Autistic boy banned from Minn. church

sherri79

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The Diocese of St. Cloud issued a statement saying the petition was filed "as a last resort out of a growing concern for the safety of parishioners and other community members due to disruptive and violent behavior on the part of that child."
Walz said the boy's behavior worsened over time, telling authorities that Adam has been "extremely disruptive and dangerous" since last summer.
According to Walz, Adam struck a child during mass, nearly knocks elderly parishioners over when he hastily exits the church, spits and sometimes urinates in church and fights when he is being restrained.
He also one time assaulted a girl by pulling her onto his lap and, during Easter mass, ran to the parking lot and got into two vehicles, starting them and revving the engine, Walz alleged.
"There were people directly in front of the car who could have been injured or killed if he had put the car in gear," Walz wrote.
Adam's parents have to sit on him and sometimes tie his hands and feet to get control of him, Walz wrote.
Carol Race has an answer to each complaint.
She said her son makes spitting faces but doesn't spit and acknowledged he has occasional problems with incontinence. She says that she and her husband sit on Adam because their weight calms him down, which is why he pulled the girl onto him.
She also said they do use soft straps to bind Adam's hands and feet on occasion because it calms him, as does the revving sound of engines, which is why he started the cars.
Some disability advocates are getting behind the Races.
"It's unfathomable and concerns me that we've taken a situation with special needs and we're making it into the criminal matter," said Brad Trahan, the founder of the RT Autism Awareness Foundation in Rochester, who has asked the bishop of St. Cloud to rescind the restraining order

http://kstp.com/article/stories/S448291.shtml?cat=1

since i know some will not click the link i tried to get as many of the facts as possible. this is why i quoted from the middle of the article.
 
I am sorry, I have friends with autistic kids, but if one is this disruptive and you cannot control him/her you have no right to force that behavior on other people. It's not like a small tic or speaking very loudly, this is way beyond that.
 
Wow, sherri. What a sad and interesting situation. I would really like to hear from our members that deal with autism on a daily basis. I have never heard of anything like this.

For me, it would be hard to take a child with issues like Adam's to church because I would be so concerned with keeping an eye on my child that I do not know whether or not I would get much out of the service. It would leave me stressed out and one of the reasons I go to church to church is to find peace.

It says the church leadership visited this family in an effort to look for alternatives. I wonder what some of those alternative were.

My prayers for this family and this congregation.
 
Shouldn't he be more socialized by this age? I would like to know more about his special education, care, diet, etc. I honestly don't know what to think about this.
 
It's very interesting, especially the reasons why he does each thing. I don't know what to think, other than the parents probably need to keep a closer eye on their son.
 
I have a son with Autism. I pick my battles with him. Unfortunately I wouldn't bring him to church if he acted this way we would find an alternative. I don't understand how this child was able to start up two cars and rev the engines. How did he get the car keys? Where was his parents? I don't allow my son to leave my site when we are in public. When he starts to get rowdy we come home. It really is that simple.
 
Wow, sherri. What a sad and interesting situation. I would really like to hear from our members that deal with autism on a daily basis. I have never heard of anything like this.

For me, it would be hard to take a child with issues like Adam's to church because I would be so concerned with keeping and eye on my child that I do not know whether or not I would get much out of the service. It would leave me stressed out and one of the reasons I go to church to church is to find peace.

It says the church leadership visited this family in an effort to look for alternatives. I wonder what some of those alternative were.

My prayers for this family and this congregation.
i am not sure what the church suggested. i would think some things could easily be done to improve the situation. my grandmother wore depends after her bladder surgery. i am sure they could find them in a size to fit this child.

sit the child and his family away from others especially children. with his size he could easily harm a child without the intent to hurt them.

ask that the other members of the church wait until this family can leave or have this family leave last. i can see how having a 6ft 225lb person running into people can be dangerous but it seems easy to fix.

ask for volunteers in the church that would be willing to learn how to help the parents control the child when he has a issue.

never leave the child unattended if he gets into cars and starts them. i understand the sound brings him comfort but this is just dangerous.
 
Shouldn't he be more socialized by this age? I would like to know more about his special education, care, diet, etc. I honestly don't know what to think about this.
i tried to find more information but it has not been easy. most articles seem slanted one way or the other. like they list the childs problems but not why he behaves this way or they say mom is upset and could be arrested if she violates the court order but never mention the cars or the allegation of him hitting other children.
 
I don't understand the car starting issue. Are people just leaving their car keys in the ignitions with the doors unlocked?
 
When I read the words very carefully it makes me think there is more to it than the obvious. These were the sentences that made me think that....

*Carol Race said it all started last June, when Walz and a church trustee visited the Races at their home to address the behavior of Adam.

I think it is interesting that she feels that is where it "all started".
If church representatives were visiting in the home about it, wouldn't things have been escalating for at least a little while?

*Carol Race just hopes the ugly back-and-forth doesn't tarnish the image of the church.
"The church isn't bad," she said. "But it's what some individuals do within the church."


So the mom is not "upset" with the church and is concerned about its reputation. But she does seem to be bothered by some "individuals" and what they "do"
I wonder who the individuals are and what is it exactly that they "do"?
 
I don't understand the car starting issue. Are people just leaving their car keys in the ignitions with the doors unlocked?
The Easter incident occurred when Adam got into the driver's seat of a car that had already been started and revved the engine because he's drawn to engines, she said. http://www.startribune.com/local/19033344.html?page=3&c=y
maybe someone started their car to allow the AC to cool it while they spoke to others.
 
i tried to find more information but it has not been easy. most articles seem slanted one way or the other. like they list the childs problems but not why he behaves this way or they say mom is upset and could be arrested if she violates the court order but never mention the cars or the allegation of him hitting other children.

Thank you for researching this case. It just seems like something isn't being done or is missing from this child's care. I'm not trying to blame the parents. I've never been a parent of an autistic child, but have studied some about the condition. I'm wondering if they keep him home all the time and this is the only time he's around other people, and he just cannot contain his excitement? Something just seems amiss.
 
I think Carol Race is about to start one heck of a lawsuit against the church. She is failing to look at the issues other then the fact her rights are being voilated & she is the one being banned.
 
I have a son with Autism. I pick my battles with him. Unfortunately I wouldn't bring him to church if he acted this way we would find an alternative. I don't understand how this child was able to start up two cars and rev the engines. How did he get the car keys? Where was his parents? I don't allow my son to leave my site when we are in public. When he starts to get rowdy we come home. It really is that simple.

Thank you for your thoughts on this Mygirlsadie.


I dont know enough about Autism so I have a question. IF this boy cannot have any expectations placed on his behavior then would that be because his autism is very profound? Is this how profound autism manifests itself? Can a child with autism in a home where the parents have trained and educated themselves as well as their autistic child, get a different result than a home where the parents dont try as hard?

I know that in any social setting (church, movie theatre, grocery store, etc) there are going to be children whose at home training is obvious. The opposite is true also. Is this the case with autistic children or is all undesirable behavior just credited to the autism?
 
When I read the words very carefully it makes me think there is more to it than the obvious. These were the sentences that made me think that....

*Carol Race said it all started last June, when Walz and a church trustee visited the Races at their home to address the behavior of Adam.

I think it is interesting that she feels that is where it "all started".
If church representatives were visiting in the home about it, wouldn't things have been escalating for at least a little while?

*Carol Race just hopes the ugly back-and-forth doesn't tarnish the image of the church.
"The church isn't bad," she said. "But it's what some individuals do within the church."

So the mom is not "upset" with the church and is concerned about its reputation. But she does seem to be bothered by some "individuals" and what they "do"
I wonder who the individuals are and what is it exactly that they "do"?

Good post, Glow. Obviously this all started before church members came knocking at their door. So far, I can't help but think this Mom is failing to grasp the responsibility that she has to keep her son from menacing fellow members of their congregation. It sounds to me like the church is trying to find a viable solution and the Mom is just digging her heels in and not willing to work towards a mutual fulfilling goal.

I will surely withhold judgment because we do not have lots of information.
 
I have a son with Autism. I pick my battles with him. Unfortunately I wouldn't bring him to church if he acted this way we would find an alternative. I don't understand how this child was able to start up two cars and rev the engines. How did he get the car keys? Where was his parents? I don't allow my son to leave my site when we are in public. When he starts to get rowdy we come home. It really is that simple.

Well you are a very thougtful person, not just towards others, but towards your son. Putting a kid through this seems like it would just be adding more stressors which only make the situation worse. Kudos to you. :blowkiss:
 
Good post, Glow. Obviously this all started before church members came knocking at their door. So far, I can't help but think this Mom is failing to grasp the responsibility that she has to keep her son from menacing fellow members of their congregation. It sounds to me like the church is trying to find a viable solution and the Mom is just digging her heels in and not willing to work towards a mutual fulfilling goal.

I will surely withhold judgment because we do not have lots of information.

I think I pretty much agree with you. I have two friends who have kids with autism. One is not so bad, the other is pretty profound. Both have said that some parents with autistic kids just give up and when someone complains about the disruptive behavior they say get very defensive and say well my child has autism and you are just ignorant.
 
The church has to think about the safety of all their members. It sounds like they have been trying for some time to work things out but the behaviors just keep happening. Also it seems to me that the child is not being supervised close enough or he never would have gotten into those cars.
When I worked with the mentally disabled there were times ones were banned from places, once a girl attacked a little child at walmart, you can not keep letting these things happen! Another one would walk through an isle knocking everything off the shelf, yes she was banned and rightfully so! There was 1 who was stopped from attending a church because he was exposing himself to children in the bathroom. There are deffinatly reasons for being banned when you care about the safety of others.

VB
 
Thank you for your thoughts on this Mygirlsadie.


I dont know enough about Autism so I have a question. IF this boy cannot have any expectations placed on his behavior then would that be because his autism is very profound? Is this how profound autism manifests itself? Can a child with autism in a home where the parents have trained and educated themselves as well as their autistic child, get a different result than a home where the parents dont try as hard?

I know that in any social setting (church, movie theatre, grocery store, etc) there are going to be children whose at home training is obvious. The opposite is true also. Is this the case with autistic children or is all undesirable behavior just credited to the autism?

It could be that it's profound, or it could be that the parents think that their disabled child should be tolerated by everyone.

Autism manifests itself in many ways, profound or not. Outbursts are common with any degree of autism. Sort of over stimulated.

I'll venture that a parent who educates themselves, not only on autism, but the child's emotional well being, their triggers and learn about how to stem a storm quickly would def get a different reaction from their child than one who just thinks they should let them do whatever.

My son is held to the same set of rules his siblings are. He's not stupid by any stretch. We do disipline different with him but when we discipline is not really an issue. He hits, screams, throws things, stomps his feet and calls names. His punishment is the same as if anyone else in the household does those things in that the first thing we do is remove him from the situation. He is made to sit in a room by himself and calm down. THEN we talk about the bad behavior and what he can do next time. He also has to tell someone he's sorry if he's done something to physically, or emotionally hurt them. Of course we do other things but he has a set standard and he's not allowed to continue to disrupt the whole household when there are ways to fix the problem.

If he does these things out in public, we leave, right then. If he calms down and we prepare him better next time, we might try again at another time.

Re: the weight issue. Why don't they have that child in a weighted vest or have him use a weighted blanket? Common for people with sensory issues and it sounds like they understand he likes weight and it helps.

I feel that the parents are being a bit selfish personally. They are making every person there deal with their kids problems. So much so that others have def noticed and tried to meet her half way. They wanted a solution way before they banned him. It's the parents responsiblity to make sure their child is not disruptive, not the other way around. I know that not everyone wants, or feels able, to deal with my son. Why would they want to put him, or others, in that position? So they can go to Church?

They need to either listen to the Bible on tape, watch a taped version of the service, prepare their son better, watch him much closer and do what's right for him, not what they want to do just because they can.
 
Okay, the following are my thoughts and opinions on this situation. I speak from experience, being the father of an 8 yo Autistic son. Additionally, my son is tall and stocky and I'm well aware of issues with controlling him physically.

And before I go any further, I would not be putting my son into that situation. When we are out in public, if he does not behave I'll take him out and sit in the car. Usually for him, sitting down listening to his music calms him down.

Stimming: Autistic people have compulsive behaviors called "stimming", self stimulation. Why they do them is disputed. However for most, they cannot stop doing the behaviors. They can include hand flapping, vocalizations, running in circles, screaming, etc. There is a wide variety of them and no two people are alike.

These are not to be confused with simple bad behavior, which autistic children are quite capable of doing as well. The trick as a parent is to recognize the difference and deal with the situation accordingly.

Walz said the boy's behavior worsened over time, telling authorities that Adam has been "extremely disruptive and dangerous" since last summer.
He's thirteen. He just hit puberty.

According to Walz, Adam struck a child during mass,
Not good on a first offense. There should not be an opportunity for a second chance. If the autistic child exhibits this behavior, then he has a one-one monitor at all times when out in public. For both his protection and that of other children. Hello, can you say LAWSUIT???

...nearly knocks elderly parishioners over when he hastily exits the church,
Again, one-one monitor, at all times.

If both of these incidents happened, then right there, the parents are not keeping track of him.

...spits and sometimes urinates in church and fights when he is being restrained.

Um, Depends??? or whatever brand of adult diaper you prefer.

Restraining an autistic person is generally doomed to failure. It won't calm them down and usually only escalates a bad situation.

He also one time assaulted a girl by pulling her onto his lap...

Walz wrote that Adam once pulled an adolescent girl -- an exchange student staying with the family -- on top of him, grabbing her thighs and buttocks.

Race says that she and her husband sit on Adam because their weight calms him down, which is why he pulled the girl onto him.

Spare me the . Pulling someone onto your lap does not qualify as assualt. I also note that the girl was staying with the family. She may have been familiar with such behavior and why he did it. However IF she was offended/frightened/etc. then it was wrong. No person, autistic or not, should be touching any other person without their permission.

and, during Easter mass, ran to the parking lot and got into two vehicles, starting them and revving the engine, Walz alleged.

"There were people directly in front of the car who could have been injured or killed if he had put the car in gear," Walz wrote.

Don't leave your cars running unattended. If someone got inside, it was unattended.

Don't let your autistic kid run into the parking lot.

Does anyone in this congregation have any intelligence?

Adam's parents have to sit on him and sometimes tie his hands and feet to get control of him, Walz wrote.

Race said they do use soft straps to bind Adam's hands and feet on occasion because it calms him, as does the revving sound of engines, which is why he started the cars.

Seeing a hysterical autistic person being forcibly restrained is going to be uncomfortable and/or traumatic for other people. Not to mention what it does to the autistic person.

(Of course, I'd look at my three kids and say, "Behave or you're next...")

Some disability advocates are getting behind the Races. "It's unfathomable and concerns me that we've taken a situation with special needs and we're making it into the criminal matter," said Brad Trahan, the founder of the RT Autism Awareness Foundation in Rochester, who has asked the bishop of St. Cloud to rescind the restraining order.

If this situation is unfathomable to you then you are a stupid a$$ and you need to step away from the tv camera. Any person with two brain cells could see that this situation is a powder keg. Sit down and STFU Brad.

Race said that he (Bishop Walz) said that we did not discipline our son.

IF he did say that, then he has no grasp of the situation or Autism in general. It is not a question of discipline. However, Autistic people, like any other people, can be manipulated and controlled, in effect, disciplined. But it doesn't work the way that he implied.

You can't tell an Autistic kid to stop doing a stim behavior and expect it to happen. However you can distract or redirect the stim into a more appropriate behavior.

Carol Race said the family ... typically sat in the cry room or in the back pew to keep avoid disrupting the services and did not hear a complaint from the parishioners until Walz showed up at their home in June.
...
Even after the restraining order was served, the family continued going to the church and would leave during the closing hymn to avoid contact with others, Carol Race said.

It sounds like the parents are not completely clueless. I would also like to see/hear the actual complaints and verify if other parishoners were in fact disturbed, frightened, offended, etc.

The family's request for certain accommodations -- such as clearing aisles when the family leaves church -- have gone unfulfilled, she said.

Anything else? A holy escort to your car maybe? Clearing the aisles, my butt.

"What are we supposed to do, literally lock our kids away so no one has to see this for the rest of their lives?" Kasemodel said. "Adam's a big boy and he is intimidating because they don't understand him. Adam makes sounds like any kid, but there were babies making a heck of a lot more ruckus than Adam was."

In this situation, you have an Autistic person who can not control their behaviors. Their behaviors are endangering others. If you can not handle that person, then you are doing them a grave disservice by taking them into public situations.

What happens if he hurries out of mass and knocks over an elderly person, injuring them?

What happens if he puts that car into gear and hits a half dozen people?

What happens if the local LE tries to arrest or incarcerate him? Or do we forget all the instances of LE overreacting or acting irrationally?

Bottom line: The parents are not controlling their child.

Their child is capable of causing physical harm to others, especially children and elderly adults.

Their child could have been struck by a moving vehicle when running in the parking lot.

Their child could have caused a tragedy by messing with a running vehicle.

The parents are not controlling their child. They are creating a situation where their child could be harmed or cause others to be harmed.
 

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