do you think maddie is alive or dead

Do you think Maddie is Alive or Not?

  • alive

    Votes: 12 3.4%

  • Not

    Votes: 46 12.9%

  • Alive and parents innocent

    Votes: 33 9.2%

  • Dead and parents not innocent

    Votes: 166 46.5%

  • Don't know

    Votes: 37 10.4%

  • Dead and parents are innocent

    Votes: 63 17.6%
  • Total voters
    357

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It's just a bit too much of a leap for me to now imagine Madeleine being mentally tortured, by an abductor there was never any proof of in the first place.
 
Donjeta said:
Anyway, if an abductor wants to torment a child with the thought that people on the internet have given up hope an think s/he's dead he doesn't actually need to have any real people thinking so, he can just make stuff up, the child won't know the difference.
Click to expand...

True but it adds strengths to the claims.
 
Gem2626 said:
I'd probably agree if we were talking about an adult but this is a child who could have potentially been kept alive between the ages of 3-9+. She would have no idea how the media/internet etc works. That little ray of hope that someone might come rescue her would be totally dashed away with "look everyone thinks your parents killed you, no one's looking for you".

Steven Stayner's abductor told him all sorts of rubbish. In Madeleine's case the abductors would be able to back it up.

Don't underestimate the power of mental torture.

Just my opinion
Click to expand...

IF they actually EXIST for which there is NO evidence whatsoever
 
Gem2626 said:
True but it adds strengths to the claims.
Click to expand...

Well, it might.

Possibly.

If the abductor has taught the child to read and if he allows her to use the internet.

Both are doubtful imo.
 
brit1981 said:
How can anyone here know whether she is alive or dead. not one LE force has stated that they know for certain. PJ said they did not know, and scotland yard said whilst they did not know there were leads that meant there was a chance she was alive. It does happen, look at natascha Kampusch, she disappeared, and individuels campaigned against her mother claiming she was involved. But eight years later she turned up alive, and denied her mother had had any involvement with which the police concurred.

So the only people who can know at the moment are the ones who were there.

Also does anyone else think a bunch of grown adults taking votes on whether a tiny child is alive or dead is rather bad taste?
Click to expand...

Well now i feel bad that i voted in this poll, because after reading your question brit1981 i do agree it is in bad taste after all. IMO i have never
believed the parents have had anything to do with their daughters abduction. Admittedly this case rarely makes headlines here anymore in Australia, but from what i know of the case, its been a witch hunt on the parents from day one. I think it was random opportunity, Maddie was a stunning child and it takes just one creep to think he/she can snatch what ever they like.
 
anxietyqueen said:
Well now i feel bad that i voted in this poll, because after reading your question brit1981 i do agree it is in bad taste after all. IMO i have never
believed the parents have had anything to do with their daughters abduction. Admittedly this case rarely makes headlines here anymore in Australia, but from what i know of the case, its been a witch hunt on the parents from day one. I think it was random opportunity, Maddie was a stunning child and it takes just one creep to think he/she can snatch what ever they like.
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Why is it in "bad taste" to believe a child is likely deceased, yet being abducted and raped by a (or several) pedophile/s is somehow in good taste?

:waitasec:
 
SapphireSteel said:
Why is it in "bad taste" to believe a child is likely deceased, yet being abducted and raped by a (or several) pedophile/s is somehow in good taste?

:waitasec:
Click to expand...

No thats not in any better taste obviously. I think that was brit1981s point (that the poll was in bad taste not the optional answers?????????????)
Or am i missing a post where brit 1891 said something contrary to that?
 
If a thread is offensive, it would be usual to report it to the mods and not contribute to it yourself.
 
Clutchbag said:
of course gem was insinuating people on the internet are the cruel ones, i wonder if gem read the sun stories where the parents told maddies siblings that the presents they got at xmas were from madeleine, you know fromthe evil badman who hadherand you know gem the one of the twins wanted to kill the abductor but her parents let her post pressies, talk about screwing your kids heads up hey gem?
Click to expand...

I don't read the sun or take anything the media says about this case as fact.
 
Donjeta said:
Well, it might.

Possibly.

If the abductor has taught the child to read and if he allows her to use the internet.

Both are doubtful imo.
Click to expand...

I agree in Madeleine's case that it is unlikely that an abductor would teach her to read however, abducted children (e.g. Steven Stayner) have been sent to school by their abductors so in general it can happen.

I do think that showing a news paper/internet article with Madeleine's parents faces on and then reading out what the article says would be enough. Yes the abductor can just say those things but using the language of a journalist would support what they're saying further IMO.

It's a bit like telling your kids Santa is real then ordering a letter from santa for your kids. You read it out to your kids and it supports what you've been telling them.
 
Yeah... I think Madeleine and her eye defect are probably too famous for an abductor to feel safe enough to send her to school but you never know, it's amazing what some people get away with. I guess if the abductor casually introduced the topic and said, "hey, my daughter has this eye defect, and she's been mistaken for Madeleine McCann so many times it's unbelievable..." people might take it in stride and not give it another thought.

Anyway, I think at this point a manipulating abductor might possibly show her the photo of any two random people and get her to believe they're her parents. Steven Sayner was seven when he was taken and was probably able to remember more than Madeleine who was several years younger. Many people have fuzzy or no memories from the time they were three or younger and if Madeleine had been living with someone who kept messing with her mind all this time there's no saying that she'd even know who Gerry and Kate are at this point.

That's what I would try to do if I ever found myself abducting a toddler. It seems it would be much easier to get away with it if the child was made to forget her real identity and believe whatever your cover story is instead of giving her reminders in the form of photos, internet stories about her disappearance, news articles about her real parents.

If the plan is to live with her and let her interact with people semi-normally and not keep her hidden and tortured in an underground cave anyway.
 
The fact is, there is no abductor.

Never was.

If there had been an abductor, there would be evidence of one, in my opinion.

:cow:
 
SapphireSteel said:
The fact is, there is no abductor.

Never was.

If there had been an abductor, there would be evidence of one, in my opinion.

:cow:
Click to expand...

This is not fact it is your opinion. We do not have all the information in this case.

Many children go missing without a trace every year. If this was organised crime, by an experienced perpetrator, then i'd think they'd be quite clever at not leaving any evidence behind. In any case the police made huge errors in the beginning and certainly compromised the investigation.
 
Gem2626 said:
This is not fact it is your opinion. We do not have all the information in this case.

Many children go missing without a trace every year. If this was organised crime, by an experienced perpetrator, then i'd think they'd be quite clever at not leaving any evidence behind. In any case the police made huge errors in the beginning and certainly compromised the investigation.
Click to expand...

Clumsy phrasing. I should have said -

The fact is, there is no evidence of an abductor.

There is evidence of Madeleine's death.

There is evidence her parents are involved.

There is evidence of deception and cover up within the Tapas group.

There is evidence of a cadaver sharing Madeleine's DNA in a car rented by her parents 25 days after Madeleine disappeared.

The only forensic evidence found in the entire resort (cadaverine and DNA) is on the belongings of her parents.

The only fingerprints on the shutters belong to Kate.

Gerry was seen carrying Madeleine toward the beach.

2 + 2 = 4, at least they did in the dark ages when I went to school.

:cow:
 
Donjeta said:
Yeah...I think Madeleine and her eye defect are probably too famous for an abductor to feel safe enough to send her to school but you never know, it's amazing what some people get away with. I guess if the abductor casually introduced the topic and said, "hey, my daughter has this eye defect, and she's been mistaken for Madeleine McCann so many times it's unbelievable..." people might take it in stride and not give it another thought.

Anyway, I think at this point a manipulating abductor might possibly show her the photo of any two random people and get her to believe they're her parents. Steven Sayner was seven when he was taken and was probably able to remember more than Madeleine who was several years younger. Many people have fuzzy or no memories from the time they were three or younger and if Madeleine had been living with someone who kept messing with her mind all this time there's no saying that she'd even know who Gerry and Kate are at this point.

That's what I would try to do if I ever found myself abducting a toddler. It seems it would be much easier to get away with it if the child was made to forget her real identity and believe whatever your cover story is instead of giving her reminders in the form of photos, internet stories about her disappearance, news articles about her real parents.

If the plan is to live with her and let her interact with people semi-normally and not keep her hidden and tortured in an underground cave anyway.
Click to expand...

BBM

Say an abductor was doing this... in regards to mentally torturing her they wouldn't need to make up someone when they would have it all laid out for them already. However, an abductor doing this does seem unlikely given her age. Your right she would probably not remember them after a little while and it would be easier to let her forget.

IF Madeleine was abducted and kept alive I think she is well out of sight. Too much risk involved in letting anyone see her.

JMO
 
Correct me if I'm wrong, but all the kids abducted and later recovered alive were within a couple of hundred miles of home, most much closer.

Based on this predictor, Madeleine would have been somewhere near PDL and found years ago, due to the "Leave No Stone Unturned" fund which surely saturated the area with full scale investigations and searches.

This is a child whose parents had almost unlimited funds for private searching, and they used them...so why did they not find even a whisper of a credible sighting either that night or since?

:waitasec:
 
Well, if someone abducted Madeleine and kept her alive I don't think billions of dollars of search funds would do much of a difference. Searches work if you're looking for remains left in the fields or the woods or the beaches but if you've got a child locked up in someone's basement the searchers aren't going to be allowed there and there will be no sightings if the abductor doesn't allow any outings. Privately funded searchers aren't going to find any children in places where you need to be LE armed with a search warrant to go to.
 
Donjeta said:
Well, if someone abducted Madeleine and kept her alive I don't think billions of dollars of search funds would do much of a difference. Searches work if you're looking for remains left in the fields or the woods or the beaches but if you've got a child locked up in someone's basement the searchers aren't going to be allowed there and there will be no sightings if the abductor doesn't allow any outings. Privately funded searchers aren't going to find any children in places where you need to be LE armed with a search warrant to go to.
Click to expand...

I beg to differ.

Privately funded searches with no dollar limit can have access to cutting edge infrared technology and listening technology which would enable them to examine each square kilometre minutely. Searching is no longer a matter of bashing down doors.

There would be no way a small child could be hidden (alive) with the technology available nowdays. The only limits to these searches are cost, which is why we don't see it more often. Most recently it was seen in Iowa, a 110 house saturation looking for missing cousins Elizabeth Collins and Lyric Cook.

A privately funded and expert team could have every single person within 1000km tracked and traced and accounted for, especially after 5 years.

I would say if Madeleine was to be found alive, she would have been by now.

The McCanns had limitless funding, resources and publicity...with absolutely zero result. I find this suspicious in and of itself, as the "abductor" would almost certainly had to have been a local, if he existed at all.

My opinon only.

:cow:
 
That sounds very James Bond but have you ever seen private searches like that happen in real life and is it even legal in Portugal to use cutting edge listening technology etc. without warrants to spy on the population as a whole, consisting of predominantly innocent people?


Were the 110 houses in Iowa searched by the girls' families or law enforcement?
 
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