General Discussion #4

strach304 said:

What blood? On the tarp? They already know it was Lisa's. There was a hit in the laundry room from a cadaver dog as well. The problem with what they have in the way of blood as in any case where the victim and suspect live together is that it has to be a large enough amount for experts to swear under oathe that the victim couldn't possibly live after such an extensive blood loss. I have to assume that LE doesn't have that. Under reasonable doubt the defense can say there are many ways to account for her blood on that tarp such as a cut finger and they went camping together, etc. No way to date that blood either. My guess is that there are no forensics in the house or vehicle that can prove she was murdered there. Without a body at this point they can't even prove she's dead. If they had forensics in the house that could prove death then they would have a chance of getting a conviction without the body at least.

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I know it was "said by a source" that the blood on the tarp matched Lisa's DNA.

I actually meant "whatever" it was that the dog hit on. LE never specified the nature of the specimen found in the house. I assumed blood.

Regardless of what it is, I still want to hear the results.

I see what you're saying about lab results BytheBay but even with an arrest LE won't publish that info. A cadaver dog picks up a death scent so lets say he indicated a cloth, some sort of material. It wouldn't have to have blood but that scent. Then there's dna testing to see if it's Lisa's. Then there's the possibility of the dog just hitting on the floor where she may have been placed uncovered. How do they prove it? It's not an exact science anyway and with only the dogs no way they can get a conviction. I just hope they come up with something else and soon.

Originally Posted by SeriouslySearching
I think it is odd that Don Z would prefer to go to a junk site like that instead of here where people are truly interested in the case. I find that in itself very strange.

Lisa Too said:

That is very strange, agreed, SS. Unless he is there hoping that someone will reveal something that would lead to a break in the case. The only other possible explanation is that he doesn't know this site exists, which I doubt.

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In actuality, neither Don Z. nor the rest of Lisa's family (or those of us who run Lisa's website) knew of this Forum, until the first few week's of August.
It has taken us some time to also obtain passwords, screen names etc in order to respond to your many insights and questions.

Forgive us for responding to the Voy.com folks, first...but they were the only online Forum named off in the Sun-Times Group article, back in July.
That was what introduced us to the world of cyber-discussion (beyond our own family website)..so we have been steadily trying to visit everyone and address all the discussions which concern our Lisa Michelle.

I will re-post here, something I pointed out on the Bravenet News-Discussions Forum, concerning the relationship between Lisa's (family) website...and all of these discussion forums. And why Don Z. and I are now trying to focus/visit each one:

"Lisa's website (FindLisaStebic.com) was created to serve as a "Main Hub" by which information, support and coordination could take place in hopes of finding her/what happened to her.
Support (graphic, media, planning/organization) for those who wish to organize benefits which add to the Lisa Stebic and Childrens Fund...is yet another function.

Most of those who know, love, worked with, lived near Lisa have been working SO very hard to channel their frustration by staging benefits (car washes, pancake preakfasts, garage sales, hair cut-a-thons, raffles, etc) because they know that adding to the Reward Fund is the best way to entice someone to come forward to solve this terrible mystery.

Now, there was a point made about LE being the main & best recipient of solid leads or tips.
This, ultimately, would be the preferable way of furthering the investigation (tip-wise).
But, for one reason or another, there are many individuals who do NOT feel comfortable getting directly in touch with LE....and this, unfortunately, is a truism which spans across the board in legal/criminal settings.
Luckily, anonymous Tip Hotline's and the internet (like these forums or direct e-mails accounts) has opened up several important, for some - more palatable - ways of "floating" salient clues in a crime.
This is why Lisa's family and those who support them are trying to pay more attention, these days, to what is going on within them.
Some would argue that we only have a "Missing Persons" case, here, with Lisa.
But the PPD has been plain in saying - confirming - that they believe Lisa is "missing" not of her own, free choice or will.
This points to criminal activity...which in turns begs the need of someone stepping up and giving information/evidence as to bring an answer to: Where is Lisa Stebic !?!?!
Even the much-anticipated report from the Crime Lab (processing current evidence) can't answer that most important question.

So, once again, the focus must remain on the building up of the Reward Fund, the independent searches, the spreading of the word to places OUTSIDE the Plainfield, IL area...and other possibilities which may lead us to Lisa.

So, please, go ahead..and indulge in as much informed discourse as you wish concerning the case.
Argue the points, follow the Timeline, root out the facts...and keep the need to find Lisa, alive.
Don Z. and I will do everything we can to keep you up with the currently-known facts of the case and try to correct erroneous assumptions being posted.

You just will need to know that both of us have very wry senses of humor...for we have agreed that in order to "keep our heads on straight" through all of this is to choose the grins versus the tears.

Lisa is just this same kind of personality..and it is our way of keeping her alive and with us - in all that we do! "
Email: findlisastebic@gmail.com

Wonder the reporter is up to these days??? Whose pool is she hanging out at?

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SeriouslySearching said:

She is probably hanging out with some Senator or Congressman this week. Next week, maybe it will be with a new employer...perhaps the National Enquirer?! LOL

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As stated on the Lisa's (family) website (www.FindLisaStebic.com) ...you have no idea how much Amy Jacobson wanted to get to the bottom of what happened to Lisa, on behalf of Lisa's 2 children & family...and how she has helped to spread the word to hundreds of thousands of people of Lisa's disappearance!
She treated Lisa's sisters with exceptional sensitivity, caring and concern - much like the handling of cut-glass figurines. Yet, she was able to extract the most in-depth of interviews with those who love Lisa most.

Amy Jacobson is an excellent investigative journalist and does NOT deserve your derision or cutting remarks.

Someday, the "Truth will Out"...and you will see that you were shortsighted & too quick to upbraid her for her devotion to solving a terrible mystery, the mystery of what happened to Lisa!

AZ, courttv.com also have a forum on their message board set up for Lisa. That site gets a lot of traffic. The moderator for that one is Coldwater and she has temporarily put it on hold till some news breaks. If you e-mail her and tell her who you are and want to post there I think she would re-open it. I know there are people from the area that have posted on that board.

AZ News Watcher said:

As stated on the Lisa's (family) website (www.FindLisaStebic.com) ...you have no idea how much Amy Jacobson wanted to get to the bottom of what happened to Lisa, on behalf of Lisa's 2 children & family...and how she has helped to spread the word to hundreds of thousands of people of Lisa's disappearance!
She treated Lisa's sisters with exceptional sensitivity, caring and concern - much like the handling of cut-glass figurines. Yet, she was able to extract the most in-depth of interviews with those who love Lisa most.

Amy Jacobson is an excellent investigative journalist and does NOT deserve your derision or cutting remarks.

Someday, the "Truth will Out"...and you will see that you were shortsighted & too quick to upbraid her for her devotion to solving a terrible mystery, the mystery of what happened to Lisa!

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Sorry, but excellent investigative journalists do NOT take their children to a suspect's home, take their clothes off to don a bikini, and jump in the suspect's pool in order to "extract" in-depth interviews. Obviously, her employers felt the same way or she would not have been fired for it. This not only shows "nearsightedness" on her part, it shows a complete disregard for what most consider professionalism and journalistic integrity. If I choose to make light of the fact she was so blatently irresponsible, I feel it is better than the things I could be saying about her.

Where ARE these wonderful interviews you have mentioned? I would like to know how she went about obtaining them and am quite interested in reading or seeing them. I have not seen any real in-depth reporting in this case unless you count the reporter who went to interview the police officer who caught Craig and his father poaching...which was impressive work, IMO.

However, I am glad you and Don Z have found our site. I feel we ask a lot of questions and bring up valid points for this investigation. We all feel Lisa's disappearance is a tragic circumstance and we would love to see her home with her children. It has been frustrating watching this case from the outside and feeling that LE is up against a mountain in solving it. I have faith that something will eventually happen whether it is through a Grand Jury or some other break in the case. At least, for Lisa, her children, and her family...I pray the answers will come.

Most of us have a sense of humor and fully understand how important it is to "lighten" the heart in dire situations. I think it is quite healthy actually and my family is much the same way.

Welcome to Websleuths! We are very opinionated, passionate, and caring individuals who have one thing in common...we are sick and tired of all the missing children/adults in our country and would love to find ways to prevent this from happening over and over again. If it is trying to enact new laws, start more programs for awareness, or whatever it takes...we want this to stop! We also want to bring home the missing. We honestly do care.

AZ NEWS WATCHER,
If what you know would blow people away, does that mean that there's enough information to make an arrest or possibly enough to name a person of interest?

philamena said:

AZ NEWS WATCHER,
If what you know would blow people away, does that mean that there's enough information to make an arrest or possibly enough to name a person of interest?

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No, no arrests, yet...unfortunately, CBS2 took out a main player to possibly solving this terrible, heartbreaking mystery..before she could get the job done.

All due to professional jealousy on the part of her competitor.

So here we sit, waiting for lab results...and listening to the high-pitch whining of "high-minded" people who obviously have never needed to get their hands dirty...or to dive into very muddy water to save a drowning person.

And, btw, Craig Stebic WAS named a "Person of Interest"...a day after CBS2 aired their first edited piece on Amy, 5 full days after the now-infamous "through the back-window of the neighbors house using an "extender" shots" were taken.

The timing of the PPD's announcement was a complete coincidence.

philamena said:

AZ NEWS WATCHER,
If what you know would blow people away, does that mean that there's enough information to make an arrest or possibly enough to name a person of interest?

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BTW, Philamena...here is the most in-depth article, to date, covering the timeline and developments in the case, up to July 12th, 2007...if you wish to be clear on the facts of the Lisa's disappearance. It was written the day that Lisa's husband - Craig - was named a "Person of Interest":

http://cbs2chicago.com/local/local_story_193135404.html

CBS) PLAINFIELD, Ill. In the days after his wife was reported missing, Craig Stebic spoke to a reporter in tears, clutching a crumpled tissue and saying his wife Lisa would never voluntarily leave their two children.

More than two months after an emotional Craig Stebic told reporters about the last time he saw his wife, Plainfield police (on Thursday, July 12, 2007) announced he's become a prime focus of their investigation.

"Plainfield police have narrowed the focus of their investigation into the disappearance of Lisa Stebic and now consider Craig Stebic a person of interest," Plainfield Police Chief Donald Bennett said. But Bennett said the announcement does not really change anything as far as the police investigation goes.

"Right now, we feel we've narrowed it in, and where we need to go is to focus currently our investigation on Mr. Stebic," Bennett said.

Plainfield police say they were led to that conclusion following numerous interviews and countless hours of investigation.

Police had previously been reluctant to name Craig Stebic as the subject of their investigation.

They said Thursday he was the last person who saw Lisa Stebic on the evening of April 30. They also said they believe Lisa Stebic was the victim of foul play.

I don't wish to argue with anyone about Amy or how I feel about the subject. AZ~ I wish you the best in finding Lisa.

I DO stand corrected on one point. Craig is NOT nor has ever been considered a suspect in this case. He was not considered a POI by LE until after Amy's "story" broke. (LE doesn't use that particular terminology "suspect" much anymore until an arrest is made.)

well talk about 800+ pounds of gorillla....this is the stress that eats at our cores. We all want this case resolved and yes along the way there will be....hiccups....it is not just Lisa Michelle, but all the things that happen when living thru this life event. Emotions are off the scale and life is surreal. Some of us have lived it some of us have lived thru the investigations and the frustration. As a retired leo from a metro area, I hold a piece of each family memeber whose search I could not resolve, in retirement I do not/WILL not give up.....I know the stress,respect it and just want to give HOPE and Strength to those out there looking....I know this for a fact you must never, never lose hope.....so to you Seriously Searching and you AZ news watcher..the search is never easy,the paths differ....know always that people are out here helping, looking in ways that can only bring comfort to you.....wishing you peace
Blessings

Nice post, Ocean!

Susan

AZ NewsWatcher,

I think you'll find this site refreshing as it seems to me all those here are truly interested and concerned. I don't know if you noticed this on the home page, but here's a link:

http://www.websleuths.com/forums/showthread.php?t=30199

that might help you and the family to keep the story in the forefront of the news, and keep the search alive. We empathize with you and the entire family, and our prayers are with you all.

Forgive us for responding to the Voy.com folks, first...but they were the only online Forum named off in the Sun-Times Group article, back in July.
That was what introduced us to the world of cyber-discussion (beyond our own family website)..so we have been steadily trying to visit everyone and address all the discussions which concern our Lisa Michelle.

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Welcome to WS AZ newswatcher. It's unfortunate Voy was the first site you which introduced you to the world of cyber-discussion. There was so much nonsense going on there, it was difficult to sift through for any worthwhile discussion regarding Lisa. I'm sure you'll find WS has a great group of people and hopefully that crowd over on VOY doesn't leave a bad taste in your mouth.

Prayers for you, your family and finding Lisa.

I must say the people here on WS not only have walked in Lisa's families' shoes, but the majority here have caked on mud and muck from standing in the "trenches" of real life crimes. Some have mothers, fathers, children, sisters, brothers, and others missing, murdered, or worse. We aren't "armchair detectives" who somehow live in another reality. We are, for the most part, the survivors of violence and tragedy.

One of my best friends was one of those murdered women by her soon to be exhusband (in prison for life now). We had a bullet-ridden body to contend with knowing he was the one who pulled the trigger and his 6 children are still to this day trying to cope with it all. I was second on his "hit list". My children and I were taken by LE into hiding until he was caught. His violence affected so many people.

I don't know what we will tell his grandchildren someday. Or should I say...our grandchildren.

I don't feel I deserved to have been singled out by AZ in his/her comments and altho I chose not to respond to the majority of them...I want AZ to realize the comments were unwarranted. It would be wise to refrain from making such adverse blanket statements or talking down to us.

We are not like the people on Voy. We don't enjoy engaging in volitile exchanges and thank goodness...it isn't allowed here. So if AZ came here expecting a fight...he/she might be sorely disappointed.

AZ News Watcher said:

BTW, Philamena...here is the most in-depth article, to date, covering the timeline and developments in the case, up to July 12th, 2007...if you wish to be clear on the facts of the Lisa's disappearance. It was written the day that Lisa's husband - Craig - was named a "Person of Interest":

http://cbs2chicago.com/local/local_story_193135404.html

CBS) PLAINFIELD, Ill. In the days after his wife was reported missing, Craig Stebic spoke to a reporter in tears, clutching a crumpled tissue and saying his wife Lisa would never voluntarily leave their two children.

More than two months after an emotional Craig Stebic told reporters about the last time he saw his wife, Plainfield police (on Thursday, July 12, 2007) announced he's become a prime focus of their investigation.

"Plainfield police have narrowed the focus of their investigation into the disappearance of Lisa Stebic and now consider Craig Stebic a person of interest," Plainfield Police Chief Donald Bennett said. But Bennett said the announcement does not really change anything as far as the police investigation goes.

"Right now, we feel we've narrowed it in, and where we need to go is to focus currently our investigation on Mr. Stebic," Bennett said.

Plainfield police say they were led to that conclusion following numerous interviews and countless hours of investigation.

Police had previously been reluctant to name Craig Stebic as the subject of their investigation.

They said Thursday he was the last person who saw Lisa Stebic on the evening of April 30. They also said they believe Lisa Stebic was the victim of foul play.

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Thank you so much for posting the article!

Glad to see a little more dialog. Points made points taken by all....much pain, a lot of healing needed. A lot can get done working together. I noted that there are a few new fundraisers or keeping Lisa's face out there, events coming up in the next few weeks...see findlisastebic.com.

SeriouslySearching said:

I don't feel I deserved to have been singled out by AZ in his/her comments and altho I chose not to respond to the majority of them...I want AZ to realize the comments were unwarranted. It would be wise to refrain from making such adverse blanket statements or talking down to us.

We are not like the people on Voy. We don't enjoy engaging in volitile exchanges and thank goodness...it isn't allowed here. So if AZ came here expecting a fight...he/she might be sorely disappointed.

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SS, I wouldn't take it too personally. I have been dissed by both AZ and Don Z, but I don't think they mean to. Having been through what you've been through, I'm sure you can understand that they are responding from a very emotional state. Having been thrown into this world, I doubt they have had the time, or maybe even desire, to learn the art of disagreeing diplomatically. It's real easy at this stage to respond to one thing said and not to know the entire position of a poster.

I think Amy Jacobson was very trusted and respected by the family. I also believe that they felt she was getting close to something, whether she was or wasn't. But, she WAS getting C.S. to talk, even if it was only superficial at the time. Judgement on Amy's part, good or bad, and on CBS's part, may have hampered this investigation. I think it taught C.S. not to trust anyone. This is a touchy subject from every angle with strong opinions. But I think the family felt that she had the best shot to get information that the family so badly wants.

closeobserver said:

SS, I wouldn't take it too personally. I have been dissed by both AZ and Don Z, but I don't think they mean to. Having been through what you've been through, I'm sure you can understand that they are responding from a very emotional state. Having been thrown into this world, I doubt they have had the time, or maybe even desire, to learn the art of disagreeing diplomatically. It's real easy at this stage to respond to one thing said and not to know the entire position of a poster.

I think Amy Jacobson was very trusted and respected by the family. I also believe that they felt she was getting close to something, whether she was or wasn't. But, she WAS getting C.S. to talk, even if it was only superficial at the time. Judgement on Amy's part, good or bad, and on CBS's part, may have hampered this investigation. I think it taught C.S. not to trust anyone. This is a touchy subject from every angle with strong opinions. But I think the family felt that she had the best shot to get information that the family so badly wants.

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Sorry, AZ and Don. I'm not trying to speak for you. Just my feeling from all I have read. Even though I have been on the receiving side of some jabs, I respect you and feel for you. No hard feelings on my end. What I have learned over the years is that when sarcasm is used, even in the best intent, it is rarely interpreted correctly in these environments.

closeobserver said:

Sorry, AZ and Don. I'm not trying to speak for you. Just my feeling from all I have read. Even though I have been on the receiving side of some jabs, I respect you and feel for you. No hard feelings on my end. What I have learned over the years is that when sarcasm is used, even in the best intent, it is rarely interpreted correctly in these environments.

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No problem, "Close"...I appreciate your trying to interpret our communiques to those who are not currently standing nose-to-nose with this current investigation ( of our missing Lisa Michelle).
Your assessment of Amy's position was fairly accurate...and her trusted position with BOTH sides of the story.

What is not appreciated (and I will say this with the utmost control and diplomacy) is that any person who lives in a Glass House, shouldn't throw stones....especially towards those people are actually doing everything, sacrificing everything to get to the bottom of what happened to Lisa (and protect her children).

Unless you ("Seriously" and anyone else who read this) are standing in our shoes, and our shoes ALONE, in this case - they have no right to make catty, snide remarks...or actually rip into someone who was actually furthering this investigation, to end the agony & pain her children and family are currently feeling.

I, too, was touched by murder during my life (see Moxley/Skakel - Greenwich, CT)...but that does not mean that I know what it is to have my own mother (named Lisa Stebic) missing (probably murdered or, at least, as the PPD/FBI designate as a "Victim of Foul Play"). The same should go for ALL of you.

Whether you like it or not...you all are "Armchair Detectives" when it comes to this case. (Despite what you tell yourselves). Just as I would be if the situation was reversed.

My proximity to Lisa's case allows me to understand many of the more layered-details .... which, I would hazard, none of you have. (Just as I have none of the details of the cases which affected your own lives, respectively.)

If Don Z. or I see that you (or anyone else,here or on other websites other Forums) are putting forth an untruth, a piece of misinformation, an undeserved vitriolic layer and/or accusing innocent people in Lisa's case...you can be assured you will hear from us! This is due to the fact that it is our assigned duty to roam through these many Forums (which are following the Lisa Stebic case)...and keep track of what is being said, put forward the truth (as we know it to be, to this date) in order to protect her..her children, her family...and, yes, even Craig Stebic.