Trayvon Martin's Autopsy

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Just K said:
oops, tired, I divided 71 by 12

Anyway 5'11 is still average height...in my book anything under is short :)
over 6' is tall over 6'5 is really tall, IMO
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5'9" is average. 5' 11" is still considered above average.

IMO!
 
deelytful1 said:
Just an emotional observation.. After reading only the first page, one mom to another, I am hoping that his mom never, ever attempts to read this autopsy report. The clinical coldness (albeit necessary) is bone chilling..
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I totally agree but understand them having to be so clinical in doing their jobs.
 
I realize there was a lot of blood inside of his body. Was there a lot of blood outside I wonder?
 
believe09 said:
I realize there was a lot of blood inside of his body. Was there a lot of blood outside I wonder?
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I read I'm the SFD report there was very minor bleeding from the GSW.

I don't remember the exact words.
 
Over the past weeks, I have seen much discussion at a number of sited discussing the TM case wondering why the paramedics were so "quick" to call the code and pronounce TM dead in the field. Some of the more strident emotional criticism very overtly implied that the officers and paramedics did not aggressively conduct resuscitation because perhaps the victim was perceived as a criminal, or further insinuations that somehow race had something to do with why TM was "quickly" pronounced dead at the scene. That TM was somehow deemed "not valuable" enough to be afforded aggressive resuscitation by the paramedics. There has also been criticism that "if only GZ had started CPR at once", perhaps TM would have lived long enough to be transported to an ER/ Trauma Center. Some have opined that GZ's failure to initiate CPR would make them vote for murder if they were jurors.

I'd like to take a few minutes and try to explain in layman's terms why this criticism is not warranted, nor is it based on scientific principles of medicine and trauma.

TM never had any chance of survival once the projectile entered his chest where it did, and hit what it did. No chance of survival at all. His entire right ventricle was essentially "gone". The remainder of the heart would have sustained burst strain, and stretch injuries, and disruption of electrical impulses, etc. You can't just sew up a hole in a ventricle and think that the heart will restart. His ENTIRE heart was mortally damaged-- not just the ventricle.

CPR relies on a "closed" central system to move blood, and keep the brain and heart muscle perfused, providing an opportunity to "fix" the underlying problem that caused the cardiac arrest. In the case of arrests from electrical disturbances, such as people collapsing while out and about in public, the treatment is "electricity" to reorder the heart's conduction. That is why AED's are prolifically appearing in public places, and laypeople are trained to use them. AED's save lives. Penetrating chest trauma to the heart is an entirely different scenario. If the heart (and/ or great vessels) have a big hole, or lots of small ones, CPR cannot work. The heart is "empty" and won' refill.

TM would have had about 6 liters of total blood volume. About 2 1/2 liters was found in the chest at autopsy, which is pretty much what I expected. The remaining 3 1/2 liters was in his extremities and body organs, unable to be circulated once the heart could no longer pump, or be pumped.

People often cite miraculous recoveries of patients with heart truama. Every once in a while there has been a miraculous "save" of a patient with penetrating heart trauma, if they happen to be at a trauma center, and a primed and waiting cardiopulmonary bypass machine is ready with a crew, and an OR prepped for an open heart. The reality is that upwards of 80% of victims of penetrating cardiac trauma die in close proximity to the injury. (I was actually surprised it wasn't higher.) Those that live, have some kind of electrical rhythm, a positive response to CPR, and a BP of at least 50 on arrival. Those in full cardiac arrest in the field, with no pulse generated by CPR, simply don't make it. GSW cause far more damage than stab wounds-- and if you read the citations below, most of the survivors were stab victims. Survival for GSW in the below article was 4%. (And remember-- that 4% reflects those victims who arrived with some BP and cardiac function to the ER.)


Outcomes after emergency department thoracotomy for penetrating
cardiac injuries: a new perspective
http://icvts.oxfordjournals.org/content/7/5/845.full.pdf
(Full text)

Cardiac injuries were caused by GSW in 82 patients (87%) and SW in 12 patients (13%). Fifteen
patients (16%) survived EDT and were taken to the operating room, while eight patients (8%) survived their entire hospitalization. All survivors were neurologically intact. Survival rates were 5% for GSW and 33% for SW. Mechanism of injury (SW), prehospital transportation
by police, higher GCS, sinus tachycardia, and measurable ED vital signs were associated with improved survival.

Overall survival rates were 17% after stab wounds and 4% after gunshot wounds.

Predictors of mortality in penetrating cardiac injury.
http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed/8507054
(Abstract; will post full text if I find a free version, because this is a really good, commonly cited article. An expert witness would surely use this reference on the stand, imo.)

I have a few more things to add, but am short on time. Will post later.
 
deelytful1 said:
Just an emotional observation.. After reading only the first page, one mom to another, I am hoping that his mom never, ever attempts to read this autopsy report. The clinical coldness (albeit necessary) is bone chilling..
Click to expand...

My thoughts exactly.
 
So, there is no link to the autopsy report itself-is that correct?
 
I'm interested in the blood on his head and the bruise around his eye that is noted on the diagrams. I wonder if these were from GZ throwing the 1rst punch?
 
tehcloser said:
I'm interested in the blood on his head and the bruise around his eye that is noted on the diagrams. I wonder if these were from GZ throwing the 1rst punch?
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The autopsy says face was unremarkable. If there was a bruise to the eye, it would have been mentioned under "evidence of injury."
The scar on the right hand is old and therefore not an evidence of injury. Scalp was intact so any blood on the head did not come from any lacerations on the head.
Regarding arrow pointing to the eye-it says "brown" as in "brown eyes." Not "bruise."
That reporter should read the whole autopsy which clearly states the evidence of injury are the bullet wound and injury to the fourth left finger.
And as I looked at the diagram again, I don't think it says a "blood spot" on the head. What it says is "black short" as is his hair was "black short."
 
Isabelle said:
Interesting that Trayvon had no injuries other than the GSW and a very small abrasion to one finger on the left hand. I think GZ got hit in the nose/face with the butt of his gun.
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that is my belief as well-- that he bonked himself in the face with the recoil and knocked himself back.
 
tehcloser said:
Diagrams also note Martin was hurt in the fight: blood on his head, a bruise around his eye, scarring on both hands.


http://miami.cbslocal.com/2012/05/18/zimmerman-atty-dont-judge-by-piecemeal-evidence/
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quote from your linked article

Gunpowder burns around his chest wound, called “stippling,” suggest Zimmerman shot him no more than 18 inches away. The gun shot’s trajectory was horizontal.
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do yall think that if you were sitting over the top of me beating my head into the pavement and I was in fear of my life and shot you, the trajectory of the bullet would be horizontal? I'm trying to picture the strange contortions while in terror of my very existence and I cant see it any way unless both of us were standing? someone help me see.



ETA: just had hubby kneel over me pretending, you know...I drew the line at actually having my head beat into the floor, and I will now say that there doesnt seem to be any possible way a bullet went in horizontally from there and EVEN MORE!!!!! in order to have my hand 18 inches away from hubby's chest with him at a 45 degree-ish angle from me, I would have to crush my hand into my boob with my elbow in a weird place if that makes sense, if I held the "gun" from my body at all, plus the length of the gun itself, would be closer to 2 or 3 inches away, maybe even actually touching.
 
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