Found Deceased TX - Sherin Mathews, 3, Richardson, 7 Oct 2017 #6 *Arrest*

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JaimeInLA said:
Or something was happening to her that was bothering her throat or stomach, making it unpleasant or painful to eat.
Click to expand...

What? While only in her home?

If something was bothering her throat and or stomach it didn’t magically get better when she was away from home.. unless she was in a bad situation in her home.


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Rocco said:
Unless something was going on in the home that caused her to develop an eating disorder. Maybe someone familiar with what those possibilities could be, could speak to that.
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I posted on this in the last thread, regarding eating issues and adopted children. It is common for adopted children to have struggles with either eating too much, or with not eating enough. Here it is:
The social worker who visited Sherin Mathew's family for follow-ups records that "eating has become more and more challenging for the family". "She likes to eat food outside but not at home".
The fourth, and the last report before Sherin's death, notes, "We discussed several different strategies that may be helpful" and that "additional mealtime strategies are needed to break this cycle and avoid more serious long term eating concerns".
The social worker also recommended "webinars and other resource for feeding issues in adopted children that may be helpful in developing different strategies for Saraswati's (as she was known before her adoption) feeding concerns".
https://www.outlookindia.com/newsscr...issues/1175180

Perhaps articles like these, which talk about patience, letting children choose to eat, not forcing, etc....
https://www.adoptivefamilies.com/ado...pted-children/
http://www.chop.edu/conditions-disea...oster-children

I found this article to be especially interesting (see quote below) https://blogs.psychcentral.com/weigh...-katja-rowell/
First there may be a challenge “from” the child, like reflux, cleft palate, a history of a drug or alcohol exposure, or any condition that leads to pain, discomfort or mechanical difficulties with eating.
Second is environmental factors: a child who is not attached to a care-taker won’t eat well, a child who has experienced abuse or neglect around feeding will be more challenging to feed. For example, an eighteen month-old who has only had a bottle with thickened liquids will be behind in her oral-motor skills.
Often, there is a combination of factors. Perhaps a child was punished by withholding food, or only was exposed to a limited range of foods and so has anxieties around eating. Stress, chaos, anxiety, poverty and food insecurity play a big role in shaping a child’s early relationship with food. These are occurrences that are simply more common in the more vulnerable population of children in foster care or who were adopted.

What this makes me think is that feeding issues can develop as a response to abuse, and feeding issues can lead to a cycle of control and punishment. JMO
 
osu said:
K-9 Handlers Who Found Sherin Mathews Share Their Story

~snip
Sunday, five pairs of volunteers and dogs from MARK9 responded to another request from Richardson police to search for Sherin again. Searchers say the weather conditions were ideal. Overnight rain along with a breezy and humid morning helped dogs pick up the scent.

One K-9 led her handler to a field north of the Mathews home and eventually to the culvert where investigators found the small child's body.

"She started doing it from a long way off, and it wasn't an area she was supposed to be looking in, but that's how it concluded," said Seevers, of the K-9's path. "She found her way there. One of the things we have to do is we have to believe in them and she took us there."
~snip

More at link:
http://www.nbcdfw.com/news/local/K-...?_osource=SocialFlowFB_DFWBrand#ixzz4wiL5aNCb
Click to expand...
So, literally it was K9's and their handlers that found her...... instead of LE?

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i8mypaint said:
This is what I don’t get either, she left the orphanage eating and drinking normally and then this... It just doesn’t make sense.


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Click to expand...

I believe that there are multiple things going on. One is that the information from the Indian authorities has slant towards them saying that they did everything right on their end. According to one earlier account (in one of the Indian newspapers I recall), there was a description of Sherin's eager participation in receiving milk, noting that they only had enough for a limited number of children.

Pictures from the orphanage or the adoption celebration show a child whose head looks somewhat disproportional (large) to the body. This to me reinforces the accounts (most recent in the Social Worker's adoption follow-up report) that point to malnourishment at the time of adoption. Also, multiple posts here have suggested that children in Indian orphanages, or orphanages in many countries where caring resources are limited and stretched, develop various expectations about food--that there won't be enough, that they have to eat quickly (or take a bottle quickly) before the caregiver has to move on to another child. So, they may have seen a child who ate well as it was available, but still wasn't getting enough nourishment.

There has been a lot of speculation about the possibility of some emergent swallowing disorder. Could be. It is also not infrequent for children adopted either from orphanages or neglectful homes to carry scars forward in the form of eating disorders, including hoarding of food.

Further, parents who tend to be success-driven or oriented in their own lives may have difficulty in giving children appropriate space to work through problems. Which leads to my own personal theory, which is that mealtime may have become something of a battleground at home owing to legitimate concerns around malnourishment, growth and development. Of course, this only makes things worse. Many parents (and teachers, relatives and onlookers) subscribe to the belief that "good" parents are able to "make" their children do what they are supposed to. Many believe strongly in corporal punishment.

Not saying this to give anyone an excuse, Merely trying to paste together the things we do know into some kind of cohesive pattern.
 
osu said:
K-9 Handlers Who Found Sherin Mathews Share Their Story

~snip
Sunday, five pairs of volunteers and dogs from MARK9 responded to another request from Richardson police to search for Sherin again. Searchers say the weather conditions were ideal. Overnight rain along with a breezy and humid morning helped dogs pick up the scent.

One K-9 led her handler to a field north of the Mathews home and eventually to the culvert where investigators found the small child's body.

"She started doing it from a long way off, and it wasn't an area she was supposed to be looking in, but that's how it concluded," said Seevers, of the K-9's path. "She found her way there. One of the things we have to do is we have to believe in them and she took us there."
~snip

More at link:
http://www.nbcdfw.com/news/local/K-...?_osource=SocialFlowFB_DFWBrand#ixzz4wiL5aNCb
Click to expand...
This part stuck in my head and made me wonder how this works. For the dog to pick up the scent does that mean she followed a trail of where Sherin had been— as in walked or had been carried— or just that the dog could pick up the scent from that far off? I have a coonhound, and he can smell from a distance, but not that distance unless there’s a scent trail to follow, but he’s not a trained dog or anything.

ETA: HAD been carried. I don’t know why I wrote hadn’t.
 
Margo/Mom said:
I believe that there are multiple things going on. One is that the information from the Indian authorities has slant towards them saying that they did everything right on their end. According to one earlier account (in one of the Indian newspapers I recall), there was a description of Sherin's eager participation in receiving milk, noting that they only had enough for a limited number of children.

Pictures from the orphanage or the adoption celebration show a child whose head looks somewhat disproportional (large) to the body. This to me reinforces the accounts (most recent in the Social Worker's adoption follow-up report) that point to malnourishment at the time of adoption. Also, multiple posts here have suggested that children in Indian orphanages, or orphanages in many countries where caring resources are limited and stretched, develop various expectations about food--that there won't be enough, that they have to eat quickly (or take a bottle quickly) before the caregiver has to move on to another child. So, they may have seen a child who ate well as it was available, but still wasn't getting enough nourishment.

There has been a lot of speculation about the possibility of some emergent swallowing disorder. Could be. It is also not infrequent for children adopted either from orphanages or neglectful homes to carry scars forward in the form of eating disorders, including hoarding of food.

Further, parents who tend to be success-driven or oriented in their own lives may have difficulty in giving children appropriate space to work through problems. Which leads to my own personal theory, which is that mealtime may have become something of a battleground at home owing to legitimate concerns around malnourishment, growth and development. Of course, this only makes things worse. Many parents (and teachers, relatives and onlookers) subscribe to the belief that "good" parents are able to "make" their children do what they are supposed to. Many believe strongly in corporal punishment.

Not saying this to give anyone an excuse, Merely trying to paste together the things we do know into some kind of cohesive pattern.
Click to expand...
IIRC: She was eager for the milk, there was only enough for 50 children.

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Each time I hear about Sherin and eating difficulties I think back to what my mother told me. I was the only child of older parents. She used to tell me I was a "terrible" eater. If there was a food that I would eat my parents would make sure there was plenty of it. Of course, by that time it was no longer something I wanted. She mentioned it to the pediatrician who wisely told her he had never seen a child willingly starve themselves, back off and I would be fine. (Note this was back in the late 50's, that school of thought has probably changed, by now) As a child I was always smaller than the other kids. That was the "norm" for me. Obviously I didn't starve to death and am still here to tell the story. I have always been a person that eats when I'm hungry not necessarily because it's "meal time". Just a thought on Sherin's "eating problems".
 
Margo/Mom said:
I believe that there are multiple things going on. One is that the information from the Indian authorities has slant towards them saying that they did everything right on their end. According to one earlier account (in one of the Indian newspapers I recall), there was a description of Sherin's eager participation in receiving milk, noting that they only had enough for a limited number of children.

Pictures from the orphanage or the adoption celebration show a child whose head looks somewhat disproportional (large) to the body. This to me reinforces the accounts (most recent in the Social Worker's adoption follow-up report) that point to malnourishment at the time of adoption. Also, multiple posts here have suggested that children in Indian orphanages, or orphanages in many countries where caring resources are limited and stretched, develop various expectations about food--that there won't be enough, that they have to eat quickly (or take a bottle quickly) before the caregiver has to move on to another child. So, they may have seen a child who ate well as it was available, but still wasn't getting enough nourishment.

There has been a lot of speculation about the possibility of some emergent swallowing disorder. Could be. It is also not infrequent for children adopted either from orphanages or neglectful homes to carry scars forward in the form of eating disorders, including hoarding of food.

Further, parents who tend to be success-driven or oriented in their own lives may have difficulty in giving children appropriate space to work through problems. Which leads to my own personal theory, which is that mealtime may have become something of a battleground at home owing to legitimate concerns around malnourishment, growth and development. Of course, this only makes things worse. Many parents (and teachers, relatives and onlookers) subscribe to the belief that "good" parents are able to "make" their children do what they are supposed to. Many believe strongly in corporal punishment.

Not saying this to give anyone an excuse, Merely trying to paste together the things we do know into some kind of cohesive pattern.
Click to expand...

Most excellent post. Thanks for all of this thinking. I think you are accurate on so many levels.
 
CanadianWells said:
This part stuck in my head and made me wonder how this works. For the dog to pick up the scent does that mean she followed a trail of where Sherin had been— as in walked or hadn’t been carried— or just that the dog could pick up the scent from that far off? I have a coonhound, and he can smell from a distance, but not that distance unless there’s a scent trail to follow.
Click to expand...
Just Wow

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Maybe Sherin was fretting for her "nani" back in India? When human beings grieve for someone they develop eating/appetite problems. No one knows how Sherin would of felt about all that because she was too young to verbalise her feelings to that extent.
 
CanadianWells said:
This part stuck in my head and made me wonder how this works. For the dog to pick up the scent does that mean she followed a trail of where Sherin had been— as in walked or hadn’t been carried— or just that the dog could pick up the scent from that far off? I have a coonhound, and he can smell from a distance, but not that distance unless there’s a scent trail to follow.
Click to expand...

I was wondering the same thing. Could it be the dog picked up on the scent of the person who carried Sherin to the culvert?
 
crelisacorder said:
So, literally it was K9's and their handlers that found her...... instead of LE?

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Click to expand...

LE brought in the K-9 unit, I do believe, possibly because they expected that the rain might have enhanced scents. Also, the handler said they were supposed to be searching a different area (not the culvert), so, likely their was some evidence (type of grass found in the Acura tires, or on WM's shoes, or something along those lines, perhaps?)
 
georgiajean said:
I was wondering the same thing. Could it be the dog picked up on the scent of the person who carried Sherin to the culvert?
Click to expand...

From what i know of cadaver dogs they are specifically trained in detecting cadaver scent only.
 
crelisacorder said:
So, literally it was K9's and their handlers that found her...... instead of LE?

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Click to expand...

I think the K-9 volunteers were being directed by Richardson LE to different areas (near the Mathews home), that they wanted them to search. But yes, I think it was the K-9's and their handlers who actually found her.

From the same article:

MARK9 assisted Richardson police in several prior searches for Sherin Mathews as police looked in wooded areas near the Mathews family home, helping police rule out certain spots and refocus on others.


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Karinna said:
From what i know of cadaver dogs they are specifically trained in detecting cadaver scent only.
Click to expand...
Right. Cadaver dogs. I forgot that bit in my comment earlier. But from what I’ve seen in other cases, they can pick up transfer scent too— like in a car were a body was, etc. So perhaps the scent could be carried on a person too? I don’t know. Just seems like a big distance, but I know they are amazing. It makes my idea that WM dropped her down that drain they were searching a little muddier.
 
Scarlett12 said:
What? While only in her home?

If something was bothering her throat and or stomach it didn’t magically get better when she was away from home.. unless she was in a bad situation in her home.


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Click to expand...

Exactly. That's what I'm saying. Something was being done to her that was irritating her throat or stomach in that home.
 
CanadianWells said:
This part stuck in my head and made me wonder how this works. For the dog to pick up the scent does that mean she followed a trail of where Sherin had been— as in walked or had been carried— or just that the dog could pick up the scent from that far off? I have a coonhound, and he can smell from a distance, but not that distance unless there’s a scent trail to follow, but he’s not a trained dog or anything.

ETA: HAD been carried. I don’t know why I wrote hadn’t.
Click to expand...

They can even follow a scent if a person was moved in a car! Remember, that was done in the Laci Peterson trial?
 
CanadianWells said:
Right. Cadaver dogs. I forgot that bit in my comment earlier. But from what I’ve seen in other cases, they can pick up transfer scent too— like in a car were a body was, etc. So perhaps the scent could be carried on a person too? I don’t know. Just seems like a big distance, but I know they are amazing. It makes my idea that WM dropped her down that drain they were searching a little muddier.
Click to expand...

Yes if the cadaver scent is on a person's clothing, vehicle or wherever else it can be detected the dogs will alert to that scent. And i agree they are amazing animals.
 
Scarlett12 said:
One thing that’s been bothering me is the report that this sweet girl had eating problems while in the home yet was fine outside of it.

This is weird, to be honest. I’ve dealt with children and eating issues due to employment at a daycare-preschool. When a child had food issues it was 24/7. It didn’t go away due to location UNLESS it was a mental issue.

I can’t help thinking that food was used as a punishment for little Sherin or that she regarded food in the home as “bad”. Meaning was she given food after abuse, or abused then given food?

She probably wouldn’t have that fear outside of the home, she would have felt safe and had no issues eating.


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Click to expand...

I'm also wondering if food was withheld from her unless she drank her milk first. How many hours was this child possibly made to sit there until she drank her milk? Maybe he got tired of it and force fed her and then just smothered her? I'm just thinking out loud and this is just my opinion. But, if this scenario is even a little bit true, everyone in that house would have known about it. JMO
 
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