Amanda Knox tried for the murder of Meredith Kercher in Italy *NEW TRIAL*#9
- Thread starter Harmony 2
- Start date
- Status
Myvice
Well-Known Member
- Joined
- Feb 21, 2013
- Messages
- 1,482
- Reaction score
- 2,891
Otto: I'm addressing you specifically because I think I remember you saying you lived in Italy for a time.
Is it common that rooms have locks that have to be locked with a key?
I guess I'm wondering why Guede would have been aware that he needed the keys to the bedroom to lock it yet walked out and left the front door open.
I guess I would also wonder why he would choose their house knowing that they were just getting by and didn't have high dollar items laying around. How would he know Merideth hadn't paid the rent and had cash?
It just seems that there are too many things that he was aware of that he shouldn't have known. Like that Merideth would be alone. JMO
Is it common that rooms have locks that have to be locked with a key?
I guess I'm wondering why Guede would have been aware that he needed the keys to the bedroom to lock it yet walked out and left the front door open.
I guess I would also wonder why he would choose their house knowing that they were just getting by and didn't have high dollar items laying around. How would he know Merideth hadn't paid the rent and had cash?
It just seems that there are too many things that he was aware of that he shouldn't have known. Like that Merideth would be alone. JMO
So the room being "in chaos" was just Filomena being Filomena. Okie.
I think broken glass covering the whole floor contributed to the impression of chaos the most.
Other thing that Filomena found disturbing for some reason was that the computer she left in the case on the floor was covered with glass.
Can you tell just by looking at the photos which things are disturbed by the stagers/burglar and which are not?
Chris_Halkides
Member
- Joined
- Sep 1, 2011
- Messages
- 608
- Reaction score
- 12
SMK,
On the previous thread you wrote, "If this is so blatant and obvious as all say, why wasn't this argued before the Italian Supreme Court (I assume it was ) and the case thrown out for compromised evidence? This is what I keep wondering. (as per International and Italian forensic standards)." I have given my thoughts on this elsewhere, but here is a briefer response: We know that key items were not taken into evidence in a promt manner and that the bra clasp was not in the same place as when it was first photographed. The Court of Supreme Cassation has chosen to deny that the crime scene was disturbed, or at least that is how I read it. I am flummoxed by their response. However, it is in keeping with everything that they have said about DNA evidence, most of which is wrong.
On the previous thread you wrote, "If this is so blatant and obvious as all say, why wasn't this argued before the Italian Supreme Court (I assume it was ) and the case thrown out for compromised evidence? This is what I keep wondering. (as per International and Italian forensic standards)." I have given my thoughts on this elsewhere, but here is a briefer response: We know that key items were not taken into evidence in a promt manner and that the bra clasp was not in the same place as when it was first photographed. The Court of Supreme Cassation has chosen to deny that the crime scene was disturbed, or at least that is how I read it. I am flummoxed by their response. However, it is in keeping with everything that they have said about DNA evidence, most of which is wrong.
Amber29
Well-Known Member
- Joined
- Apr 9, 2013
- Messages
- 1,358
- Reaction score
- 357
A breeze shutting the door or not does not change the fact that RS claims the door was wide open when he arrived that morning.
Thank you for this response. It is perplexing indeed that they would have such an attitude.
Yes, to tell you the truth, I was so excited to see (by the title) that Crini had chosen a detail that had bothered me as the crux of his focus, I more or less skimmed the post. I took it on faith that Crini himself had focused on this as the poster declared he did :blushing: ( I am assuming he did in his closing; pity I cannot read Italian or Google translations of Italian)
In these I would not notice anything but the window - (in the pic I can see it's open but not broken) -
and "the drawers that were NOT opened" and thus were noted as suspicious by the Postal Police do not even appear to be there.
I guess it's mainly the window here .
(***I suppose this gave rise to the window as "entrance point for the lone wolf; sans staging " concept. )
Attachments
TorisMom003
New Member
- Joined
- Nov 3, 2009
- Messages
- 4,386
- Reaction score
- 7
On the last thread there was talk about how the bra clasp could have been contaminated. One only needs to watch the video of the investigators "finding" the bra clasp again to understand how. The investigators had to look for the bra clasp since it was not where they last saw it. It had been pushed under a pile of clothes and other things. When the bra clasp was found it was handled in a way that anything on the investigators hands and fingers would naturally be found on the bra clasp. One investigator even touched the metal hook itself with a dirty gloved finger. IF RS's DNA had been found on the material itself instead of just the metal hook then one can claim that contamination is unlikely, however that is not the case. Because of the handling of the bra clasp it is evidence that should be tossed out, IMO.
Now if we look at some of the evidence of RG then we have evidence where no contamination could be possible. RG left his own handprint in Meredith's blood on the pillow. There is 0% chance of this being from contamination. There is also 0% chance of contamination when RG's DNA was found on and in Meredith since she was removed on the day that she was found and sent for an autopsy. The purse is a little more tricky, however since it was Meredith's blood mixed with RG's DNA and RG had no reason for his DNA to be on Meredith's purse at all, then one can conclude that this is also not from contamination. To find RG's DNA, footprints, handprints, etc in the cottage is not something that one would expect to find since he had not been known to have previously been in the cottage before.
MOO
Now if we look at some of the evidence of RG then we have evidence where no contamination could be possible. RG left his own handprint in Meredith's blood on the pillow. There is 0% chance of this being from contamination. There is also 0% chance of contamination when RG's DNA was found on and in Meredith since she was removed on the day that she was found and sent for an autopsy. The purse is a little more tricky, however since it was Meredith's blood mixed with RG's DNA and RG had no reason for his DNA to be on Meredith's purse at all, then one can conclude that this is also not from contamination. To find RG's DNA, footprints, handprints, etc in the cottage is not something that one would expect to find since he had not been known to have previously been in the cottage before.
MOO
Amber29
Well-Known Member
- Joined
- Apr 9, 2013
- Messages
- 1,358
- Reaction score
- 357
It is in RSs prison diary. (See my post above)
Do you claim it's fake or that he didn't say it or there's an excuse why he said it?
I've never been able to figure out if Filomina's bedroom door was open or closed when Sollecito arrived. According to him, it was open. According to some of Knox's statements, the door was closed.
What has always interested me is that Knox knew that Meredith's door was locked during her first visit to the cottage that morning. I have to agree that if Knox checked one bedroom in search of a possible burglary, presumably an innocent person that was concerned about a burglary would check all the rooms. She did check the large bathroom even though she had no reason to go there.
I suppose that, like the ever changing alibis on the night of the murder, the explanation of activities on the morning of November 2 is also a moving target. She showered and she didn't, Filomina's bedroom door was open and it wasn't, she checked Meredith's door and not Filomina's door, she was panicked because Meredith's door was locked and she wasn't, she wasn't concerned about the crime scene so she went for lunch, she was concerned about the crime scene so she phoned her mom 2.5 hours later even though nothing had changed.
I don't think that we can rely on statements made by Knox, so we have to rely on both independent statements, and on logical reasoning, for information. Sollecito stated that Filomina's bedroom door was open when he arrived. If that is true, then Knox had to have seen the broken window and ransacked bedroom, so she should have contacted Filomina or police. She would have walked past Filomina's bedroom door at least four times. Would she have checked only her bedroom and Meredith's bedroom door?
I have no idea if it's accurate.
It's not in Crini's argument for some reason. I don't remember seeing it mentioned by previous prosecutors or by Massei.
Basically, it's not what the prosecution claims, just like the hickey red herring. Correct?
Thank you for this post, the logical reasoning,I've never been able to figure out if Filomina's bedroom door was open or closed when Sollecito arrived. According to him, it was open. According to some of Knox's statements, the door was closed.
What has always interested me is that Knox knew that Meredith's door was locked during her first visit to the cottage that morning. I have to agree that if Knox checked one bedroom in search of a possible burglary, presumably an innocent person that was concerned about a burglary would check all the rooms. She did check the large bathroom even though she had no reason to go there.
I suppose that, like the ever changing alibis on the night of the murder, the explanation of activities on the morning of November 2 is also a moving target. She showered and she didn't, Filomina's bedroom door was open and it wasn't, she checked Meredith's door and not Filomina's door, she was panicked because Meredith's door was locked and she wasn't, she wasn't concerned about the crime scene so she went for lunch, she was concerned about the crime scene so she phoned her mom 2.5 hours later even though nothing had changed.
I don't think that we can rely on statements made by Knox, so we have to rely on both independent statements, and on logical reasoning, for information. Sollecito stated that Filomina's bedroom door was open when he arrived. If that is true, then Knox had to have seen the broken window and ransacked bedroom, so she should have contacted Filomina or police. She would have walked past Filomina's bedroom door at least four times. Would she have checked only her bedroom and Meredith's bedroom door?
and this graphic (which illustrates that a check of the other bedrooms would be what one would expect ).
(btw, did these doors lock with keys as Meredith's did?).
I had assumed that just this type of reasoning and inference was the crux of Crini's focus.
Thanks once more.
Amber29
Well-Known Member
- Joined
- Apr 9, 2013
- Messages
- 1,358
- Reaction score
- 357
RSs whole diary entry in interesting, there's this tidbit as well.
"Meanwhile I was loitering around the house and I advised Amanda to call her friends Filomena, Laura and Meredith. And therefore, after having done so, she told me that Laura was in Viterbo, that Filomena was with her boyfriend and that she would have arrived later and, lastly, that Meredith did not answer. We look around [facciamo un giro] the house and Amanda is terrified and jumps on me because she tells me that the faeces were no longer in the toilet since presumably before, when she was taking a shower, she had seen that there were faeces in the bathroom and nobody had flushed the toilet. I have a look and leaning over I see the reflection of the water and, not seeing any faeces, I believe what Amanda had told [diceva] me."
http://themurderofmeredithkercher.com/Raffaele_Sollecito's_Prison_Diary_(Translated)
Considering all these phone calls were made already at his house. Seems RS has the whole timeline of the morning and how things went down confused.
Is Amanda or Raffaele telling the truth of how things went that morning?
"Meanwhile I was loitering around the house and I advised Amanda to call her friends Filomena, Laura and Meredith. And therefore, after having done so, she told me that Laura was in Viterbo, that Filomena was with her boyfriend and that she would have arrived later and, lastly, that Meredith did not answer. We look around [facciamo un giro] the house and Amanda is terrified and jumps on me because she tells me that the faeces were no longer in the toilet since presumably before, when she was taking a shower, she had seen that there were faeces in the bathroom and nobody had flushed the toilet. I have a look and leaning over I see the reflection of the water and, not seeing any faeces, I believe what Amanda had told [diceva] me."
http://themurderofmeredithkercher.com/Raffaele_Sollecito's_Prison_Diary_(Translated)
Considering all these phone calls were made already at his house. Seems RS has the whole timeline of the morning and how things went down confused.
Is Amanda or Raffaele telling the truth of how things went that morning?
- Status