NH NH - Maura Murray, 21, Haverhill, 9 Feb 2004 - #13

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stephsb said:
What did they talk about on the latest podcast?


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From the Maura Murray Missing Podcast YouTube:

Ep 18: Crossing the Rubicon

Published on Nov 25, 2015
In this episode Lance Reenstierna and Tim Pilleri talk to blogger and podcaster Cold N. Holefield about his life online, his thoughts on the Maura Murray case, and what it means to cross the rubicon and be a part of an egregore.

There's was very little said about Maura Murray, if I remember right, and a lot of Cold N. Holefield talking about himself and his "energy" concept. I'm not sure I even finished listening to the whole Podcast so maybe someone else can fill in with more details.
 
TessDeco said:
From the Maura Murray Missing Podcast YouTube:

Ep 18: Crossing the Rubicon

Published on Nov 25, 2015
In this episode Lance Reenstierna and Tim Pilleri talk to blogger and podcaster Cold N. Holefield about his life online, his thoughts on the Maura Murray case, and what it means to cross the rubicon and be a part of an egregore.

There's was very little said about Maura Murray, if I remember right, and a lot of Cold N. Holefield talking about himself and his "energy" concept. I'm not sure I even finished listening to the whole Podcast so maybe someone else can fill in with more details.
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A bit strange, wasn't it?

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Ava Adore said:
Also, as mentioned above, he was about to lose his house. Where did this 4k come from? Why was it taken from multiple accounts?

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I assumed it was because there's usually a daily limit on how much you can withdraw from an ATM.
 
bluesneakers said:
I assumed it was because there's usually a daily limit on how much you can withdraw from an ATM.
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That's assuming it all came from one account. I saw in a post once someone discussing that if you're hiding money when facing bankruptcy, it's common to spread it amongst accounts. Obviously, I cannot say for sure that's what he was doing, but just an observation.

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Ava Adore said:
That's assuming it all came from one account. I saw in a post once someone discussing that if you're hiding money when facing bankruptcy, it's common to spread it amongst accounts. Obviously, I cannot say for sure that's what he was doing, but just an observation.

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No, I mean he withdrew the limit from one account, then withdrew the limit from another account, etc.
 
bluesneakers said:
No, I mean he withdrew the limit from one account, then withdrew the limit from another account, etc.
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Right, but the assumption has always been that he was going around to multiple ATMs and drawing from one account. I pose the theory that possibly he went to multiple ATMs and withdrew from multiple accounts...like he had the money divided around multiple banks/accounts. From what I read, it's never been proven he took money from one account. I believe it has all been based on a comment he made offhand. It's just a theory I had. It's just that, why would a man who is facing bankruptcy have (and willing to give his daughter) four thousand dollars? He was about to lose his house. It lends credence that maybe, just maybe, Maura left for other reasons.

Don't get me wrong, I believe Maura has perished, and more than likely in the mountains. What I want to know is exactly what she was running from. I don't agree with Renner that she was off to party at a cabin. I don't really agree she hit Vasi either. But we know he went around pulling out money from multiple ATMs (either from one account or several), and it doesn't make sense. If he knew Maura's car was genuinely on its last leg (which has been disputed), and they had a plan to go car shopping, why didn't he stop by his bank beforehand and get the cash withdrawn in one withdrawal, get a cashiers cheque, or use a regular check? None of his actions seem to make sense or seem planned. Who wanders around with 4k in cash? Especially when buying something that big?

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Ava Adore said:
Right, but the assumption has always been that he was going around to multiple ATMs and drawing from one account. I pose the theory that possibly he went to multiple ATMs and withdrew from multiple accounts...like he had the money divided around multiple banks/accounts. From what I read, it's never been proven he took money from one account. I believe it has all been based on a comment he made offhand. It's just a theory I had. It's just that, why would a man who is facing bankruptcy have (and willing to give his daughter) four thousand dollars? He was about to lose his house. It lends credence that maybe, just maybe, Maura left for other reasons.

Don't get me wrong, I believe Maura has perished, and more than likely in the mountains. What I want to know is exactly what she was running from. I don't agree with Renner that she was off to party at a cabin. I don't really agree she hit Vasi either. But we know he went around pulling out money from multiple ATMs (either from one account or several), and it doesn't make sense. If he knew Maura's car was genuinely on its last leg (which has been disputed), and they had a plan to go car shopping, why didn't he stop by his bank beforehand and get the cash withdrawn in one withdrawal, get a cashiers cheque, or use a regular check? None of his actions seem to make sense or seem planned. Who wanders around with 4k in cash? Especially when buying something that big?

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Exactly what I'm saying - money in multiple accounts. Money withdrawn from different accounts at different ATMs. Most banks will limit how much you can withdraw via ATM, so even if he had 4k in one account he wouldn't be able to take out more than 200 - 400 dollars.
 
bluesneakers said:
Exactly what I'm saying - money in multiple accounts. Money withdrawn from different accounts at different ATMs. Most banks will limit how much you can withdraw via ATM, so even if he had 4k in one account he wouldn't be able to take out more than 200 - 400 dollars.
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Sorry, I misunderstood you [emoji85]

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This sentence was attributed to Fred above:

"We went to a place in Northhampton that her boyfriend had good luck with."

I thought that Maura's boyfriend, Billy Rausch, was from Texas attending West Point in New York State.

But he had good luck buying a car in Northampton???

Huh?
 
It was supposedly $400 at 10 different ATMs in one day. Which isn't possible. The bank would shut that down for suspicious activity. And most ATMs Cap at $300, not $400.

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TessDeco said:
Read the Univ of Mass Police Report from 2/22/2004. Fred states in part: "We were going to get her a car. That's why I came up that weekend. We started in Hadley looking at cars $4000 on my person (sic). We went to a place in Northhampton that her boyfriend had good luck with."

http://mauramurray.blogspot.com/2012/03/police-obtained-fred-murrays-cell-phone.html

I'm sure the police have thoroughly investigated Fred Murray's statements. After all, he was one of the last people to see her. Certainly the police would be able to verify his claims.

Respectfully, I would ask: Why are internet bloggers trying so hard to spin the $4000 into something shady or mysterious? Maybe Fred really did intend to look for a better car for Maura. Maybe Maura's first accident (in Fred's brand new car) put a damper on spending the money that weekend. Maybe Maura's emotional state was a distraction. Who knows? IMO the $4000 has been spun by blogs on the internet to fit their own theory that Fred was helping Maura disappear, to start a new life ..in Canada.

All JMHO

When my daughter was in college, large cash withdrawals were not all that rare for me. College life, dorm life, unexpected expenses are not uncommon. Thank goodness she graduated and those days are over! :)
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Thanks for the link. I had missed the Quality Inn dynamic. I assumed that FM got a middle of the night roust right out of bed, but MM just sort of tiptoed in and told him the news in the morning. It's interesting to see how she handled it and how she reacted the next day in the car. It also seems she had a signature drink...
 
LisaLange said:
It was supposedly $400 at 10 different ATMs in one day. Which isn't possible. The bank would shut that down for suspicious activity. And most ATMs Cap at $300, not $400.

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Were all his accounts with the same bank? Were any of the withdrawals cash advances from credit card accounts?

I know it varies, but my ATM limit is $400/day.
 
Laughing said:
This sentence was attributed to Fred above:

"We went to a place in Northhampton that her boyfriend had good luck with."

I thought that Maura's boyfriend, Billy Rausch, was from Texas attending West Point in New York State.

But he had good luck buying a car in Northampton???

Huh?
Click to expand...

Bill Rausch is from Ohio I believe. He'd graduated from West Point and was stationed at FT Sill OK at the time.
However I don't know anything about his car buying, which was your question.


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Ava Adore said:
Right, but the assumption has always been that he was going around to multiple ATMs and drawing from one account. I pose the theory that possibly he went to multiple ATMs and withdrew from multiple accounts...like he had the money divided around multiple banks/accounts. From what I read, it's never been proven he took money from one account. I believe it has all been based on a comment he made offhand. It's just a theory I had. It's just that, why would a man who is facing bankruptcy have (and willing to give his daughter) four thousand dollars? He was about to lose his house. It lends credence that maybe, just maybe, Maura left for other reasons.

Don't get me wrong, I believe Maura has perished, and more than likely in the mountains. What I want to know is exactly what she was running from. I don't agree with Renner that she was off to party at a cabin. I don't really agree she hit Vasi either. But we know he went around pulling out money from multiple ATMs (either from one account or several), and it doesn't make sense. If he knew Maura's car was genuinely on its last leg (which has been disputed), and they had a plan to go car shopping, why didn't he stop by his bank beforehand and get the cash withdrawn in one withdrawal, get a cashiers cheque, or use a regular check? None of his actions seem to make sense or seem planned. Who wanders around with 4k in cash? Especially when buying something that big?

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Great posts, Ava, but I think we have to be careful with some of the interpretations:

1. My first question on this post - do you have any facts that FM went bankrupt? I couldn't find the records that showed he declared bankruptcy after MM's disappearance.
2. 2nd question about the house - I don't think it's clear 22 Walker was owned by FM. Comments on MSfMM discuss the public record showing it was in his brother's name, along with other parties, but FM is not specified. Do you have another source that puts him as one of the Et.Al.'s? If not, that's a plausible reason why his money and the tax deficiency would be unlinked.
3. 3rd thought about the withdrawals - there are plenty of rationales someone can come up with for the withdrawal behavior. FM does appear to be a funky cat in ways w/ some idiosyncratic mannerisms, but not sinister ones. I don't see a middle aged Dad, sort of salty New Englander preferring to walk around with a wad of cash in 2004 for a day or two to be all that abnormal. Remember, they were scoping used cars. Who hasn't heard the archetypal story of trying to haggle with Used Car Salesmen, using "cash on the spot" as the #1 weapon in the arsenal to talk down the sticker?
4. Also, no matter the method employed, the family spokesperson noted where the money went...ironically, this was also on MSfMM just recently: http://mauramurray.blogspot.com/2015/11/family-spokesperson-says-fred-left-4000.html (although the focus was on MM's potential access, not the fact it wasn't accessed). From HDM's comments, simple inference is that FM and MM had a joint account. But the important nugget is that police were informed of it after her disappearance and noted the $4K was not withdrawn. In that light, it doesn't feel like a plot to funnel secret funds to her under pretense.
 
However, I am on slight disagreement with just believing what Fred says or letting it go. The whole basis of knowing exactly why she might have taken off could shed light on a couple things. Many, many people have found his mismatched statements odd, such as his initial reaction in calling the police and telling them he had information for them, and him making the comment about her being naked and drunk on the mountain like an old squaw. Now, maybe, just maybe he has a super odd sense of humor that you have to know him to understand.

I also don't believe the rag in the tail pipe. I think she was drunk driving and stuffed it in there after she crashed so she could later blame it for the reason she crashed. She was facing her second possible drunk driving accident.

Okay, so maybe I agree with you like 90%.

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Ava Adore said:
http://mauramurray.blogspot.com/2011_08_01_archive.html?m=1

"Word is police were once interested in a pair of brothers who made snow out at Loon Mountain in Feb. 2004. They drove to work every evening along Rt. 112 and would have passed the scene of Maura's disappearance. My source was told by police that the night Maura disappeared, the brothers did not show up for work."




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Further review finds that a red truck was registered to Walter Glynn, early-30s at the time, who lived with his brother Robert. Presumably, these are the Loon Mtn boys who never showed up to work on Feb. 9.

A red truck was seen acting suspiciously, with the driver taking a particular interest in lone women on foot. The Glynns drove such a truck and would have been on the road that night. This lead, which has been under everybody's nose for years now, needs to be further explored.
 
JamesRenner said:
This has never been verified and is probably just rumor.
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The red truck or the rumors about the brothers showing up? If I remember correctly, you believe the red truck could have been a possible tandem driver?

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