IN - Lauren Spierer, 20, Bloomington, 03 June 2011 - #19

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northsider said:
Well, it would make sense if they were. Think about what we know from various pieces of info:

- ZO and AB (and others) had been at the 500 with CR, JR, LS, HT, and DR just four days earlier

- If ZO = DD, then JR was almost certainly a client of his as well

- According to HT, the party at JR's was "already out of beer" when DR and LS got there, yet they stayed for an hour, which likely means they were focusing on coke

- There are obviously several more people involved in this evening that simply haven't been named yet by LE

- JR hadn't had a chance to hang out with these folks too much in the recent past, since he spent the spring semester abroad
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Must you leave so soon, Northsider? Your visits are never long enough.
 
Frogzilla said:
If you read back, there are quite a few posts that I can paraphrase quite easily, ready?

(JW is innocent because he is.)
LOL that is not helping discussion in any way. It is frustrating when people are discussing something and that is the response to a long post or string of posts,

Also round and around we go. THERE IS NO EVIDENCE ANYBODY IS INVOLVED!!! So why clear anybody?
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Right, I think where the disagreement is coming in is that one side seems to be arguing that there is nothing to implement JW in the whole thing, so he appears innocent. The other side is saying there is nothing to implement JW's innocence in the whole thing, so he could be involved.

It's the same argument from 2 different sides. Both are correct :)
 
bx2 said:
Can you provide the source of this? I'm not disputing it, I'm just interested in where it comes from. I was also at the 500 (along with a few hundred thousand people) but of course wasn't with this group.
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Did you see them or say hey.
 
elmomom said:
sorry it was humor, you asked for it in 2 posts in a row, and I was trying to find it for you as fast as I could - now, chill out:seeya:
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Ok, lol. No problem. I read the link and what I found interesting is that he just talked to BPD on Tuesday? Why did n't they talk to him earlier? Unless I misunderstood the article.
 
British said:
Ok, lol. No problem. I read the link and what I found interesting is that he just talked to BPD on Tuesday? Why did n't they talk to him earlier? Unless I misunderstood the article.
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I think you can probably answer your own question if you give the reason you think this was the first time he has talked to LE.
 
British said:
Ok, lol. No problem. I read the link and what I found interesting is that he just talked to BPD on Tuesday? Why did n't they talk to him earlier? Unless I misunderstood the article.
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lol, this was what we all did last night... talked about the implications of this, and yes, he just talked to them this past Tuesday. He has spoken to them previously AFAIK. But it does mean (I think we can ALL agree) that LE is still interested in something he might have to say.
 
elmomom said:
lol, this was what we all did last night... talked about the implications of this, and yes, he just talked to them this past Tuesday. He has spoken to them previously AFAIK. But it does mean (I think we can ALL agree) that LE is still interested in something he might have to say.
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Ok, lol. Thanks. By the way, what does AFAIK mean?
 
If you were to describe all the POIs as either "her friend" or "not her friend" who would you list as which...

this is my list
CR, JR, DR, HT, JW her friends
ZO AB and other roommate (BB) ..... not her friends?
 
elmomom-I agree with your list except I waffle back and forth on CR. Sometimes I have a kinder picture of him than other times. My definition of friend may also vary a bit from others.
 
Frogzilla said:
I'm tired of people throwing me into this circus fun house of flawed logic. This is not directed to you because I am addressing your post, I am saying this for the record. My point is that on PT I could be anybody. I am glad that you know who you are when your posting, but do you know who anybody else is? Same goes for this website, I could of phrased it better but It would not matter. I have noticed that when defending JW, people like to butcher other's posts and only address less than 5% of original posts.
And again for the record, I am saying I do not have any reason to believe JW is guilty, but I have every reason to suspect him. I do not expect LE to clear ANYBODY in this case until a resolution happens.
If JW is completely innocent, why is he a POI to begin with? It has nothing to do with unaccounted time? Why did he leave town? LE just thinks he looks like an easy patsy to pin this on? It's not like he was stationed in Siberia when LS went missing, so why do people act like he couldn't of left his house that night? Why are LE wasting their time, energy and resources on taking cadaver dogs to JW apartment if he has no involvement. Why is JW out of the blue responding to reporters about polygraph test? Why is he showing the public his anger? Why not at worst his frustrations? Or dare I say it, caring or sympathy for anybody besides himself.
I am done addressing this topic because it is flying wayyyyyyyyyyyyyyyyyyyyyyy over people's heads and I don't want to confuse people anymore than they already are. If I have something to add on another subject I will chime in.
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I'm sure lots of people feel JW is directly involved...as lots of people do not and probably more are on the fence.
I do not.
As for LE they obviously don't have what they need to name a suspect/s yet and that may take a process of elimination.
That's what you're seeing here too..a process of elimination to try and find the truth.
If we wait on LE for everything there wouldn't be a whole lot of purpose for the forum imo.
Maybe in the end you will be right and I'll eat crow...I can handle that.
But in the mean-time I'll explore my theory as you should yours.
 
I would like to say that I have a problem with JW because he was to see Lauren after the game which ended early and he tried calling ,her phone later was left at Kilroy's.Now he dated this girl for two years and some say they were having problems some not.You mean to tell me he didn't know she was hanging out with CR and really messed up.Didn't text or call her until much later.Didn't know about the fight at Smallwood which one of his friends was involved in.Then he just went to bed after not talking to Lauren with no concern what could have happened to her since she never showed up.But the next day he was all worried and contacting her roommate.I find all this very fishy and strange.
 
I would kindly like to say we should all respect everyone's opinions.We are a sum of the whole.This is a great board and we are all looking for Lauren
 
Frogzilla said:
THERE IS NO EVIDENCE ANYBODY IS INVOLVED!!!
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Huh?

1. JR, the self-proclaimed last person to see LS alive, has a story (he watched her walk solidly to the corner and turn) that some say is impossible on his end (he couldn't see her from that vantage point at that hour - personally I've never been convinced by this charge, but many are) and either way appears potentially impossible on hers, as it is seriously inconsistent with the testimony of several people that at 2:40 (and perhaps 3:40) she was inebriated to the point at which she could not talk or walk (itself supported by JR's story, who suggested he needed proof otherwise). We cannot say the same of any other POI - MB's story that he was working on papers is supported by their being turned in the next day, CR's amnesia story is supported by rumored xanax use and/or the videotaped assault, JW's story is supported by the testimony of his roommate, absence of any evidence he ever left home, and LE access to his/her phone and his car, and DR's story is supported by SW camera/entry data, LE access to his phone, and absence of any evidence he was involved past 1:30-45. Whether or not any of these stories are true, they at least make logical sense (JW went to sleep before the confrontation occurred). JR's does not.

2. JR was clearly awake (or passed out in LS's presence) circa the time of her disappearance, per the cellphone call from his phone. We cannot establish that that is true of any other POI - that is an hour at which most people, even partying college students, are asleep, or maybe pulling an all-nighter. We can also establish it is not true of at least two POI - CR (who has been poly'd along with his roommate), and JW (whose roommate has told same to Federal LE, presumably on pain of false statement and obstruction of justice charges).

3. JR has not submitted to a LE polygraph, preferring a private administration (as indicated by his lawyer's statement re providing results to LE). JR may not in fact have ever spoken directly to LE. We cannot say the same of any other POI - CR and MB have submitted to LE polys, DR has spoken to LE and may not have even been asked to take one, and JW's statements, while arguable, suggest (to me) that he took a LE poly, consistent with LE's description of him as cooperative two days after they administered polys to CR and MB.

4. JR has not spoken to anyone in the media. We cannot say the same of any other prime POI except MB (iirc) - CR and DR have spoken on camera, and JW's media contact is now infamous here.

5. JR may not have participated in any searches (though I'm not sure about this one). We cannot say the same of any other prime POI - CR/MB asked around about the "little blond girl," and DR and JW have participated in volunteer searches.

6. JR supposedly skipped town fast; at least, we have no evidence that he was around after 6/3. We cannot say the same about any other prime POI - JW was around until at least 6/9 or 10, and CR/MB and DR until at least 6/17, if not longer.

I mean, what am I missing here?
 
AnalyticalExaminer said:
Huh?

1. JR, the self-proclaimed last person to see LS alive, has a story (he watched her walk solidly to the corner and turn) that some say is impossible on his end (he couldn't see her from that vantage point at that hour - personally I've never been convinced by this charge, but many are) and either way appears potentially impossible on hers, as it is seriously inconsistent with the testimony of several people that at 2:40 (and perhaps 3:40) she was inebriated to the point at which she could not talk or walk (itself supported by JR's story, who suggested he needed proof otherwise). We cannot say the same of any other POI - MB's story that he was working on papers is supported by their being turned in the next day, CR's amnesia story is supported by rumored xanax use and/or the videotaped assault, JW's story is supported by the testimony of his roommate, absence of any evidence he ever left home, and LE access to his/her phone and his car, and DR's story is supported by SW camera/entry data, LE access to his phone, and absence of any evidence he was involved past 1:30-45. Whether or not any of these stories are true, they at least make logical sense (JW went to sleep before the confrontation occurred). JR's does not.

2. JR was clearly awake (or passed out in LS's presence) circa the time of her disappearance, per the cellphone call from his phone. We cannot establish that that is true of any other POI - that is an hour at which most people, even partying college students, are asleep, or maybe pulling an all-nighter. We can also establish it is not true of at least two POI - CR (who has been poly'd along with his roommate), and JW (whose roommate has told same to Federal LE, presumably on pain of false statement and obstruction of justice charges).

3. JR has not submitted to a LE polygraph, preferring a private administration (as indicated by his lawyer's statement re providing results to LE). JR may not in fact have ever spoken directly to LE. We cannot say the same of any other POI - CR and MB have submitted to LE polys, DR has spoken to LE and may not have even been asked to take one, and JW's statements, while arguable, suggest (to me) that he took a LE poly, consistent with LE's description of him as cooperative two days after they administered polys to CR and MB.

4. JR has not spoken to anyone in the media. We cannot say the same of any other prime POI except MB (iirc) - CR and DR have spoken on camera, and JW's media contact is now infamous here.

5. JR may not have participated in any searches (though I'm not sure about this one). We cannot say the same of any other prime POI - CR/MB asked around about the "little blond girl," and DR and JW have participated in volunteer searches.

6. JR supposedly skipped town fast; at least, we have no evidence that he was around after 6/3. We cannot say the same about any other prime POI - JW was around until at least 6/9 or 10, and CR/MB and DR until at least 6/17, if not longer.

I mean, what am I missing here?
Click to expand...

Can you clarify what you are giving evidence JR is involved in? I think you'd agree that none of this is evidence of him being involved in a crime.
 
AnalyticalExaminer said:
Huh?

1. JR, the self-proclaimed last person to see LS alive, has a story (he watched her walk solidly to the corner and turn) that some say is impossible on his end (he couldn't see her from that vantage point at that hour - personally I've never been convinced by this charge, but many are) and either way appears potentially impossible on hers, as it is seriously inconsistent with the testimony of several people that at 2:40 (and perhaps 3:40) she was inebriated to the point at which she could not talk or walk (itself supported by JR's story, who suggested he needed proof otherwise). We cannot say the same of any other POI - MB's story that he was working on papers is supported by their being turned in the next day, CR's amnesia story is supported by rumored xanax use and/or the videotaped assault, JW's story is supported by the testimony of his roommate, absence of any evidence he ever left home, and LE access to his/her phone and his car, and DR's story is supported by SW camera/entry data, LE access to his phone, and absence of any evidence he was involved past 1:30-45. Whether or not any of these stories are true, they at least make logical sense (JW went to sleep before the confrontation occurred). JR's does not.

2. JR was clearly awake (or passed out in LS's presence) circa the time of her disappearance, per the cellphone call from his phone. We cannot establish that that is true of any other POI - that is an hour at which most people, even partying college students, are asleep, or maybe pulling an all-nighter. We can also establish it is not true of at least two POI - CR (who has been poly'd along with his roommate), and JW (whose roommate has told same to Federal LE, presumably on pain of false statement and obstruction of justice charges).

3. JR has not submitted to a LE polygraph, preferring a private administration (as indicated by his lawyer's statement re providing results to LE). JR may not in fact have ever spoken directly to LE. We cannot say the same of any other POI - CR and MB have submitted to LE polys, DR has spoken to LE and may not have even been asked to take one, and JW's statements, while arguable, suggest (to me) that he took a LE poly, consistent with LE's description of him as cooperative two days after they administered polys to CR and MB.

4. JR has not spoken to anyone in the media. We cannot say the same of any other prime POI except MB (iirc) - CR and DR have spoken on camera, and JW's media contact is now infamous here.

5. JR may not have participated in any searches (though I'm not sure about this one). We cannot say the same of any other prime POI - CR/MB asked around about the "little blond girl," and DR and JW have participated in volunteer searches.

6. JR supposedly skipped town fast; at least, we have no evidence that he was around after 6/3. We cannot say the same about any other prime POI - JW was around until at least 6/9 or 10, and CR/MB and DR until at least 6/17, if not longer.

I mean, what am I missing here?
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In other words no evidence.No arrests.Maybe phone records and whatever they come up with from the POI search will show something of benefit.
 
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