4 Univ of Idaho Students Murdered, Bryan Kohberger Arrested, Moscow, Nov 2022 #82

[North_Idaho_Nony]

My thought was because the Defense does not want anyone else to open/read them as they make there way to BK. MOO

Incoming mail​

Incoming Mail Guidelines explain the process for sending mail to prison residents, what items are prohibited and what happens to mail when a resident is transferred. The residents in our prisons may receive letters (no packages) and photos (no Polaroids or nudity) from family/friends. Personal letters will be opened and searched for contraband;

Incoming Mail | Idaho Department of Correction

www.idoc.idaho.gov

Good info.

BK is in the custody of the Latah County Sheriff, and our jail looks to be a little more inmate friendly from a mail standpoint:
Latah County Jail
Scroll down to Inmate under Additional Information.

MOO: it’s not usual for Latah County jail inmates to have their mail be pre-screened by their lawyers.

MOO & speculation: maybe it’s not unusual in particularly high profile cases pre-trial? IANAL, but I could see a lawyer in that situation making it a requirement of representation. Unless that would be an illegal contract clause or something

 

[Nila Aella]

Investigators probe Bryan Kohberger's social media in connection with Idaho college murders

The documents include search warrant applications for some of Bryan Kohberger's internet activity.

abcnews.go.com

Investigators are probing the digital footprint of Bryan Kohberger, the suspect accused of killing four Idaho college students in an early morning attack last year, according to new court documents.

 

[jepop]

Re deleted accounts:

IDK if BK had multiple usernames/accounts/phones, it's possible. I keep thinking how many other things he did which did not seem to be so smart for someone trying to "hide" discovery. Maybe he was stealthier with technology? I do believe that this is what LE is looking for though (after reading @schooling posts). MOO

@schooling posted a bit earlier today:

Thank you @Nila Aella. I hadn't see @schooling's update. The issue about using an IMEI as an identifier was bothering me or the issue of looking for an IMEI through other identifiers. Will have a re-think.

 

[jepop]

Yeah that would be like using your juvenile history against you sort of frowned upon, probably not allowed as evidence due to timing. But what do I know. I'm Just speculating.

No, you're right I think.At least there would certainly be a question of relevance/connection to the crimes with which he is charged. Personally,not sure it would be admissable, too removed in time and place. MOO

 

[jepop]

Informative, as always! Thanks.

One reason this crime is so (fill in blank) is because it is actually different, it is in my opinion more of a stranger on stranger.

In most murders, even multiple murders, the people know each other and know each other well such as family, lovers, former lovers, etc... (Sometimes in multiple murders a person is killed just for being in the wrong place wrong time like I think Ethan.)

Especially when it comes to planning ahead, most planned murders like this are not stranger on stranger and it raises hair on the back of our heads.

The Truth About Stranger Homicide, and Who's Really at Risk

Stranger homicide is rare, but young men more likely to fall victim than women.

www.psychologytoday.com

• Stranger homicide is extremely rare.
• Young men are more at risk than women of being murdered by a stranger.
• Women are far more likely to be murdered by man known to them—a family member, friend or intimate partner—than a stranger.

Violent Crime by Strangers and Nonstrangers | Office of Justice Programs

www.ojp.gov

Among violent crimes, robbery was most likely and homicide was least likely to be committed by a stranger.

Most violent crimes by strangers (70 percent) were committed against males, while most by relatives (77 percent) were committed against females. Spouses or ex-spouses committed over half of all crimes by relatives and about two-thirds of all crimes by relatives against women.

Crimes by strangers were more often committed by two or more offenders than were crimes by nonstrangers. Stranger-to-stranger crimes more often involved a weapon but less often resulted in attack or injury than did crimes by a nonstranger.

Crimes by relatives involved attack and injury more often than did stranger or acquaintance crimes. However, of those injured, victims of stranger and acquaintance crimes were more likely to require medical attention than victims of crimes by relatives.

100%. It's the stranger (not including online and one way stalking) aspect of this -to my mind -very deliberate act of multiple murder, an intended, calculated and relatively efficient act, - that creates the space/blanks that we all want to see filled. In that absence we have our theories and imaginations. The State, I believe in trial, will concentrate on the who and the how, rather than the why (unless there is an easily fathomable why, which so far we are not seeing - either from the nature of the murders, or from what we know of the defendant and the victims). Ofcourse a confession (no odds imo) might produce a why as per defendant's reasoning. MOO

 

[jepop]

Identity and incriminating online statements....

One reason for the possibility of someone's safety (possible life) being endangered is because the information being disclosed can lead to their identity.

It can be a total nightmare to have your identity disclosed in a notorious murder investigation.

Another reason is because there will be online conversations that BK had with others and they could be embarrassing to someone who says something personal to him. Could make someone look bad.

Really bad. Negative remarks against women or a victim for example. Incriminating statements that would enrage others seeing them.

All kinds of incriminating things people say online. Look at all the racist remarks getting people in trouble and enraging the public.

2 Cents

Depending on which warrant, I can think of many reasons why a judge might use this boilerplate worded rule, amongst others, to seal a warrant. There may be personal details or historical data/info relating to many innocent parties. Not to mention private/personal info related to victims and defendant that should not be released. Much may turn out not to be relevant to trial. But is the State supposed to sort one from the other prior to sealing and redact identifying info? I'd say not. MOO. And rather than go painstakingly through the info redacting where needed, it is better to just seal the whole return. The state needs time to sort and investigate the returns. It all has to stay in evidence for defense discovery. MOO

Once identifying info gets out- in todays world of internet etc etc especially- those people are identified to all. So harassment etc, mental health consequences, stalking, verbal abuse, press at the door. I never forget that the wording is ...life and/or safety of...life and/or safety of...There is nothing wrong with being cautious nor is that a judge being disingenious Imo. The judge can't predict the future -what might happen if the affidavits and returns on these warrants were unredacted? If phone numbers and names were released? The wording is sometimes over dramatised IMO. It can be taken seriously without assuming that it means someone would definately be waiting in the shadows to silence an innocent party, or an investigating officer on the case, if the seal was removed. MOO

ETA: Not to mention the victims' and maybe especially, the defendant's families' safety has the potential to be compromised if the returns and affidavits of the relevant warrants are unsealed. MOO

 

[jepop]

Snipped for focus @10ofRods . Posting a QR code in apt. for party guests?

IDK if I should come out of my cave more frequently or if I should stay waaay back w my quill pen, ink well, & parchment.

haha,I think I might need a new quill, may have to pop out for a walk in the woods. I recommend crow feathers. Ink is available at the stationary store.

 

[Slamalam]

BBM

Walking a fine line here with ToS and our delicate sensibilities lol, but my guess is that:

1. this trial is going to be the D, T, & A Trial of the Century (so shocking)

2. someone (or someones?) who knows the answer to the shocking bit is the answer to the second bit because potentially they're not the only one who knows the answer to the shocking bit - they're just the one who said something.

ETA: Remember, we have a lot of missing pieces in those warrants, and that means some probable cause related to those parties.

As to specifics, beats me. And this is not meant to imply anything about anyone specifically, and certainly not meant to indirectly malign the victims at all. I just think that the shocking and endangered bits make more sense when linked, and if the court would just unseal the documents for me, I'd promise not to tell. Until that happens though, we get into a game of blindfolded darts (which admittedly, the blindfold never hinders me much because I suck so badly at the game, but that's a whine for another day). And this is all IMO, JMO and ICBW.

ETA: I think that it's important to reflect on all of the warrants and not disregard or dismiss inconvenient pieces in this case.

What’s D, T, & A? Thanks!

 

[Balthazar]

SnapChat/Map is a sure way to run into local people whom you might not know. On Game Days, many college students "follow" anyone and everyone that they think is on their side in the game (these people stay followed). College students love it. Think you saw the same guy in more than one place? You can send him a short message (which will disappear, is my understanding, after so many hours). Young women use it to get compliments and to meet others.


Yep, I’ve pondered everything from a hidden camera inside 1122 King Road (in a heating duct?) - which seems unlikely to…

Trail/game cams (easy peasy, just come back once in a while and have a look). However, they do make ones that utilize cellular data (Verizon and T-Mobile both have them, a little bulkier and I’d think any criminal would want to avoid them.

But if he knew their wifi password (some college students have a QR code prominently displayed so that visitors can access wifi during parties or get together), then it would be even easier.

Snapchat would be another way to get occasionally “hits” on the habits of where people might be in real time.

Lots of ways to snoop, I guess.

IMO.

He wouldn't need to hide a camera when he could use their TV's cameras or the camera on their computers.

 

[Balthazar]

What’s D, T, & A? Thanks!

Digital Technology and Analytics

 

[jepop]

Threaten safety or lives of... I just spent some tedious time checking out the most recent orders to seal and/or seal and redact. The financial warrants are for the victims and (it's an assumption)the surviving roomates. Unredacting exposes this financial information. When the killer was at large, clearly their safety could have potentially be threatened. But even now, revealing those details can conceivably be construed as the kind of exposure that might cause threats to their safety. We know that the surviving victims have been abused on social media. It would be a circus and potentially result in safety threatening mental health issues. The victims' tinder warrants would potentially identify innocent parties they interacted with. The warrants that sought info on unidentified Tinder accounts were very likely initially identified from Maddie and Kaylee's tinder warrants (the 20 accounts sought come after the returns on MM and KG's tinder). Again (at the time), exposing possible POIs but not necessarily the killer. Most tellingly of all Imo, is that one of the e-bay warrants and one other of the K bar warrants are subject to the "safety'phrase' in their sealing. When I checked those two they both potentially identified specific purchasers. At the time ofcourse those names needed to be protected. But even now, what could potentially happen to them if unredacted? What of the individual who sold them (e bay?)? Makes so much sense that they remain sealed even after arrest. That unredacting the returns might be a threat to the safety of the individuals involved makes sense at least to me. Note that none of the warrants that are clearly BK's have this reason for their sealing/redacation. Just the victims (alive and dead) and other parties who may once have been investigated or were otherwise involved in the investigation where they were potentially identifiable. MOO

 

[Sister Golden Hair]

Investigators probe Bryan Kohberger's social media in connection with Idaho college murders

The documents include search warrant applications for some of Bryan Kohberger's internet activity.

abcnews.go.com

Investigators are probing the digital footprint of Bryan Kohberger, the suspect accused of killing four Idaho college students in an early morning attack last year, according to new court documents.

I do think that there's more to come. There are definitely some warrants that haven't been updated IMO (BK's finances, for example).

 

[Sundog]

Good info.

BK is in the custody of the Latah County Sheriff, and our jail looks to be a little more inmate friendly from a mail standpoint:
Latah County Jail
Scroll down to Inmate under Additional Information.

MOO: it’s not usual for Latah County jail inmates to have their mail be pre-screened by their lawyers.

MOO & speculation: maybe it’s not unusual in particularly high profile cases pre-trial? IANAL, but I could see a lawyer in that situation making it a requirement of representation. Unless that would be an illegal contract clause or something

Perhaps far-fetched, but could it be that BK's attorney receives the mail first because if something exculpatory in any way shows up in the mail, then Ann Taylor sees it/handles it first, so no claim can be made that BK somehow manipulated the document?

Maybe an attorney could weigh in here with some ideas as to why the attorney would read BK's mail before he receives it.

Or maybe the MSM source that first reported this got it wrong?

 

[10ofRods]

He wouldn't need to hide a camera when he could use their TV's cameras or the camera on their computers.

True. I didn't realize newer TV's have cameras - but if they do, would the TV have to be on? It might have given a somewhat skewed view of who was in the house, if it was on the second floor or in the kitchen.

But if he got access to a device or computer, he'd have a LOT of information. I do wonder if this is what LE meant when someone said this case was going to be surprising and very "large" (data-intensive is what that means to me - 50TB that we know of, is a lot).

I also wonder if on other occasions, Kohberger drove to Moscow and parked elsewhere, in order to practice entering the neighborhood on foot. OTOH, one of my theories is that he was casing more than one house, looking for specific weakness/variables/inhabitants known only to himself (but we can speculate).

Good point about the computers. And even some kind of malware in an attachment (I got malware from a student attachment recently, so that's on my mind). It was sending info about me to someplace on the web. Indeed, when I got the right software to remove it/scan for it, two of those turned up on my computer. I don't think it was using my camera - but it was certainly letting someone know that I was on the internet, what I was looking at, etc.

IMO.

 

[Cool Cats]

Perhaps far-fetched, but could it be that BK's attorney receives the mail first because if something exculpatory in any way shows up in the mail, then Ann Taylor sees it/handles it first, so no claim can be made that BK somehow manipulated the document?

Maybe an attorney could weigh in here with some ideas as to why the attorney would read BK's mail before he receives it.

Or maybe the MSM source that first reported this got it wrong?

3 reasons why BK's attorney could be getting his mail:

1.) Death threats:

Bryan Kohberger receives threatening letters | Banfield

Bryan Kohberger, the man accused of killing four University of Idaho students, has reportedly received love and hate letters. Ex-inmate Larry Levine, founder of Wall Street Prison Consultants, weighs in on "Banfield." #BryanKohberger #IdahoFour #Banfield

www.newsnationnow.com

2.) Mail BK gets can incriminate him in court:

• Never write anything about the inmate's court case you wouldn't want read aloud in court.
• Assume that everything you write will be read by jail staff and can and will be used against you or your inmate in court.

Inmate Mail - Latah County Jail, ID

www.jailexchange.com

3.) Drugs causing jail to reroute mail to 3rd party:

Staff at the Latah County Jail has increasingly been finding letters that are being mailed to inmates being dipped into illegal drugs in liquid form. Because of this crime they may be eliminating all direct mail from families and friends and moving to a system where all personal mail (not legal) is sent to a third party who will either provide photocopies of your letters or will forward them in a digital form to be read by inmates on terminals in their unit.

Instructions on this service are listed below, or will be outlined in detail when this new policy takes affect. If you have any questions, call the Latah County Jail at 208-882-2216.

 

[pittsburghgirl]

100%. It's the stranger (not including online and one way stalking) aspect of this -to my mind -very deliberate act of multiple murder, an intended, calculated and relatively efficient act, - that creates the space/blanks that we all want to see filled. In that absence we have our theories and imaginations. The State, I believe in trial, will concentrate on the who and the how, rather than the why (unless there is an easily fathomable why, which so far we are not seeing - either from the nature of the murders, or from what we know of the defendant and the victims). Ofcourse a confession (no odds imo) might produce a why as per defendant's reasoning. MOO

Informative post, as was the one by Cool Cats to whom you are responding here (100%).

Once we know this is primarily a murder by stranger, the question of motive becomes one of trying to apply normal human reasoning to a monster. Even in a "road rage" type killing, we can see that a killer felt disrespected and threatened but it is not really possible to make the decision to murder someone over a driving issue a "normal" motive. What I'm saying is that what would be a typical motive to a person known by the victim (money, jealousy, "If I can't have you no one can"), just can't apply to a stranger. Such a murderer is killing to feed some twisted psychological need or enact some hideous fantasy that is personal and idiosyncratic to him. So it's not really a "motive" in the sense of providing a rational explanation. It's going to be some sick compulsion.
in some cases).

 

[al66pine]

Digital Technology and Analytics

This should be entered into threads w alpha listing of terms & abbrev's used here.
It would be great if someone find that thread and add.

Anyone? TIA.

 

[Observe_dont_Absorb]

He wouldn't need to hide a camera when he could use their TV's cameras or the camera on their computers.

Oh good point. I'm so tech baffled that things like this are beyond me but yes, nowadays people can hack into devices and remotely activate the audio / visual right?

 

[Observe_dont_Absorb]

True. I didn't realize newer TV's have cameras - but if they do, would the TV have to be on? It might have given a somewhat skewed view of who was in the house, if it was on the second floor or in the kitchen.

But if he got access to a device or computer, he'd have a LOT of information. I do wonder if this is what LE meant when someone said this case was going to be surprising and very "large" (data-intensive is what that means to me - 50TB that we know of, is a lot).

I also wonder if on other occasions, Kohberger drove to Moscow and parked elsewhere, in order to practice entering the neighborhood on foot. OTOH, one of my theories is that he was casing more than one house, looking for specific weakness/variables/inhabitants known only to himself (but we can speculate).

Good point about the computers. And even some kind of malware in an attachment (I got malware from a student attachment recently, so that's on my mind). It was sending info about me to someplace on the web. Indeed, when I got the right software to remove it/scan for it, two of those turned up on my computer. I don't think it was using my camera - but it was certainly letting someone know that I was on the internet, what I was looking at, etc.

IMO.

It's true, newer TVs have cameras just the same as laptops do. One reason for this is so (young) people can have 'watch parties' as per the setting on online video streaming sites - each household logs on and watches a movie at the same time and they can also audio-visual interact with one another live time. Also for gaming, family and social calls, and even work meetings.

 

[10ofRods]

Snipped for focus @10ofRods . Posting a QR code in apt. for party guests?

IDK if I should come out of my cave more frequently or if I should stay waaay back w my quill pen, ink well, & parchment.

I just learned about it this week. I saw a tutorial online on how to do it, while I was simply trying to learn how to use my darned QR reader (phone works just as well). What the QR code does is allows someone with a smart phone to focus their camera on the code and it automatically opens settings, adds the wifi name and the password. Some students take a great deal of pride in how many they have (which also allows them, usually, to use that wifi when in 100 feet of the source).

I assume that BK did not have their wifi, or we wouldn't have heard about the "handshake" thing.

OTOH, KG's wariness about safety (and perhaps even her move home) are concerning. And the other roommate moving out is concerning, as well. Had they noticed something? Maybe they had recently changed their password (and maybe even their party style, since they had only had a smallish get together on Friday, a pre-party, before most went out to other parties.

think this might work better for organized crime and crimes with a purely economic motive- pro theives, smugglers, etc.

I agree, but it's definitely a trend in criminology to apply it to people who commit serial crimes of all kinds. (Rational Choice Theory, is what we've been talking about).

For example, let's say someone commits a rape and then spends a couple of months worrying they'll be caught. They want to rape again, so they try to improve their rape kit, their rape plan etc. They make rational choices, such as using a condom. They invest in rape drugs. We know that rapists do buy condoms and they do buy drugs. They start going places they would never usually go, to pick their victims (etc). They get a burner phone and create fake identities. Rational Choice Theorists cite this as evidence that criminals attempt to behave rationally (so as not to get caught).

I've never seen it applied to organized crime or smugglers, but obviously, that would be another example. I can't link the full article, but the prosecution used RCT to convict Dahmer. He was pleading insanity and the State argued that he made rational choices, in terms of choosing victims and what he did to plan for and commit his heinous crimes. The full article is behind a paywall, and the first page is disturbing so I'm putting it in a spoiler.

He Speaks Not, Yet He Says Everything; What of That: Text, Context, and Pretext in State v. Jeffrey Dahmer 87 Denver University Law Review 2009-2010

HE SPEAKS NOT, YET HE SAYS EVERYTHING; WHAT OFTHAT?: TEXT, CONTEXT, AND PRETEXT IN STATE V.JEFFREY DAHMERGREGORY J. O'MEARA, S.J.t[Dahmer] drill[ed] holes in his living victims' heads, pour[ed] inchemicals to zombify them, ha[d] sex with the corpses' viscera,and ke[pt] some body parts in his...

heinonline.org

I think many criminals think they're being smart and rational. And it can take a lot of other humans to prove that they did what they did.

IMO.

3 reasons why BK's attorney could be getting his mail:

1.) Death threats:

Bryan Kohberger receives threatening letters | Banfield

Bryan Kohberger, the man accused of killing four University of Idaho students, has reportedly received love and hate letters. Ex-inmate Larry Levine, founder of Wall Street Prison Consultants, weighs in on "Banfield." #BryanKohberger #IdahoFour #Banfield

www.newsnationnow.com

2.) Mail BK gets can incriminate him in court:

• Never write anything about the inmate's court case you wouldn't want read aloud in court.
• Assume that everything you write will be read by jail staff and can and will be used against you or your inmate in court.

Inmate Mail - Latah County Jail, ID

www.jailexchange.com

3.) Drugs causing jail to reroute mail to 3rd party:

Staff at the Latah County Jail has increasingly been finding letters that are being mailed to inmates being dipped into illegal drugs in liquid form. Because of this crime they may be eliminating all direct mail from families and friends and moving to a system where all personal mail (not legal) is sent to a third party who will either provide photocopies of your letters or will forward them in a digital form to be read by inmates on terminals in their unit.

Instructions on this service are listed below, or will be outlined in detail when this new policy takes affect. If you have any questions, call the Latah County Jail at 208-882-2216.

I get all of these reasons, but the State does have the right to receive an inmate's mail just for these reasons. Why allow his attorney to protect him if someone is trying to send him contraband? Why protect that person? D inoes he know this person? Does the attorney just stick it in a file? Isn't it necessary to turn over for discovery? (I truly don't know the answer to that).

If people are writing incriminating things to him (they know him and are writing about what they know of him), I guess I can see that.

If the attorney is screening for death threats, ought not the police to be notified if there are any? It's a federal crime.

I am going to assume (perhaps wrongly) that the attorney has to turn over all the mail (but can mark the ones that Bryan prefers not to receive?) It's just such an odd thing. If people are writing to Bryan to offer alibis, etc., that would be very concerning for only his defense attorney to know of them. Jails don't usually allow such a privilege. If I were a longterm inmate in a jail anywhere in Idaho, I'd ask for the same privilege, for sure.

I am also assuming that the jail might screen things first, then give them to the attorney for personalized screening (but MSM hasn't reported that, and might not, as it's more sensationalistic to make it sound like he's privileged in some way). In that way, the attorney can protect Bryan from the negative consequences of his actions (he is presumed innocent, after all but I bet he gets a lot of hate mail).

IMO.