2011.06.27 TRIAL Day Twenty-nine (Morning Session)

Discussion in 'Trial Archive - Threads and References' started by beach, Jun 19, 2011.

Thread Status:
Not open for further replies.
  1. pinkfly

    pinkfly Well-Known Member

    Messages:
    3,802
    Likes Received:
    1,515
    Trophy Points:
    113
    ICA must be very hard for Dr.s to asses with all her lies and stories
     
  2. Etiana

    Etiana Truth fears nothing but concealment

    Messages:
    487
    Likes Received:
    0
    Trophy Points:
    0
    Well, I guess the good thing about this testimony is once again JB is helping the State. The jury has got to be as fed up as we are about this witness.
     
  3. Whisperer

    Whisperer Well-Known Member

    Messages:
    17,543
    Likes Received:
    72
    Trophy Points:
    48
    I think she was using some gasoline to get rid of the smell. Heck she probably used everything she could find. I would think bleach would have changed the color of the carpet. Did it?
     
  4. Kat

    Kat Kind words do not cost much

    Messages:
    17,192
    Likes Received:
    552
    Trophy Points:
    0
    Recess for lunch
     
  5. whiteangora

    whiteangora I'm on the right track baby. I was "Born This Way"

    Messages:
    5,751
    Likes Received:
    1
    Trophy Points:
    0
    All of this talk of food has made the inmate hungry. I think she's planning her last meal request on that legal pad.
     
  6. logicalgirl

    logicalgirl Peace Hawk

    Messages:
    16,024
    Likes Received:
    0
    Trophy Points:
    0
    Whatever that high of excitement ICA was on this morning - it has worn off and she looks quite down - not perky at all.
     
  7. MyTinkieGirl

    MyTinkieGirl Well-Known Member

    Messages:
    1,608
    Likes Received:
    755
    Trophy Points:
    113
    Remember what Dr. Vass explained...about the 10 lbs of raw hamburger under a bag. There was NOT a 10 lb salami present...nor 10 blocks of Velveeta. AND....other things DO contain fatty acids, BUT, not the same ones as the grave wax found...and NOT the levels of EACH found.
    Like meat fat has a diff fatty acid profile from cheese....AND both will have a diff fatty acid profile from grave wax.
    So, basically....the fatty acids in any of these foods that are found in grave wax COULD be the same fatty acids, BUT, the "other" ones just don't "selectively" decide like "ya know...I don't wanna hang out....I'm outta here".

    Also....as we've all discussed before....the chemical composition of these items MAY have "some" of the chems found by Dr. Vass....but the majority of the "decomposition" chems.....NOT!!!
     
  8. CHCL3

    CHCL3 New Member

    Messages:
    15
    Likes Received:
    0
    Trophy Points:
    0
    Lee Goff M. Early post-mortem changes and stages of decomposition in exposed cadavers. Exp Appl Acarol 2009;49(1-2):21-36. http://www.academia.dk/BiologiskAntropologi/Tafonomi/PDF/post-mortem-changes.pdf

    Decomposition of an exposed cadaver is a continuous process, beginning at the moment of death and ending when the body is reduced to a dried skeleton. Traditional estimates of the period of time since death or post-mortem interval have been based on a series of grossly observable changes to the body, including livor mortis, algor mortis, rigor mortis and similar phenomena. These changes will be described briefly and their relative significance discussed. More recently, insects, mites and other arthropods have been increasingly used by law enforcement to provide an estimate of the post-mortem interval. Although the process of decomposition is continuous, it is useful to divide this into a series of five stages: Fresh, Bloated, Decay, Postdecay and Skeletal. Here these stages are characterized by physical parameters and related assemblages of arthropods, to provide a framework for consideration of the decomposition process and acarine relationships to the body.
     
  9. liltexans

    liltexans Retired WS Staff

    Messages:
    13,452
    Likes Received:
    25,813
    Trophy Points:
    113
    KBelichWFTV Kathi Belich, WFTV
    A couple jurors are smirking after defense objects to state's objection and Chief Judge Perry cut Baez off and told them to go to bench
    2 minutes ago
     
  10. pinkfly

    pinkfly Well-Known Member

    Messages:
    3,802
    Likes Received:
    1,515
    Trophy Points:
    113
    lunchtime
     
  11. goldleaf

    goldleaf New Member

    Messages:
    212
    Likes Received:
    0
    Trophy Points:
    0
    Run for your life before you pass out!
     
  12. mombomb

    mombomb New Member

    Messages:
    1,437
    Likes Received:
    0
    Trophy Points:
    0
    SIDEBAR #! (11:31-11:35)

    DIRECT EXAM BY BY - continued

    Regarding his chart, all the studies are different and study bodies in different stages. There are various people looking at the various chemicals given off of a decomposing body. His table is a summary based on a portion of all of the compounds presented.

    (ICA writing notes again)

    Dr. Vass's studies are #6 and #7. Dr. Strafalopolis in Greece(sp) is #4 and #5.

    What can we learn from the chart?

    OBJECTION may be a (case) violation - REPHRASE

    If above 50% would show a general agreement among the studies. The numbers were well below that which means there is disagreement at this point. The only that are above the 50% threshold are 4 chemicals. Tolumine and paraxylene, dimethyl disulfide and tri-sulfide.

    Next slide - a photo provided to him of contents of trunk after they had been removed and inventoried. This is relative to possible decomp events from food products or volatiles related to consumer products.

    Fatty acids - in report by Dr. Vass. These 4 fatty acids are everywhere, related to fatty materials, i.e. milk products, cheese. They are the same compounds found in human body fat.

    Sodium, Calcium, Magnesium and Iron are generally found in milk or other materials we ingest.

    These fatty acids are not unique to human decomp.

    Sodium, calcium.... are not unique to human decomp.

    Next slide - shows pork and beef and other items we might consume also contain the same fatty acids reported by Dr. Vass.

    Regarding chloroform - Oakridge did not do a quantitative analysis.

    Chloroform is everywhere. It is very common in very low quantities. Can be high in bleach....

    OBJECTION - JA speaking with JB - JA requests sidebar

    SIDEBAR #2 (11:46-11:52


    Chloroform can be found in cleaning products, in many products, depending on the concentration level. Bleach has high amounts of chloroform. Other products that contain chloroform would be... Witness then referenced the World Health Organization...

    OBJECTION - JA stated the WHO was one of the areas they had talked about - SUSTAINED

    Chloroform found in drinking water, household foods (cheeses and soft drinks)

    JA - we need to approach (he had a piece of paper he wanted to show the Court.

    SIDEBAR #3 (11:54-11:59


    Talking heads are noticing that AF is going to sidebars now and CM is staying sitting down.

    Recess for lunch until 1:45. Legal matter that needs to be taken up at 1:30.
     
  13. Turnadot

    Turnadot New Member

    Messages:
    3,763
    Likes Received:
    1
    Trophy Points:
    0
    The great CHEESE conspiracy!
     
  14. grandmaj

    grandmaj Former Member

    Messages:
    43,414
    Likes Received:
    13
    Trophy Points:
    0
    What is going on in this thread? Bashing, off color jokes, name calling outrageous behavior.

    Every post that we have to remove today will be reviewed to determine if a TO is warranted. Don't be in that group.
     
  15. JBounds

    JBounds I feel lucky

    Messages:
    2,904
    Likes Received:
    6
    Trophy Points:
    0
    Is ICA trying to evaluate her own evaluation?
     
  16. wenwe4

    wenwe4 Well-Known Member

    Messages:
    9,437
    Likes Received:
    6,467
    Trophy Points:
    113

    HHBP - calls for lunch - start back @ 1:45 - there is a matter we need to take up 1:30....an appointment one of you has @ noon - jury come back 1:45 = rest @ 1:30


     
  17. luv

    luv Live Love Laugh ♥

    Messages:
    1,105
    Likes Received:
    4
    Trophy Points:
    0
  18. LongtimeMedic

    LongtimeMedic Former Member

    Messages:
    382
    Likes Received:
    0
    Trophy Points:
    0
    Vass did not do a quantitative analysis but rather a qualitative... meaning it's there, but he can't say how much, certainly not a "Shocking" level. moo
     
  19. Elley Mae

    Elley Mae The enemy is here. beware

    Messages:
    18,415
    Likes Received:
    10,942
    Trophy Points:
    113
    Jurors back at 1:45 the rest at 1:30
     
  20. Softail

    Softail Active Member

    Messages:
    12,517
    Likes Received:
    24
    Trophy Points:
    38
    Recess until 1:45 for the jury- There is a matter to be discussed at 1:30 for everyone else.
     
Thread Status:
Not open for further replies.

Share This Page



  1. This site uses cookies to help personalise content, tailor your experience and to keep you logged in if you register.
    By continuing to use this site, you are consenting to our use of cookies.
    Dismiss Notice