Allison Baden-Clay - GENERAL DISCUSSION THREAD #32

DunnoZo said:

Thank you Ferris. What this means to me is that the screams were heard on the portion of Rafting Ground Road closer to Moggill Rd. It seems to be midway between small Winrock St. roundabout and Moggill Rd. If I had a clue how to mark up a map I would. If I had a clue how this information relates to the case I'd be happier...

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Agreed, I can't see how it is related. The house is a long way from anywhere that a person would be walking. There is no public park nearby and no footpaths. Red herring. IMO.

Opinionsgalore said:

Whereabouts is the roundabout (where the police were questioning motorists) in relation to Kholo creek and scout grounds ? sorry I don't know that area at all, and I apologise if this has already been covered.


This is MOO.

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Hi OpinionsG (aka Onions)

The Kenmore roundabout is nowhere near Kholo Creek - probably 14-15 Km away (I'll have to check the distance next time I head that way).

RumourSquasher: I take your point about the screams being heard between Winrock St roundabout and Moggill Road. But that is a long way from Rees Way and Creekside Park, and even further from the BC house. If it were Allison, she would only have had to go a bit further onto Moggill Rd, turn left, and then a bit more of a walk to get to BC Seniors' place. And if it were teenagers skylarking - where would they have been? They're all private properties up there I think....

So, I'm still not convinced either way on where those screams originated (as opposed to where they were heard), and whether or not they have anything to do with the case.

My mind remains open on that one....

Makara said:

Marly, I had an interesting drive around and checked out Bunga Road, the scout camp entrances and Wirrabura Road, amongst other places. I waved to a few cars going by, but people didn't seem very friendly, nobody waved back to me. It was getting a bit warm in the car and I realised that I had the heater on. It was then that I also realised that I was sitting at my computer 'driving' around on Google Street View and my air-con was flat chat in the living room. :floorlaugh:

I live in NSW and I don't think I'll be in the area this coming weekend. Google Street Maps is fun and I don't even need a driver's license. :floorlaugh:

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You'd think at least one of them would have waved back...ah well maybe a Google car will go by some time when a couple of forum members are at the bridge...give Makara a wave for goodness sake!!!....

Nads said:

Or do-gooder, bleeding hearts who believe that he is a victim. They would have to be clueless now though to still believe that.

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And sometimes rich sicko widows might 'fall in love' with him while he is in jail. It happens.

DrWatson said:

Hi OpinionsG (aka Onions)

The Kenmore roundabout is nowhere near Kholo Creek - probably 14-15 Km away (I'll have to check the distance next time I head that way).

RumourSquasher: I take your point about the screams being heard between Winrock St roundabout and Moggill Road. But that is a long was from Rees Way and Creekside Park, and even further from the BC house. If it were Allison, she would only have had to go a bit further onto Moggill Rd, turn left, and then a bit more of a walk to get to BC Seniors' place. And if it were teenagers skylarking - where would they have been? They're all private properties up there I think....

So, I'm still not convinced either way on where those screams originated (as opposed to where they were heard), and whether or not they have anything to do with the case.

My mind remains open on that one....

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Thanks Doc



This is MOO.

Hi everyone. I'm not long home from work and am trying desperately to catch up with pages of posts but am finding it difficult. I have been viewing since Thread 1 and in the early days I found it much easier to read every single post. For some reason I now find it really hard to catch up. When I have lots of pages I always start where I finished up but then I feel really lonely back there by myself so I skip forward to the last page of the thread and then I get confused about what is being talked about so then I go back again and I feel like my head is spinning. So anyway I just wanted some contact before I go back to catch up. BTW I'm sure you've already spoken about it- but Linette's new avatar made me LOL as soon as I logged on. Also I just wanted to say a HUGE Thank you to all of you who put a lot of effort into keeping us all up to date with everything. I love knowing that no matter how busy life gets,I won't miss out on anything to do with this case thanks to all of you. I feel guilty because I don't get a chance to contribute much but just wanted you all to know how much I enjoy reading posts and occasionally replying.

Ferris said:

image attached shows Truter house.

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Good pic FERRIS. It shows that the Truter house is closer to NBC's house. The proximity was shown on RUMOURSQUASHER's map posted about p.31.

As a high frequency, high decibel scream (i.e. a woman's scream), is not directional at night out in the open in a semi-rural area. The sound (scream) would travel globally and dissipate with distance. Sound drops off with distance (e.g. 6DB per doubling of distance). If it was a still night i.e. no wind, with little background noise, then the sound will travel further. However, in a dense treed area, the higher frequency sound waves (i.e. a woman's scream) would dissipate more quickly. High frequency sound waves hit the leaves of the trees and break up. As sound travels globally, then one would not be able to tell the direction it came from, unless they were in close proximity. Therefore, the people who live closest in proximity to the high decibel, high frequency sound (i.e.a woman's scream in terror) would hear it through their windows. The further away you live, the lower and more distant the sound would be, etc.
Hypothetically, this means that the sound (female screams heard) were in close proximity to the Truter house. This indicates that the female screams heard emanated in close proximity to that area. [I have not talked about low frequency sound i.e. a man's scream/voice because we are only concerned about the female scream]. My opinion, not fact.

Timmy said:

Hi everyone. I'm not long home from work and am trying desperately to catch up with pages of posts but am finding it difficult. I have been viewing since Thread 1 and in the early days I found it much easier to read every single post. For some reason I now find it really hard to catch up. When I have lots of pages I always start where I finished up but then I feel really lonely back there by myself so I skip forward to the last page of the thread and then I get confused about what is being talked about so then I go back again and I feel like my head is spinning. So anyway I just wanted some contact before I go back to catch up. BTW I'm sure you've already spoken about it- but Linette's new avatar made me LOL as soon as I logged on. Also I just wanted to say a HUGE Thank you to all of you who put a lot of effort into keeping us all up to date with everything. I love knowing that no matter how busy life gets,I won't miss out on anything to do with this case thanks to all of you. I feel guilty because I don't get a chance to contribute much but just wanted you all to know how much I enjoy reading posts and occasionally replying.

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Oh Timmy we love you and don't want you to feel lonely. I'm sure a lot of us have to catch up at times or skip a few pages. But I do agree that it is getting more complicated to keep up. Maybe it is because not much new information or leads have come to light and we are simply rehashing posts from early on.

Timmy said:

Hi everyone. I'm not long home from work and am trying desperately to catch up with pages of posts but am finding it difficult. I have been viewing since Thread 1 and in the early days I found it much easier to read every single post. For some reason I now find it really hard to catch up. When I have lots of pages I always start where I finished up but then I feel really lonely back there by myself so I skip forward to the last page of the thread and then I get confused about what is being talked about so then I go back again and I feel like my head is spinning. So anyway I just wanted some contact before I go back to catch up. BTW I'm sure you've already spoken about it- but Linette's new avatar made me LOL as soon as I logged on. Also I just wanted to say a HUGE Thank you to all of you who put a lot of effort into keeping us all up to date with everything. I love knowing that no matter how busy life gets,I won't miss out on anything to do with this case thanks to all of you. I feel guilty because I don't get a chance to contribute much but just wanted you all to know how much I enjoy reading posts and occasionally replying.

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I'm there as well Timmy. I was offline for a day and had 30 pages and a new thread to contend with. I (happily) spent a couple of days catching up when I could.
I'm currently trying to write a poem/ode to the bloggers, just to thank them for keeping everything shipshape and up to date, plus brightening my reads with their irreverent humour <3


This is MOO.

DunnoZo said:

Thursday night during school. IMO it would be odd for them to be having a "party" and I would agree more likely for teenagers to be near Creekside park & Rees Way, but unlikely there would be many walking near #35 & 29 Raft. Gr. Rd. where Mr. Truter supposedly lives. At night, this area would be pretty desolate. I also recall thinking it was mild that night, just before the cool evenings, and their windows would've still been open, in MOO. I'm not saying I believe that Allison left her house again that night, just looking at all possibilities.

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DUNNOZO Your post is crucial in determining the the conditions for high frequency sound (i.e. female scream) to travel that night. You say mild night, no wind etc?

Fuskier said:

Good pic FERRIS. It shows that the Truter house is closer to NBC's house. The proximity was shown on RUMOURSQUASHER's map posted about p.31.
Brief Consult with Acoustic Engineer:
As a high frequency, high decibel scream i.e. a woman's scream, is not directional at night out in the open in a semi-rural area. The sound (scream) would travel globally and dissipate with distance. Sound drops off with distance (e.g. 6DB per doubling of distance). If it was a still night i.e. no wind, with little background noise, then the sound will travel further. However, in a dense treed area, the higher frequency sound waves i.e. a woman's scream would dissipate more quickly. High frequency sound waves hit the leaves of the trees and break up. As sound travels globally, then one would not be able to tell the direction it came, from unless they were in close proximity. In the Baden-Clay case, the people who live closest in proximity to the high frequency sound (scream) would hear it through their windows. The further away you live, the lower and more distant the sound would be, etc.
Hypothetically, this means that the sound (female screams heard) were in close proximity to the Truter house. This indicates that the screams emanated in close proximity to that area. [I have not talked about low frequency sound i.e. a man's scream/voice because we are only concerned about the female scream]. My opinion, not fact.

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Thank you Fuskier for asking the acoustic engineer about this. It makes sense. The western side of RG road reminds me of parts of Samford Valley due to it's large open blocks of land and I believe sound would carry there. MOO

linette said:

Which makes me wonder, WHO would put up that much money to help him? Your average Joe wouldn't get that sort of help. I'm thinking, keeping in mind the dodgy dealings of the past, maybe he does have something on someone... someone who also stands to lose alot if it comes out. {This could be the reason this person is putting up the money for him} I think this is going to be far more than just a murder case in the end.

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:goodpost:

Absolutely the way I'm thinking also, spot on.

Opinionsgalore said:

I'm there as well Timmy. I was offline for a day and had 30 pages and a new thread to contend with. I (happily) spent a couple of days catching up when I could.
I'm currently trying to write a poem/ode to the bloggers, just to thank them for keeping everything shipshape and up to date, plus brightening my reads with their irreverent humour <3


This is MOO.

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That makes me feel better-knowing I'm not the only one. I've never been on a forum before so always feel like I'm unsure of forum 'etiquette' .Lovely gesture - the poem. One thing that I have got better at since the start is getting at least some housework done while 'sleuthing'. Now as soon as I hear a car pull up in the driveway I slam the iPad shut and run for the nearest appliance eg. Iron and make it look like I've been there the whole time, just so I don't get the usual 'roll of eyes' from family members!

Fuskier said:

DUNNOZO Your post is crucial in determining the the conditions for high frequency sound (i.e. female scream) to travel that night. You say mild night, no wind etc?

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I just remember thinking my windows were open when I heard the media report. Can't recall what the weather was like, sorry

Timmy said:

Hi everyone. I'm not long home from work and am trying desperately to catch up with pages of posts but am finding it difficult. I have been viewing since Thread 1 and in the early days I found it much easier to read every single post. For some reason I now find it really hard to catch up. When I have lots of pages I always start where I finished up but then I feel really lonely back there by myself so I skip forward to the last page of the thread and then I get confused about what is being talked about so then I go back again and I feel like my head is spinning. So anyway I just wanted some contact before I go back to catch up. BTW I'm sure you've already spoken about it- but Linette's new avatar made me LOL as soon as I logged on. Also I just wanted to say a HUGE Thank you to all of you who put a lot of effort into keeping us all up to date with everything. I love knowing that no matter how busy life gets,I won't miss out on anything to do with this case thanks to all of you. I feel guilty because I don't get a chance to contribute much but just wanted you all to know how much I enjoy reading posts and occasionally replying.

Click to expand...

Don't feel bad. There's times when I'm still reading 10 pages behind, and I'll suddenly decide to comment on something and then realise the topic has changed four times since then.
... and glad you like my Avatar... just thought I'd mention it's Jeffrey Dean Morgan... seems to be some confusion. haha

Bobbie Elliott said:

Can anyone hazard a guess as to how much it is costing to defend this case? I know its a bit like asking "how long is a piece of string?"

If the BCs have access to such funds, and they seriously cared about Allison, why didn't they use their $$$ to post a reward for Allison's murderer?

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I think they are eyeing Allison's insurance money. It takes a special kind of person to believe (now) that GBC may be innocent of the crime, or that the Crown have not got sufficient evidence to prove his guilt. For some funny reason, these lawyers, it seems, are expecting to win the case and grab a big piece. May be up to $300K or so each?

The last question is really good. It is more than strange that nobody of the BC clan actually raised that issue.

I am truely baffled about the whole defence situation and how it is going to be bank-rolled. I cannot for the life of my come up with a scenario where a family member/s have access to the sort of fund a heavy-duty trial like this will run to in costs. Surely if a law firm is going to do a pro-bono case, they would have to justify to someone within the system, why they are doing a pro-bono case. (i.e. that they are absolutely and without a doubt convinced of his innocence). GBC, I would assume, would have access to support through legal-aid but he's bringing in big guns??? At some stage last week there was talk of having legal triplets represent him, but that no longer seems to be the case .... does that say that the budget for defence does have a bottom line. It was interesting that one of the legal-triplets is associated with the Griffith University "Justice Project" (Nyst). From what I've read about that, the project is about clearing the names of the wrongfully incarcerated .... "Hurricane Carter" being probably their biggest name in incarcerations that went wrong. I was fortunate in being able to attend an address that "Hurricane" gave in Brisbane circa 2004. His address was so incredibly inspiring which is why he alligned himself to the Griffith Uni Justice Project. Again, why would Nyst be so convinced of GBC's innocence to attach his interest to this case. Does it beg a question?

If, alternatively the money is coming from some group such as the Baptist Church I would be jumping up and down in protest if I were to be a contributor to the Church. Surely the Church, or any other authority, who has in its possession funds from people with good intentions have to be accountable for how they distribute their funds.

grannie said:

I think they are eyeing Allison's insurance money. It takes a special kind of person to believe (now) that GBC may be innocent of the crime, or that the Crown have not got sufficient evidence to prove his guilt. For some funny reason, these lawyers, it seems, are expecting to win the case and grab a big piece. May be up to $300K or so each?

The last question is really good. It is more than strange that nobody of the BC clan actually raised that issue.

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So when GBC is found guilty of murder, will the insurance money go to their daughters? I know he won't get a cent, but will they still get it?

CouchCop said:

I am truely baffled about the whole defence situation and how it is going to be bank-rolled. I cannot for the life of my come up with a scenario where a family member/s have access to the sort of fund a heavy-duty trial like this will run to in costs. Surely if a law firm is going to do a pro-bono case, they would have to justify to someone within the system, why they are doing a pro-bono case. (i.e. that they are absolutely and without a doubt convinced of his innocence). GBC, I would assume, would have access to support through legal-aid but he's bringing in big guns??? At some stage last week there was talk of having legal triplets represent him, but that no longer seems to be the case .... does that say that the budget for defence does have a bottom line. It was interesting that one of the legal-triplets is associated with the Griffith University "Justice Project" (Nyst). From what I've read about that, the project is about clearing the names of the wrongfully incarcerated .... "Hurricane Carter" being probably their biggest name in incarcerations that went wrong. I was fortunate in being able to attend an address that "Hurricane" gave in Brisbane circa 2004. His address was so incredibly inspiring which is why he alligned himself to the Griffith Uni Justice Project. Again, why would Nyst be so convinced of GBC's innocence to attach his interest to this case. Does it beg a question?

If, alternatively the money is coming from some group such as the Baptist Church I would be jumping up and down in protest if I were to be a contributor to the Church. Surely the Church, or any other authority, who has in its possession funds from people with good intentions have to be accountable for how they distribute their funds.

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Wouldn't the police also be curious as to where the money is coming from, considering his financial woes? If by chance there is something dodgy going on with the money-giver, they'd be looking into that too?

Hi I have only posted twice as a Brookfield local with my daughter Valkarian but I have lurked affectionately and with interest since the first thread. I was disappointed when my daughter posted that she had left more flowers on Allison's fence and she was criticized as harassing Allison's daughters. If you saw the sign on the fence on the left of the flowers saying "we will miss you Allison, your parents and daughters are in our thoughts" just after Allison was found - this was Valkarian. It was prominent in the CM photos. I think Allison's daughters would have been touched to see the many expressions of shared community grief and if you knew my daughter she could never harass anyone, she is a much better person than most - kind caring and very funny. We both went to the cricket match at Brookfield showgrounds and spent up big for Allison.

Anyhoo I am responding to a call for assistance from Curiosasacat and have been doing some sleuthing for the ABC websleuths community, I can confirm that on a very dark and rainy night you can see a car at the top of the driveway of Allison's house from the road even when the lights of the car are off so this may help us to evaluate the rumour that locals driving past the house at 11.00pm on the night that Allison was murdered saw a car with all four doors open. Had to test this rumor when my husband was at work as OH is QPS and he would not approve.

Just 2 days before GBC was arrested I saw him at the local shops as I was waiting for someone and had to stand there as he slowly walked past and looked at me with that sullen, angry and defensive expression. He was in the Prado with the Settled number plates and the damage on the front passenger side. Creepy.

I love following this largely warm and caring community and look forward to your company and investigative talents every day.