RULED OUT: Have we found Anna? Possible match to NamUs case UP 9597 - *NO MATCH*

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SideKick said:
After pondering and searching for Purisima Creek photos today, in my heart I find it hard to believe anyone could be swept down along a curvy, snake like and sometimes extremely shallow creek all the way to the ocean. I do realize there was some flooding on the day she disappeared but the entire creek even low areas would have to have been high enough to do so...and without being stuck somewhere in a turn. Joe Ford said he toured the entire creek bed down to the ocean.


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These pictures make it look impossible. But I grew up in the Bay Area, and believe me, those creeks turn into raging rivers when they are flooded. There are often redwood tree trunks that make it to the ocean after larger floods.

What I don't know is just how flooded it was when Anna went missing.
 
jackornaught said:
Um, if this State supposedly lost the DNA, then why are there rule outs for this UID on her NAMUS site?

I'm confused.

Prayers to Anna's family.
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There is nothing to indicate the state "lost" the dna. Please don't perpetuate rumors that the state lost the dna. If you have a link supporting such information, please provide it.

Secondly, we do not know how the rule outs were determined.
In some cases NamUs volunteers review a panel of potential matches and rule out. In other cases the rule outs are determined by the coroner. We currently do not know the basis for which the rule outs listed on NamUs were ruled out. Either of the above scenarios is possible.
 
SideKick said:
After pondering and searching for Purisima Creek photos today, in my heart I find it hard to believe anyone could be swept down along a curvy, snake like and sometimes extremely shallow creek all the way to the ocean. I do realize there was some flooding on the day she disappeared but the entire creek even low areas would have to have been high enough to do so...and without being stuck somewhere in a turn. Joe Ford said he toured the entire creek bed down to the ocean.


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Earlier posts of Joe Ford indicate he was not entirely convinced Anna did not fall into the creek. While the searches were extensive it can not be ruled out with 100% certainty Anna did not fall into the creek. IIRC the detective who initially handled the case indicated he was 90% sure they would have found her if she had fallen into the creek.

Upon re-reading some of Joe Ford's initial posts, he indicated there were area's of such heavy growth they were almost impenetrable.

We've always made the assumption Anna would have made it to the ocean immediately or almost immediately. If she happened to fall into the creek and was caught in an impenetrable area, she may have made her way to the ocean much much later. Many times we have read about remains being found after the natural decomposition process and at that time those remains are usually scattered. It is possible that occured in this case as well. I hated typing that, however that is a possibility and one we had not previously discussed.
 
Cubby said:
There is nothing to indicate the state "lost" the dna. Please don't perpetuate rumors that the state lost the dna. If you have a link supporting such information, please provide it.

Secondly, we do not know how the rule outs were determined.
In some cases NamUs volunteers review a panel of potential matches and rule out. In other cases the rule outs are determined by the coroner. We currently do not know the basis for which the rule outs listed on NamUs were ruled out. Either of the above scenarios is possible.
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See the update to my post:

Didn't mean to perpetuate rumors, or otherwise speak out of turn.
 
I sat here trying to think of something comforting to say and there just aren't any words for something like this. All I can say is that I am praying for Anna's family and I hope that answers are given to them quickly.
 
annemc2 said:
I have tears streaming down my face as I read this. ((Praying for Annasmom and family. ))
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Me, too. I have read Annasmom's book (Searching for Anna) and read all I could about Anna and some others in this case. I just don't know what to say or think at this moment. I can only imagine how her family feels right now.

SideKick said:
After pondering and searching for Purisima Creek photos today, in my heart I find it hard to believe anyone could be swept down along a curvy, snake like and sometimes extremely shallow creek all the way to the ocean. I do realize there was some flooding on the day she disappeared but the entire creek even low areas would have to have been high enough to do so...and without being stuck somewhere in a turn. Joe Ford said he toured the entire creek bed down to the ocean.

(snip)
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I, too, have believed that she did not fall in the creek, although I think it's *possible*. And honestly, that's what I hope happened: if this is Anna - or whoever it is - I hope it was a very unfortunate accident.

Prayers for Annasmom and the family. :hug:
 
Anna's family wants to express heartfelt thanks to the kindhearted and passionate members of Websleuths who have searched so diligently the past six years.
 

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I am able to jump on the computer briefly to say a couple of things:

1) Certainly, this is not the happy ending that we were hoping for (and still are hoping for). But our goal, ultimately, is to find out what happened to Anna. Whatever happened in 1973 is whatever happened - the truth is what we have been seeking.

2) One clarification: The coroner has not yet sent the sample to a private lab. She is working on getting the sample from the CA DOJ and authorization to send the jaw bone "outside" of the system. This should occur in a week or two. Once the sample is sent to a private lab, then the clock will start "ticking".

3) One concern with DNA samples is contamination - someone briefly touching a sample improperly will spoil it beyond use. Now imagine a sample soaking in a virtual stew of organic matter (the ocean) for 33 years. This is likely why a private lab using "state of the art" technology is required in this case. Hopefully, a private lab will have a quicker turnaround than the DOJ's overworked lab.

Offers of condolences are premature at this point - let's let the pros do their job and wait for the results. My heart is telling me that this is likely Anna, but I have seen too many results that varied wildly from my expectations to jump to conclusions.

I do want to express a special thanks to Cubby for making the possible link between this UID case and Anna. I also want to thank her for her discretion in how she approached myself and the family before posting anything here - obviously, this is a rough period and I appreciate her sensitivity in the handling of this matter.
 
Wow... I really am not sure whether to hope it is her so that her family can finally have some closure, or whether to hope it's not... Annasmom, please know that I am here if there is anything I can do.
 
I read about Anna's case some time ago.

I really hope this new find brings about closure for her family. :(
 
Dr. Doogie said:
I am able to jump on the computer briefly to say a couple of things:

1) Certainly, this is not the happy ending that we were hoping for (and still are hoping for). But our goal, ultimately, is to find out what happened to Anna. Whatever happened in 1973 is whatever happened - the truth is what we have been seeking.

2) One clarification: The coroner has not yet sent the sample to a private lab. She is working on getting the sample from the CA DOJ and authorization to send the jaw bone "outside" of the system. This should occur in a week or two. Once the sample is sent to a private lab, then the clock will start "ticking".

3) One concern with DNA samples is contamination - someone briefly touching a sample improperly will spoil it beyond use. Now imagine a sample soaking in a virtual stew of organic matter (the ocean) for 33 years. This is likely why a private lab using "state of the art" technology is required in this case. Hopefully, a private lab will have a quicker turnaround than the DOJ's overworked lab.

Offers of condolences are premature at this point - let's let the pros do their job and wait for the results. My heart is telling me that this is likely Anna, but I have seen too many results that varied wildly from my expectations to jump to conclusions.

I do want to express a special thanks to Cubby for making the possible link between this UID case and Anna. I also want to thank her for her discretion in how she approached myself and the family before posting anything here - obviously, this is a rough period and I appreciate her sensitivity in the handling of this matter.
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Thank you for the update and clarification regarding the status of the private lab, Doogie. I appreciate it very much.

I also agree, it is too soon for condolences. I've seen possible matches that I was certain were going to be a match, but were ultimately ruled out. I've also seen dentals rule someone out who was later matched via dna. Let's let the "pro's" do their job, as we won't know either way until the dna can be compared.

This should not mean we stop searching alternative theories while we wait. We don't know at this time, so we should continue exploring all area's until we get an answer on this dna comparison, whichever way it turns out.
 
Kind of OT. There is a general discussion thread for NamUs case #9597. I thought perhaps I should add the link to that thread here for anyone who wishes to follow the general discussion thread in the UID forum. I will be following both threads, to see what developments occur. And adding some relevant info there, such as the status of the dna.

Here is the link to the general discussion thread in the UID forum. The following thread is designated for all discussion surrounding this case, other than the possible match with Anna.

CA CA - San Gregorio, Unidentified Child 5-7 Years old, Found 3/26/2006 - Websleuths Crime Sleuthing Community
 
katydid23 said:
These pictures make it look impossible. But I grew up in the Bay Area, and believe me, those creeks turn into raging rivers when they are flooded. There are often redwood tree trunks that make it to the ocean after larger floods.

What I don't know is just how flooded it was when Anna went missing.
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Geologist Kenneth R. Lajoie of the U.S. Department of the Interior wrote the following to us on May 1, 1979 (cited in Chapter 14 of Searching for Anna):
Purisima Creek has incised or cut downward into its broad floodplain and formed a deep, narrow gully over the past 5,000-6,000 years. The narrow configuration of the present stream channel...indicates the stream is still eroding its bed, not depositing sediment...Purisima Creek, like all streams along the San Mateo Coast, has a very seasonal discharge pattern; floods occur during and after winter rains and the stream dries up during the late summer drought....In my opinion, large objects such as rocks (maybe one to two feet in size) and logs, and large amounts of sediment can be moved during periods of high discharge (flood stage). Any sediment left in the stream channel after a flood would probably be washed out gradually over a period of days, weeks, months, or maybe the next year. Large objects such as branches,logs, etc., may get hung up in brush and log jams. Sediment may build up for longer periods of time behind persistent obstructions such as brush jams, but is eventually washed out." Mr. Lajoie's full report is contained in the book.
 
Prayers for Annasmom and family as the wait for results begin. May there be some closure in this long journey.

eleph
 
Been following Anna's case and also read the book. I was shocked when I saw this new thread. I will be saying prayers that this moves along quickly, the family needs closure.
 
I too have followed the case and I am in shock as I read here today. I hope you get the answers you need shortly and I am praying for you all. Either way I know this will be hard on you.
 
I think this was one of the first cases I read when I came to WS. I spent the entirety of an afternoon reading all of Anna's threads. I, too, am shocked to read this update. I hope for her family that this might, indeed, be some closure.
 
I am shocked to read this new development. I, like many others on here, have mixed feelings about this being or not being Anna. On one hand it would be closure for Annasmom and family and on the other hand all hope of finding Anna would be gone.

If this is Anna, I would be comforted by the knowledge that she didn't have a traumatic life at the hands of some horrible people but instead, went to sleep and has been safe in the arms of Jesus all these years.

I was packing to move yesterday and when I picked up my copy of Searching For Anna, I stopped and spent a few minutes looking at Anna's beautiful little face, wondering where she could be. Ironically, when I opened my emails this morning, I had an email from another member of WS who told me to have a look at Anna's forum.

Whatever the outcome, my thoughts and prayers are with you and your family Annasmom.
 
I keep coming back to the title of this thread. The collective WE is what I love about WS and about all the people here who are searching for Anna. Thanks for making me smile a bit during this uncertain time, Cubby!
 
annemc2 said:
I keep coming back to the title of this thread. The collective WE is what I love about WS and about all the people here who are searching for Anna. Thanks for making me smile a bit during this uncertain time, Cubby!
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No doubt it is a collective WE. We are all in this search together whether we actively post often or just read.

:grouphug:

I'm back and forth whether I think this is Anna or not. The location certainly makes it a very strong possibility. However, I am going to follow both threads, because it may be that this uid is identified as someone else prior to the time it might take to get the DNA from a private lab. We just don't know.......
 
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