Girl with red shorts and white top

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clitheroelarger.jpg
M0208008.jpg
 
JoeFromLB said:
Here it is:

http://cnnnancygrace.files.wordpress.com/2010/03/00641.jpg

This is the possible match to Dorothy Clitheroe missing from Phoenix. You can see the bruise on the right leg above the knee and possible bruising on the left leg. I don't see any writing on her arm except something that looks like the letter "D". She's pointing to it. According to her Charley Project page, one of Dorothy's forearms was scarred due to her backing into a hot radiator and the name "US Steel" was imprinted into her skin, but most of it was gone by 1973. The letter "U" might have been the only one still showing. Could what looks like a "D" in the pic actually be a "U"?

http://www.charleyproject.org/cases/c/clitheroe_dorothy.html
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Thanks. I thought they were red and white striped, so I was looking all over for blue and white striped and couldn't figure out who you were talking about. LOL now I see the lens probably made them red. I have thought all along this looks just like Dorothy, if not, it's her twin. I wonder if she's one of the ones their investigating from AZ, I wish they'd say who they're checking out already and take the ones that have called in off the grid.
 
scuseme said:
I think it could be a "U" also. If she backed into the radiator kind of sideways and the fron of her arm hit it, the "U" would be facing with the curved part pointing to her wrist. With her arm lifted the way it is, the "U" is in that position. I think this is very possible. Good find.:dance:
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I just had a horrible thought. Is it possible he had already threatened and/or beat her before taking her to some deserted location to shoot these photos? Did she have a premontion that she might not come out of this safely and wanted someone to identify her photo by the "U" imprinted on her forearm?

Or am I just reading too much into all this?
 
JoeFromLB said:
I just had a horrible thought. Is it possible he had already threatened and/or beat her before taking her to some deserted location to shoot these photos? Did she have a premontion that she might not come out of this safely and wanted someone to identify her photo by the "U" imprinted on her forearm?

Or am I just reading too much into all this?
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Her smile strikes me as pretty genuine. Think she might look more scared if she had just been threatened and beaten and thought that she could end up badly and need identification? If it's Clitheroe she might be pointing at the marking as a "Clumsy me, look what I've got here, I can laugh about it now but let me tell you it hurt like hello when I got it" sort of thing. Not that it matters if it's somebody Alcala killed, she'd have become scared eventually...

She's pointing at her chin too, did she have anything there or is it just a cute pose?
 
Very good observations on the writing/markings on what could be the Clitheroe girl.
I can tell you this, "back in the day" when I was a runaway I kept my ss# written on the bottom of my foot with black permanent marker, along with all kinds of other strange things to try and be sure if I disappeared I might be identified. Strange how we think at 14 years of age. It rarely occurred to me I would not be found in time to still have flesh... My trivia for the day, just trying to show you that yes she may very well be thinking like that.
 
JoeFromLB said:
I just had a horrible thought. Is it possible he had already threatened and/or beat her before taking her to some deserted location to shoot these photos? Did she have a premontion that she might not come out of this safely and wanted someone to identify her photo by the "U" imprinted on her forearm?
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The woman in this picture is smiling and looks playful. If she thought she was about to die, I can't imagine she would have a lighthearted expression. She would be in survival mode.
 
Katrinka said:
The woman in this picture is smiling and looks playful. If she thought she was about to die, I can't imagine she would have a lighthearted expression. She would be in survival mode.
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Not if she thinks she is giving him what he wants and it buys her time to come up with an idea, IMO.

Another thought might be if Alcala had asked her to point to any scars she had.

I see him as knowing how to manipulate them and the situation, orchestrate might be the word. I think he did a lot of it just to capture the different emotions and responses on film. They were mere puppets to him and he liked to be in charge and make them dance at his whim. When the dance was over he killed them and needed a new puppet. Very sick. All just my opinion though.
 
dsntslp said:
The girl in the engineer shorts (blue and white stripes) in the pic that looks like it has been taken through a red filter has very ugly bruising on both legs. Her right leg has two round marks the size of fists and her left leg has a band of bruising that is quite a few inches long and at least an inch wide. She also has a left ankle that is so swollen looking that it is hard to discern an ankle bone but when I see that same ankle in her other pic it looks normal, so idk. Maybe it was just the way she was standing. (From memory here, apologies if slightly off.) And that is one of two pic's where I believe the subject has writing on her arm, perhaps it says "Alcala" or something. I can see it but can't read it. She is pointing to it even.
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Your post got me to look again at this pic and that's when I finally saw the writing. I had looked at this picture many times but not in the larger size.
I've got the Nancy Grace site bookmarked now!
 
Kimster said:
Did anyone call this in?
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Yes, "tut med" did and so did I. There are also news reports that Phoenix authorities are looking into a case there matching a photo. I would guess it's Dorothy.
 
punklove said:
I wish we knew exactly where the scar was, you can see something on her stomach but its hard to tell if its a scar.
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The scar is on a forearm per this:

Sleuthster said:
[SIZE=+1]DOROTHY MILDRED CLITHEROE[/SIZE][SIZE=+1]Age Progression[/SIZE] Case Type: Endangered Missing DOB: Aug 6, 1959Sex: FemaleMissing Date: Sep 20, 1973Race: WhiteAge Now: 50Height: 5'3" (160 cm)Missing City: PHOENIXWeight: 130 lbs (59 kg)Missing State : AZHair Color: BrownMissing Country: United StatesEye Color: BrownCase Number: NCMC942383Circumstances: Dorothy's photo is shown age-progressed to 49 years. She was last seen on September 20, 1973 at Cortez Park in Phoenix, Arizona. She was wearing Levi bell bottom jeans and a white tank top with a pattern of upside down multi-colored teardrop shapes. She wore thick eyeglasses and had pierced ears but it is unknown if she was wearing any jewelry when she disappeared. She may have had the remnants of a "US Steel" scar on one of her forearms from backing into a hot radiator. It is possible only the letter "U" was still visible.
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carbuff said:
She has a burn scar on her arm but nothing mentioned on her leg. That could be a bruise -- I used to have marks like that on my thighs all the time back in the days when I played softball.
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WOW....
 
I'm going to (very respectfully) disagree with those who think she looks badly beated and under duress. IMHO, her smile matches her professional/yearbook photo and school pictures aren't taken under duress so she is probably smiling genuinely. Sadly, if this girl is identified as a victim, I don't think she had any idea who she was posing for at the time this photo was taken and she was just innocently clowning for the camera.

She looks like she has an athletic build -- see the "bodybuilder" pose photo. Also, note the distance she was from Alcala, who might have also been behind a tripod. If she felt threatened at that moment in time I think she would have easily outrun him. If she had been beaten badly I don't think she could have balanced on the rock so easily. Those probably are real bruises, though; I just think she got them somewhere else and possibly from an accident rather than violence.
 
I agree, tatertot.

Her expression reminds me of the way I look without my glasses. Sort of disoriented. Did Clitheroe normally wear glasses?
 
tatertot said:
I'm going to (very respectfully) disagree with those who think she looks badly beated and under duress. IMHO, her smile matches her professional/yearbook photo and school pictures aren't taken under duress so she is probably smiling genuinely. Sadly, if this girl is identified as a victim, I don't think she had any idea who she was posing for at the time this photo was taken and she was just innocently clowning for the camera.

She looks like she has an athletic build -- see the "bodybuilder" pose photo. Also, note the distance she was from Alcala, who might have also been behind a tripod. If she felt threatened at that moment in time I think she would have easily outrun him. If she had been beaten badly I don't think she could have balanced on the rock so easily. Those probably are real bruises, though; I just think she got them somewhere else and possibly from an accident rather than violence.
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I agree, her smile looks very natural and unforced. It wouldn't surprise me if she was active in sports and I think the bruising is likely from that kind of activity, not from being injured by Alcala.
Since it doesn't seem to be in this thread, here's a link to the bodybuilder pose.
 
Thanks for posting that. Also, my bad, she wasn't standing on a rock (bad memory!) but it would be near impossible to balance as she did on badly injured legs.
 
Bargle said:
I agree, her smile looks very natural and unforced. It wouldn't surprise me if she was active in sports and I think the bruising is likely from that kind of activity, not from being injured by Alcala.
Since it doesn't seem to be in this thread, here's a link to the bodybuilder pose.
Click to expand...

I have been trying to find this image in a large resolution format that can be blown up but I can't find one! For some reason, this picture is not on Nancy Grace's blog...Does anyone have a link???
 
dsntslp said:
Very good observations on the writing/markings on what could be the Clitheroe girl.
I can tell you this, "back in the day" when I was a runaway I kept my ss# written on the bottom of my foot with black permanent marker, along with all kinds of other strange things to try and be sure if I disappeared I might be identified. Strange how we think at 14 years of age. It rarely occurred to me I would not be found in time to still have flesh... My trivia for the day, just trying to show you that yes she may very well be thinking like that.
Click to expand...

wow, do you know if that is/was a common practice among runaways? I've never heard of that before ...
 
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