Wrongful death trial begins. Trial coverage and discussion #2

Lezah said:

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If anything, the fact there is no DNA contamination on RZ body after a prolonged, acknowledged, lengthy and direct contact ( cutting down, mouth to mouth, CPR etc) suggests to me a greater likelihood that AS could well have been in the ‘hanging room’ as he was at the ‘cut down’ - as the complete lack of his DNA is consistent in BOTH scene of death situations.

If there is ‘no shedding’ in the ‘cut down’ scenario, it is not unreasonable to conclude there would likely be ‘no shedding’ in the ‘hanging room’ scenario as well.

The only ‘DNA match’- is in that there is none found in either situation.

So, in my opinion, the jury has enough combined direct and circumstantial evidence, combined with testimony - to find AS the likely perpetrator - at this stage of the proceedings.

That said, the defense still has a considerable way to go, so their presentations may change that for me, but they currently have quite a catch up job.

Just my opinion ��

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Lezah - Brilliant post, mate! Glad you're feeling better.

Seattle1 said:

There are no insurance policies that provide coverage for MURDER!
Insurance coverage to defend one self against the charge (i.e., legal fees), yes but should Plaintiffs prevail, there will be NO PAYMENT TO
RZ Family.

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Thank you for this info. I have no idea how that type of insurance policy works. I was thinking if there was a judgement it might pay some/all of it, but that makes sense that it is for defense fees!

stmarysmead said:

So Adam wiped it with the Magic towel AFTER it had been dusted for fingerprints? It’s the black fingerprint dust that’s been “wiped.”

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That’s not how that works.


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K_Z said:

Actually, Jonah says it was in early 2011 when they were dating, or maybe that's just when she told him? The video of Jonah's testimony on the shoplifting is at the link, part of the short news story.

That particular situation has been used over and over and over and over by extremely mean spirited posters here and elsewhere to demean and degrade Rebecca. To suggest that she somehow deserved what happened to her. So frustrating.

Certainly she wasn't perfect, but the sheer volume and tenacity of the hateful attackers, when the victim is long dead in her grave, has been nothing short of astounding. Mass murderers and serial killers have been treated more kindly and respectfully than some of those who have mercilessly attacked and demeaned this dead woman. That alone sends up so many red flags. Why does anyone have this level of hate, over so many years, toward a woman long dead, whose death was ruled officially a suicide? Not even an ounce of compassion, even if they believe she committed suicide?? Who can sustain that level of hate, trolling obsessively all over the internet, for so many years? It's frightening.

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I stopped reading the discussion here years ago because I was astounded and disgusted by the level of hate, ridicule and vile comments about a grieving mother. Even now, after DS has been cleared and apologized to by the plaintiffs attorney, some posters try mightily to insert some hatred, seeing if it can pass the mods.

So it is not RZ alone that has been subjected to the behavior you describe.
The intense anger here...on both sides...has been palatable at times, to the detriment of a productive discussion.

Discussing the death of a child and a young vibrant woman is very emotional. Two lives cut short...many people who loved them left grieving and questioning. To many, Max’s “accident” never looked like an accident...to others calling Rebecca’s death,..a suicide...was an outrage. But it seemed on this Board, one had to pick a Team and have Team spirit.

It was really off-putting, just to read.

Since only Rebecca and her sister were in the house with Max, to question whether he really DID falll, would inflame the RZ supporters. “We are not discussing Max.” Why not? If we can discuss the probability of RZ being murdered, why not Max?

To get justice for one, required ignoring the other. To get justice for one grieving family, required vilifying the other. Why? There were TWO suspicious deaths. Wouldn’t it be ironic if there was some other explanation, missed because of Team Spirit on both sides?

When the argument is made, as it has been many times, that RZ was extremely religious and therefore would NEVER commit suicide, it is not “hateful” to discuss her affairs and theft. It’s just the truth of her life. Does that make her evil or a bad person? NO! It just refutes the contention that she was a person who allowed the tenets of religion to guide her life. Please just consider it like that.

I had a pretty negative opinion of JS until yesterday. I believe now that he loved his son dearly and loved Rebecca too. He had affairs but since RZ had affairs too, who’s to say whether that was an issue in their love affair. There has never been one scintilla of proof that he “paid off” the investigators. Look around, there is ineptitude and shoddy work in many places. That accusation may give comfort, but, no one can link one bit of evidence to support it.

I’m not sure RZ was murdered. I’m not sure Max fell by accident. I do believe, at this point, that AS is innocent.

Jessica2012 said:

No, but isn’t being a Christian all about organized religion to some extent? He did not ever say she considered herself a Christian, and said she did not like any organized religion. If I missed Jonah saying she was a Christian, please let me know where he said that. One attendance at Easter Service in the over two years they were together does not make on a Christian. I’m not trying to put her down for that at all. But it certainly sounds like she was not religious in the way her parents and family thought she was. She would not the be first person like that.

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No, being Christian is not all about organized Religion. I am Christian. I do not go to Church. A person doesn't have to go to Church every given Sunday and pray everyday to be Christian or Religious. If that's how you view Religion, that's fine, but assuming that everyone views and connects with Religion like that is not accurate.

Jessica2012 said:

Whoa, I am not trying to disrespect Rebecca in any way, shape, or form.

Mary has been saying since Rebecca died that she was very religious, and was a Christian, and would never commit suicide because she believed she would go to hell. This does not seem to be true.

Mary testified on the stand to what I said above. Jonah is testifying to the person he knew.

Being a Christian does not mean you will not commit suicde, just as not being a Christian doesn’t mean you will.

It is another piece of information for the jury to weigh as they contemplate their verdict. You have made up your mind. They have not and will have to consider all of the testimony.

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What makes you believe that she didn't actually think she would go to hell if she was to commit suicide? Because she wasn't going to Church? I don't think is fair to assume that she didn't believe in the concept of hell just because she wasn't going to Church. She could very well believe that people who commit suicide go to hell. Her sister knows her and, if she says RZ wouldn't commit suicide is because they might have talked about it. I know for a fact that my brother would never commit suicide and my brother knows damn well that would never do that too because we have talked about it, we know each other.

Jessica2012 said:

I know this because i watched his sworn testimony on the witness stand. There are links up thread should you care to watch. I don’t think watching it qualifies me to be an insider.

There are no links to show that becoming the top level of Maritime Pilot are suitable for high school graduates with no training in the field. Can you please supply that, as I am very interested. Thank you.

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I think AS is absolutely an accomplished man. Does one need to be the CEO of a corporation to be accomplished? Why demean a man who has found a career path, done well with it, and earned an honest living?

If one believes he murdered RZ, that still does not mean that a whole group of people in certain types of jobs need to be demeaned to prove a point.

Update to Rebecca’s ...


Week #4 trial ended with the testimony of the defense handwriting expert (per him, he is paid over $10,000) just to look at the door and say it is not a sample worth comparing (Everything is worth testing especially when it involves suspicious death). He did not attempt to obtain Adam Schacknai’s handwriting or Rebecca’s handwriting for comparison. He responded that the defense didn’t ask him to compare to anything. Mr Greer pointed out to him that if the writing on the door even had a slight similarity to Rebecca’s handwriting, the defense team and he would have been all over it to prove their theory of suicide. He couldn’t say much to that and THAT was a great moment.

Before him, Jonah Schacknai testified and attempted very hard to accomplish character assassination of Rebecca. He tried to say Rebecca knew how to tie knots and her conflict with his daughter was upsetting enough to support the suicide theory. Attorney Greer pointed out that he lied on the stand by reading Jonah’s deposition under oath where he stated that he was not aware that Rebecca knew how to tie knots or has seen her do it.

The San Diego Sheriff Department DNA technician was one heck of a liar. She tried to say that the DNA on the knife handle did not have enough DNA for it to be vaginally inserted. Attorney Greer had her clarify to the jury that the DNA swab was taken after it was swabbed once to test for blood, then treated with superglue fume to lift prints, then reswabbed from unknown area of the knife for the DNA that she claimed is not a vaginal source. Greer also pointed out that she did not bother divulging in her report that one of their sample was contaminated, and one of the inconclusive DNA from one of the door knob was a male contributor. She did not have clear answer to why there was no DNA on the paint brushes, the paint tube, or on the other door knobs. The ropes were not swabbed for DNA at crime scene but instead days later after it was coiled and bagged. The DNA found on the rope that was tied to the bed was minimal and is most likely transfer DNA.

As frustrating and heart wrenching as it maybe to sit through this lies and their attempt to still humiliate and degrade Rebecca even in death, I felt like we were able to point out the defense attempt to undermine truth and expose lies of those who testified for them.

Trial resumes Monday 3/26. The San Diego Sheriffs department medical examiner Dr Lucas is scheduled to testify. He has a lot of explaining to do.
Thank you everyone for all the prayers and support.

Help spread the word!

https://www..com/rydrn-justice-for-rebecca

claudianunes said:

What makes you believe that she didn't actually think she would go to hell if she was to commit suicide? Because she wasn't going to Church? I don't think is fair to assume that she didn't believe in the concept of hell just because she wasn't going to Church. She could very well believe that people who commit suicide go to hell. Her sister knows her and, if she says RZ wouldn't commit suicide is because they might have talked about it. I know for a fact that my brother would never commit suicide and my brother knows damn well that would never do that too because we have talked about it, we know each other.

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I think it’s debatable because she didn’t fear Eternal damnation from breaking two of the commandments, Thou Shalt Not Steal and Thou Shalt Not Commit Adultery. Her husband testified she had multiple affairs. That doesn’t sound like someone who takes the basic tenets of religion seriously.

From JS testimony, she grew up in a very strict home. Her family didn’t know many things about her adult life away from them. She was certainly a loving daughter, dutifully supporting her parents.

There has been very good evidence presented to give doubt about suicide. I think the whole argument that she was too religious to kill herself should just be dropped and the focus be on the evidence.

stmarysmead said:

I think it’s debatable because she didn’t fear Eternal damnation from breaking two of the commandments, Thou Shalt Not Steal and Thou Shalt Not Commit Adultery. Her husband testified she had multiple affairs. That doesn’t sound like someone who takes the basic tenets of religion seriously.

From JS testimony, she grew up in a very strict home. Her family didn’t know many things about her adult life away from them. She was certainly a loving daughter, dutifully supporting her parents.

There has been very good evidence presented to give doubt about suicide. I think the whole argument that she was too religious to kill herself should just be dropped and the focus be on the evidence.

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Yes... because "stealing" and cheating on a guy is a super close step to hang herself naked with her arms and legs bound. Same thing.

Respectfully snipped-

K_Z said:

Very interesting that Jonah contradicts Dina's testimony about pantomiming self stabbing, and contradicts her testimony about "asian honor." One of them is not telling the truth about that.

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BBM-

My feeling was the same listening to Jonah’s testimony concerning Dr. Peterson. What is the truth? Who is telling the truth? Dina and Jonah’s versions are completely different. IIRC, Dina testified they did not know Max’s condition was fatal on the night of the 12th. Jonah testifies they did via a conversation on the 12th with Dr. Peterson. A conversation where Dina became “hysterical” and had to calm her down.

For clarification, I thought Dr. Peterson testified the conversation on the 12th did not happen? There are several contradictions.

claudianunes said:

Yes... because "stealing" and cheating on a guy is a super close step to hang herself naked with her arms and legs bound. Same thing.

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That’s not what I meant at all. If someone states, XYZ would never eat that because he is a vegetarian and then it can be proven that XYZ was a frequent McDonalds customer, it undercuts that assertion.

The binding, etc. is a better argurment against suicide than her supposed deep abiding religious faith that yet did not prevent numerous incidents of adultery, and possibly theft.

There’s no insult intended.

*Lash* said:

Respectfully snipped-



BBM-

My feeling was the same listening to Jonah’s testimony concerning Dr. Peterson. What is the truth? Who is telling the truth? Dina and Jonah’s versions are completely different. IIRC, Dina testified they did not know Max’s condition was fatal on the night of the 12th. Jonah testifies they did via a conversation on the 12th with Dr. Peterson. A conversation where Dina became “hysterical” and had to calm her down.

For clarification, I thought Dr. Peterson testified the conversation on the 12th did not happen? There are several contradictions.

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I would t expect two parents facing the horror of losing a child to have the same reactions or recall. Not sure, since neither JS or DS are party to this suit, how any conversation between them proves anything in regard to murder or suicide.

prpladi said:

Is there a link to back this information up?

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At the 13:30 minute marker of Tricia’s interview with Atty Greer. Court documents from the ROA have shown Adam had an ins policy with Travelers Ins Company.

soundcloud.com/tricia-arrington-griffith/keith-greer-trial-update-wed-31418

ETA - I believe Atty Greer stated Adam’s ins policy would not pay for murder, maybe some atty fees.

Not related to the thread, but how many kids does JS have? Just curious.

*Lash* said:

At the 13:30 minute marker of Tricia’s interview with Atty Greer. Court documents from the ROA have shown Adam had an ins policy with Travelers Ins Company.

soundcloud.com/tricia-arrington-griffith/keith-greer-trial-update-wed-31418

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Is it true that the Zahau family received monies from DS insurance company before they removed her from the case? If true, what was that settlement about? There are so many half truths and rumors.

stmarysmead said:

That’s not what I meant at all. If someone states, XYZ would never eat that because he is a vegetarian and then it can be proven that XYZ was a frequent McDonalds customer, it undercuts that assertion.

The binding, etc. is a better argurment against suicide than her supposed deep abiding religious faith that yet did not prevent numerous incidents of adultery, and possibly theft.

There’s no insult intended.

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Fun fact: McDonald's does have vegetarian options.
Do not take this one seriously, I'm just playing but I had to lmao. (With all due respect, of course!)

stmarysmead said:

I would t expect two parents facing the horror of losing a child to have the same reactions or recall. Not sure, since neither JS or DS are party to this suit, how any conversation between them proves anything in regard to murder or suicide.

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I would expect the same. It was a horrible awful time. Max was DS’s only child. I am not suggesting it was not a traumatic time for both parents. My concern is the discrepancies in the timeline and what was said.

Yes, JS and DS are not party to the suit. They do play a part in the timeline of events. The alleged suicide trigger was JS’s voicemail. The voicemail was allegedly to give Rebecca the grave news coming from Dr. P..

The message on the door? How does it fit in the timeline? Adam allegedly sexually assaults Rebecca and paints a cryptic message on the door. What did the message mean to Adam? Was he talking about Max or was he talking about Rebecca saving JS? In my opinion, the conversation with Dr. P is important in the alleged suicide timeline.

It was interesting to me, that if it is true, as Mr Greer has stipulated, that JS was already dating the woman who was to become his current wife, why didn’t the defense try to get that testified to yesterday?

I understand why Mr Greer would not bring it in, because it could help provide a state of mind and misery conducive to suicide. But why wouldn’t the defense bring that up if Jonah is so committed to exonerating his brother?

JS’s testimony yesterday sounded as if this was a couple trying mightily to work thru family issues? But yet, supposedly, he was fooling around already?

I just can’t fit this all together, either for their relationship or defense trial strategy? Yes, it might embarrass AS and his current wife, but his brother is being accused of murder?

And why would Mr Greer add this in a sworn deposition if not true?

claudianunes said:

Not related to the thread, but how many kids does JS have? Just curious.

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He has 2 kids