The Package and the Defense Motion

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Did anyone notice that "the package" has not been examined and is being held for in camera review?

No manifesto, or leaking pipes?
 
jjenny said:
Well, the defense sure doesn't seem to worry about his privacy when they release this info.
LOL. Court documents appear to be a great way to release info when there is a gag order in place.
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possibly a preemptive strike?
get people discussing how he was so messed up and in need of help...build a sympathy case...

dunno...just throwing that out there....
 
prima.facie said:
possibly a preemptive strike?
get people discussing how he was so messed up and in need of help...build a sympathy case...

dunno...just throwing that out there....
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People are already discussing this right and left.
 
gitana1 said:
That makes it sound like seeing a psychiatrist is a mandatory part of the graduate program. Otherwise, why so many students?

Okay, I'm confused. I saw a report linked here stating that the notebook contained details about how exactly the killer would massacre a bunch of people, with drawings, etc. But the state's response to the motion indicates that they have not yet opened the "box" and were waiting for an "in camera" review, which means in the judge's chambers, with the judge present. Which is it?:
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Seems like Fox News had an overzealous "source" that was right about the package being delivered, but wrong about the contents. Someone probably speculated about the contents and was wrong. It could really just end up being a note to his doctor. If that's the case, I'm not sure they can seize it and use as evidence as it's protected by HIIPA, correct?
 
As one that could be part of the word "people", I have been extremely dubious of the media assertions.
 
newsleuther said:
Seems like Fox News had an overzealous "source" that was right about the package being delivered, but wrong about the contents. Someone probably speculated about the contents and was wrong. It could really just end up being a note to his doctor. If that's the case, I'm not sure they can seize it and use as evidence as it's protected by HIIPA, correct?
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I am pretty sure that if they got the warrant HIPAA wouldn't apply.
 
newsleuther said:
Seems like Fox News had an overzealous "source" that was right about the package being delivered, but wrong about the contents. Someone probably speculated about the contents and was wrong. It could really just end up being a note to his doctor. If that's the case, I'm not sure they can seize it and use as evidence as it's protected by HIIPA, correct?
Click to expand...

Well, in criminal cases, there are circumstances in which HIPPA can be bypassed. I will ask my law partner (he does criminal law) for specifics.
 
in regards to what the defense claims - that JH's right to due process and a fair trial has been jeopardized.....how will this affect the trial now? will the information that has been leaked not be admissible?

can an attorney here speak on this?
 
prima.facie said:
in regards to what the defense claims - that JH's right to due process and a fair trial has been jeopardized.....how will this affect the trial now? will the information that has been leaked not be admissible?

can an attorney here speak on this?
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You should read the people response. Just because defense lawyers say something doesn't make it so.
 
jjenny said:
You should read the people response. Just because defense lawyers say something doesn't make it so.
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let me clarify.....if it is true, would it still be admissable...id like to hear the opinions of attorneys on this since there are some posting amongst us....
 
pinkflamingo said:
Sorry if this was already mentioned, (i missed a few pages) but JH left his position, he was no longer a member of the university. Why should she still be responsible for him?
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While I personally don't see that this particular DR. 'saw' JH in the capacity the defense is now 'claiming' for the sake of removing of the journal.

IF JH WAS seeing the DR professionally before his acts, it MIGHT be relevant.

If JH was seeing the DR for medication and counselling before his horrendous act, then him mailing anything to his DOCTOR WOULD be covered under doctor patient confidentiality.

BUT!! The fact is in this journal he threatened the lives of others!... Even after the fact, if a patient threatens others, is it still covered?

Little confused on that aspect.
 
I meant more like, he had dropped out over a month earlier. Obviously had ANYONE received that notebook (and opened it) and did not report it to police, they would be liable. However, I am just imagining that he stopped seeing her in May, which was like 2 months ago. Maybe she did refer him for more help. I really doubt that any professional would just refuse to see or help him if they thought he was capable of doing this. Of course it is a possibility, but there is no evidence that suggests that ANYONE knew that this was his plan.

It will be interesting to see what unfolds...
 
"If JH was seeing the DR for medication and counselling before his horrendous act, then him mailing anything to his DOCTOR WOULD be covered under doctor patient confidentiality.

BUT!! The fact is in this journal he threatened the lives of others!... Even after the fact, if a patient threatens others, is it still covered?"

Prosecution response to defense motion asserted that the package had not been opened yet and media reports about its content did not come from law enforcement.

But you raise an interesting point: if the package contains threats, can the defense claim patient confidentiality? And who determines what is a "threat" in this situation, where hindsight colors every communication and makes it see an inevitable precursor?
 
I've pulled a few posts about "the package" from the Armchair Psyche thread, to address here.

21merc7 said:
Did anyone notice that "the package" has not been examined and is being held for in camera review?

No manifesto, or leaking pipes?
Click to expand...


gitana1 said:
<respectfully snipped to thread pertinent part of post>

Okay, I'm confused. I saw a report linked here stating that the notebook contained details about how exactly the killer would massacre a bunch of people, with drawings, etc. But the state's response to the motion indicates that they have not yet opened the "box" and were waiting for an "in camera" review, which means in the judge's chambers, with the judge present. Which is it?:
Click to expand...

newsleuther said:
Seems like Fox News had an overzealous "source" that was right about the package being delivered, but wrong about the contents. Someone probably speculated about the contents and was wrong. It could really just end up being a note to his doctor. If that's the case, I'm not sure they can seize it and use as evidence as it's protected by HIIPA, correct?
Click to expand...


I'm not specifically addressing the above posters ... all replies are welcome.

A package was sent to the university, or possibly specifically to one particular professor, by a perp who:

1) after gassing movie theater, shot down 70 people; fatally wounding 12
2) booby-trapped his apartment, secured by trip wire, with multiple explosives which took LE/FBI two days to disassemble
3) had allegedly warned LE upon arrest about said package
4) caused 2 research buildings on campus to be evacuated for 2.5 hours, whilst being searched

Who truly believes that LE would even think of letting said package to go unopened and uninspected (to await opening en camera)? :waitasec:

Because to me, that inaction would define "insanity"! IMOO
 
Bullchit!!! This woman is not gonna take th fall for this individual who thoroughly plotted, planned and slaughtered the innocent!! She is being used.. She is all part of his sick plan!! He made sure his notebook didn't reach her til after he slaughtered the innocent!! His bullchit will never work!!

Bye bye Jimmy!!!
 
~n/t~ said:
IF she was his doctor and treating him, can she just drop them like a hot potato? IMO, she may have referred him to another psychiatrist after he withdrew and PERHAPS that may have been one of his triggers for this attack (??)

:moo:
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It's pretty clear he had been planning the attack way before he actually dropped out of the university (the gun and ammunition stockpiling). This was not planned in a month IMO
 
According to the response of prosecution to defense, anonymous sources used by the media were not accurate. So, I certainly don't believe that package arrived ahead of time. I think it makes much more sense for it to arrive on Monday, just like the University said.
 
I personally think it is a slippery slope. The 'what ifs' and 'might of beens' cloud the issue.

Clear cut for most psychologist/psychiatrists is.. if someone threatens others lives or their own live, then they need to report it. Right?

So IF this DR saw him before hand and saw NO sign of violence on anyone, they would have no need to report. Correct?

Then this package comes in, after the fact, before the DR saw it. So there is no liability for the DR.

After the fact, since there is no liability for the DR, why would it still be privileged?

He threatened death to other people.

Maybe I am just reaching.... Ugh!!!!!
 
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