ATLANTIC CITY SK: possible link to LISK and GB4?

Interestingly, about the two main suspects in the AC murders. One, Terry Oleson, was arrested but never charged and eventually let go. He worked at the Golden Key as a handyman, had child *advertiser censored* on his computer, and fit the sketch of the suspect. For whatever reason, he was let go and never charged or heard from again. The second, the former pimp/drug dealer turned minister who was Kim's bf, was known to have a foot fetish. He was subsequently killed while in prison. What I find most interesting however, is that the woman who helped create the sketch, Denise Hill, me an unkown man (man in the sketch) who spoke about foot fetishes, that he had killed some women before. What happened is that after Oleson was arrested and being interrogated, Denise Hill told police she saw the man in the sketch on a street in AC. She recanted what she said about the suspect being Oleson, because she swears she saw the man on the street while Oleson was in custody. This man often called himself the "the riverman" and would travel to AC every few months, from Fla. The whole thing from the get go was odd. Not that police fouled anything up, but there were so many directions and turns being taken, it's hard to get a gauge on what is actually true. Some have speculated that this "riverman" was in fact HA, however I have my doubts.

There was another poi in AC. His name is Bill Schlue. Pamela Covelli told investigators she was with 3 of the four girls in a hotel with Bill Schlue. She said Schlue was making the girls get naked and giving them crack to smoke but no sex was involved. Pam Covelli then apparently got scared by Schlue's erratic behavior and left. Terry Oleson's lawyer also claims that Schlue called him to confess to the murder of the 4 girls.

Also, dont forget that Denise Hill's Riverman paid in crack and phone cards.

And for anyone who doesn't believe AC and LI are connected...just remember that the head of the investigation in AC said he has NO DOUBT they are the work of the same killer.

Do any of YOU have more info about this case than him? I think not, so I'm going to go with his opinion on this

NJGuy said:

Interestingly, about the two main suspects in the AC murders. One, Terry Oleson, was arrested but never charged and eventually let go. He worked at the Golden Key as a handyman, had child *advertiser censored* on his computer, and fit the sketch of the suspect. For whatever reason, he was let go and never charged or heard from again. The second, the former pimp/drug dealer turned minister who was Kim's bf, was known to have a foot fetish. He was subsequently killed while in prison. What I find most interesting however, is that the woman who helped create the sketch, Denise Hill, me an unkown man (man in the sketch) who spoke about foot fetishes, that he had killed some women before. What happened is that after Oleson was arrested and being interrogated, Denise Hill told police she saw the man in the sketch on a street in AC. This man often called himself the "the riverman" and would travel to AC every few months, from Fla. The whole thing from the get go was odd. Not that police fouled anything up, but there were so many directions and turns being taken, it's hard to get a gauge on what is actually true. Some have speculated that this "riverman" was in fact HA, however I have my doubts.

Click to expand...

~above respectfully BBM~

So is the second man that was killed in prison the chef that she became involved with in FL before moving to AC? If so, can you elaborate on the circumstances of his death?

That is very interesting about Denise Hill. do you have a link for this info? TIA I betcha that this is what Phelps and Kelly were referring to in the interview on TODAY when they said that they interviewed someone with info re the night before Kim disappeared.

"Riverman". That's an interesting pseudonym. Perhaps I was under the misguided assumption that this guy travels the east coast by land, such as a trucker or someone who's business requires travel. The first thing that comes to mind upon hearing the name "riverman' is a tug boat captain, or perhaps a certified boat captain who moves boats seasonally between FL and LI, but that is just moo.

I appreciate you sharing your knowledge of the AC cases with us.

wm

SherlockHomes said:

There was another poi in AC. His name is Bill Schlue. Pamela Covelli told investigators she was with 3 of the four girls in a hotel with Bill Schlue. She said Schlue was making the girls get naked and giving them crack to smoke but no sex was involved. Pam Covelli then apparently got scared by Schlue's erratic behavior and left. Terry Oleson's lawyer also claims that Schlue called him to confess to the murder of the 4 girls.

Also, dont forget that Denise Hill's Riverman paid in crack and phone cards.

And for anyone who doesn't believe AC and LI are connected...just remember that the head of the investigation in AC said he has NO DOUBT they are the work of the same killer.

Do any of YOU have more info about this case than him? I think not, so I'm going to go with his opinion on this

Click to expand...

Well stated SherlockHomes! Can you possibly get hold of a link to this info?

Phone cards eh? And crack? I agree with you that it is the same killer. MOO

wm

SherlockHomes said:

There was another poi in AC. His name is Bill Schlue. Pamela Covelli told investigators she was with 3 of the four girls in a hotel with Bill Schlue. She said Schlue was making the girls get naked and giving them crack to smoke but no sex was involved. Pam Covelli then apparently got scared by Schlue's erratic behavior and left. Terry Oleson's lawyer also claims that Schlue called him to confess to the murder of the 4 girls.

Also, dont forget that Denise Hill's Riverman paid in crack and phone cards.

And for anyone who doesn't believe AC and LI are connected...just remember that the head of the investigation in AC said he has NO DOUBT they are the work of the same killer.

Do any of YOU have more info about this case than him? I think not, so I'm going to go with his opinion on this

Click to expand...

What do we have on Bill Schlue? Anything? Real name or alias? :waitasec:

Interesting info on the Mindhunter site about William Shlue (or Schule):

Last week, a Press reporter received a letter from Schlue dated Sept. 16 that said, "If you want to know more about the killings in A.C., you should come and see me." But when a reporter met Schlue, 45, Tuesday, he said he had to postpone the interview "until at least Monday. There's stuff going on."


According to Leonard, Schlue described "visions he was having regarding murders of these women. He indicated in these visions he had choked these women to death. He mentioned he was under the influence of crack cocaine and alcohol and admitted that he possibly blacked out. He indicated that he had a burning feeling in his chest. He referred to my client as the Salem County guy and that he did not want to see an innocent man go to jail. He also indicated that he did not want to go to prison for life or go on death row."

That interview was not taped, Leonard said, but at least one subsequent telephone conversation was recorded and later handed over to the Prosecutor's Office.

NJGuy said:

Interestingly, about the two main suspects in the AC murders. One, Terry Oleson, was arrested but never charged and eventually let go. He worked at the Golden Key as a handyman, had child *advertiser censored* on his computer, and fit the sketch of the suspect. For whatever reason, he was let go and never charged or heard from again. The second, the former pimp/drug dealer turned minister who was Kim's bf, was known to have a foot fetish. He was subsequently killed while in prison. What I find most interesting however, is that the woman who helped create the sketch, Denise Hill, me an unkown man (man in the sketch) who spoke about foot fetishes, that he had killed some women before. What happened is that after Oleson was arrested and being interrogated, Denise Hill told police she saw the man in the sketch on a street in AC. She recanted what she said about the suspect being Oleson, because she swears she saw the man on the street while Oleson was in custody. This man often called himself the "the riverman" and would travel to AC every few months, from Fla. The whole thing from the get go was odd. Not that police fouled anything up, but there were so many directions and turns being taken, it's hard to get a gauge on what is actually true. Some have speculated that this "riverman" was in fact HA, however I have my doubts.

Click to expand...

Hi NJguy

In al respect, could you please post info / link that back up that the "pimp/drug dealer turned minister" / "known to have a foot fetish" guy was Kim Raffo's boyfriend?

I ask because I'm 99% sure that he was NOT Kim Raffo's boyfriend .

The only connection I know of, between this guy, whos name was Mark A. Hessee, and Kim Raffo is that Raffo, and another AC victim Barbara V. Breidor, at some point had rented a room at the hotel, Fox Manor Hotel, where this guy lived.

here is a link to the information:

http://www.nytimes.com/2006/12/23/nyregion/23slay.html?ref=nyregion&pagewanted=all

Many Leads, but No Arrests in Killings of Four Prostitutes By SERGE F. KOVALESKI
Published: December 23, 2006


And by the way Mark A. Hessee was NOT killed in prison, he died Dec 21, 2010 in West Haven, Conn., "with his daughters by his side".
Here is a link to that info:

http://juneauempire.com/stories/011211/obi_768875420.shtml

SherlockHomes said:

There was another poi in AC. His name is Bill Schlue. Pamela Covelli told investigators she was with 3 of the four girls in a hotel with Bill Schlue. She said Schlue was making the girls get naked and giving them crack to smoke but no sex was involved. Pam Covelli then apparently got scared by Schlue's erratic behavior and left. Terry Oleson's lawyer also claims that Schlue called him to confess to the murder of the 4 girls.

Also, dont forget that Denise Hill's Riverman paid in crack and phone cards.

And for anyone who doesn't believe AC and LI are connected...just remember that the head of the investigation in AC said he has NO DOUBT they are the work of the same killer.

Do any of YOU have more info about this case than him? I think not, so I'm going to go with his opinion on this

Click to expand...

WOW, Is Bill Schlue still around and mobile? What does LE say about Schlue? Just curious as he has bizarre ways about him that could be SK'
ish.

Aleph said:

That is the kind of thing I view as extremely significant.

Click to expand...

I can't decide, but it's an unusual nickname to call one's self.

There are interesting parallels between the LISK, the AC Killer (assuming the LISK and the AC Killer are not the same) and the Green River Killer. Most obvious would be their choice of victim (sex workers). Then there are the dumping areas by the side of the road, by train tracks or along the Green River. Also, there's evidence that the LISK knew and gained the trust of his victims. The Green River Killer would occasionally hire sex workers and not murder them, which gave them a false sense of security that he couldn't be the actually killer or else he'd have killed them.

And then there's the fact that Ridgeway did communicate with the police via a letter that was initially believed to be false. While the LISK and/or AC Killer haven't contacted LE (that we know about) the LISK did contact the family of one of his victims.

So in some significant ways they have a lot in common. So maybe you're right. Maybe it is significant.

Here's some notes that I jotted down while watching the show.

'13'

Says SK is a structured individual. The AC case is one of 13's favorite cases. He said strangling is up close and personal. Also, it is neater, with no blood in his car during transport. He wants to see his victims suffer. Says Sk has a foot fetish, he is smart,...doesn't leave clues......He hasn't stopped.....he is not in AC anymore. '13' believes that he is responsible for the GB4 and thinks he has a boat. Sk invites women out on his boat so no one can hear them scream. 13 thinks SK hit AC because of the democratic convention in AC bringing in working girls from out of town.
(Was there a Democratic conv. in AC in 2006? I haven't googled it)

'Tim Braun'

He caught Charles Cullen, a NJ SK. TB thinks SK revisits his 'work' and keeps the footwear to relive his crimes.

'Dr Ed Merski'

He says the shoes are sexually stimulating to SK. Says SK relives crimes by fantisizing with the shoes, touching them, smelling them...

'Hugh Auslander'

Ex hubby of Kim Raffo. He says he called her cell after he was told she was dead, IIRC by his brother. Somebody answered Kim's phone and hung up on him. The person never spoke but he heard backgroud noise/ busy noise. Says it seemed like they accidentally answered without thinking. He says the girls didn't like the 'pike' as it was out of their comfort zone and he thinks SK lured them with something for them to agree to go there with him. Encourages anyone with info to come forward.

'Anonymous Working Girl'

AWG was friends and worked with Kim Raffo. AWG and another escort were picked up by 2 black men in a van and taken to a party at a hotel. KR was there, as well as an unidentified white man. KR was in one bed, in the other bed were two women who didn't move at all the whole time. Then the party moved to a motel in the area where the bodies were found. The two women in bed were left behind. AWG says the white man left the new party place at some point. They were all doing crack. AWG got freaked out and left the 'party' before the others due to the guys behavior, calling names, being aggressive etc.. ONe of the guys tried to strangle her friend and she reported it to LE and encouraged AWG to do the same but she didn't due to fear.. The guys were arrested but released for lack of evidence. AWG feels the two women in the bed were Tracy and Barbara who were already dead. Says she asked Kim
"Who are they?" and kim answered, "IDK, they were not here before I left and returned." Kim was found dead approx a week later.

'My Observations on the show'

I thought the dramatizations were sensational for shock effect. Some scenes were disturbing, yet I guess truthful about the life of a working girl and the drug use that goes with the lifestyle. There were dramatizations of snorting coke, shooting herion, being choked with a ligature, and then the downright creepy shots of the supposed SK caressing and sniffing/smelling the shoes he kept. Not to mention the shots of the supposed dead women were all shown lying face up althought Phelps said they were found face down with heads turned to the east. (although one detective thinks their heads got turned that way due to the flow of the water in the ditch which apparently has a current.)
At one point Phelps states that the 3rd victim, Tracy Ann Roberts, was Asphixiated in Nov. 2005. I thought "WTH?!" (I majored in communications and broadcasting and am a stickler for getting the facts correct and was surprised by this mistake)

Overall, I liked the show and feel it certainly serves a purpose in bringing awareness to these cases. Phelps seems to operate on emotion due to his SIL's unsolved murder and his heart seems to be in the right place. Kelly seems to operate on logic and is no nonsense.

I think the show is scheduled to air again in the next night or two. Just google Discovery ID and you can find the show's schedule.

This is all paraphrased and MOO. HTH

wm

Found this March 8, 2012 newsreport concerning the weather on the days 3 of the AC victims disappeared.
Kind of an odd (still interesting though) newsreport to pop up now 5-6 years after those murders hmm...wonder what that is all about?

As far as I remember, it was storm at one of days one of the GB4 victims disappeared, I think it was Amber Costello.
I will check out the weather on the days all the GB4 disappeared, and post it here.

http://www.nbc40.net/news/21337/

METEOROLOGIST SAYS WEATHER COULD BE FACTOR IN 2006 MURDERS
Jessica Klein ( jklein@nbc40.net) - 3/8/12 05:46 pm

ATL. CO. -- A well-known meteorologist says weather could actually have something to do with the murders of four prostitutes in the West Atlantic City section of Egg Harbor Township back in 2006.

Jim Eberwine, a now retired meteorologist who used to work for the national weather service, appeared on the Hurley in the Afternoon show on WOND radio Thursday. He says weather elements are critical to criminal cases, and he believes it's no coincidence that there were coastal storms on three of the four days when the victims disappeared.

The bodies of Kim Raffo, Tracy Ann Roberts, Barbara Breidor and Molly Jean Dilts were found on November 20th 2006, behind a strip of motels along the Black Horse Pike.

"I think if you look at crimes that too place over the years, you'll find a relationship between these kinds of conditions and killing people and dumping their bodies in places where you wouldn't have to worry about evidence," said Eberwine.

Headded that when there is bad weather, most people tend to stay inside so there usually aren't any witnesses to these crimes. Atlantic County Prosecutors says the case remains open and active.



http://www.nbc40.net/news/21337/video

Video on the subject

If anyone already have weather info on the GB4 case please post it.

Here are the dates the GB4 disappeared:


Maureen Brainard-Barnes: July 9, 2007

Melissa Barthelemy: July 10, 2009.
(some reports say she disappeared July 12th)

Megan Waterman: June 6, 2010,

Amber Lynn Costello: September 2, 2010

Theforeigner said:

Found this March 8, 2012 newsreport concerning the weather on the days 3 of the AC victims disappeared.
Kind of an odd (still interesting though) newsreport to pop up now 5-6 years after those murders hmm...wonder what that is all about?

As far as I remember, it was storm at one of days one of the GB4 victims disappeared, I think it was Amber Costello.
I will check out the weather on the days all the GB4 disappeared, and post it here.

http://www.nbc40.net/news/21337/

METEOROLOGIST SAYS WEATHER COULD BE FACTOR IN 2006 MURDERS
Jessica Klein ( jklein@nbc40.net) - 3/8/12 05:46 pm

ATL. CO. -- A well-known meteorologist says weather could actually have something to do with the murders of four prostitutes in the West Atlantic City section of Egg Harbor Township back in 2006.

Jim Eberwine, a now retired meteorologist who used to work for the national weather service, appeared on the Hurley in the Afternoon show on WOND radio Thursday. He says weather elements are critical to criminal cases, and he believes it's no coincidence that there were coastal storms on three of the four days when the victims disappeared.

The bodies of Kim Raffo, Tracy Ann Roberts, Barbara Breidor and Molly Jean Dilts were found on November 20th 2006, behind a strip of motels along the Black Horse Pike.

"I think if you look at crimes that too place over the years, you'll find a relationship between these kinds of conditions and killing people and dumping their bodies in places where you wouldn't have to worry about evidence," said Eberwine.

Headded that when there is bad weather, most people tend to stay inside so there usually aren't any witnesses to these crimes. Atlantic County Prosecutors says the case remains open and active.



http://www.nbc40.net/news/21337/video

Video on the subject

Click to expand...

This would go along with some people's theory that he may have a job where he works outdoors. Perhaps he couldn't work due to weather conditions, which freed up his schedule for murder?

I will check out the weather on those days. Maybe it will jog my memory if there was a big storm or something approaching LI. Alot of times when we know of extreme weather approaching; LI goes into panic mode.

7/9/2007 - Severe T-Storms
7/10/2009-Sunny
7/12/2009-T Storms
6/6/2010-T Storms
9/2/2010-Rain

Very Weird. Construction jobs are often shutdown when it rains, especially jobs pouring concrete.

Theforeigner said:

Found this March 8, 2012 newsreport concerning the weather on the days 3 of the AC victims disappeared.
Kind of an odd (still interesting though) newsreport to pop up now 5-6 years after those murders hmm...wonder what that is all about?

As far as I remember, it was storm at one of days one of the GB4 victims disappeared, I think it was Amber Costello.
I will check out the weather on the days all the GB4 disappeared, and post it here.

http://www.nbc40.net/news/21337/

METEOROLOGIST SAYS WEATHER COULD BE FACTOR IN 2006 MURDERS
Jessica Klein ( jklein@nbc40.net) - 3/8/12 05:46 pm

ATL. CO. -- A well-known meteorologist says weather could actually have something to do with the murders of four prostitutes in the West Atlantic City section of Egg Harbor Township back in 2006.

Jim Eberwine, a now retired meteorologist who used to work for the national weather service, appeared on the Hurley in the Afternoon show on WOND radio Thursday. He says weather elements are critical to criminal cases, and he believes it's no coincidence that there were coastal storms on three of the four days when the victims disappeared.

The bodies of Kim Raffo, Tracy Ann Roberts, Barbara Breidor and Molly Jean Dilts were found on November 20th 2006, behind a strip of motels along the Black Horse Pike.

"I think if you look at crimes that too place over the years, you'll find a relationship between these kinds of conditions and killing people and dumping their bodies in places where you wouldn't have to worry about evidence," said Eberwine.

Headded that when there is bad weather, most people tend to stay inside so there usually aren't any witnesses to these crimes. Atlantic County Prosecutors says the case remains open and active.



http://www.nbc40.net/news/21337/video

Video on the subject

Click to expand...

Makes sense to me. I've been posting weather conditions and moon phases of the dates last seen for awhile now. I'll try to find a link.

ETA this link is set to the date of Melissa's disappearance but can be reset for the last seen dates of all the victims. Scroll down for weather info, rainfall, etc.

hth and sorry I don't have the time to help research at this time.

http://www.wunderground.com/history...eq_city=NA&req_state=NA&req_statename=NA&MR=1

LINative13 said:

7/9/2007 - Severe T-Storms
7/10/2009-Sunny
7/12/2009-T Storms
6/6/2010-T Storms
9/2/2010-Rain

Very Weird. Construction jobs are often shutdown when it rains, especially jobs pouring concrete.

Click to expand...

Where did you get that? Wunderground only shows rain on 7/10/09

noaa.gov

Look in weather archives

The weather reports for Long Island in the summer months almost always have "possible thunderstorms" listed. We should be sure to check that there was actual heavy rain or storm events, not just reported.

Also, instead of speculating that he is a rain-dancer or concrete mixer, why are we not starting with what is known: that the girls were discarded in a drainage ditch. It could simply be that his strategy is to use running water to speed decomp and cleanse the body/crime scene right?


I'm barely catching up to this thread to bare with me.

LINative13 said:

7/9/2007 - Severe T-Storms
7/10/2009-Sunny
7/12/2009-T Storms
6/6/2010-T Storms
9/2/2010-Rain

Very Weird. Construction jobs are often shutdown when it rains, especially jobs pouring concrete.

Click to expand...

These jobs also do not typically work on weekends also.

Here are the dates and days the GB4 and AC4 disappeared:


Maureen Brainard-Barnes: July 9, 2007 - Monday

Melissa Barthelemy: July 10, 2009 - Friday
(some reports say she disappeared July 12th) - Sunday

Shannan Gilbert - May 2, 2010 - Sunday

Megan Waterman: June 6, 2010 - Sunday

Amber Lynn Costello: September 2, 2010 - Thursday?

Kim Raffo - found on a Monday, 11/20/06. Had been deceased a day or two - Sat./Sun.

TA Roberts
MJ Dilts
B. Breidor

The last three were never reported missing and when their bodies were discovered on 11/20/06 they were estimated to be deceased for up to a month.