Found Deceased TX - Michael Chambers, 70, Hunt County, 10 March 2017 #1

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1MommaBear said:
Hi all. I don’t post much, mostly just lurk, but this and a couple of other cases have captured my attention lately.

Pmerle00, I’m so sorry that you and your family are going through this horrible situation. PaPaw sounds like a wonderful man, and I hope you find him soon.

Based on what we know from articles available online, and the information that Pmerle00 shared with us here on Websleuths, this is my theory (my opinion only!):

PaPaw went to Walmart and purchased makeup for his wife. He arrived home, got out of his truck, and locked it. He went into the house and placed the makeup on the bathroom counter and tossed the receipt in the bathroom waste basket. He left the house, locking it behind him, and went to his shop. Someone with the intent of robbing him was hiding nearby and saw him heading to the shop. PaPaw entered the shop, put his wallet and keys down, and started working on whatever task he had planned to work on (he might not have actually had time to start the task). The robber entered the shop (PaPaw does not lock the door to the shop when he is inside working) and confronted PaPaw, demanding cash. PaPaw handed over the cash that was in his wallet. The amount was not enough for the robber, who demanded more. PaPaw said that he didn’t have more, which angered the robber, who picked up a nearby wooden rod and struck PaPaw, thus the blood. The robber said that he was going to drive PaPaw to an ATM and that he must withdraw cash. PaPaw figured that there was no way he was going to withdraw a large sum of cash for the robber. (After all, he was a firefighter, who faced dangerous and deadly situations many times before, and he had the smarts and the skill to avoid it.) He said he’d grab his ATM card, but he instead grabbed his driver license because he had no intent of handing over a bunch of cash. (I believe he left his wallet and keys behind in the shop, thinking they’d be locked up and secure there for when he returned. His cell phone was still in his pocket, where he normally keeps it.) The robber forced him out of the shop and into a car (possibly threatening him with a gun?). I’m thinking that because PaPaw was a man of habit, and because he figured that some way he could get out of this situation, he locked the door behind him. (Firefighters are trained to remain calm and cool-headed under pressure, so I think PaPaw probably behaved in a manner consistent with that training.) The robber drove him to an ATM, and demanded that PaPaw withdraw cash. PaPaw, thinking that he could get out of this by this point, reached in his pocket and said that he only had his driver license. The situation was such that PaPaw could not summon help (possibly there was no one around to see or hear him?). The angered robber then forced PaPaw back into the car and decided that he had to kill him so that he could not identify/testify against him. The robber drove him to another location, killed him, and disposed of his body. (Gah. I’m sorry. I hate to write that.)

I believe this is a money-motivated crime, and that the suspect either knew PaPaw, or knew of him (possibly through the car club/car restoration hobby). The suspect knew that PaPaw was doing well financially, and would either have cash on him or access to cash.

I know that nothing of value was stolen, but sometimes criminals just want cash. When they steal things, they run the risk of being caught with those things, tying them to the crime. They also run the risk of being caught while trying to sell the items for cash, which it what they really want. Even though everyone knows that ATMs have cameras, I’m still amazed by the number of robberies that take place at ATMs.

Pmerle00, can I ask you a few questions?

1) Does this theory sound plausible based on your knowledge of PaPaw and the situation?
2) Do you know if the investigators have reviewed surveillance footage of nearby ATMs (both walk-up ATMs and drive-thru ATMs)? If they haven’t, could you ask them to do so?
3) Is PaPaw’s property such that someone could park a car out of view, such that PaPaw may not see it when he drives up to his house? (Even if it’s not possible to conceal a car from view, the suspect may have had an accomplice waiting nearby.)

All of the above is my opinion only! Please feel free to poke holes in my theory, as I'm sure I've missed some things.
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I think this theory fits most of the evidence we have so far. Your points about him being a fireman and therefor cool under pressure and calm are good ones. The question is - WHO could have done that to him? And WHERE is he now? Why can't we find him?

I've added the ATM videos to the list of questions to ask investigators next. I'm not sure if they have done this, since there was no abnormal bank activity that we know of. It's a good suggestion, so thank you.

It is possible that a car could be parked on OR off the property out of sight, yes. However, there were no unusual or unidentifiable tire (or other) tracks. Still possible.
 
ocgrad said:
This has alot of merit. Even if he didn't make it to an ATM. He may have admitted he only had his DL before they got there as he tried to talk the robber down. He may have smartly left his Keys and wallet where they were knowing they were now locked out and would have to wait for the wife to get home.
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Trying to talk his way out of the situation or even trying to help the perpetrator out of their own situation wouldn't be out of the question for Papaw. However, locking things into the shop with the intention of waiting for his wife to get home isn't something he would do. He would want them as far away as possible by the time she got home to protect her.
 
Razz said:
A plausible theory for sure. But since ATMs allow only a certain amount of money to be withdrawn,
I would think allowing the robber that amount would be a reasonable exchange for his life.

Also, it would have been midday when area businesses around the ATMs would be busy and MC could have taken off or called for help.

I still like the theory that he put the leftover cash from Wal-Mart into his pocket. The d.l? I'd be interested to know if he purchased a decongestant.

He'd also want to sort the bills from the coins. If he was in a hurry or there was a long line behind him, he may have jammed it all into his pocket. I've done that w/ my purse
instead of placing my money in it's proper place in my billfold. Sometimes it's just faster and easier.

Why would Pawpa bring his billfold out to the shed unless he normally kept it in his pocket and then store it in a special place in the shed?
Was he afraid it could be stolen if someone broke into the house while he was out in the shed?

I'm thinking he may have stopped for lunch somewhere. Maybe a favorite cafe?

This perp would have to know MC if he hid himself in the woods. First they'd have to know his address and 2. They had to know he wouldn't be out all day. (Otherwise they could be waiting in those stinking woods all day).

I wonder if he didn't cut a finger and soon realized he was going to need more than a towel to stop the bleeding and it would require him going into the house.

Perhaps he left the shed, forgetting for a minute that he'd left the door knob in the locked position. He locked himself out and instead of bothering his wife at work or getting a locksmith or busting the door down, he took a walk.

As there don't appear to be sidewalks where he lives, he had to walk on the road shoulder. Maybe someone came by and sideswiped him on the road. Maybe they pulled him off the side of the road, made sure he was well hidden and took off.

For some reason, I think he's fairly close to home. But maybe in an unfamiliar field on the side of the road.

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It would be highly a-typical for him to not put the cash and DL back in his wallet (though I'm not sure he ever took the DL out at Wal-Mart). The coins would go in his pocket to be put in his vehicle for later combination with other change and eventual rolling of coins. There was not a line behind him, and he did not seem to be in a hurry from his pace on the cameras in the store and in the parking lot.

Papaw has a normal place for his keys, wallet and hat in the shop while he's working. It is a habit. He only keeps his phone in his pocket to be able to answer calls in a timely fashion.

I'm still looking into the lunch question, so bear with me there.

I tend to agree that they would have had to know him. But that brings me back to motive. Who that he knows that well would want a small amount of money from him? They're not loaded by ANY stretch of the imagination.

If he'd injured himself, my opinion is he would have called someone had he locked himself out of the shop or if he were severely injured. Or walked to his neighbor's house, who he knows very well - there is a gate that wouldn't put him on the road if he did that, and they are only yards away from his property. Also, despite it being a wooded area, there is a good size population in the immediate area, and there were neighbors out and about all day. There were also fisherman in the opposite direction of the aforementioned neighbor who would have seen him. In any case, that doesn't explain the DL missing either.
 
johunt said:
I also read something about blood being on a dowel. Can you elaborate if you know?
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The blood on the dowel rod is confirmed to be Papaw's, but that's about all I know. I didn't actually see the rod.
 
johunt said:
One of the searches was a neighboring property because the "dogs" hit on something there. Can you elaborate at all?
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The search dogs sounded or indicated they picked up the trail heading towards a neighboring property. This could have been an older scent, as Papaw has been all over their land. They got owner permission and performed a foot search that included dogs and also dragging, sonar and divers on some bodies of water to no avail.
 
Razz said:
It should be on the receipt w/ the make up.

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I know the sheriff took the receipt, let me see if I can find out. I was thinking if someone later tried to use his DL to purchase meds, could that be tracked even if the purchase was declined. Might not be a person tied to his disappearance, but if they found it somewhere it could help know where to search.
 
Razz said:
Pmerle00: I originally asked that thinking he may have had his d.l. out of his wallet to show for a purchase he may have made for a decongestant. But, it may not be a bad idea to check to see if his dl was used after he disappeared for that purpose.

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I should have read a bit further before responding to the last post. YES. This is what I am thinking also. Perhaps not by the perpetrator, but it would be a clue nonetheless. Is there a system that tracks ATTEMPTS at purchasing? Or only purchases? This is on my list to ask the sheriff as well.
 
Razz said:
So, are you the daughter of one of the daughters from his 1st marriage? Does everyone get along? Is your blood grandmother,
(Papaw's 1st wife) still in the picture?

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Yes - I am the oldest daughter of his oldest daughter. (can I give my name on here, or is that frowned upon??? My FB page has links and such aggregated to the best of my abilities right now.)

Everyone gets along - my grandmother (Papaw's first wife) and Papaw and Becca all come to family events. They make small talk. Outside of grandkids or great grandkids birthday parties, they don't talk that I know of. They aren't buddies, but they definitely get along just fine.
 
Razz said:
Anything found that he may have been hit with? Any blood on the shed doorknob? And no blood outside the shed at all?

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Perhaps the dowel rod, but I'm just guessing, I didn't actually see it. It was wooden, so I'd say unlikely to be a striking weapon. No blood on any doorknobs. No blood outside that I know of.
 
abstr said:
I have a few questions but I really won't ask. I think this family is going thru enough and the questions seem unrelated. I pray for all of you.
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Ask away. Anything, even something that seems unrelated, could help trigger something else that helps us find answers. I will answer what I can, and ask LE or the family about the rest.
 
QueenBea13 said:
With them living somewhat out in the country, would it be plausible to think someone came to him saying they needed help or had some sorta medical emergency & MC went to aid & that's when something nefarious happened?
I agree with others saying the missing drivers license makes my mind go to a real life "Breaking Bad" situation, like someone needed an I.D. to purchase behind the counter type allergy meds to manufacture illegal drugs. I'd definitely have LE check with DEA & check the area for possible meth labs.


*All thoughts & opinions mentioned above are just that, MY random thoughts & opinions*
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I think the idea of someone saying they needed help is plausible, but then what about the blood in the shop?

I really think the idea of checking for activity of any sort on his DL is a good one. Whether it was the perpetrator or someone who found it, it would be a clue. So far, I am asking them to look into: controlled drugs, hotels, liquor stores, ATMs, their bank. What else is tied to a DL??
 
I hope what I am doing is helpful! If there is a better/preferred way of going through this forum, let me know. I'm willing to change/modify/whatever to help y'all think this through with me.


I am going through these to answer in order.


Some things, I hope you all understand, I cannot share at this point in the investigation. That is frustrating for me. It is frustrating for you. I am checking with LE to see if I CAN share some things that aren't public knowledge, so bear with me as they get me answers so I can get you information.


I really appreciate all of your questions and input. It is at LEAST helping me ask more questions of LE. :)
 
Pmerle00 said:
I think the idea of someone saying they needed help is plausible, but then what about the blood in the shop?

I really think the idea of checking for activity of any sort on his DL is a good one. Whether it was the perpetrator or someone who found it, it would be a clue. So far, I am asking them to look into: controlled drugs, hotels, liquor stores, ATMs, their bank. What else is tied to a DL??
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Was it for sure HIS blood? I know I'm probably asking a redundant question here. But was it DNA tested and confirmed to be HIS?


*All statements are that of my own opinion unless otherwise specified.*
 
Pmerle00 said:
The blood on the dowel rod is confirmed to be Papaw's, but that's about all I know. I didn't actually see the rod.
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1).Just what exactly would a wooden dowel be used for in his shop? Were towels hanging off it?

2). Did it appear he was in the middle of cutting something or anything that would cause him to bleed?

3). Part of the beauty of WS is the ability to stay anonymous. You really don't know who can be lurking. (indicated as guests located somewhere on the page you're writing on). Prehaps others can advise you on that better than I can.

4). The d.l. is huge in my mind. If he had used it for something during his errands, there could be an innocent explanation.
If not, finding out why his d.l. was taken or why it is missing is important.

5). One of the neighbors said they didn't get home until around 3 pm
and they didn't see anything unusual. Were there other neighbors that were home that day?

Most of us here are genuinely concerned about missing people and what may have happened to them. It is so wonderful to have you on board and I'm hoping together we can figure out where PaPaw is.

Oh about the phone. I have an Android and I pay online but before that, I used to get a paper bill that listed all calls and texts made. I can't read or hear messages but I can see who was calling who by all the telephone numbers listed.

6). Who was Papaw's mobile phone carrier? Determine if he got paper bills. If so, you should be able to see all the phone #s called and received from and to all the phones under their plan.


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Did Mr Chambers have any medical issues or mental health issues? I know sometimes that is hard to ask and answer. Perhaps something was bothering him that no-one knew and he went and cleared his head. Idk because that doesn't explain the blood in the shed. Unless he hurt himself but it wasn't serious , perhaps got mad at himself and stormed out for a breather only bringing his d.l.
Hope he is safe. Seems like a true man of honour.


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SavetheQueen said:
Was it for sure HIS blood? I know I'm probably asking a redundant question here. But was it DNA tested and confirmed to be HIS?


*All statements are that of my own opinion unless otherwise specified.*
Click to expand...

Yes. It's DNA tested and confirmed to be his.
 
dyannaON said:
Did Mr Chambers have any medical issues or mental health issues? I know sometimes that is hard to ask and answer. Perhaps something was bothering him that no-one knew and he went and cleared his head. Idk because that doesn't explain the blood in the shed. Unless he hurt himself but it wasn't serious , perhaps got mad at himself and stormed out for a breather only bringing his d.l.
Hope he is safe. Seems like a true man of honour.


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Click to expand...

No medical issues other than blood pressure (which is controlled through meds prescribed by his doctor) and bad knees. The sheriff's department is getting medical records. Hopefully they have them already. Either way, Papaw would not be one to get bad news at the doctor and disappear himself - he might not TELL anyone, but he wouldn't just up and leave - he would know how much pain and confusion that would cause.
 
Pmerle00 said:
No medical issues other than blood pressure (which is controlled through meds prescribed by his doctor) and bad knees. The sheriff's department is getting medical records. Hopefully they have them already. Either way, Papaw would not be one to get bad news at the doctor and disappear himself - he might not TELL anyone, but he wouldn't just up and leave - he would know how much pain and confusion that would cause.
Click to expand...


Thank you for responding. I really hope and will send my prayers that today you find pawpaw. ❤️


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Razz said:
1).Just what exactly would a wooden dowel be used for in his shop? Were towels hanging off it?

2). Did it appear he was in the middle of cutting something or anything that would cause him to bleed?

3). Part of the beauty of WS is the ability to stay anonymous. You really don't know who can be lurking. (indicated as guests located somewhere on the page you're writing on). Prehaps others can advise you on that better than I can.

4). The d.l. is huge in my mind. If he had used it for something during his errands, there could be an innocent explanation.
If not, finding out why his d.l. was taken or why it is missing is important.

5). One of the neighbors said they didn't get home until around 3 pm
and they didn't see anything unusual. Were there other neighbors that were home that day?

Most of us here are genuinely concerned about missing people and what may have happened to them. It is so wonderful to have you on board and I'm hoping together we can figure out where PaPaw is.

Oh about the phone. I have an Android and I pay online but before that, I used to get a paper bill that listed all calls and texts made. I can't read or hear messages but I can see who was calling who by all the telephone numbers listed.

6). Who was Papaw's mobile phone carrier? Determine if he got paper bills. If so, you should be able to see all the phone #s called and received from and to all the phones under their plan.


Sent from my SM-J700T using Tapatalk
Click to expand...

The dowel could have been used for many things - a cheater bar to prop something open is my best guess, but I am NOT a car person, so don't quote me on that.

No evidence that he cut himself on something he was working on (no blood on any other tools, etc.).

I believe there were neighbors that were home and outside all day, but not his immediate neighbors.

We have the bills with the messages/call logs under their plan. The issue is, with Apple phones, when you send or receive a message and you are connected to wifi, it is NOT charged to your carrier and there is not a record of it with the carrier. Hence the debacle about how to get a log of those if the phone in question wasn't backed up to the cloud.
 
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