"Tape Recorder Man"

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Motherof5 said:
.... Thrasher has said in a previous post that Coffey was known to abduct kids from shopping centers. I asked where and what kids but haven't gotten a response. Do you know of Coffey having done this?
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I will try posting an answer again to your question. Let's hope that the server allows it to go on the boards. I have had a number of posts simply disappear - or appear in duplicate.

First, This thread is on TRM rather than on Coffey, and I want to emphasize that Mr. Coffee might or might not be TRM.

On the Thread about possible Suspects, there is quite a bit of information posted about Fred Howard Coffey, Jr.

He is a convicted Child abductor, molester, and murderer. To answer your specific question, I know of only one specific instance in which he did abduct a young girl from a convenience store parking lot. That occurred in 1974 In Virginia Beach, VA, prior to his discharge from the Navy.
 
I'm sorry for asking the Coffey question as this is the TRM thread, but Coffey seems to be the only suspect that most want to consider. I also was hoping to catch you because I haven't heard back from Thrasher. I do realize that Coffey may or may not be TRM and IMO he probably isn't. Again, I'm sorry.
 
Richard said:
The fact that TRM also "disappeared" at the same time as the Lyon sisters tends to prove that he was IN FACT involved in or responsible for their disappearance. Think about it. He was seen at malls on successive days before. If he had nothing to do with the Lyon sisters, wouldn't he simply be back the next day conducting his "interviews"? And if he was truly just an innocent old guy, why didn't he come forward to clear his name and get police on the right track?
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Richard, I agree that the fact that TRM wasn't seen agian after March 25th 1975 does make it appear that he either took the girls or was involed.But don't you think it's possible that TRM could have been some nut talking to kids and when he heard on the news that night or the next day that 2 girls he had just talked to were now missing,he would stop the TRM thing right then and there for fear of people tinking he was involved? He may not have come forward, again for fear of LE thinking he was involved. I know that the sketch of TRM didn't come out right away,but news of the girls being missing did. I'm just saying that it's POSSIBLE that TRM talked to them and then went on home to listen to his lastest recordings and then heard the news about the girls and decided to retire his TRM role.
 
Motherof5 said:
Richard, I agree that the fact that TRM wasn't seen agian after March 25th 1975 does make it appear that he either took the girls or was involed.But don't you think it's possible that TRM could have been some nut talking to kids and when he heard on the news that night or the next day that 2 girls he had just talked to were now missing,he would stop the TRM thing right then and there for fear of people tinking he was involved? He may not have come forward, again for fear of LE thinking he was involved. I know that the sketch of TRM didn't come out right away,but news of the girls being missing did. I'm just saying that it's POSSIBLE that TRM talked to them and then went on home to listen to his lastest recordings and then heard the news about the girls and decided to retire his TRM role.
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Certainly what you suggest is a possibility. But it is somewhat out of character for what we know about TRM. This scenario would presume that he heard of the girls' disappearance, and immediately KNEW that it was the same girls he spoke with, AND that he KNEW foul play was involved - as opposed to their just running away or visiting a friend.

TRM was a rather bold fellow, who did not seem to worry a lot about who saw him or what children he approached. It is more likely that he was involved/responsible than that he was just an innocent bystander with a rather weird hobby. If he truly was a "weird hobbiest", he would probably not have thought that he had done anything wrong. That is, if he hadn't abducted the girls, he probably would have been at Wheaton Plaza or another mall within the next few days doing the same thing as before with his tape recorder and microphone.

TRM could have been a "harmless" old geezer with a tape recorder who just happened to be seen talking with Sheila and Kate hours before they mysteriously disappeared. Possible, yes, but it almost requires one to set aside common sense to believe such a BIG Coincidence took place.

Now just WHO the Tape Recorder Man was is the big mystery.
 
Richard TRM could have been a "harmless" old geezer with a tape recorder who just happened to be seen talking with Sheila and Kate hours before they mysteriously disappeared. Possible said:
Wow!!! Requires one to set aside common sense? I just wanted to explore another option and because I think that this could be a possibility,I have no common sense? I sure didn't expect that harsh post from you.I think I'm done here.:sheesh:
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Motherof5 said:
Wow!!! Requires one to set aside common sense? I just wanted to explore another option and because I think that this could be a possibility,I have no common sense? I sure didn't expect that harsh post from you.I think I'm done here.:sheesh:
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Sorry, I intended no offense.

As I said at the top of my last post, it is certainly a possibility that the TRM was not involved at all - and I have stated that on a number of other occasions as well.

It simply seems more logical to me to consider the strong possibility that TRM actually was involved in this case - as seen in his actions before and his conspicuous absence immediately afterward. One must, however - as you have pointed out - consider all sides and all possibilities in any case.

Coincidences DO occur every day in every situation. And I think that some unfortunate coincidences occurred in the course of this case and the investigation which followed. Consider the possibility, but also consider the strong Probabilities as well.
 
:clap:Thank you so much. That was very well stated. I agree with you and am 99% sure it was TRM. I just didn't want to miss anything no matter how small. I've been thinking about BTK and how he was hiding in plain sight. I often wonder if TRM did the same thing. I've wondered about the sketch. The sketch artist said he felt really good about the sketch,so this makes me think that it was a very good likeness. I'm wondering if TRM would have to be from another area or do you think it's possible that he was from the area? I'm wondering if he could be from the area and someone who saw the sketch thought it looked like someone that they knew but shook off the thought because who wants to believe something like that about a family member,friend or neighbor? We didn't have a sketch with BTK,but when he was caught,his family had no idea. If I saw a sketch that looked like my father,husband or uncle, I would probably talk myself out of it unless I had some reason to think that they could have done something like that.What do you think?
 
As I previously stated, I twice, & on seperate occasions saw a man with a briefcase,tape recorder & microphone, talking to children. It was not until 12 yrs. later, a suspect, Fred Coffey appeared in the paper. This is a very long time to remember what someone looks like. During those 12 yrs, I made an honest effort to due just that, 'REMEMBER' knowing it may be important someday. Today, as then, I am still satisfied that the man I saw was Fred Coffey.
 
I talked to a cold case detective recently, & was told that they don't Think Coffey snatched the Lyon Girls. I replyed that the TRM I saw looked a Hell of a lot like Coffey, & that you'd almost have to say that the TRM was not involved either. He indicated at this point, maybe TRM did not do it. I personally think they're wrong, but they are the investigators, & have learned more about the case than what I know.
 
I know that you have posted this before, but can you refresh my memory? I wanted to know where you saw TRM and do you remember the ages of the kids he was talking to? Also, was he talking to both boys and girls?
 
MY first encounter with TRM was in front of Sears at White Oaks, where he was speaking with a red headed girl 13-15 yrs. old. She was holding a basketball & he had a briefcase with a tape recorder. While I was parking my car he picked up his brief case & stepped behind a large pilar by the entrance walkway.I was hard-pressed for time but I did notice him standing there as I passed by. My intention was to take care of my business in Sears, & confront him on my way out. I was delayed for about 15 or 20 mins. in Sears, & he was gone & so was the young girl, as I exited the store.

The second encounter was at Wheaton Plaza, were he was trying to speak with 2 little toddlers (females),whose mother was trying to pull them away. I stepped up as the mother & girls went on by. Among other words, I told my girlfriend who was with me, that this SOB is a baby snatcher, & I want to take a good look at him, so when someone disapears around here, I'll know who done it. I wanted to confront him then & there, but my girlfriend insisted we go, because it was freezing cold in the open (at the time) mall. I just missed my second chance to deal with this derelect. Also, he did have a recorder with a
microphone, which was attched to a brief case.
 
Thanks Jeb for posting the particulars about your two sightings of TRM.

TRM was seen on at least 7 separate days in at least 5 different Maryland shopping centers between Mid February and 25 March 1975.

He was seen on four separate occasions at Wheaton Plaza with his tape recorder and microphone.

These sightings were not, however, known to police until AFTER "Jimmy" and his parents came forward on 28 March 1975 during which time the first of two TRM sketches were made.


Police withheld word of this story until they could first make some inquiries of Wheaton Plaza employees and show them the sketch. When no leads developed that way, the story and sketch went out to the media on 31 March 1975

What followed was a flood of calls to police headquarters from people who thought they knew who TRM was. Among those callers were several people who claimed to have seen such a man with a tape recorder at the various malls and shopping centers. Although some of the witnesses stated that they were upset or suspicious about the activities observed - of a man attempting to tape record young girls - nothing had been reported, or if so, nothing done about the strange man. His activities were strange but not illegal. However, they now seemed to take on a different significance.

TRM was reported as having been seen (by Jeb) in mid February at White Oak Shopping Center and on 28 February at Wheaton Plaza.

TRM was seen again the next day, 1 March again at Wheaton Plaza by a man who observed him for half an hour approaching young children outside various stores.

Aproximately 15 persons reported sightings of a strange man with a tape recorder at Bowie Shopping Center, Iverson Mall, and Marlow Heights Shopping Center (all in Prince Georges County, MD) on or about 22 March 1975.

Three Wheaton Plaza employees (who had not been initially contacted by police on 29 or 30 March) saw the sketch and reported that they had seen him at Wheaton Plaza a day or two before the 25th of March.

Of course, "Jimmy" and his young male friend reported seeing TRM talking to the girls on that fateful Tuesday, 25 March 1975.
 
Motherof5 said:
I've been thinking about BTK and how he was hiding in plain sight. I often wonder if TRM did the same thing. I've wondered about the sketch. The sketch artist said he felt really good about the sketch,so this makes me think that it was a very good likeness. I'm wondering if TRM would have to be from another area or do you think it's possible that he was from the area? I'm wondering if he could be from the area and someone who saw the sketch thought it looked like someone that they knew but shook off the thought because who wants to believe something like that about a family member,friend or neighbor? We didn't have a sketch with BTK,but when he was caught,his family had no idea. If I saw a sketch that looked like my father,husband or uncle, I would probably talk myself out of it unless I had some reason to think that they could have done something like that.What do you think?
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Thoughts anyone???????????:waitasec:
 
My initial thoughts about TRM when I saw him at Wheaton Plaza were, that he must be from elsewhere to do what he's doing, & being so bold about it. I also believe he altered the color of his hair to grey, he appeared to be heavier than what Coffey would have been but this could be explained with flaired pants, & last but not least he had on footwear with high thick heels which could accout for the differance in height between him & Coffey. These are my beliefs.
 
I think that the term "Hiding in plain sight" would pretty well fit most well organized preditors. Part of their psyche would be to act perfectly normal and calm most of the time, but transforming into a monster when they "need" to.

Watching all the excitement that they cause while acting like part of the crowd, or general population might give this type of person a secondary "high".

It is probably just as important to them to be able to blend back in to a normal routine and family life as it is for them to step into their preditory role(s). This is what truly makes them so hard to track down and stop.

BTK really had gotten away with murder, as long as he maintained his life of "normalcy". It was only when he started going off the deep end for an extended period of time and started playing games with police (sending messages etc) that he was finally located and arrested.

There is also probably something to be said about potential witnesses NOT wanting to believe that an unknown suspect is a friend, neighbor, or relative. But there may be many reasons for such a person not coming forward: Anything from simply not knowing of the crimes to fearing the person they suspect might be the perpetrator. Also, there are probably those who did come forward, but whose information was ignored by investigators and filed away.

In dealing with a very cold or old case, detectives do have the advantage of checking other similar cases which may have occurred since. Patterns and similarities might lead to an arrest.

And there is the possibility that someone who knew something about the case could come forward with their information - perhaps because the intervening years have changed his/her mind about testifying. Situations change. It is because of this that the idea of keeping these old cases alive and publicized is so important.
 
ShurlT said:
...The only reason I've hung on this idea was because the newspaper article I read that had the COMPOSITE OF TRM...not somebody else...was that it appeared with the Kathy Beatty case and then there was a small bit of information included about the disappearance of the Lyon's sisters. Maybe the police at that time thought there might be a connection with Kathy's case and the Lyon's case and so they added the composite and some information about the TRM.....
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The sketch of the Tape Recorder Man (TRM) only appeared four times in the Washington Post, all four printings were in the month of April 1975.

The first sketch, made 28 March 1975 appeared twice and then when a number of witnesses came forward to say that they had seen him at various malls, each was asked what they thought of the sketch and if they could offer any changes.

A second sketch was made by D. Morton who simply altered his origional drawing by changing the chin area slightly. The rest of the sketch remained the same and the date was not even changed (28 march). That second sketch appeared twice in the Washington Post. It is copies of these two sketches from the Washington Post archives which I forwarded to NCMEC for publication on their website.

Regarding the Kathy Beatty case, I saw only one small article in the Washington Post issue of Saturday 26 July 1975 which stated that she had been attacked and was in the hospital. A second article appeared in early August to state that she had died of her injuries. There were no photos or sketches in either article and no mention of the Lyon Sisters.

In January 1976, a much longer article featuring a photo of Kathy appeared in the Washington Star newspaper. I do not recall any mention of the Lyon Sisters, and certainly no reference to TRM. It may be possible that one of the weekly papers may have published the TRM sketches, but I have never seen them associated with the Beatty case.

In 1987, when Fred Coffey was in the news, Montgomery County Police tried to connect him to both the Lyon and Beatty cases, but had no solid evidence to charge him in either.
 
Richard said:
In dealing with a very cold or old case, detectives do have the advantage of checking other similar cases which may have occurred since. Patterns and similarities might lead to an arrest.
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I agree. I also think that short of a confession or info from someone that knew TRM,finding and solving similar cases would be the best shot at solving this/getting to TRM.
 
Just wanted to submit Earl Bramblett as a possible suspect for TRM and get opinions. He was looked at for this case http://www.doenetwork.org/cases/36dfva.html and here his the link to info and pictures of him. He was executed in 2003 for killing a family of four.http://www.allamosa.com/earlbramblett.html

I thought he looked like the description of TRM,likes young girls,charged once with molestation and of course the doenetwork case he's suspected in. Virginia isn't too far away. Anyway just a thought.
 
That boy Earl Bramblett does not look like the guy I saw with the 'recorder'. I suppose I could be wrong about some of these obseravtions, but I believe in what I saw, & will 'never' forget it.
 
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