Found Deceased TX - Sherin Mathews, 3, Richardson, 7 Oct 2017 #6 *Arrest*

dms said:

Choked.

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Lol. That’s about the third time I’ve done that. My old English teacher would plotz. :blushing:

Margo/Mom said:

I cannot imagine that any professional would recommend force feeding. But they might have stressed the importance of frequent feedings. If the professional was medical, rather than behavioral, they might have addressed the nutritional aspects but missed out on factors that interfered with eating.

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Three babies in our family had that horrible regurgitation issue that resembled Linda Blair's pea soup scene in the Exorcist. One had failure to thrive because it was so bad. All are of normal weight/height range, and happy and healthy now, but it was working to find the right formula, the right formula thickness, and the right amount, at feedings. With the one who had it the worst a round-the-clock feeding schedule was put in place, but was never forced (Just try to get the baby to eat small amounts, several times per day, and through the night, at regularly scheduled feedings).

Even if WM felt he should force feed Sherin, and did so to the point that she choked, that at least shows concern, that he was making her eat. However, after she choked, there was an utter lack of concern, not even enough to rush her to his wife for help (according to his story). So, which is true? I must make her eat to thrive? I could not care less if she chokes to death while I stand by and watch? It makes no sense.

My spouse got choked, at a festival, this summer. At first I just thought it was coughing and then realized! I was asking should I go get someone?!?! (I can't perform the Heimlich Maneuver) Should I hit you on the back?! My spouse waved "No!" (smh). A man sitting near us even asked if he could help! (spouse waves, No.) About the time I was getting ready to give it a shot at the HM, "No" or not, the food became dislodged, from all the coughing, and gagging.

A complete stranger was going to help my spouse, yet WM didn't care enough to rush their child to his wife, her mother, a nurse? Being so very concerned about her getting her milk, at 3:00 a.m., that he "physically assisted" her, somehow doesn't ring true.

I'm sorry if I missed it somewhere, but has LE said anything about her being found in the culvert but inside a bag, or wrapped in anything? Did they say anything about her clothing? Her shoes?

If she was not wrapped in anything, I am not sure that she would have been relocated after very much time, unless she were placed in a freezer or something to slow the decomposition.

Also, I don't believe for even a second that WM was assisting her in "drinking her milk" at 3 am in the garage. That is preposterous. Why would you take a kid into the GARAGE at 3 am to get her to drink her protein drink? Is it because she would cry and scream about it and you didn't want the mother to her and wake up? If so, that's probably an indication that you shouldn't be doing that to the poor kid and should ask further advice from the pediatrician. But of course he wouldn't have done that because according to him, even when his daughter supposedly choked and expired basically right in front of him, he didn't even have the sense to contact anyone for medical assistance and try to save her life. Instead he felt the need to do a load of wash. That .

I wonder how he explained that to Sherin's mother. I wonder if he had to explain that to her, actually. Oh, that's right, at that time his story was that he left her outside by a tree and then she went missing for hours while he did the laundry... I wonder what he was needing to wash away.

rsd1200 said:

The only thing that I think is possibly true out of both his stories, is that "milk" somehow figures in, and that Sherin died. The garage part makes no sense. I know most of ya'll have seen the video that shows the interior of their garage, with only one car in there. After seeing the video, it makes the garage story either, even less likely, or more sinister (Garage video is on Maria Guerrero's FB site, with News 5, dated 10/18/2017)

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BBM


Here is:
The garage video slow motion so you can really check out the garage.[video]https://drive.google.com/open?id=0B2WO0nov1zHERmZON3U2enQ1Tm8[/video]

the garage video reg speed [video]https://drive.google.com/open?id=0B2WO0nov1zHEQUx1d19CMW4xeDA[/video]

and just for good measure since it is mentioned so often the sling video (this one looks like Sini really loved her [video]https://drive.google.com/open?id=0B2WO0nov1zHEQ0c2WTBsU2h0dTg[/video]

I do love my IPad it makes playing with videos fun. LOL

MarisaS1985 said:

I didn't mean to imply down to the hour, but bugs are very accurate within a time frame. We allegedly have four hours from the time the Acura left until LE was called, if Sherin was dumped immediately as in that one hour frame, we will know based on the bugs... But what I was responding to was the suggestion she may have been dropped with someone else still alive and then dumped at the culvert when she finally perished. The bugs definitely would be able to say if Sherin passed when we believe she was dumped versus several days or even two weeks later when her body was found. Basically, if Sherin was dumped I'd guess within the 12 hours that from Friday evening until Saturday morning that should be easily seen based on the bugs life cycle... Same as if she died in the day or two days etc after... You can't make the bugs get older faster and you can't make them younger. The weather was tracked esp temperature and a forensic entomologist will be able to take those numbers into the life cycle of the bugs and come up with a fairly accurate time of death. Yes temp etc can speed up the life cycle or make things develop slower, but that's part of the forensics in this case...

People are worried based on the wording of WM saying something like he believed she had died and removed her from the house, that she may have been alive and removed to the custody of a secondary person and been there several days before she succumbed to death... So time of death is really important in deciding if WM should be charged with murder or not...

If only this was a tv show, case would be solved, Sherin would've been found alive right on time and it would have all happened the first day...

Jmo


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There is no way we are going to know based on bugs the exact hour that she died. It doesn't work that way. Especially considering body was decomposing for while before found. If the time of death is way off (by days or weeks) then perhaps bugs could be used to figure that out, but I don't think there is any chance that she was dropped with somebody else while still alive, and there has been no suggestion of that.

Grouchymom said:

BBM


Here is:
The garage video slow motion so you can really check out the garage.[video]https://drive.google.com/open?id=0B2WO0nov1zHERmZON3U2enQ1Tm8[/video]

the garage video reg speed [video]https://drive.google.com/open?id=0B2WO0nov1zHEQUx1d19CMW4xeDA[/video]

and just for good measure since it is mentioned so often the sling video (this one looks like Sini really loved her [video]https://drive.google.com/open?id=0B2WO0nov1zHEQ0c2WTBsU2h0dTg[/video]

I do love my IPad it makes playing with videos fun. LOL

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Is Sini the lady with the glasses who pops her head into the video or the girl next to Sherin? Thanks.

Some insight into determining time of death here.

https://www.sfu.ca/~ganderso/forensicentomology.htm

"The second method,*that of using maggot age and development can give a date of death accurate to a day or less, or a range of days, and is used in the first few weeks after death."

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vmmking said:

Some insight into determining time of death here.

https://www.sfu.ca/~ganderso/forensicentomology.htm

"The second method,*that of using maggot age and development can give a date of death accurate to a day or less, or a range of days, and is used in the first few weeks after death."

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You beat me to it! Here is another link talking about the different bugs and how each life cycle can help determine time of death with great accuracy...

The links don't look the same and haven't clicked yours yet to know if they go to the same page. Forensic entomology seems to be highly underrated for some reason so I hope ppl will click and get a better understanding of how important bugs and bacteria are into determining time of death, and even if there may have been open injuries or wounds!

Even if the autopsy itself is inconclusive the bugs will tell a story that could be very important, especially if Sherin died somewhere else or if her body was in a very different location. Like in marshy area.

http://www.sfu.museum/forensics/eng/pg_media-media_pg/entomologie-entomology/


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Grouchymom said:

BBM


Here is:
The garage video slow motion so you can really check out the garage.[video]https://drive.google.com/open?id=0B2WO0nov1zHERmZON3U2enQ1Tm8[/video]

the garage video reg speed [video]https://drive.google.com/open?id=0B2WO0nov1zHEQUx1d19CMW4xeDA[/video]

and just for good measure since it is mentioned so often the sling video (this one looks like Sini really loved her [video]https://drive.google.com/open?id=0B2WO0nov1zHEQ0c2WTBsU2h0dTg[/video]

I do love my IPad it makes playing with videos fun. LOL

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Yeah, this is nothing like one of my friend's almost cozy garage with tool benches and chairs, a radio, fridge, basically a place you could comfortably hang out for a bit.

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Grouchymom said:

BBM


Here is:
The garage video slow motion so you can really check out the garage.[video]https://drive.google.com/open?id=0B2WO0nov1zHERmZON3U2enQ1Tm8[/video]

the garage video reg speed [video]https://drive.google.com/open?id=0B2WO0nov1zHEQUx1d19CMW4xeDA[/video]

and just for good measure since it is mentioned so often the sling video (this one looks like Sini really loved her [video]https://drive.google.com/open?id=0B2WO0nov1zHEQ0c2WTBsU2h0dTg[/video]

I do love my IPad it makes playing with videos fun. LOL

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My thought is based on the whole "eating outside the home" that had come up, that perhaps she loved to eat in the car, so they went and sat in the car? WM may have grown tired/bored with her still playing around and taking her time, and "assisted" her... IMO the fact we haven't seen another search on the garage implies they already knew where she died. Jmo

ETA is the back alley paved? I thought it was gravel but could be wrong, regardless, that is the cleanest garage i think I've ever seen, the floor doesn't appear to have a trace of dirt. And two cars going in and out regularly should leave dirt or tracks even though the floor appears to be epoxied and easy to clean... Not saying they did a cleanup for five hours, but am wondering about control and having everything spotless after looking at the garage floor... JMO


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Grouchymom said:

BBM


Here is:
The garage video slow motion so you can really check out the garage.[video]https://drive.google.com/open?id=0B2WO0nov1zHERmZON3U2enQ1Tm8[/video]

the garage video reg speed [video]https://drive.google.com/open?id=0B2WO0nov1zHEQUx1d19CMW4xeDA[/video]

and just for good measure since it is mentioned so often the sling video (this one looks like Sini really loved her [video]https://drive.google.com/open?id=0B2WO0nov1zHEQ0c2WTBsU2h0dTg[/video]

I do love my IPad it makes playing with videos fun. LOL

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Thank you for the links
It does not look like Sini at all in the sling video with baby Sherin. In my opinion, I don't think that is Sini. Is it confirmed to be her?
Very endearing video of baby Sherin

MarisaS1985 said:

My thought is based on the whole "eating outside the home" that had come up, that perhaps she loved to eat in the car, so they went and sat in the car? WM may have grown tired/bored with her still playing around and taking her time, and "assisted" her... IMO the fact we haven't seen another search on the garage implies they already knew where she died. Jmo

ETA is the back alley paved? I thought it was gravel but could be wrong, regardless, that is the cleanest garage i think I've ever seen, the floor doesn't appear to have a trace of dirt. And two cars going in and out regularly should leave dirt or tracks even though the floor appears to be epoxied and easy to clean... Not saying they did a cleanup for five hours, but am wondering about control and having everything spotless after looking at the garage floor... JMO


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I had also wondered whether Sherin’s father was trying to feed her in the car.

jens said:

I had also wondered whether Sherin’s father was trying to feed her in the car.

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I have a hard time with the theory that he was trying to get her to drink milk in the car. Spilled milk would be horrendous to clean in a vehicle. With seeing how clean the garage was, I can't imagine him willing to get the milk all over the car while "assisting" her drinking the milk.

This whole 'assisting her to drink' thing makes me nuts. How do you 'assist' a 3 yr old to drink? All you can do is pour milk down their throat. Otherwise there is no need for assistance if they are already drinking.

That wording is incorrect/misleading-- because there is no 'assisting' in drinking. If she was actually drinking it, no one would need to assist in any way. She would be drinking on her own.

To 'assist' means he was forcing her to try to swallow the liquid. Sounds like manslaughter at the very least, to me. :jail:

katydid23 said:

This whole 'assisting her to drink' thing makes me nuts. How do you 'assist' a 3 yr old to drink? All you can do is pour milk down their throat. Otherwise there is no need for assistance if they are already drinking.

That wording is incorrect/misleading-- because there is no 'assisting' in drinking. If she was actually drinking it, no one would need to assist in any way. She would be drinking on her own.

To 'assist' means he was forcing her to try to swallow the liquid. Sounds like manslaughter at the very least, to me. :jail:

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Right.
I speculate the autopsy is going to paint a very different picture of what happened. Very.

lonetraveler said:

I have a hard time with the theory that he was trying to get her to drink milk in the car. Spilled milk would be horrendous to clean in a vehicle. With seeing how clean the garage was, I can't imagine him willing to get the milk all over the car while "assisting" her drinking the milk.

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Likewise. Unless he tried feeding her in the Acura which was not in the garage.

katydid23 said:

This whole 'assisting her to drink' thing makes me nuts. How do you 'assist' a 3 yr old to drink? All you can do is pour milk down their throat. Otherwise there is no need for assistance if they are already drinking.

That wording is incorrect/misleading-- because there is no 'assisting' in drinking. If she was actually drinking it, no one would need to assist in any way. She would be drinking on her own.

To 'assist' means he was forcing her to try to swallow the liquid. Sounds like manslaughter at the very least, to me. :jail:

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I hated eating or drinking anything when I was as young as Sherin. I recall my mum trying to force feed me. I would cry and make a huge fuss about eating. She would close my nose and mouth so I don't spit the food out. I would eventually end up vomiting and she would then let go.

I was given a lot of supplements but in no way was I woken up in the middle of the night to be fed.

3 am is very close to the morning. Why not 5 am instead of 3 am? The whole 3am things is just so messed up. The only thing I can think of is Sherin waking up around 3 am crying and him taking her to the garage to soothe her so she doesn't wake up the rest of the house.

lonetraveler said:

I have a hard time with the theory that he was trying to get her to drink milk in the car. Spilled milk would be horrendous to clean in a vehicle. With seeing how clean the garage was, I can't imagine him willing to get the milk all over the car while "assisting" her drinking the milk.

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Unfortunately, none of his stories (the parts we have been told anyway) make any sense, but we don't know his state of mind or frustration. Irrational minds (which clearly he had when he failed to call 911), simply don't leave much room for our speculation to make sense.

In the case of the cars, they all look (from what I have seen) to be pretty meticulously cared for and clean. Maybe he has the cars detailed very regularly. Maybe he has leather interior that wipes easily and also has a blanket that washes up (possibly the laundry?) the floor mats may be the big deep ones we often have in Canada that are made to protect the carpets from ice, snow, salt and melting. They are perfect for keeping spills as well, if your coffee falls to the floor you can pick up the mat and spray it out and not worry about your carpet.

The extreme cleanliness of the garage seems like someone in the house is very controlling and has an everything has a place mentality.

I would LOVE to be one of those people who has a sparkling home at all times but its just not how I am. I did have a roommate once though that was diagnosed with OCD and she cleaned everything, in great detail, to give her a sense of control, it helped with her anxiety. Our relationship worked out simply because while I wasn't a slob I wasn't infringing on her need to clean. To her this really was a need. I remember one time she was washing the floor by hand (like everyday) and she looked up at me and said she was sorry and offered to let me do it if I really wanted to. I asked her if she would want to redo it if I did and she said yes that it would bug her for the rest of the day...

So I am not saying that the Mathews necessarily had an abusive relationship or anything like that, but I do feel that one or both feel a need for control, whether they do things themselves, or expect perfection from others, even in cleaning/organizing from one another.

From my own observation via MSM the past three weeks, I would say they BOTH have a need to feel in control and that is why Sini hasn't been very cooperative, it likely gives her a sense of control, especially right now as her entire world has fallen down.
WM has shown a need to control right from the immediate need to "clean up" Sherin after she passed, then do laundry etc (if the laundry story is still true?) and then right down to when the body was found and him marching into LE knowing what he wanted to be photographed in in MSM, clean shaven, nice shirt, nice pants, etc - and giving the confession he wanted to give, knowing he would be arrested and still maintain control to a degree how all of that went down. Had he waited he may still be free, he may have been free for several more weeks or months as they go through the autopsy and evidence and create a case, but to someone who needs to feel in control, that would be horrendous and a torture in itself to never know at what time on which day they might come for you...

Clearly this is all my own opinion and speculation.

edimmu said:

I hated eating or drinking anything when I was as young as Sherin. I recall my mum trying to force feed me. I would cry and make a huge fuss about eating. She would close my nose and mouth so I don't spit the food out. I would eventually end up vomiting and she would then let go.

I was given a lot of supplements but in no way was I woken up in the middle of the night to be fed.

3 am is very close to the morning. Why not 5 am instead of 3 am? The whole 3am things is just so messed up. The only thing I can think of is Sherin waking up around 3 am crying and him taking her to the garage to soothe her so she doesn't wake up the rest of the house.

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Regarding the bold section, I was also trying to rationalize it as maybe Sherin waking up, possibly WM says he'll go and Sini goes back to sleep. Then maybe rationalizing the garage by putting Sherin in the car and saying "let's pretend we're going on a journey". But the latter implies reasonably calm and caring, so how could that switch to standing back and watching her die and then hiding the body and lie about what had happened?

When I went into hospital for an op earlier this year, when I awoke in recovery I asked for water. The nurse gave me a cup and I took about 5ml in my mouth and it went down the wrong way...but I was in a too-flat reclining position and still so sore from the op that I couldn't cough properly, so the nurse can't have noticed I was choking on it and just asked me if I wanted more. I indicated "no" and got on with choking quietly, obviously not seriously and it did settle okay within a few minutes.

Was Sherin reclined/laying down as he helped her drink and so she choked quietly as I did, and he didn't notice until it was too late? But then that would be a tragic accident and no reason to hide the body?

Did I read correctly a few pages back? Sherin's body has been released?

If so, should we hear COD soon?


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