NY - Rita Tangredi, 31, and Colleen McNamee, 20, murdered, 1993-94, John Biltroff *GUILTY* - #2

bessie said:

If you haven't read this book, you should. It's probably the most comprehensive work on the topic to date. I know it changed the way I view serial killers and habitual violent offenders. Where John Douglas is the"Mindhunter", Dr. Pincus is the "Brainhunter"

http://books.google.com/books?id=c_vlTkkvEI0C&pg=PA9&source=gbs_toc_r&cad=3#v=onepage&q&f=false

http://neurology.georgetown.edu/faculty/pincus

http://abcnews.go.com/WNT/story?id=130048

http://www.amazon.com/Base-Instincts-What-Makes-Killers/dp/0393323234

Click to expand...

Thanks Bessie,...I just ordered a book to finish out my summer.

no......but it is close..:dunno:

his parents are from there.....relatives...etc...

I wonder if he worked construction in midtown. There's that case of the girl in midtown who was found buried in the concrete of a building they think from late 80's early 90's. They said it was likely a construction worker since she was in the cement. Obviously not Bittrolff's MO but it still want to know whether he works in the city or ever has.

FYI
For those unfamiliar with Long Island, construction workers in all phases, handymen, landscapers & the such are a dime a dozen for every reason from retirees to those on disability to those with records in need of being employed but have difficulty with being hired as a result. Everyone & their brother knows someone in the construction field.

Discussion from Thread #1 continues here.

LISleuth said:

FYI
For those unfamiliar with Long Island, construction workers in all phases, handymen, landscapers & the such are a dime a dozen for every reason from retirees to those on disability to those with records in need of being employed but have difficulty with being hired as a result. Everyone & their brother knows someone in the construction field.

Click to expand...

The guys who lay claim to be in those trades are a dime a dozen, the guys who have the knowledge and skills to execute what you're looking for are a little bit harder to find. Just a little FYI.

mcme said:

The guys who lay claim to be in those trades are a dime a dozen, the guys who have the knowledge and skills to execute what you're looking for are a little bit harder to find. Just a little FYI.

Click to expand...

Off topic, but...
That's an absolute fact, Mcme. I'm having major restoration issues right now and can't tell you how many construction companies I've gone through just trying to get an estimate, and feel secure in the quality of their work. Half of them don't carry enough insurance for the type of work I need them to do, some don't want to take on the depth of work that I know needs to be done and try instead to sell me crap like gutters or new roofs (hello? my house is sinking, idiots!), one company told me they'd have to tear up every floor in my house to get to the major support beam underneath, and several of the larger, more reputable companies never even returned my call...even AFTER they had come out to do an estimate. I WISH good construction companies were a dime a dozen, then my house would have already been fixed.

I just thought about the killings happening in the summer months and the killers shoe fetish. Maybe he has summer sandal fetish to be more precise.

threelittlebirdies said:

I just thought about the killings happening in the summer months and the killers shoe fetish. Maybe he has summer sandal fetish to be more precise.

Click to expand...

Which killings are you referring to, Birdies? Rita was murdered in Nov. and Colleen was murdered in Jan. Nothing reported about missing shoes in those cases.

Mountain_Kat said:

Which killings are you referring to, Birdies? Rita was murdered in Nov. and Colleen was murdered in Jan. Nothing reported about missing shoes in those cases.

Click to expand...

I was referring to LISK..sorry I was not clear. My point is that JB is not LISK, who has a shoe fetish it appears. So, I was thinking maybe LISK has a sandle fetish because of the summer months.

I have changed my mind and think there is more than one serial killer.

JB may just be a Holiday/Anniversary Seaside Killer. I'm leaning toward him being Manorville, Lisk, AC4 and maybe even Wilmington. I'd like to see a history of his travels between 1984 and 2014...with an emphasis on 2000-2014.

I suspect he used that hang dog "oh poor me" expression when he told them he was all alone for his Birthday, the holidays, etc.

threelittlebirdies said:

I was referring to LISK..sorry I was not clear. My point is that JB is not LISK, who has a shoe fetish it appears. So, I was thinking maybe LISK has a sandle fetish because of the summer months.

I have changed my mind and think there is more than one serial killer.

Click to expand...

How did you get the idea that LISK has a shoe fetish?

The AC4 serial killer might have had a shoe fetish due to that all 4 victims was all fully clothed but missing their shoes

Just K said:

JB may just be a Holiday/Anniversary Seaside Killer. I'm leaning toward him being Manorville, Lisk, AC4 and maybe even Wilmington. I'd like to see a history of his travels between 1984 and 2014...with an emphasis on 2000-2014.

I suspect he used that hang dog "oh poor me" expression when he told them he was all alone for his Birthday, the holidays, etc.

Click to expand...

I with you on this ....I am cross eyed from looking into building being done in that time period....

Just K said:

JB may just be a Holiday/Anniversary Seaside Killer. I'm leaning toward him being Manorville, Lisk, AC4 and maybe even Wilmington. I'd like to see a history of his travels between 1984 and 2014...with an emphasis on 2000-2014.

I suspect he used that hang dog "oh poor me" expression when he told them he was all alone for his Birthday, the holidays, etc.

Click to expand...

I no longer know which murders people are referring to when they say "LISK" and "Manorville", so would you mind clarifying your post for me, K ? When you say LISK, do you mean the killer of just the GB4, or do you mean a single killer responsible for all 10 individuals (whole or parts) found off Ocean Parkway ? When you say "Manorville", do you mean all six bodies found there since 2000, or just Jessica Taylor, Jane Doe and the 2 John Does found in close proximity to each other?

Once you clarify that, can I ask you what leads you to believe that these murders are all the work of one serial killer? I see similarities between the four AC victims and the four Gilgo victims, but I don't see similarities between those victims and the other Ocean Pkwy victims (whole or parts), or any of the Manorville victims (whole or parts), other than the fact that some parts of two of those victims ended up in both locations. I'm trying to see what you and others see with respect to those connections. Help me out here.

ETA: I get a bit confused with respect to actual body counts, since parts were scattered, so bear with me if my counts are off. I think you probably know what I'm asking, though.

MK, first I will define my idea of:

LISK= GB4

Why RB?
Mainly b/c RT's daughter was bf to MB
And the fact that at least one had a ligature
Also he has ties to Babylon, the Bronx and Central Florida (ALC)
Also, I might add the transvestite found on OP because, iirc, he was beaten about the skull.

BUT: Then I would have to consider the decapitated/dismembered remains on OP. As I believe this is really about smashing out their faces/personalities and not about making them harder to ID. Why leave the blanket and jewelry on the toddler and jewelry on the mother.

So, yes the 11 remains on OP.

Also, I believe he knows how to work on the whole "I'm just a helper persona and I'm really harmless...ask anyone who knows me... You can trust me."

Manorville= woman & man November 2000
JT and Man found July 2003
And likely the man with the berry bush growing through remains
Witness said he was wrapped in something and had no shoes on.

Why RB?
Because some of the above 11 were scattered on OP and torsos dumped in Manorville.
Because he lives practically in walking distance from the dump sites and especially the Wading River Rd.
Because he knows how to cut things up.

To me, the earlier killings show some kind of torture, humiliation and sadistic acts.

Then we come to AC 4 he is 40 years old and about to pay out on a big lawsuit.
He lived within blocks of where KR grew up.
Because they were left in a straight line in a group of 4 facing the ocean and a copy of "Beach Rd" was left next to the remains.
Because BB, ALC, RT all look like his wife.
Because the Holidays were approaching.
Because he looks like the AC4 composite sketch.

His MO:
It's just all of it combined. I'm not putting much weight on COD because I think each case is more or less a project or production to him. I believe it is more about the impetus to kill for the reaction of the witnesses, LE, family and friends as well as for the stalking and taunting afterwards.

ETA: His DOB: JULY 1st, 1966
Wife's DOB: June 24, 1969

All but ALC in the GB4 were abducted in late June and early July. And Amber, the last of the four placed together was taken near Labor Day.

Mountain_Kat said:

I no longer know which murders people are referring to when they say "LISK" and "Manorville", so would you mind clarifying your post for me, K ? When you say LISK, do you mean the killer of just the GB4, or do you mean a single killer responsible for all 10 individuals (whole or parts) found off Ocean Parkway ? When you say "Manorville", do you mean all six bodies found there since 2000, or just Jessica Taylor, Jane Doe and the 2 John Does found in close proximity to each other?

Click to expand...

I think this is a good point for ALL of us to remember! It's clear that we all have different theories and see different connections, so I think it's a good idea for all of us to be very specific about which murders/victims we're talking about, rather than using catch-all like "LISK," "OP," and "Manorville." (Perhaps the one exception is AC4.)

Just K said:

I'm leaning toward him being Manorville, Lisk, AC4 and maybe even Wilmington.

Click to expand...

Me too, but I think that soon there will have to be something that illuminates the subject. Right now, JB's pretty much a cipher - we don't really know where he's been working, hanging out, who he knows - really we know almost nothing. We'll have bits and pieces of the puzzle soon; for all we know JB has solid alibis for all of the important dates. Or, in the other direction, we might start getting people ID'ing him as having been on the south shore, people with stories to share. At any rate, the wall of silence will crumble eventually.

Considering he is the only suspect in three brutal murders that all occurred within six months of each other and when he was 27 years old, it is not out of the question for him to have committed a couple dozen murders since the age of 21. (1987/1988)

OP (GB4, JD (legs 1996) JD Mother, JD Toddler, JD Transvestite male, JD skull?) = 9
AC 4
MV 5 2000 JD Female and JD Male , 2003 JD Male & JT and 2013 UID Male with berry bush growing through remains
RT, CM & SC 3
Wimington 2 or 3

That would be 23 or 24 and doesn't include some of the very likely ones like these 13 victims: So possible total could be 36+ or-

June 1, 1986 (Just after Memorial Day) PATRICIA COSTELLO of Brentwood, Suffolk County, was living in Bay Shore at the time of her murder. She worked as a topless dancer/cocktail waitress at various bars in Suffolk County. At about 5pm, Sunday, June 1, 1986, a horseback rider in Heckscher State Park found Ms. Costello’s nude, strangled body, approximately 200 feet from the shore of the Great South Bay in Islip. Seemingly, the assailant tried to make the murder appear to be a suicide by tying one end of a piece of material around Ms. Costello’s neck and the other around a nearby tree.

May 23, 1987
SOURCE: Body Found in Brookville: [NASSAU AND SUFFOLK Edition]
Newsday [Long Island, N.Y] 23 MAY 1987: 14
Quote:
The badly decomposed body of an unidentified male was found partially buried yesterday off an estate-lined street in Brookville by two landscapers clearing wood from one of the homes' manicured lots.

Local authorities said the man's head was smashed beyond recognition and that the body had been lying in the shallow gully for more than a week. Police found no identification on the fully clothed man, who they believe was white or Hispanic.

Police said the body, covered with leaves and broken twigs, was found about 11 a.m. in a wooded area along a private, unnamed road off Brookville Road. The road leads to a cluster of four homes, about a quarter mile from the Brookville police station. Brookville Road is the site of several million-dollar estates.

July 18, 1992 IVONNE RIVERA, vanished from TJ's, once a popular bar in the waterfront village of Babylon, 23-year-old statistics major left the bar alone about 2:30 a.m. , planning to walk home. Her battered, naked body was discovered by a man walking his dog in a grassy area near the Babylon grade school. The cause of death was listed as blunt force trauma. Police never recovered her clothes, and declined then, and now, to say whether she had been sexually assaulted.

June 28, 1997 found: (Probably died June 25, 1997) PEACHES, unidentified black woman, torso found with head and hands cut off, found by a hiker in Hempstead Lake State Park. She was wrapped in a black plastic garbage bag and stuffed into a dark-green Rubbermaid container with a floral pillow sham and frayed red towel.

July 22, 2005 Jamie Diane Seymor missing from the Port Authority

On March 3, 2007, (Cherries) another woman’s torso, stabbed and stuffed inside a suitcase, washed ashore in Mamaroneck. One of her leg bones and her right foot with her toe nails half polished washed up from the Long Island Sound later on March 27 among the rocks in Cold Spring Harbor. On March 28, her severed leg bone washed up in a plastic bag a short distance away at the estate of Cablevision billionaire James Dolan. The rest of her has never been found.

Sept. 14, 2007 THALIA STATHIS disappears; In July, a New York state trooper found her badly decomposed human remains in a vinyl bag that had been dumped on the shoulder of the Southern State Parkway in North Merrick, N.Y

6/26/2008 TANYA RUSH disappeared from Brooklyn. Dismembered woman was found stuffed in a suitcase near Newbridge Road in Bellmore off the Southern State Parkway, a 39-year-old mother of three, fingerprints were on file from a previous arrest.

June 21, 2010 JENNIFER PAPAIN, a North Patchogue prostitute who advertised on Craigslist

Jun. 21, 2010 in Long Island Sound BLACK MALE , five miles north of Port Jefferson, 5’9”, 160 lbs, thick black hair, mustache and beard. No clothing on body.

7-6-10 Elena Jazmir Lozada, Tuesday after the 4th of July weekend, which was a three-day weekend with Monday the holiday. https://www.findthemissing.org/cases/8308/0/
She is from the exact same area as MW.

Jul 31, 2010 7:30 am US/Eastern MICHAEL TAUS Missing West Islip L.I. after blind date arranged on internet. Missing with pitbull.

Something occurs to me about these males: Maybe the killer sets up dates with them but acually attacks them and dumps them more half hazardly because his goal here is to use their vehicle to abduct the prostitutes...This is THEORY!

PS Thanks to Seaslug and Redbird for finding most of this data.

I remember when they found one of the skulls on OP they were saying it had been there for sometime because a plant was growing throught it. And just k you brought up the manorville man with the berry plant growing thru him.....could these plants have sprout up by seeds stuck to the victims from the killers truck or clothes?

If the OP skull had a berry bush growing through it then I would think they may have been dumped around the same time.

For the victim whose head has never been found (Possible female 1987...black lace found on body part), I wonder if they checked that Skull and other parts that washed up from NY in to NJ's waters (1990)?

P.S. Thanks to Seaslug and Redbird for many of these stories.