Connecticut school district on lockdown after shooting report at a Newtown elemen #8

HastingsChi said:

We don't know if going to the gun range was a family activity when the Lanza's were still married. We don't know for sure if Nancy or Peter ever took Adam to the gun range. We don't know if the Lanza's went hunting together or if they were even hunters. We don't know more than we do know; this causing endless speculation. Studies have proven that the public remembers the first reporting of events more than the public remembers the true facts that come out with the patience of time.

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It appears they had not been living together since 2001.

Nancy bought most or all of those guns, the ones Adam had or gained access to, in the last 2-3 years. I believe some or all of that has been verified as to dates purchased. I fail to see how hunting, going to the gun range, or a host of other things directly has to do with access in the home of these types of weapons. Access to guns that I doubt Adam could have purchased? Access to guns that went beyond a regular old rifle.

This may sound callous, but I'm not so sure in the scheme of thing that initial reporting remaining in people's minds about NL is the most important thing on everyone's minds. I don't think most people care about the blame as much as learning from the situation and preventing this the next time. Most people realize the news does a lot of misreporting in this day and age.

HastingsChi said:

We don't know if Adam Peter Lanza's father Peter owned guns either; but no one seems to raise that question because it is easier to blame a murder victim who is not in a position to respond to such things...

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No one is blaming Nancy. We have questions, of course. I also have questions for his father, but none of them has anything to do with the fact that he may own guns. The fact is, the guns used to kill 26 innocent people were Nancy's guns. We do not know how readily or freely they were available to him on a daily basis and we will probably never know. What we can learn from this is...

If you are a parent, and you have a troubled adult son living in your home, and your hobby is collecting dangerous weapons and enjoy using them for sport, then maybe it would be a better idea to store these weapons in a storage unit where you need a password to even enter the property and then a key to even enter the unit. Keep one handgun in the home (for protection). Lock it up properly with a lock that required a #code that only you know; that way, no one can get a hold of a "key". Then, when you want to go out shooting weapons for sport, drive on down to the storage unit and pick them up and do your thing.

Questioning whether or not his father had guns makes no sense. IMO.

HastingsChi said:

Thanks manzana and donjeta, I didn't know that. I do appreciate both of you sharing that. Thank you!

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See what a thank you gets you!

Chris Manfredonia, whose 6-year-old daughter attends the school, was heading there Friday morning to help make gingerbread houses with first-graders when he heard popping sounds and smelled sulfur.

He ran around the school trying to reach his daughter and was briefly handcuffed by police. He later found his child, who had been locked in a small room with a teacher.
http://articles.latimes.com/2012/dec/14/nation/la-na-1215-newtown-school-shooting-20121215

eileenhawkeye said:

On CNN, they showed pictures of all the victims with the song "Amazing Grace". However, they did not include Nancy Lanza. What's up with that?

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That has bothered me.. But they do include her in the number of dead for some reports- I think when they leave her out they are pretty much talking about what happened in the school. (that and they don't know if they should pity her or loath her-happy to see the parents of the victims know the difference.)

wfgodot said:

Or if he had not had access to an assault rifle in the first place.

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Nothing she did was illegal at this time. Connecticut gun laws permitted her to have the weapons she owned. It's the law that allowed her to own the assault rifle, whether it was full auto I don't know that yet. But if I read the law right she could own a full auto too. I think if it was a full auto we would have heard that by now. jmo

time said:

This may sound callous, but I'm not so sure in the scheme of thing that initial reporting remaining in people's minds about NL is the most important thing on everyone's minds. I don't think most people care about the blame as much as learning from the situation and preventing this the next time. Most people realize the news does a lot of misreporting in this day and age.

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Respectfully snipped by me

TIME I agree that it is not the most important thing and you are spot-on that "learning from the situation and preventing this the next time" is much more important. I do appreciate you sharing that and pointing that out.

Keeping in mind what studies have proven about initial reporting and remembrance, in learning from this situation and using it as a tool to help prevent future horrific acts it is so critically important that we are using facts and not speculation/misreporting. Since it will take time for the facts to come to be known via LE investigation, as hard as it is to do at this moment of sorrow, we must find a way to be patient and wait for the facts before being able to truly use the horrific activities of the monster that is the shooter as a learning tool to help keep the children safe and get help for those before they act.

HastingsChi said:

If years and years = 3 years then I guess you're right.

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"Peter and Nancy Lanza split in 2001 and in 2010, Peter started dating a new woman. The source said that's when Adam stopped speaking with his dad. The father and son hadn't seen each other since then, according to the report."

http://www.huffingtonpost.com/2012/12/18/peter-lanza-adam-lanza_n_2324979.html

I believe this has been reported by several sources and the press has reported on their divorce agreement (as you pointed out).

manzana said:

See what a thank you gets you!

Sandy Hook Second Shooter Chris Manfredonia - YouTube

There was no second shooter

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I really appreciate you sharing that. THANK YOU AGAIN MANZANA (waiting to see what I get for this thank you hehehehe) :great:

To clarify I didn't suggest or ever believe there was a second shooter; the story Lou Young shared on CBS was so poignant I was surprised not to see any follow-up (until you and dojeta shared the info with me today). Thanks again to you both.

Elley Mae said:

Nothing she did was illegal at this time. Connecticut gun laws permitted her to have the weapons she owned. It's the law that allowed her to own the assault rifle, whether it was full auto I don't know that yet. But if I read the law right she could own a full auto too. I think if it was a full auto we would have heard that by now. jmo

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I did not say possession was illegal. I did imply that said possession killed twenty first-graders and six adult teachers.

Legality is cold comfort in the face of the Newtown dead.

wfgodot said:

Courage of Sandy Hook teacher, 25, who ran back
into elementary school to help co-workers escape gunman (Daily Mail)
Ted Varga showed colleagues escape route as shots rang out last Friday

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Another male school staff member... remember the modsnip who wrote it wouldn't have been as bad if it hadn't been an all female staff?

kalekona said:

That has bothered me.. But they do include her in the number of dead for some reports- I think when they leave her out they are pretty much talking about what happened in the school. (that and they don't know if they should pity her or loath her-happy to see the parents of the victims know the difference.)

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I understand why Nancy is not included in the memorials for the Sandy Hook Elementary School victims. Nancy is a victim, but she is not a victim of the Sandy Hook Elementary school shooting. They, IMO, are separate cases, separate crimescenes, and probably even separate motives. These crimes are connected by one thing and one thing only. HIM!

HastingsChi said:

If years and years = 3 years then I guess you're right.

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Nancy and Peter Lanza, a tax director for General Electric, separated in 2006, divorced in 2009 and Peter remarried in 2011

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Guardian

Isabelle said:

Passion flower: I think you are right in your post on the previous thread about NL shutting others out of her life. I think she truly believed what she was doing for her son was the best and was not willing to entrust her son's longterm care to others, As a mother, I 'm not sure how I would have acted or what I would have done if I were in her situation. To be totally honest, I may have done the same thing she did, but I certainly would not have had dangerous weapons in my home. Very sad. If no one in her family tried to intervene and convince her to see the situation differently, they should have, esp the dad and should never have given up. Am I making sense?

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I am a grandma of an asperger grandson.
It takes a village to raise a child.
Everyone of us have worked with him.
Taken him to counselors, doctors and teachers.
We take classes also.
We have broken the barriers, he hugs, kisses, shows empathy.
He has come along way.
He has friends, goes to regular classes.
When ever someone has a child with any disability,
they need allot of help.
We are a hands on family and lucky that we all take care of each other.

The following was sent to me this morning via e-mail and I had to share it!



Twas' 11 days before Christmas, around 9:38
when 20 beautiful children stormed through Heaven's gate.

...

Their smiles were contagious, their laughter filled the air.
They could hardly believe all the beauty they saw there.
They were filled with such joy, they didn't know what to say.
They remembered nothing of what had happened earlier that day.
"Where are we?" asked a little girl, as quiet as a mouse.
"This is heaven." declared a small boy.
"We're spending Christmas at God's house."
When what to their wondering eyes did appear,
but Jesus, their Savior, the children gathered near.
He looked at them and smiled, and they smiled just the same.
Then He opened His arms and He called them by name.
And in that moment was joy, that only heaven can bring,
those children all flew into the arms of their King.
And as they lingered in the warmth of His embrace,
one small girl turned and looked at Jesus' face.
And as if He could read all the questions she had
he gently whispered to her, "I'll take care of mom and dad."
Then He looked down on earth, the world far below
he saw all of the hurt, the sorrow, and woe.
Then He closed His eyes and He outstretched His hand,
"Let My power and presence re-enter this land!"
"May this country be delivered from the hands of fools"
"I'm taking back my nation. I'm taking back my schools!"
Then He and the children stood up without a sound.
"Come now my children, let me show you around."
Excitement filled the space, some skipped and some ran.
All displaying enthusiasm that only a small child can.
And I heard Him proclaim as He walked out of sight,
"in the midst of this darkness, I AM STILL THE LIGHT."

I don't know who the author is, or where it originated. I just thought it was wonderful.

HastingsChi said:

Respectfully snipped by me

TIME I agree that it is not the most important thing and you are spot-on that "learning from the situation and preventing this the next time" is much more important. I do appreciate you sharing that and pointing that out.

Keeping in mind what studies have proven about initial reporting and remembrance, in learning from this situation and using it as a tool to help prevent future horrific acts it is so critically important that we are using facts and not speculation/misreporting. Since it will take time for the facts to come to be known via LE investigation, as hard as it is to do at this moment of sorrow, we must find a way to be patient and wait for the facts before being able to truly use the horrific activities of the monster that is the shooter as a learning tool to help keep the children safe and get help for those before they act.

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BBM - I am well aware of what remains salient in people minds having some expertise in cognitive psychology.

It's not difficult to glean the facts that matter from the media and are not in dispute.

I don't really think it's necessary to refer to Adam Lanza as a monster because as you have pointed out, we really don't know the facts of all of this which means we don't know how he got to the point he did. I am interested in that topic and realize I don't really know.

eileenhawkeye said:

On CNN, they showed pictures of all the victims with the song "Amazing Grace". However, they did not include Nancy Lanza. What's up with that?

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I don't get it either. This morning a friend's church rang the bells 27 times at 9:30, and the pastor has been getting death threats today. I mean, seriously? WTH is wrong with people?

Even Vinnie Politan keeps talking about the 26 victims and the 26 random acts of kindness idea.

It's really bugging me. This woman, regardless of who she was before, was likely shot while she was sleeping. How is that not a victim?

time said:

"Peter and Nancy Lanza split in 2001 and in 2010, Peter started dating a new woman. The source said that's when Adam stopped speaking with his dad. The father and son hadn't seen each other since then, according to the report."

http://www.huffingtonpost.com/2012/12/18/peter-lanza-adam-lanza_n_2324979.html

I believe this has been reported by several sources and the press has reported on their divorce agreement (as you pointed out).

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Thanks TIME. I appreciate you sharing that.

While an 8 year separation strikes me as odd, it is possible that the reporting is accurate; possible. I read the statement from the divorce mediator who met with Nancy and Peter in 2009 and the agreed upon settlement and conditions.

Yes I am aware that Peter Lanza began dating and later married a new woman following the divorce. (Btw the new Mrs Lanza looks exactly like Nancy...) As far as Adam and Ryan's relationship with their father, currently reporting on that is more speculation than based in fact.

http://articles.latimes.com/2012/dec/14/nation/la-na-1215-newtown-school-shooting-20121215

Chris Manfredonia, whose 6-year-old daughter attends the school, was heading there Friday morning to help make gingerbread houses with first-graders when he heard popping sounds and smelled sulfur.

He ran around the school trying to reach his daughter and was briefly handcuffed by police. He later found his child, who had been locked in a small room with a teacher.

HastingsChi said:

I really appreciate you sharing that. THANK YOU AGAIN MANZANA (waiting to see what I get for this thank you hehehehe) :great:

To clarify I didn't suggest or ever believe there was a second shooter; the story Lou Young shared on CBS was so poignant I was surprised not to see any follow-up (until you and dojeta shared the info with me today). Thanks again to you both.

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Yeah I know that is why I replaced the Youtube video with an article, Video named him as a second shooter.

angelmom said:

I don't get it either. This morning a friend's church rang the bells 27 times at 9:30, and the pastor has been getting death threats today. I mean, seriously? WTH is wrong with people?

Even Vinnie Politan keeps talking about the 26 victims and the 26 random acts of kindness idea.

It's really bugging me. This woman, regardless of who she was before, was likely shot while she was sleeping. How is that not a victim?

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I believe the tribute shown during AC360 did include Nancy. The one I watched during CNN Newsroom did not. It makes me think it's up to *someone* (producer, whoever made the tribute) about whether or not she is included.