OH OH - William 'Bill' Comeans, 14, Columbus, 7 Jan 1980 - #1

Status
Not open for further replies.
Were any kids in school jealous of Bill?

Did his GF have an older brother at school that maybe didn't like him dating her? An ex-boyfriend that would be jealous? How long had they dated? Did they date before the attacks began?

Did the family know all of his friends? Did he discuss any friends in any odd way?

Only reason I ask is the notes at school. Obviously from someone in the school often enough to know which lockers were his, his friend's, and his GF's, if the notes are related to the attacks.

The attacks had to be someone that was hanging around in the neighborhood often. The final attack: he may have just been going back to pick up his sister, not lured away, and assumed the family would know that was where he would be. Yet he was obviously seen by the attacker(s) hanging around in the neighborhood .

All of that assumes this was murder, and not the auto erotic asphyxia noted in the beginnings of the thread (which people do outside a lot more than you guys want to know, just saying, avoid parks at night if you don't want to see something you don't want to see.)
 
Black trash liner I believe. Something you couldn't see through, so no descriptions given.
Why both when either one would have worked alone. And a note? Seems all very premeditated?

Bill willingly went back to school. We thought the first one was random. The second one obviously targeted. The third? After number two Bill wasn't out of our sight, we thought.

BBM1: Yes. Going with the scenario I posted earlier, I think leaf bags and inner tubes are both things you'd find in a garage. And it's because you couldn't see through the bag that I'm considering that it might be part of a fabrication. If Bill was left alone after the attack (which I think is highly plausible -- if the perp was disgusted with himself and wanted to pretend it didn't happen, he's want Bill out if his sight), maybe Bill came up with this story while he was still in the garage, struggling with what he remembered and his dreadful feelings about what he may have done, as well as things said to him. If he was drugged, he would still be groggy. Maybe he saw the bags and took one? Before he got it together enough to flee? Just thinking through the possibilities ...

BBM2: Right. And there is physical (bodily) evidence, at least after the second attack (maybe this one too?) that Bill was choked. But in Bill's story of what happened, he uses the bag to explain how he was overcome and how they were able to stay anonymous. He doesn't say they used it to try to suffocate him. Right?

BBM3: Premeditated ... well, in terms how I see this predator, I think he would have been watching Bill up to this point, cultivating a relationship, probably fantasizing about an opportunity presenting itself -- maybe even alternately trying to suppress it. But to me, the tools suggest he used what was handy in the garage. Maybe that suggests that this was a chance meeting between him and Bill, rather than an appointment Bill had with him? Not sure ... at least, it suggests acting on an urge in the moment, being overcome finally and doing it. If Bill didn't have an appointment with him, maybe when they ran into each other the man asked for a hand -- e.g., "Hey, Bill -- would you mind helping me carry this into the garage?" I can't imagine Bill saying no to that, but I'm only speculating.

Premeditation may come through more from the notes, IMO. And it's hard to know whether they were penned by the attacker or Bill. Do you recall what the handwriting analysis said? Now that I am thinking this part through again, I can't see the predator leaving this note for Bill -- mainly due to the syntax ("He was warned," IIRC -- not "You were warned"). I think if the man left the note, it would have been TO Bill, but again -- speculating.

BBM4: The victim profile suggests Bill would have had to give into denial to cope with this. Maybe he did this by telling himself it had been a fluke occurrence, or that he had imagined the details of what happened to him. I think he would have had to do something like that to go on. It would have happened naturally. And breaking through a child's denial can be very difficult. It means they don't want to remember. They choose to believe the version they tell you and don't want to be put off of it.

MOO. This is only one way to put the pieces together.
 
That has always bothered me. First attack, plastic bag and bicycle intertube. Who comes up with a combination like that? An intertube, I guess they owned a bicycle? Just an odd combination in my mind.

And as you put it, bag, tube, rope used in first two attacks. Why was the third different? Because he was wearing a scarf, so no additional weapon was needed to strangle him? And why bring a knife and not use it to inflict damage on his body?

I'm going to stangle you to death, but I don't want to cause you obvious greiveous wounds like would be made from a butcher knife?

BBM: If the knife turns out to have belonged to Bill's murderer, it may point to the predator intending to kill Bill that night. IMO, he was desperate and didn't know how the night would unfold. To be graphic (I'm sorry): The man may have been more comfortable with -- or preferred -- strangulation. But he was out of his element. He may even have wanted to believe he wouldn't give into the urge connected with the strangulation again. That what he did tonight with the knife was going to give him back his self-control. But when he saw the scarf, IMO, it may have broken his resolve. Thus, he may have dropped and neglected the knife. JMO
 
From the timeline:
7/21 - 10/31/80 Neighbors on Maple Drive receive threatening letters/notes
13-19 letters (sources are mixed on the exact number) are received by eight families living w/in 200 yards of one another on Maple Dr. (or within 200 yards of the Comeans home)
Families on Maple Drive who receive the notes include: Armstrong, Baker, Blain, Comeans, Kidwell, Stormont, Tope, and Watts
Families receive identical notes on same days.
In July they start to arrive at two-week intervals.
Some are mailed, others hand-delivered at night (several sources say tied to porches and cars with leather belts; one source says taped; one source says leather straps).
First to be delivered in person arrive 9/9/80.
Sometimes arrival is 4 days apart, other times 33 days apart.
Handwriting is described two ways:
“crudely printed messages”
“neatly penciled on pieces of cut envelope.”
Handwriting analysis reveals all are written by same person. (Unclear whether comparison include pre-death notes.)
Messages are “very brief in three or four words or in poorly constructed sentences.”
Messages reported in press:
Parents should guard their children carefully, signed X.
“Time is short”
“[Name] is next” (seven neighborhood females, aged 7-50, were specifically named across in these notes)
“All have been warned”
“Death in October”
“U R Next”
“It’s time.” (left the night before Halloween)

I think it's odd that, given a teen-age boy had been targeted, the Maple Drive notes name only females as possible future victims. It seems like the letter writer would have tried to make it look like either: A. teens/younger folks were being targeted, or B. males were being targeted. But sending notes that, when they name anyone at all, name females aged 7-50...that's pretty much the exact opposite of a crime that has specifically targeted a teen-aged boy three times. Eight families got notes...seven females were specifically named...so does that mean that every non-Comeans family that received threatening notes had a female family member named? Or did some families have more than one female family member named?

I would imagine AJT had to mix it up a bit to justify inserting herself into the case, perhaps for attention (claiming that someone had tried to pull her into a van, for example). So I see why she might have a variety of names and ages in there, because she had to get "older" and "female" in the pool of those supposedly threatened, so that she could include herself in there. Because otherwise, everything about this case is centered around teens and high school, and "50-ish woman who doesn't work for the school system" would stick out like a sore thumb. But as it is, with every other note threatening females across a wide spectrum of ages, it makes it seem like the supposed letter-writer is out to get females...which ends up making it look like Billy's case is the odd one out.

Now, it seems like it's official that the letters were all faked by AJT for her own purposes (whatever those might have been), and someone who would do something like that likely has twisted reasoning that rational minds just cannot ever fathom. And maybe it's as simple as "other than the Comeans and Tope families, there were no other males on Maple Drive that she could have named in those notes" (although, that really seems unlikely). Did AJT just think that if females were threatened, it would get more attention? I don't know what to make of it.

Maybe it's nothing. it just strikes me as odd, in a kind of "doth protest too much kind of way." (Not that I'm going anywhere forbidden.)
 
Have you guys noticed how many times a GARAGE is mentioned in this thread? I'm trying to think outside the box here. How many homes in the neighborhood had garages?
 
From the street shot of the neighborhood, it looks like many of the homes had detached garages or sheds. Both would be a perfect place to commit the crime.
 
I just want to throw some idea out there.....

The night of the murder. Could Bill's killer have been at this birthday party that Kathleen attended? He then came and told Bill that Kathleen wondered from the party and they need to find her?
Party consisted of the family.

What was Bill wearing the night he was found? Was he dressed up in a warm jacket, wooly hat, gloves and a scarf to go out on that cold, snowy night?
Why was he wearing a scarf if he was stationed in/at the house? Was it his scarf that he was strangled with?
Bill was dressed warm. He was going in and out of the house; he was also outside taking down Christmas decorations from the porch.
 
Original post TBM:


But also, if Bill had started to walk back for his sister ... even if he was only in the street for a moment ... that could be the point of abduction -- in my way of thinking, by car.

Most likely Bill would have cut through the neighbors front yard (to the south of our house) to get me from the party (two doors down).
 
Which scene do you mean? The murder?
The problem is though, the killer only had a time frame of roughly 20-30mins. Bill's dad and neighbor began searching the neighborhood roughly 20 mins after 9 pm.
That would mean the killer would have to have abducted Bill from his Garden, dragged him into a nearby Garage, strangled him, then carried Bill back into his car and drove to the end of Buena Vista and left him there all the while avoiding being seen by Bill's family and neighbors.
Plus it doesnt explain why the knife was left at the seen imho.

I agree with you and GBMG that a garage would sound very plausible for the 2nd alleged abduction. He could have been kept in a garage unconscious. That would explain why LE said his clothes were completely dry.

Agreed about possibly a garage. Unless he was actually going to someone's house for visits, it seems most likely garage for the 2nd attack.
 
From the street shot of the neighborhood, it looks like many of the homes had detached garages or sheds. Both would be a perfect place to commit the crime.

Do you mean on the night of the murder? A garage or shed provides perfect privacy for the killer for sure. But the only thing that bothers me about this theory on the night of the murder is the very small time frame.
Bill is taken approx 9 pm, and his father begins looking for him with a neighbor some 20 mins after he is missing.
Because Bill was found at the end of the parallel street do we not think Bill's father, brother and neighbors would have spotted a car drive up and down? Its a very risky move for the killer to abduct, murder at his home, bring Bill back to the car and leave him so close to where he was originally taken without being seen?
Plus, it doesnt seem to make sense that the killer left the knife at the scene. (Unless of course, the knife accidentally slipped out of his pocket while placing Bill down)

If we go by the theory that Bill was abducted and not coerced into walking down to Buena Vista i think its more probable he was taken into a van parked close by, driven down a block, murdered in the van and left at Buena Vista imho.

I do agree with you and GBMG that a Garage could have been used in the 2nd attack when Bill was 'missing' for 6 hours.
 
Have you guys noticed how many times a GARAGE is mentioned in this thread? I'm trying to think outside the box here. How many homes in the neighborhood had garages?
Almost every single house in the neighborhoods had garages, and it would probably be a pretty even split of attached garages vs. detached garages.
 
Dec. 5, 1980
Neighbor of Slain Youth Arrested for Penning Series of Death Notes, Columbus Dispatch
Dec. 5, 1980
New Rome Woman Admits Threats to Neighbors, Columbus Citizen-Journal

So the letters had nothing to do with Bills death, only a female elderly neighborhood weirdo.


My thoughts


1st attack September-can't ID multiple assailants, claimed he was was choked from behind, near the HS. Was there a police report? I cannot see the police ignoring the assault of a 'child' unless there was far more to it. Maybe they could tell the story was mostly fabricated. And Bill wasn't talking much.

The 2nd attack in October- Bill was 'collecting money for his paper route'. I would guess that to be an after school activity possibly stretching til 8-9 pm at the very latest?
He claimed to have been 'attacked' again. But at no time does anyone claim he was robbed. Cannot id attackers again but was able to confirm there were two guys in an aqua car. Hardly a common car color even for 1979. The average 15 year old boy knows the difference between a Ford and a Toyota. Why no detailed description? Big car? Little car? It should have been relatively simple to ID by the police. If it was HS bullies a ride around the neighborhood or HS parking lot would have revealed all.

He did not return home till 1am with strangulation marks on his neck. What night of the week was it? If it was a Saturday it is when kids go out with friends and would not raise suspicion to parent. But 1am is late for a 9th grader. If a police report was made it has to be dated.


Any chance of auto-erotic asphyxiation? Any chance of him leaving to meet another male? Was Bill gay? What was he wearing when he was found?

I am not in anyway demeaning his memory. But what we commonly talk about in 2014 was very taboo in 1979. I can see a teen boy in 1979 being very vague about his sexuality or try to hiding gay bashing. No one back then wanted to be labeled as 'queer' by their family or anyone else. AIDS epidemic was new there was such a prejudice against gay men.

Was there a lover hurting Bill? Were gangs of boys harassing and harming him? Certainly his siblings although they did not realize it then, are sophisticated enough now to know now.

I was in a teen in HS back then and no one was 'out'.
 
Dec. 5, 1980
Neighbor of Slain Youth Arrested for Penning Series of Death Notes, Columbus Dispatch
Dec. 5, 1980
New Rome Woman Admits Threats to Neighbors, Columbus Citizen-Journal

So the letters had nothing to do with Bills death, only a female elderly neighborhood weirdo.


My thoughts


1st attack September-can't ID multiple assailants, claimed he was was choked from behind, near the HS. Was there a police report? I cannot see the police ignoring the assault of a 'child' unless there was far more to it. Maybe they could tell the story was mostly fabricated. And Bill wasn't talking much.

The 2nd attack in October- Bill was 'collecting money for his paper route'. I would guess that to be an after school activity possibly stretching til 8-9 pm at the very latest?
He claimed to have been 'attacked' again. But at no time does anyone claim he was robbed. Cannot id attackers again but was able to confirm there were two guys in an aqua car. Hardly a common car color even for 1979. The average 15 year old boy knows the difference between a Ford and a Toyota. Why no detailed description? Big car? Little car? It should have been relatively simple to ID by the police. If it was HS bullies a ride around the neighborhood or HS parking lot would have revealed all.

He did not return home till 1am with strangulation marks on his neck. What night of the week was it? If it was a Saturday it is when kids go out with friends and would not raise suspicion to parent. But 1am is late for a 9th grader. If a police report was made it has to be dated.


Any chance of auto-erotic asphyxiation? Any chance of him leaving to meet another male? Was Bill gay? What was he wearing when he was found?

I am not in anyway demeaning his memory. But what we commonly talk about in 2014 was very taboo in 1979. I can see a teen boy in 1979 being very vague about his sexuality or try to hiding gay bashing. No one back then wanted to be labeled as 'queer' by their family or anyone else. AIDS epidemic was new there was such a prejudice against gay men.

Was there a lover hurting Bill? Were gangs of boys harassing and harming him? Certainly his siblings although they did not realize it then, are sophisticated enough now to know now.

I was in a teen in HS back then and no one was 'out'.

Yes there were police reports.

The family have released a picture of a similar car

October 22 1979 is a Monday.

In one of his recent postings, his brother Bob mentions that Bill was missing that evening, so yes, suspicions were raised.

I take it you have not (yet) found the description of what he was wearing when he was fouind and how. Keep on looking! It is all out there! :seeya:
 
Almost every single house in the neighborhoods had garages, and it would probably be a pretty even split of attached garages vs. detached garages.

Hi Kath, were there any houses unoccupied that you are aware of?
 
Almost every single house in the neighborhoods had garages, and it would probably be a pretty even split of attached garages vs. detached garages.

Thank you Kat for your prompt reply. My heart breaks for you and your family. I am a crime victim myself, and found more support here than I did with a counselor. Blessings to your family! You guys have suffered enough. :(
 
Original post TBM:


Great addition, dogperson. To help the family think through things in a fresh way (they've likely already gone over the residents in the neighborhood a million times), maybe it would help if we all brainstormed some roles for potential perpetrators. I would think of paid and volunteer positions. Here are some we've mentioned with others I've added:

  • Church or other youth group leader
  • Private music teacher
  • School accompanist
  • Local school personnel: Teacher, aide, superintendent, principal, coach, extracurricular advisor, custodian, guidance counselor, school psychologist
  • Camp director, recreation program director, scout leader, local children's theater company coach, birthday party clown/magician
  • Children's (or school) photographer
  • Librarian
  • Daycare worker
  • Paper route coordinator or customer
  • Medical personnel: Doctor, nurse (tho male nurses were more rare then), orderly, custodian at a medical facility, home healthcare aide, pediatric dentist or hygienist, child psychologist
  • Social worker, child welfare worker
  • College professor?
I don't know if any family member has the time, energy, or local connections to do something like this, but one way to be methodical about this would be to print street-view maps, talk to people you remember from when you lived there, figure out who lived where and did what, and mark up the map. If nothing else, it might point to what you don't know ...

Reading through this story I think too that someone close by did it. It has to be. It's almost like he was in a constant watch from somebody. They knew what he was doing and could act on it.

So if we make the hypothesis that he was close by, then he lives on the same street. And given the nature of the attack, I doubt he stopped after this victim. And since it's been a long time, there's a good chance he was caught on another agression. So, one way to go forward would be to survey everyone that lived there at the time, and trace back where they live now and get which one has been arrested for something criminal / agression.

Maybe it has already been proposed here. I didn't read the whole 44 pages yet.

Sent from my Nexus 7 using Tapatalk
 
Hi Kath, were there any houses unoccupied that you are aware of?

In the neighborhood we lived (Little Farms Addition) and the neighborhood were Bill's first attack occurred (Lincoln Village), I'm sure there may have been a house vacant, we are talking around 2500+ houses. Back in 1979, vacant houses were definitely not as common has they are today.
 
Dec. 5, 1980
Neighbor of Slain Youth Arrested for Penning Series of Death Notes, Columbus Dispatch
Dec. 5, 1980
New Rome Woman Admits Threats to Neighbors, Columbus Citizen-Journal

So the letters had nothing to do with Bills death, only a female elderly neighborhood weirdo.
The letters written "after" Bill's death by AJT had nothing to do with Bill's death.

My thoughts


1st attack September-can't ID multiple assailants, claimed he was was choked from behind, near the HS. Was there a police report? I cannot see the police ignoring the assault of a 'child' unless there was far more to it. Maybe they could tell the story was mostly fabricated. And Bill wasn't talking much.
For clarification, Bill wasn't attacked near a high school, it was an elementary school. And of course, a police report was made. They went to the crime scene and recovered items.
 
I'm going to touch on a few topics & items, most that have been mentioned thus far, however I am going to be focusing in on a more detailed (ie. in-depth) analysis aspect in an attempt to provide some food for thought & feedback. All insights are "IMO", so yours may vary.

The 1992 David Chereck, age 15, strangulation case in Skokie & Morton Grove, IL:
I had known about this case. Not in full detail, but sufficient info to comment. Bob, you stated "Found within two blocks of his home in wooded area".
That part is not true. He was found actually more than a mile from his house, in a wooded area in the next suburb. He was also found in just a T-shirt, pants, & socks. His shoes and winter jacket were completely missing from the scene. Initially there was considerable speculation of auto-erotic asphyxia.
This case was hugely botched from the get-go, as it's jurisdiction was fought over by an incompetent local PD (a PD that severely botched handling the disappearance of my own sister in 1970), but fell in the hands of an even more highly incompetent county "Forest Preserve" police force.
My opinion: I find it highly unlikely the perp of that case (CA "suspect", or other) had anything to do with Bill's case, for the reasons:
1. Perp drove victim far from abduction site. Perp concealed body in dense wooded area, not in very public place & plain open view like Bill.
2. Perp also stripped David of his jacket and shoes, and took them from scene (never found items, afaik).
3. Perp highly unlikely to simply commit his act within 2 blocks of your home. Far more his MO (modus operandi) to disable Bill and drive far away to a very secluded place.
4. Several more reasons, but main ones already listed are significant enough.

The "Car" (in Bill's case):
Tho I never rule out anything (tho I may keep things below 5% probability), I do not see a vehicle being used, especially for the 3rd attack/death.
1. Use of a vehicle is far more "witness-able" and "cumbersome" in a virtually slightly over 1 block radius attack. (on abduction AND the very open final death scene).
2. Use of a vehicle largest "benefit" would be to carry Bill far from the abduction point. That did not occur, in the least.
3. Use of a vehicle is far more unlikely in "spur of the moment" chances of catching Bill away from family, in front of his own home.
4. Use of a vehicle would also allow Bill to easily/readily notice it either on approach, or parked nearby the house. Or upon exit of the "occupants".
These are my main reasons for placing the use of a vehicle as "unlikely".

Use of black plastic bag & inner tube (attack #1):
1. IMO, does not afford any justification or reason as to why Bill did not see his attackers. Even in situations attacked "from behind". Probably the best way I can demonstrate this is a real life recreation of the event. Since surprise would be a necessary key element, it's hard to recreate. However, hypothetically, if you were riding a bicycle and have two people jump out from a concealed area (say a tree/bush) behind you: First, unless you were riding a bike at a bare crawl (most kids don't), you would be a fair distance ahead of them by the time they jumped out. Most trees wouldn't afford 100% concealment for a very "close up" victim.
But mainly, in the act of anyone attempting to place a bag over your head, even by surprise, there is almost always ample time to react and see that person's face.
Simply put, I place myself in any victim's shoes. I'd feel comfortable challenging anyone to be able to do it successfully to me, and not have me see their face.

It's been asked "Why those two items? Why the need for the bag? Why not just the inner tube for strangulation?"
I'm not a doctor, medical examiner, nor killer, but will provide the following info from what I know.
1. Both items would be needed for maximum asphyxiation in the shortest amount of time, thus reducing "struggle/consciousness" time to a minimum.
2. Quite simply, the bag limits breathable air to virtually close to zero air. The inner tube (or any tying item) seals the enclosure and maintains the seal. It's rather scary just thinking about it, I know. Just trying to explain.
3. But this allows use of the victim's hands (unless they are held/tied) before the point of unconsciousness, to tear off the items
4. The note left said "He was warned". Keyword is "WAS". Not "is". If Bill didn't fake that note, then to me that significantly indicates they intended him NOT to walk away alive.
5. All of these are reasons why I said in my very first post that I believe the intent of #1 attack was to kill on that date, rather than scare. I also can't answer why they used an inner tube, rather than say rope or duct tape, other than 1. possibly handy for the perps to have. 2. Due to the stretchy material, it actually would be the best material to both seal and ADD/maintain compression pressure to the throat/neck once it is tied off.

I would appreciate feedback to see what others think, or if they disagree with certain parts, and opposing viewpoints, so we can exchange ideas, and reduce the chances of going in wrong directions.

Right now I'm reviewing aerial photos of the neighborhood taken in 1971. That is the "closest" year that is available for me at present, tho typically for a fee you can order a specific year, or one much closer to 1979. The ultimate goal is to get a 100% accurate detailed view of each scene and surroundings, as if standing right there. That would be very high value as a "foundation" in any successful investigation. That is why you often see LE standing silent at a scene, turning & taking in the entire 360° around them, in deep thought.

In my thinking, I literally have hundreds of vital questions about physical neighborhood details, scene details, details on your observations between & after each attack & I also still have comments/opinions on numerous segments ("evidence" at scene, etc). However, this post is already more lengthy than I originally intended, so i will end here for now.
 
The inner tube/plastic bag are handy not just to adults, but to teens with bikes and of course homes. So is a butcher knife. I just don't see an adult carrying a butcher knife around as they could purchase a hunting knife or pocket knife for themselves. So, if the butcher knife had anything to do with attack 3, I'm thinking teens to twenties. Could also include female perp, as females would not likely have a hunting knife. Could also suggest suicidal ideation (along with taking Valium to not feel the pain and Valium fog enforcing the idea), ex.: ex-hubby had an ex-GF in his backyard with a butcher knife talking of cutting her wrists after their break up.

Was the butcher knife ever taken for prints or did people at the scene touch it and blow that chance?

Wish we could see all of the police reports, with names redacted of course, since the police feel there are no suspects and no one has ever been charged with a crime.

Where was the scarf knotted at on Bill's neck? Front, back, or side? I am assuming front, but that still would go with the police idea of suicide or self inflicted accident. If a stranger jumped you from behind, depending on the length of your scarf (and I am again assuming as I know I should not) that a guys scarf is not too long, they have to be very close to you. There will be some tug and the knot, or tightening part, would turn a bit if it was a surprise attack, I would think, as the victim would lurch or struggle, the perp is coming from behind and tugging at something that is cloth and generally a bit slippery. Actually, thinking about a guy's scarf, the longer ends would normally hang in front of you, at your chest. So, the victim would know someone was reaching on both sides to grab the scarf, and there would be some struggle. Still thinking through it....
 
Status
Not open for further replies.

Members online

Online statistics

Members online
178
Guests online
3,408
Total visitors
3,586

Forum statistics

Threads
592,298
Messages
17,966,942
Members
228,735
Latest member
dil2288
Back
Top