NY-Long Island-4 bodies on Beach-Possible Serial Killer-Dec 2010 #2

After a ton of research and a couple of strokes of luck, internetgirl101 and I seem to have uncovered some background information on a couple of the girls. First, here is a link to one of Barthelemy's ads:
http://www.escortpost.com/escorts/26941_chloe_in_manhattan_the_bronx_new_york_i_m_a_very_sexy_blonde_that_would_love_to_come_over_and_play/

If you google different combinations of words from her ads, you'll find ads she posted on other sites, under other names (so far we think she used "Chloe" and "Megan")


There are also several sites for johns where they post reviews of escorts they've had encounters with. One of these sites for LI is:
http://www.longislanderotic.com/longislanderotic/forum/

You have to be a member to read the posts but there is a thread on there about the murders and a thread about Costello. I'm not going to go into too much detail because it's second-hand information, you can go on there and read it for yourself, but some of the johns are claiming that in July she robbed a few of her clients by having them come to her apartment, pay her, and then having a couple of guys come out with baseball bats and demand the john leave the apartment. A few of the men on the board talk about getting revenge on her but for many reasons, I doubt that's what got her killed in the end. As with Barthelemy, if you use the words and phone number on the copy of the ad they posted in that forum, you will find more ads that Costello posted for her services on other sites. She used the name "Carolina"

Another notable review site with a thread about the murders is:
http://www.utopiaguide.com/forums/showthread.php?t=42531&page=2

I have not had the chance to look through the forums extensively and I am hoping that posting this information on here will get us some help with the searches. It's a lot to go through and new sets of eyes are always appreciated. Feel free to PM me if you want more information.

I have tons of thoughts and theories based on this new info but I'm not ready to put them all out there yet, too exhausted... long day at work and gloomy weather here in NY.

Once again, this information was gathered by both internetgirl101 and myself, so internetgirl, if you have anything to add, definitely do so.

Best wishes to everyone.

Mia said:

Hi everyone! I was directed to this thread from another WS member, who thought I may be of assistance to you guys in some small way. I am around the age of the murdered girls, live in NYC (Manhattan), and in the past did independent 'escorting' through CL, so know quite a bit about the 'scene' and am not shy about answering any questions you may have LOL. I also have a few girlfriends who do or did the same thing - we're all white, middle class, educated (we all have advanced degrees), upwardly mobile individuals. None of us, as far as I know, were sexually abused as children, and none of us were coerced into it - it is a choice we all made on our own.
Anyway, since i now have a more socially accepted, 'regular' job I'm pretty busy these days but will try to check in and answer any questions anyone has, if you have any.

Surprisingly I know very little about this case but am going to go back and read the first thread to get caught up, but from a cursory read of the information available I feel this is definitely a john who killed these girls, not a pimp, and he is one of the types who hates prostitutes, for whatever reason. I came across a couple of these types during the 3 years I was an escort, and ran far away fast but to this day am continually harassed by one of them through e-mail - what he has written to me through email (I never actually met this guy, thank goodness, only talked to him on the phone and corresponded briefly through e-mail) reminds me of the way the killer harassed Melissa's family.

Anyway, it's a wonderful thing you all are doing to help get justice for these young girls, which they certainly deserve, and again, I'd love to help in any way if I can.

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Mia

:welcome:

Please, Please, and more pretty pleases report this person that is emailing you for your own safety as well as others

As well thank you for sharing your experiences with us

Wow great find, should have realized there is a bunch of fellows who are regulars with a different forum. Who could blame them they don't want this Murderer[sp] out. It seems like LE has a lot of work but they can back track through CL or phone records and find the link.

Wheres the info on someone contacting one of the Girls Parents?

Not directly related to this case but I thought that I should post this link: http://www.wesh.com/r/27061257/detail.html

It's about developments in the similar string of murders in Daytona Beach...they found DNA on two of the victims that they believe belongs to the killer. Connected or not, it's a very similar case. I hope they get a hit from the DNA and catch the guy!

Is there some sort of Timeline? The first girl was missing for a long time. The reason the Girls use CL is so they don't need a Pimp, I think. if they worked for a Escort Service they would get a cut of the $$. It might be safer but less money. Some kind of timeline would be good.

Righteous1, I began posting a timeline on thread 1 but it was mostly general information. I will try and locate it for you.

In the meantime, Amandareckonwith has all the news stories archived for us in her above link.

http://s296.photobucket.com/albums/mm166/crankycrankerson/Ocean Parkway Murders -NY-/

It is a great resource for us and thanks to Amandareckonwith for her dedication in keeping us organized.

I have been busy lately and haven't had much time for posting or helping with research but i am reading along and keeping up with all the great brainstorming. You Sleuths are the best!

wm

I did go thru some on that link Thanks. There is all the news clips all the family's it's very sad and makes you feel that they were really just girls with problems. Welcome to the Human Condition. the News keeps calling them Hookers it's really f*&^d up. I thought they would have come beyond that but what do I know. Sex Sells. I figured a breakdown of the facts and so forth. they will catch this Guy they may even have some idea who he is already. CL, Cellphones Websites all are traceable today. It's only a matter of Time. The sooner the better .

7-07....Maureen Barnes was the first to disappear of the four bodies found. She was headed to NYC and planned to return the next day per reports. 4'11" 105 lbs.

7-12-09...Melissa Barthelemy is the 2nd missing girl. Calls to her family were made from her cell phone on 7-16-09...7-19-09...7-23-09. The calls were made from midtown Manhatten near Penn Station, Madison Square Garden and 'by' Times Square. 4'10", 95 lbs.

06-10 Megan Waterman... young looking female. 5'5", 150 lbs.

9-20-10 Amber Costello....lived in Wilmington, NC and has and ex Husband living in the area. 4'10, 100 lbs.

There is much information missing here. This is just general info from the notes I have taken and perhaps we can add to the timeline as much has been learned since. so perhaps we can amend it as we trudge along in our sleuthing.

Has anyone else besides myself considered the thought that this SK may be a female who is posing as a male online?

I have no experience with this business at all. However, if it were me and my contact was a female in setting up the 'appointment', it would give me a false sense of security. I am only broaching this possibility because all but one of the victims would be considered 'of small stature' in today's world and a larger woman could easily have overtaken any of these young women. This is JMO based on my own small stature.

Also, the fact that these women were found enclosed in burlap bags bothers me. I feel like this is the biggest clue we have at this point in time. Why were those bags used to dispose of the bodies?

Here is why I ask such questions and it is kind of personal so my apoligies for being off topic.....

I was helping my daughter move yesterday and we were in a quandry trying to figure out how to move her TV from her bedroom to her car. She suggested that we use a sleeping bag that was left on the floor to move it because it's so heavy. We 'walked' the TV onto it and then dragged it out of her house to the garage and lifted it (still in the sleeping bag, mind you) into her car. I was surprised how much easier and quicker this was as opposed to carrying the darned thing!

I thought of this case during the process and those blasted burlap bags and how much easier it is to move heavy things when dragging them. Especially if one is of small stature!

My thoughts and opinions for today!

wm

Waltzinmatilda, those burlap bags are of great interest to me too. We discussed them early in this case, and I believe there was some good ideas passed around about the perp being involved in landscaping or something in order to have access to that kind of burlap. That makes sense to me, but the fact that burlap bags were used to dump 4 bodies over what appears to be a three year time span just seems to indicate there was some greater significance to the burlap. Your analysis of using a sleeping bag to move your daughter's TV is great. Even a 98 pound woman's dead weight can be an awkward package to remove from an apartment/home/motel to a deserted beach. I would think that the perp would have used a blanket, a sheet, a bedspread..... something besides burlap during the three year period. I still believe there is some other significance to the burlap to this guy.

Thanks, That's a much longer time span then I realized a very long time. they all went missing when the Weather was warm. That Call may not mean anything it's hard to tell. But MSG and Times Square are right in the Middle of Manhattan, traveling from Manhattan all the way out to the Island is not something a City Person does. I mean if you hang out in the City and Know who's who on the Street it's because your from the City. Going to long island is the same as going to Florida. Everything is in the City already. People come into Manhattan. The Girls I could understand going out to the Island to meet someone, outcall. One thing The Train that goes out to the island Leaves from MSG/ Penn Station. As for the Burlap Bag where did that info come from? That's not something LE is going Leak, each Girl 4 Burlap Bags. Or was it one of the girls? it is a clue, a big one. If you have a House on the Island there would be a reason to have that type of Bag even if it was old, the bag. Someone in the City isn't going to have that in the Apartment.

Righteous1, The information about the burlap bags is from an article in the case archives link. It is titled 4 Women were Probably victims of Serial Killer, N.Y. officials Say. It is dated Jan 25, 2011 and I found it on pg 2. (Sorry IDK how to bring it over here)

Also, Amber Costello was the only one who lived on LI according to the article. I just wanted to clarify that. (She is originally from Wilmington NC). Hope this helps.

wm

OK thanks, Those Bags could be used for Seafood.

I wonder if the authorities can tell if the bags were used for seafood. It seems like there would be a stench to them but maybe that is the killers MO to cover up decomp odor. It is likely that there are fish remnants in the bags if that is the case, ie. fish scales, oyster shell remnants.

This is a good suggestion righteous1. I have thought that the killer may be a truck or delivery driver with a route from the city to LI or vice versa. Maybe he delivers fish to restaurants and fish markets.

As a matter of fact, my son owns a seafood biz. He delivers NC seafood to the gulf states (he started this biz after the gulf oil spill occured) and has a refrigerated truck.
I will ask him if his different types of seafood is separated into burlap bags.

This killer is mobile for sure based on the calls from the city and the location of the bodies. What would be a better way to transport a dead body than a refrigerated truck?
Great thinking Righteous! I am glad you joined us here.

All MOO

wm

I sent a message to my son via facebook asking him about the burlap sacks. He is en route to AL so I didn't want to distract him from driving that truck by calling

I also asked him if I can have one if he does indeed pack his fish in this way. I am 5' tall and want to see if I can fit into one. Will let you all know when I hear from him but it may be a day or two. Thanks, wm

waltzingmatilda said:

I sent a message to my son via facebook asking him about the burlap sacks. He is en route to AL so I didn't want to distract him from driving that truck by calling

I also asked him if I can have one if he does indeed pack his fish in this way. I am 5' tall and want to see if I can fit into one. Will let you all know when I hear from him but it may be a day or two. Thanks, wm

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Wow, waltzingmatilda, I like your dedication! Let us know what you find out. My question is did they say burlap bags in the reports or just burlap and does burlap come in rolls? I don't know why it would matter exactly and I don't really trust reporters with details like that anyway but I feel like bags vs. rolls would have different uses in different occupations (like clamming vs. landscaping or something). To answer my own question thanks to google, it does come in rolls or bags. I agree that the burlap over the years is EXTREMELY relevant to this case, wish they released more details about it. Was it two or three of the girls in it? I remember hearing it wasn't all of them. I wonder which of them it was (from a timeline perpective). Also, I'm gonna look up how burlap biodegrades... seems like a substance that would almost disappear into the soil after time.

http://www.gardenguides.com/115892-landscape-fabric-alternatives.html

Interesting bit on burlap taken from the above gardening website, bolding added by me because the wording stood out to me:

"Buy burlap by the yard. It won't last as long as landscape fabric but will do the job of allowing moisture to reach the landscaping plants and smothering weeds while allowing the plants to grow. Since the burlap is brown it looks like dirt from a distance and may not need to be covered with mulch to disguise it. Like newspapers, burlap will eventually decompose."

Seems like a "good" (for lack of a better word) substance to use to transport and dispose of a body outside, especially in an area such as the place these women were discovered as it's durable, camouflages with nature, and eventually disappears.

Thanks svpernin! Please let us know what you learn about the burlap. What sizes are the bags? The sizes of the sheets,rolls etc.

The article dated Jan. 25, 2011 on the photobucket archive that Amandareckonwith has compiled for us states......ALL were WRAPPED in burlap. (It's on pg 2 of #17)

If the bodies were WRAPPED, then I would think landscaping. If they were placed in burlap bags, then I lean towards the fishing industry.

I wish we knew more. I don't always trust the media reporting these days. MOO

wm

svpernin said:

http://www.gardenguides.com/115892-landscape-fabric-alternatives.html

Interesting bit on burlap taken from the above gardening website, bolding added by me because the wording stood out to me:

"Buy burlap by the yard. It won't last as long as landscape fabric but will do the job of allowing moisture to reach the landscaping plants and smothering weeds while allowing the plants to grow. Since the burlap is brown it looks like dirt from a distance and may not need to be covered with mulch to disguise it. Like newspapers, burlap will eventually decompose."

Seems like a "good" (for lack of a better word) substance to use to transport and dispose of a body outside, especially in an area such as the place these women were discovered as it's durable, camouflages with nature, and eventually disappears.

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You go svpernin! Great info! This information makes me think someone familiar with landscaping techniques planned the disposals. Perhaps someone who landscapes for a municipality or the state who maintains the roadside growth and has access to a truck and wears a uniform which wouldn't arouse suspicion for bypassing motorists during the disposal.?! Just typing out loud....

I agree it sounds like a 'good' substance to use for such a crime. I will not be surprised to learn, when this perp is caught (and he will be) that this person is also of small stature. JMO.

wm

waltzingmatilda said:

You go svpernin! Great info! This information makes me think someone familiar with landscaping techniques planned the disposals. Perhaps someone who landscapes for a municipality or the state who maintains the roadside growth and has access to a truck and wears a uniform which wouldn't arouse suspicion for bypassing motorists during the disposal.?! Just typing out loud....

I agree it sounds like a 'good' substance to use for such a crime. I will not be surprised to learn, when this perp is caught (and he will be) that this person is also of small stature. JMO.

wm

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ps....apologies for the above run on sentence:innocent: