Theories #1: What Happened to Jennifer Kesse?

Bumping for Jenn.

I learned a few things from the continuing podcast that I did not know--for example, I did not know there was a girl who looked like Jennifer.

But the information that hit me most was from Mr. Kesse explaining that someone knocked on the door of Jenn's condo while she was on the phone with Rob around 9:57 pm on January 23, 2006.

I keep asking myself what are the odds that this would not be significant in a missing person's case that has gone nowhere for eleven years?

I can't stop myself from coupling it with the possibility of both phones going dead around 10:40 pm, on the evening of January 23, 2006. (And perhaps cell phone pings suggesting phone movement just prior to 10:40 pm).

I know many cases have been quoted showing the unreliability of cell phone data around 2006, but I will humbly quote one where a jury found them reliable enough to bring back a guilty verdict--Nicole Pietz.

Nicole was murdered in 2006 in Seattle, Washington. It took the state until 2013 to bring the case before a jury, but they finally felt confident enough to do so. (And Nicole's mom pushed really, really hard.)

Granted, Nicole's body was found and witnesses spoke about the accused's behavior before and after Nicole's death; but cell phone pings were used to place him in the vicinity during the time frame of Nicole's naked remains being dumped under a blackberry bush. And using cell phone pings as well as video from the gym they both attended/worked, evidence was presented of the accused making a cell phone call to himself from Nicole's cell phone on the day after her disappearance.

The jury convicted on the strength of this circumstantial evidence.

Nicole's murder happened the same year as Jennifer disappeared, although in a different state. Does cell phone technology vary from state to state? If so, that would help settle my thoughts.

Otherwise, I think it is only furthering this tragedy to keep theories confined to the same box.

Only my opinion, though.

I never heard of someone knocking on Jennifer's door during that last phone call with Rob before.

Amazing.

It has taken a long, long time for this to come out. Why?

This case should have been solved in 2006 but this is what a botched investigation looks Iike.

Myserty64 said:

I never heard of someone knocking on Jennifer's door during that last phone call with Rob before.

Amazing.

It has taken a long, long time for this to come out. Why?

This case should have been solved in 2006 but this is what a botched investigation looks Iike.

Click to expand...

I too have never heard this before. Did JK answer the door ? Give any indication that she knew who it might be at the door ? This is a huge key, imo. Huge odds that this would not be connected to her disappearance. jmo

liz b. said:

I too have never heard this before. Did JK answer the door ? Give any indication that she knew who it might be at the door ? This is a huge key, imo. Huge odds that this would not be connected to her disappearance. jmo

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I agree, it's very, very significant. I must listen to the podcast. Jennifer's case was one of the first missing person cases I watched on youtube ("Disappeared" episode?) about 18 months ago or so, when I started watching crime programmes. Even though I knew nothing about the way police work I can remember thinking if I had a relative missing, I wouldn't have wanted these cops on the case. Their approach just seemed so sluggish. Since then I've learned to be a bit less judgemental (I hope!) and I know sometimes there are reasons why investigations look poor to those of us on the outside.

But in this case I haven't changed my opinion much, I don't think there was ever any reason to think that Jennifer would disappear voluntarily. Sometimes there are indications of this but it's often an excuse for lazy police work. And I never understood why there seemed to be this insistence that whatever occurred, happened in the morning, mostly based on the shower being wet, clothes on the bed which to me wasn't strong evidence. The fact that the two phones shut off that night at the same time was to me highly suspicious along with just common sense that most bad things happen at night.

I have read that the family have changed their views about certain people in Jennifer's life over the years. I think it is probably apparent now who was most likely involved but it is one of those awful cases where a sloppy initial investigation could prevent justice taking place, as opportunities to gather evidence were lost in those early stages. Chances of finding Jennifer's body with forensic evidence intact are now slim, a confession unlikely and hard to build a strong circumstantial case after so much time. But not impossible hopefully. As noted by Truth Prevails in the case of Nicole Pietz there has to be a family putting the pressure on as well. The Kesse family is this type of family, it's just really sad that not only do people lose their loved ones but they have to spend decades, some people, the rest of their lives, pushing authorities with all the stress that brings.

Truth Prevails said:

Bumping for Jenn.

I learned a few things from the continuing podcast that I did not know--for example, I did not know there was a girl who looked like Jennifer.

But the information that hit me most was from Mr. Kesse explaining that someone knocked on the door of Jenn's condo while she was on the phone with Rob around 9:57 pm on January 23, 2006.

I keep asking myself what are the odds that this would not be significant in a missing person's case that has gone nowhere for eleven years?

I can't stop myself from coupling it with the possibility of both phones going dead around 10:40 pm, on the evening of January 23, 2006. (And perhaps cell phone pings suggesting phone movement just prior to 10:40 pm).

I know many cases have been quoted showing the unreliability of cell phone data around 2006, but I will humbly quote one where a jury found them reliable enough to bring back a guilty verdict--Nicole Pietz.

Nicole was murdered in 2006 in Seattle, Washington. It took the state until 2013 to bring the case before a jury, but they finally felt confident enough to do so. (And Nicole's mom pushed really, really hard.)

Granted, Nicole's body was found and witnesses spoke about the accused's behavior before and after Nicole's death; but cell phone pings were used to place him in the vicinity during the time frame of Nicole's naked remains being dumped under a blackberry bush. And using cell phone pings as well as video from the gym they both attended/worked, evidence was presented of the accused making a cell phone call to himself from Nicole's cell phone on the day after her disappearance.

The jury convicted on the strength of this circumstantial evidence.

Nicole's murder happened the same year as Jennifer disappeared, although in a different state. Does cell phone technology vary from state to state? If so, that would help settle my thoughts.

Otherwise, I think it is only furthering this tragedy to keep theories confined to the same box.

Only my opinion, though.

Click to expand...

A girl who looked like Jennifer ? Do you mean the woman in the apartment rental office who says that she took a rental application from someone she swears was JK?

Myserty64 said:

I never heard of someone knocking on Jennifer's door during that last phone call with Rob before.

Amazing.

It has taken a long, long time for this to come out. Why?

This case should have been solved in 2006 but this is what a botched investigation looks Iike.

Click to expand...

Botched investigation is right. If I remember right, there were a lot of foreign workers doing construction on her condo building. I thought someone said they can't question them all. YES they can and should have. A beautiful blond walks in and out of her condo, they see her comings and goings, that would be very tempting to these people. She was not in a safe place living there alone. JMOO

I believe we really need some kind of confirmation that there was a knock on Jennifer's door during the 9:57pm phone call to Rob.
This was the night before she vanished.

In all the transcripts of interviews Nancy Grace, Greta etc carried out with the various characters associated with this mystery I never saw this 'knock' mentioned once.

So, did the 'knock' really occur or didn't it?

If there was a 'knocker' it has to be the perpetrator, right?

Myserty64 said:

I believe we really need some kind of confirmation that there was a knock on Jennifer's door during the 9:57pm phone call to Rob.
This was the night before she vanished.

In all the transcripts of interviews Nancy Grace, Greta etc carried out with the various characters associated with this mystery I never saw this 'knock' mentioned once.

So, did the 'knock' really occur or didn't it?

If there was a 'knocker' it has to be the perpetrator, right?

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I've always heard mostly from Jennifer's parents since this happened. What is missing from some of the podcasts and videos is more from Rob. Don't get me wrong, I definitely believe Rob was in the clear that day and had nothing to do with Jennifer's disappearance. But he was one of the closest, if not the closest, to Jennifer in the months before January 2006 and I'm wondering what a more lengthy interview might bring up. Yes, I know he was BRIEFLY interviewed on some crime programs but it was superficial. I also wonder who she was closest to at work and could they get an interview from that person or persons. Again, not because they are a suspect, but rather they may mention something that at the time appeared to be insignificant and yet know with everything else could fit into the puzzle. Any nearby residents of the condos might be interesting as well. I'm sure LE has done this (I hope they have anyway!), but revisiting some info might jar something loose with the public. And then, who knows, we finally get that one piece of information to put it all together.

She had just returned from a cruise, right? What if someone from that cruise obtained access to her personal info like her address etc, and stalked her? I have always wanted a thorough investigation of all who were on that ship. Someone may have become obsessed w her. She was beautiful. Just a theory I think must be erased by investigating every person.

Truth Prevails said:

Bumping for Jenn.

I learned a few things from the continuing podcast that I did not know--for example, I did not know there was a girl who looked like Jennifer.

But the information that hit me most was from Mr. Kesse explaining that someone knocked on the door of Jenn's condo while she was on the phone with Rob around 9:57 pm on January 23, 2006.

I keep asking myself what are the odds that this would not be significant in a missing person's case that has gone nowhere for eleven years?

I can't stop myself from coupling it with the possibility of both phones going dead around 10:40 pm, on the evening of January 23, 2006. (And perhaps cell phone pings suggesting phone movement just prior to 10:40 pm).

I know many cases have been quoted showing the unreliability of cell phone data around 2006, but I will humbly quote one where a jury found them reliable enough to bring back a guilty verdict--Nicole Pietz.

Nicole was murdered in 2006 in Seattle, Washington. It took the state until 2013 to bring the case before a jury, but they finally felt confident enough to do so. (And Nicole's mom pushed really, really hard.)

Granted, Nicole's body was found and witnesses spoke about the accused's behavior before and after Nicole's death; but cell phone pings were used to place him in the vicinity during the time frame of Nicole's naked remains being dumped under a blackberry bush. And using cell phone pings as well as video from the gym they both attended/worked, evidence was presented of the accused making a cell phone call to himself from Nicole's cell phone on the day after her disappearance.

The jury convicted on the strength of this circumstantial evidence.

Nicole's murder happened the same year as Jennifer disappeared, although in a different state. Does cell phone technology vary from state to state? If so, that would help settle my thoughts.

Otherwise, I think it is only furthering this tragedy to keep theories confined to the same box.

Only my opinion, though.

Click to expand...

It's just so odd that Mr. Kesse would be mentioning that someone came to the door that night. What podcast is this ? Can you send a link, I really want to hear it. tia. The Kesse family has always maintained that JK's disappearance happened during the morning hours.

https://audioboom.com/posts/6396347-unit-2226

My apologies to everyone. I'm so sorry; I thought everyone would have heard about it. I hope that links works. I'm really rushed right now so can't give a hint about what time to begin listening for it, but if anyone has trouble finding it I will listen to it again tomorrow evening until I locate the minute mark.

For anyone who might listen on another format, the name of the episode is Unit 2226. It is episode 11.

He doesn't really say much about it. Apparently Jennifer told Rob it was her upstairs male neighbor. No one seemed to know if law enforcement interviewed the person or not.

Now I'm really interested in hearing what you all think. Don't get your hopes up too much, though, because there is really not much info given on this.

I read about someone "jiggling" Jennifer's door knob years ago the night she got back from her trip....I had never heard that there was a knock at her door while she was on the phone with Rob until a few weeks ago when I heard it on Unconcluded....

To me , this is another one of those "many coincidences " in Jennifer's case....Some people do not believe in coincidences, the older I get I believe less and less in coincidences as well .....So, to me at what point do we start considering that these "coincidences" are actually relevant clues in Jennifer's case?

Just going to throw something out there....We know that the phone call with Rob was a short call, could the knock at the door have been someone other than a neighbor , someone that Jennifer may have been seeing perhaps? Someone that stopped by to take her out for the evening? Yes, I know she told Rob that she was tired and going to bed but she could have changed her mind.....I doubt seriously if she were seeing the person who knocked on her door while she was talking with Rob that she would have told Rob, "got to go my date is at the door".....

Does the knock at the door mean anything in this case?

Cherry said:

She had just returned from a cruise, right? What if someone from that cruise obtained access to her personal info like her address etc, and stalked her? I have always wanted a thorough investigation of all who were on that ship. Someone may have become obsessed w her. She was beautiful. Just a theory I think must be erased by investigating every person.

Click to expand...

Jenn and Rob flew there and back, plus stayed with friends while there. There was no cruise.

liz b. said:

A girl who looked like Jennifer ? Do you mean the woman in the apartment rental office who says that she took a rental application from someone she swears was JK?

Click to expand...

The woman I'm referring to is a woman who bore a striking physical resemblance to Jennifer, but was living a more "unseemly" lifestyle at that time. She has since turned her life around and does not want her privacy intruded upon.

Prior to the podcast, I had no knowledge of this and was surprised. Why it stands out to me is because of the strange statement law enforcement made to Jenn's parents about Jenn being located in a couple of weeks. During this time period, searches were being conducted in less attractive buildings and areas.

I need to check my records better, but I believe someone even phoned in a tip to LE about Jenn being held captive in a building. I wonder if it could have been this girl, and even if someone brought her to the attention of law enforcement to totally mislead them.

Just a personal theory of my own.

Early on there was a report by woman that Jennifer was being held at 1414 40th st near Rio Grand Ave not far from Jennifer's condo....

I didn't know Jennifer had an upstairs male neighbor who would be knocking on her door either.
Why would he be knocking on her door at close to 10 pm anyway?

I have always leaned towards the theory that the answer to this crime lay in Jennifer's workplace.
However I can't fit the POI in with this theory.
The POI appears to have the physical stature of many of the workers at Mosaic.

So I was playing around with the poi video. I noticed when I paused it and played with cursor that he split at 18 second mark . I am guessing it is due to the three second delay. I highly doubt two guys walked side by side for 42 seconds. Anyway, on left he is walking backwards . I see arm, strap and perhaps a dolly. Let me know what you think.

Interesting podcast. I listened twice,very carefully. JK told Rob that she thought the knock on the door could be her upstairs neighbor. She never said it was her upstairs neighbor. As careful as she was, I do not think she would have ever opened her door at night to just anyone. A scenario : the person who knocked on her door was someone well known to JK. He had a thing for her. Maybe he had been nearby that night, perhaps drinking in a bar. He knows JK is home alone that night, so he goes over there. He gains her trust by appearing to be way drunker than he actually was. He begs JK for a ride home, as he is not up to driving. She agrees o give him a ride, and they take her car. Things go badly sideways from then on. The person seen parking her car and walking along was just a guy who picked up $50.00 for parking her car. JK was likely killed the same night she left. jmo, and speculation. The knock on her door is huge, imo

Wow, I thought there was a cruise. Nix that!

liz b. said:

Interesting podcast. I listened twice,very carefully. JK told Rob that she thought the knock on the door could be her upstairs neighbor. She never said it was her upstairs neighbor. As careful as she was, I do not think she would have ever opened her door at night to just anyone. A scenario : the person who knocked on her door was someone well known to JK. He had a thing for her. Maybe he had been nearby that night, perhaps drinking in a bar. He knows JK is home alone that night, so he goes over there. He gains her trust by appearing to be way drunker than he actually was. He begs JK for a ride home, as he is not up to driving. She agrees o give him a ride, and they take her car. Things go badly sideways from then on. The person seen parking her car and walking along was just a guy who picked up $50.00 for parking her car. JK was likely killed the same night she left. jmo, and speculation. The knock on her door is huge, imo

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Yes, this has been my preferred scenario since seeing an interview with Mrs. Kesse a while back. And hypothetically perhaps there was a spurious, set-up reason for someone to pop round as they happened to be in the area. In general families often in the beginning understandably don't want to believe that someone they know could be involved in hurting someone they love. This often changes over time, but the problem by then is proving it, if someone was a little bit protected by the family in the initial stages. This knock on the door is a very important piece in the puzzle. And to me at the moment, there don't seem to be any facts that would jar with this scenario and quite a few that would support it, especially the time the 2 phones shut off, if this could really be pinned down and verified. Strong circumstantials, but is it enough? Probably not, without more evidence or a confession.

Reminds me of the Tara Grinstead case, sadly for very pretty women, there are often so many men around them (whether they wanted them or not), the field of suspects is much harder to narrow down.

This case is so solvable.

But first I am still troubled by the POI. If he/she was innocent of any wrong-doing apart from parking Jennifer's car at HOTG why hasn't he/she come forward?

I believe there is two suspects that need some heat applied.

One is from her workplace.

The other was an ex who followed Jennifer from Tampa to Orlando.
Is this a sign of possessiveness? If so it is indeed a very bad sign.