FL FL - Michelle Parker, 33, Orlando, 17 Nov 2011 - #13

telemag said:

I gotta disagree with you on this one. It makes no sense to me to kill someone dump the body then go joy riding around in their car in hopes that someone will notice a window sticker. There would be a very good chance someone would see who was driving the car and also a chance although lesser IMO of getting pulled over by an officer for what ever reason.

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Well yeah it didn't make a lot of sense to me either when I posted it but I figured I'd just throw it against the wall and see if anything stuck :smile:

*putting on thinking cap* the only way possible that it **MIGHT** have happened is if the hummer was dumped immediately..before she was reported missing..afterwards if would have definitely been too risky.

Melissa

In my opinion Michelle's disappearance appears to be a more personal crime (ie was perpetrated by some one who knew her), rather than a stranger/random abduction.

It occurred in a very narrow timeline. Statistically, random abductions are rare, so for it to happen in such a small timeframe, never mind at all, is unlikely.

The phone being discarded, intact, in a separate location. I would think most strangers would not take the time to do this since there is very little about the victim, herself, besides any evidence on the body, to ID the perp. So, why attempt to distance the phone (which could be used to ID the victim) from the actual victim? I would think only someone who knew the victim would do this, without even knowing he was making a BIG mistake.

The removal of the Glow decals. I do not believe a stranger would take the time to do this. If the stranger even took the time to attempt to disguise the vehicle, they would simply back the Hummer into a parking spot to delay a witness from IDing the vehicle. Removing the decals is the act of someone who knew Michelle and knew the connection Michelle had to those decals (HER business).

Replying to the brother's text was not the act of a random attacker. First off, why even reply? To delay. A random attacker would have no need to do this. Also, I do not feel a random attacker would feel confident enough to reply to a text without knowing the relationship his victim has with the person ending the text.

Taking the keys from the Hummer after parking it. I think that a random perp would just leave the keys behind. Taking them shows a subconscious desire to protect the vehicle from theft. This would be odd for a random attacker. Why else would you pocket the keys? You clearly can't keep the keys for yourself (they will always be a direct link to whoever parked that Hummer), but you do not want anyone else driving off with that vehicle, so you take the keys with you. I don't think that the person who parked the Hummer even realized they were doing this, it was just second nature. But a random attacker wouldn't care about the vehicle at all; he got what he wanted...Even if the keys are found discarded at another site, this will hold..


So, those are just a few of my thoughts on why this wasn't a random attack. Still thinking on reason/details that would make me lean toward a random attack. I haven't come up with any yet, but would be open to suggestions...

Not saying these details lead to DS being the perp, but they IMO do point to someone who knew Michelle., which narrows the suspect pool considerably.

Mirage said:

(respectfully snipped for space only)

You said exactly what I have been wanting to say for days... I can tell you have been thru it because you speak it exactly as it is. I was married to one exactly the same.. in fact, it sounds like we were married to the same man!

Also, when a control freak such as this realizes they are actually losing total control of their subject, they can and will try anything to get that power back.. they will likely try to be nice first, but when nothing works, they will try violence, anger and any other tactic to regain control of this person they so badly want to control. Maybe Michelle was finally showing that she was truly healing from his abuse, and was into a healthy relationship.. and it sent him over the edge. It would be entirely possible.

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Your second paragraph describes my ex-wife to a T (minus the violence, so far). Since I remarried 7 years ago, and she realized I was outside her grasp, she has done everything possible to try to disrupt my life with my second wife and children. It hasn't amounted to violence yet, but I am honestly scared by her, though I make sure not to show it.

maedlamsmom said:

In my opinion Michelle's disappearance appears to be a more personal crime (ie was perpetrated by some one who knew her), rather than a stranger/random abduction.

It occurred in a very narrow timeline. Statistically, random abductions are rare, so for it to happen in such a small timeframe, never mind at all, is unlikely.

The phone being discarded, intact, in a separate location. I would think most strangers would not take the time to do this since there is very little about the victim, herself, besides any evidence on the body, to ID the perp. So, why attempt to distance the phone (which could be used to ID the victim) from the actual victim? I would think only someone who knew the victim would do this, without even knowing he was making a BIG mistake.

The removal of the Glow decals. I do not believe a stranger would take the time to do this. If the stranger even took the time to attempt to disguise the vehicle, they would simply back the Hummer into a parking spot to delay a witness from IDing the vehicle. Removing the decals is the act of someone who knew Michelle and knew the connection Michelle had to those decals (HER business).

Replying to the brother's text was not the act of a random attacker. First off, why even reply? To delay. A random attacker would have no need to do this. Also, I do not feel a random attacker would feel confident enough to reply to a text without knowing the relationship his victim has with the person ending the text.

Taking the keys from the Hummer after parking it. I think that a random perp would just leave the keys behind. Taking them shows a subconscious desire to protect the vehicle from theft. This would be odd for a random attacker. Why else would you pocket the keys? You clearly can't keep the keys for yourself (they will always be a direct link to whoever parked that Hummer), but you do not want anyone else driving off with that vehicle, so you take the keys with you. I don't think that the person who parked the Hummer even realized they were doing this, it was just second nature. But a random attacker wouldn't care about the vehicle at all; he got what he wanted...Even if the keys are found discarded at another site, this will hold..


So, those are just a few of my thoughts on why this wasn't a random attack. Still thinking on reason/details that would make me lean toward a random attack. I haven't come up with any yet, but would be open to suggestions...

Not saying these details lead to DS being the perp, but they IMO do point to someone who knew Michelle., which narrows the suspect pool considerably.

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LOL .. I find myself wondering if DSJr'n'Company read these posts and think "Darn, I knew I shouldn't have done this .. or dang, I should have done that .."

Assuming, of course, that he IS the perp.

I do agree that carjacking is out -- they car isn't missing. Random abduction in my mind is out -- decal removal is a problem with me .. as well as the location of her phone.

This is personal.

Can't WAIT for an arrest so we can see what they've got!

*anxiously wringing hands*

Been gone since Saturday, but catching up.

I've seen a lot of people musing about why LE named a suspect. I am not involved with LE, but I believe it has something to do with the legalities of search warrants for both physical searches and data/records like Epass (toll authority) and phone records, maybe even phone taps. I think that it either paves the way, making it easier for those kinds of activities or it is a necessity to name someone to be able to obtain that information. Just so they LE can't haphazardly tap, trace or obtain phone/data records.

Just my opinion...

stg said:

Your second paragraph describes my ex-wife to a T (minus the violence, so far). Since I remarried 7 years ago, and she realized I was outside her grasp, she has done everything possible to try to disrupt my life with my second wife and children. It hasn't amounted to violence yet, but I am honestly scared by her, though I make sure not to show it.

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Wow! seven years and she's still not over it? Yeah, I'd be scared too! As for me, when my ex wasnt over it in two years, I moved to another state, as I was not giving him another minute of my life! :great:

Mirage said:

Wow! seven years and she's still not over it? Yeah, I'd be scared too! As for me, when my ex wasnt over it in two years, I moved to another state, as I was not giving him another minute of my life! :great:

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Ridiculous, isn't it? It died down during her second marriage, but that lasted less than two years, and once that ended, all her focus went back on us, as I predicted would happen. We have two children together, so unfortunately I can't avoid her. The problem is, since my wife and I had twin girls, her intensity has ratcheted up even higher. I honestly have no idea what she's capable of.

telemag said:

I agree, but Casey's case hardly has any comparison to Michelle's. If Dale is responsible for Michelle's disappearance he has done an excellent job in doing so as far as not leaving a trace of evidence.

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Again, IMO, we don't know what evidence LE has. There was the found truck (prints, dna, hair), the found phone, possible discrepancies between what records/data says and what the suspect says...

Also, it took 6 months, but Caylee was found. I remember watching some of our local coverage about it and the ME answered a question 'If they had found Caylee sooner would they have more evidence?' with a 'Yes.'

I think whoever did this might have been smart enough to only incapacitate MP until they were able to get rid of her, if she is no longer with us. This would fool any cadaver dogs that would most assuredly be brought in to search the vehicle(s) and possibly the condo. Maybe it wasn't meant to go as far as it did, but when they realized the path that they were on, decided that the only way out was for her to disappear. DS, if he is the one, may not be the brightest bulb, but even a dullard could have picked up some 'useful' information from Casey's mistakes.

stg said:

Ridiculous, isn't it? It died down during her second marriage, but that lasted less than two years, and once that ended, all her focus went back on us, as I predicted would happen. We have two children together, so unfortunately I can't avoid her. The problem is, since my wife and I had twin girls, her intensity has ratcheted up even higher. I honestly have no idea what she's capable of.

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Totally OT, but who was that woman who stalked and is suspected of killing her ex and his new gf in another state .. geez, saw the show and it freaked me out ..

Psycho ex wife, stalking and obsessive..

Eeeeeek!!

Why do people feel the need to control another??

ETA: Dana Chandler .. and apparently they are trying her now ??

TexasCharm said:

Totally OT, but who was that woman who stalked and is suspected of killing her ex and his new gf in another state .. geez, saw the show and it freaked me out ..

Psycho ex wife, stalking and obsessive..

Eeeeeek!!

Why do people feel the need to control another??

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Are you thinking of Betty Broderick? I read that book. Freaked me out.

andalso said:

In thinking about this a little more...

Yvonne would most certainly call Dale's cell phone before calling his parents landline if she was trying to reach Dale. If I am trying to reach you, I am going to call you, not your parents.
So, if in fact Yvonne did call the parent's landline wouldn't that mean that Dale was not answering his cell phone,IMO, because he was otherwise occupied. Suspicious.

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I agree. And they probably called him about 6:59 pm. First they get the call from her son that she never came home, and probably also that she never returned his calls/texts.

Then they probably called the daycare to see what time she picked up the twins or if she made it there at all. They would have been told she did so at about 2:45 or so.

So the next obvious call would be to Dale. I don't know what numbers that they had for him though. I assume, because of the kids, they had his cell and or home and probably his parents as well.

BritsKate said:

I, unfortunately, will never know Michelle beyond her gorgeous smile. I can tell you what type of woman stays with someone who hurts her though. A woman who believes in the commitment she made, who trusts people she loves and wants to believe the best of them, and who often puts those she loves in front of herself.

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(respectfully snipped by me, for space)

Or, a woman who, through years of emotional abuse, believes the lies told to her.

LittleBitty35 said:

Good point!

Off topic, I just want you to know that I intend to steal your dog...in your avatar, too cute. It would make my other pets unspeakably happy.

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OT; He is my daughter's but she went off to school so now he is all ours. LOL
His best friend is our big bad German Shepherd, but he remains the boss.

hon3yb33 said:

Just out of curiosity cuz I've been MIA with Strep and strep infected kids :frown: but how did this name come up? I have emailed the mod to be verified so I will finally be able to answer some questions. Until then I gotta sit still biting my tounge because I'm not sure what I can and can't say..

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I would like to know about that name too. It's new to me, but I've been in and out the last couple of days. I really want to hear what you have to say too. I think we could use some fresh insight.

Originally Posted by katydid23

Originally Posted by nobodynoz *
<Deep breath>

I'll tell you why this information "bugs" me. I am trying not to be driven and overtaken by emotion, specifically hate. Although Dale seems not in the least a likeable person, given his past history and his cold demeanor whenever we've seen him on video, not to mention his apparent action with the camera person, a couple of snippets of detail, such as Yvonne's words above, give me a glimpse of humanity in this man. I saw another article in which Yvonne mentioned the occasion of her talking with him and embracing him after the hearing where he retained custody of the twins. As I remember, she said that he sobbed and shook during that exchange.

Don't get me wrong. I am not trying to defend him or in any way promote sympathy for him. And I appreciate that some of you may see those episodes as just Dale's attempts at manipulation, and as Yvonne wisely trying to keep open the connection for the sake of the twins. But someone posted yesterday the suggestion that Dale could be a sociopath, without conscience. I can see the possibility of this, certainly, and so the suggestion that Dale is holding in some emotional pain that he might only reveal to Yvonne (and perhaps his family and close friends, but we don't hear about that) gives me some hope, believe it or not.*

If Dale did something monstrous to Michelle that ended her life, and then rushed around madly to cover up the deed, which certainly seems to be the case based even on the little evidence the public has right now, then a spark of humanity and conscience is a good sign that, in my opinion, we should acknowledge. It suggests that what he may have done is weighing on him, perhaps heavily and even nightmarishly.*

The hope this could give us is that he will more likely reveal, or even confess, what took place.

I know it may be a slim chance indeed that this will happen. But if he is in fact an emotionless sociopath, we would have no chance of that at all.

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I see your point, and I HOPE you are right. But my jaded opinion is that he was crying those tears FOR HIMSELF. I think he was emotional because he knew he had royally screwed up big time, and he was scared FOR HIMSELF.

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I agree with you both in that at this point I could go either way on who the real Dale is, deep down at his very most core.. I agree with you, nobodynoz and I have as well taken notice of these few instances we seem to be hearing about as possible glimpses of humanity in Dale.. But then again true sociopaths have no ability to truly feel for others pain, sorrow, nor even their pleas of help.. The sociopath is literally unaffected.. But what they are capable of feeling is what katydid23 speaks of in that they very much feel for THEMSELVES.. in fact most engage In frequent pity parties for themselves quite frequently due to their constant feeling that they're being wronged by someone or something else.. The reality of it is usually that it is themselves that are in the wrong but they are INCAPABLE of ever taking responsibility for their actions, reactions, decisions, and choices they make throughout their self centered lives.. Is it this that we are getting glimpses of?? A narcissistic person with sociopathic tendencies?? Therefor the tears and any anguish that we see or hear about is Nothing more than self pity and fear for his own azz???

As I said at this point I believe either are still possible as to what is truly at the core..the very soul of Dale Jr.. But I did want to add one other instance that I took notice of that falls in this exact category.. The same rule applies for it as it truly could go either way with what was Dale Jr's motive for the action/reaction.. It's in the court docs, the one's that give the very detailed Accts of those involved in and/or around the night that Dale threw his wife's head into a rod iron balcony inflicting severe injuries not only all about the head, under her hair/scalp, face, and ears.. But also all about her body literally from her head to her feet even sustaining injury..

His wife's acct and the officers acct were seperate statements handwritten but both of them went into extreme detail about Dale's seemingly showing remorse and sorrow for having caused injury to his wife.. He was uncontrollably crying and apologizing and demanded that he be the only party charged as the aggressor(from what I understood they both had physically lashed out and I guess there may have been discussion on charging them both with DV).. He continued to cry and beg with remorse and for them to only charge him that he took full responsibility for what occurred and that he wanted to die, he wanted to kill himself for harming his wife..

I can see that going either way.. Was it self pity knowing he had no choice but to plead and beg and show extreme remorse in a most dramatic fashion??.. Or is there really a soul that feels way Down deep in there?? One that is capable of feeling remorse, and sorrow for causing those you love pain and anguish?? I don't know the answer to that.. But I can see it going both ways and I believe it's just something that will continue to become clearer as this case continues to unfold.. As we learn more about just who the real Dale Jr is???.. IMO one things for sure..there certainly seems to be no lacking in the department of violent, irrational, anger issues that are deep seeded in this man.. And that alone, in and of itself is extremely concerning..jmo, tho

SongBird said:

I believe part of the facade with some ...like DS jr ...is to come off as a great guy..super friendly...etc.....let's face it...everyone in our world demonstrates a certain degree of niceness imo...what I feel diferentiates each of us ...is how we handle anger...unfortanately some people go to drastic extremes with anger...which is why we are here reading about these sad tragedies ...but what I'm trying to say here is...the poor choice is always after the fact..when it is too late...the victim is usually stuck at this point due to either being fooled, naive, gullibe..etc.. what I have learned...before taking the bait when meeting somone new ...test the anger side...see how this person reacts ... ..JMHOs

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BBM. Way back when I read a quote that said something like..."If you want to test a man's character, give him a pile of tangled up Christmas lights to untangle".

Lark2 said:

I have read here and other places that Dale Jr. worked as a cabinet installer at a place called MASCO.

Manta has a listing for a business called MASCO Cabinetry at 2901 Titan Row, Orlando:

http://www.manta.com/c/mr54ttk/masco-cabinetry-llc

This is very close to W. Sand Lake Road where someone up-thread where 1) either the Hummer was sited or 2) where the cell phone pinged. Also close to Rose Blvd. home of Dale Sr and the heavily searched Oakridge area in general.

Anyone know if this is the Masco Cabinetry where Dale worked? Also, didn't the phone ping from a tower near W. Sand Lake Road??

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Yes, that is the address of his employer, at least as of Nov. 17. We went there to get comment, and were told no one there could comment. The cell ping we are told was closer to Oak Ridge and Orange, but towers usually reach up to about a three-mile radius.

TexasLil said:

Can someone help me with the street Michelle's parents live on? I would like to add to the map the route to the salon from home and to Dale's condo from the salon.

TIA

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They live on Guy Court in Geneva, Seminole County.

I don't know if this is Websleuths-appropriate, but I have a riddle/challenge for you all (hoping you haven't solved it already):

Something I uncovered early on that was not newsworthy (in my opinion), but interesting (if not bizarre) is discernible from online public records:

Who performed the wedding ceremony of Dale Smith II's first wife when she remarried after she and Dale got divorced?

SuziQ said:

BBM. Way back when I read a quote that said something like..."If you want to test a man's character, give him a pile of tangled up Christmas lights to untangle".

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Think I'll cross-stitch that and put it on my door. lol