business?

Fourth, does anyone really think that LE's case will be severely jeopardized by not having those records? Does anyone think the defense having those records would get KC off? In other words, IMHO, this is much ado about nothing because the records of those who are seeking not to have them released won't shed much light on the case for either side.

In summary, it should not be necessary to invade the right to privacy of everyone involved in order for there to be a fair trial for KC or justice for Caylee.
 
You must log in or register to reply here.

DNASolves

Who is Escambia County John Doe (1989)?

Members online

... and 97 more.
Total: 3,252 (members: 98, guests: 3,154)

Online statistics

Members online
98
Guests online
3,154
Total visitors
3,252
Totals may include hidden visitors.

Forum statistics

Threads
591,857
Messages
17,960,143
Members
228,625
Latest member
julandken
Back
Top