4 Univ of Idaho Students Murdered, Bryan Kohberger Arrested, Moscow, Nov 2022 #89

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Cameras work can be biased though, and through focus and cropping not present the whole situation.
Definitely yes to cameras, but MOO a CSPAN type cam with the single point of view of the whole court minus the jury.

Yes as an movie producer and cinematographer can verify - camera work can be a powerful thing just like any other medium. I guess the way around this is to have certain agreed fixed angles sort of like CCTV where there is no 'camera work' just 'recording'.
 
He had a silver flashlight when he was searched so good chance he had a flashlight with him that night. SG said he likely wasn't expecting 2 girls in the bed.

If surprised to find 2 people he could have used his flashlight to see who was who. He pulled back the comforter to get a better look and holding a flashlight and a sheath and a knife he dropped the sheath and the comforter fell over it.

When SG says KG was both attacked and stabbed I think BK was trying to subdue her such as grabbing and pushing. The coroner will be able to tell by the bruising if there is any from that type of force.

2 Cents
The thought of a flashlight is scary to me, because if he was holding one, he could have used it to blind the victims, or even as another weapon. It seems unlikely that he would want something in both hands, although it's just as unlikely he would go into the house without being able to see. If M had her fairy lights on in her room, he probably could see that from the window, and the good vibes and fairy lights in the living room also. Maybe he didn't think he needed any extra light?

I still question the "there's someone here," comment, and what transpired after it was said. Was it said because of the noises coming from upstairs, did someone see someone, or maybe someone saw the sliding door was opened? At that point, did anyone downstairs turn a light on, in the kitchen, in X's room, etc.?
 
The thought of a flashlight is scary to me, because if he was holding one, he could have used it to blind the victims, or even as another weapon. It seems unlikely that he would want something in both hands, although it's just as unlikely he would go into the house without being able to see. If M had her fairy lights on in her room, he probably could see that from the window, and the good vibes and fairy lights in the living room also. Maybe he didn't think he needed any extra light?

I still question the "there's someone here," comment, and what transpired after it was said. Was it said because of the noises coming from upstairs, did someone see someone, or maybe someone saw the sliding door was opened? At that point, did anyone downstairs turn a light on, in the kitchen, in X's room, etc.?
I think that X discovered an open slider, one which had just minutes prior been closed... she shut it, set her food down, returned to E and said someone is here...

Which BK heard. And IMO that's how one murder became two became four.

Jmo
 
The thought of a flashlight is scary to me, because if he was holding one, he could have used it to blind the victims, or even as another weapon. It seems unlikely that he would want something in both hands, although it's just as unlikely he would go into the house without being able to see. If M had her fairy lights on in her room, he probably could see that from the window, and the good vibes and fairy lights in the living room also. Maybe he didn't think he needed any extra light?

I still question the "there's someone here," comment, and what transpired after it was said. Was it said because of the noises coming from upstairs, did someone see someone, or maybe someone saw the sliding door was opened? At that point, did anyone downstairs turn a light on, in the kitchen, in X's room, etc.?

I've read a few different people's theories that are a little bit to graphic for my liking -but- regardless what I'd like to know is if people are persuaded of these theories, why do they think that no-one screamed, yelled, shouted, smashed a window, grabbed their phone and rang 999 etc. They would have been fighting for their lives, tipping over furniture, throwing things, grabbing things to defend themselves with. It was only one man with a knife after all.

Personally I don't think anyone fought back -or- put up a ferocious fight *unless* the other housemates' accounts are woefully missing some detail. I think they were probably very drunk and very fast asleep. Hopefully never knew what happened. X would have been the least asleep having not long since received her door dash and probably eaten it. In fact I can't imagine how she wasn't still up and about as the timing was so close.
 
I've read a few different people's theories that are a little bit to graphic for my liking -but- regardless what I'd like to know is if people are persuaded of these theories, why do they think that no-one screamed, yelled, shouted, smashed a window, grabbed their phone and rang 999 etc. They would have been fighting for their lives, tipping over furniture, throwing things, grabbing things to defend themselves with. It was only one man with a knife after all.

Personally I don't think anyone fought back -or- put up a ferocious fight *unless* the other housemates' accounts are woefully missing some detail. I think they were probably very drunk and very fast asleep. Hopefully never knew what happened. X would have been the least asleep having not long since received her door dash and probably eaten it. In fact I can't imagine how she wasn't still up and about as the timing was so close.
LE did say in the PCA that X was on Tik Tok at 4:12, so she was most likely awake the entire time. It's so scary to think about. My bet is that the whole thing was much noisier than what the PCA suggests. Even SG said the coroner said it was a "hell of a battle" downstairs.
 
There will always be "still shots" of the defendant smiling or laughing, that type of thing, but in court a camera focused on a witness from the time they are sworn in and give their name until they are excused, can't be edited.

When there are no cameras it is the news articles that edit what the witness says which can get taken out of context. 50 pages of court testimony gets distilled into a one page article.

2 Cents
They can edit. Not the actual live feed but feeds that are uploaded to Youtube for people to watch later on can be downloaded and people can edit to their heart's content. Now-adays someone could also use AI to alter them. Actually, now that I think about it, someone could use AI and create their own feed from footage already available. And people can be very gullible.... They might as well have the cameras. I anticipate that it's going to be a mess either way. Might as well be a mess with one accurate version of events available to everyone.
 
Cameras don't lie. It's when you take the cameras out and have to depend on others interpretation of what occurred that you run into problems.

jmo
I watched some of the hearing and the Judge seemed to make a special point of CourtTV's use of commentators and cherry-picking of clips.
So obviously selectively edited footage can be misleading. (Most of the public wouldn't watch every hour of every day's hearing and would rely on re-packages )

Nonetheless, I thought some of the judge's arguments were lame. ( eg using OJ trial as an analogy where the Defence team sought out as much media attention as possible)

Anyway, I just hope that if he decides on audio feed only ( I assume delayed like Vallow) that they manage to provide adequate mics and sound because so far, it's been poor
 
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Interesting how cameras don't lie but what they show is not the full picture in many instances. And then there is deliberately editing to create a specific narrative.
While this is true, in video, interpretation it is somewhat left up to the viewer. "In the eye of the beholder", so to speak. When we do not have cameras in the courtroom, the interpretation is left to the point of view/agenda of the reporter, with no way of us, the public, being able to judge for ourselves.
 
They can edit. Not the actual live feed but feeds that are uploaded to Youtube for people to watch later on can be downloaded and people can edit to their heart's content. Now-adays someone could also use AI to alter them. Actually, now that I think about it, someone could use AI and create their own feed from footage already available. And people can be very gullible.... They might as well have the cameras. I anticipate that it's going to be a mess either way. Might as well be a mess with one accurate version of events available to everyone.

The public can slice and dice but not legit news sources if they even care about their reputations and YouTube accounts. Libel/slander comes to mind.
 
I've read a few different people's theories that are a little bit to graphic for my liking -but- regardless what I'd like to know is if people are persuaded of these theories, why do they think that no-one screamed, yelled, shouted, smashed a window, grabbed their phone and rang 999 etc. They would have been fighting for their lives, tipping over furniture, throwing things, grabbing things to defend themselves with. It was only one man with a knife after all.

Personally I don't think anyone fought back -or- put up a ferocious fight *unless* the other housemates' accounts are woefully missing some detail. I think they were probably very drunk and very fast asleep. Hopefully never knew what happened. X would have been the least asleep having not long since received her door dash and probably eaten it. In fact I can't imagine how she wasn't still up and about as the timing was so close.
In the USA we call 911.

Allegedly X and K fought for their lives. It is possible that K saw the attacker as he came into M‘s bedroom and said “Someone’s here.” to try to awaken M. If DM’s account is correct I trust that she would know K’s voice. According to Mr. G, K was trapped between the wall and M so she couldn’t flee. All JMO.

It is possible that those who were awake were too frightened to scream. It is possible that the attack was so sudden no one could get to their phones to try to call for help. I am less certain about what happened in X’s room. Her father said she fought for her life. DM said she heard crying. E may have been attacked on the bed but allegedly wound up on the floor blocking the door. Allegedly there is a loud thud on the sound from the camera next door. I do wonder how DM and BF did not hear that and go to investigate? All JMO.
 
While this is true, in video, interpretation it is somewhat left up to the viewer. "In the eye of the beholder", so to speak. When we do not have cameras in the courtroom, the interpretation is left to the point of view/agenda of the reporter, with no way of us, the public, being able to judge for ourselves.
Exactly and we all know already that some of the writers covering this case have written incorrect information.
 
I've read a few different people's theories that are a little bit to graphic for my liking -but- regardless what I'd like to know is if people are persuaded of these theories, why do they think that no-one screamed, yelled, shouted, smashed a window, grabbed their phone and rang 999 etc. They would have been fighting for their lives, tipping over furniture, throwing things, grabbing things to defend themselves with. It was only one man with a knife after all.

Personally I don't think anyone fought back -or- put up a ferocious fight *unless* the other housemates' accounts are woefully missing some detail. I think they were probably very drunk and very fast asleep. Hopefully never knew what happened. X would have been the least asleep having not long since received her door dash and probably eaten it. In fact I can't imagine how she wasn't still up and about as the timing was so close.
My personal opinion is that many of those fight back theories have been (probably unintentionally) inspired by watching action movies. I do think it's important (and by design) that the killer struck during the same early morning hours that Special Forces and SWAT often plan their raids. People are more deeply asleep, reflexes are slower, etc. By the time victim #1 consciously knew they were in trouble, I believe they were already severely injured and probably incapable of fighting back or screaming. At least imo.

It seems that victim #2 was slow to awaken. When people are in a place they feel safe, like their home, the subconscious often tends to assign mundane explanations for things heard, rather than concluding that their housemates are being murdered right next to them. She was apparently also trapped against the wall so, once she woke up, there would be no throwing things or flipping anything over. It also seems to me that BK would have to be up on the bed in some way to contain and kill victim #2. That could be when he lost track of the sheath. It should also mean he got blood on him. No time to look for the sheath, things have gotten complicated. So he comes downstairs and runs into Ethan and Xana.

I agree that X would have been the least asleep, which seems to be confirmed by what is believed to be her saying "someone is here". People don't just make announcements in the dead of night, so she was probably talking to Ethan. It seems interesting to me that there is no sense of concern assigned to X saying that, so some things have been left out of the PCA at this point. X is also the one who would seem most likely to have the time and awareness to scream. Once she woke Ethan, I would expect him to try and protect her. Fighting for ones life is a consuming, quiet business, so I don't think Ethan would make much noise, but he might have challenged BK (Hey you!) and that might have been heard. Maybe X screamed as Ethan was attacked, or maybe she was frozen in horror. It's possible that quite a bit has been left out of the PCA at that point and will come out at trial.

MOOooo
 
Well we will have to wait for the hearing to find out details but with four people dead, two survivors, and not one single report of anyone yelling, screaming, pleading, or yelping in shock ... something doesn't stack up in that regard, unless everyone was pretty much fast asleep.

In a house that previous residents have stated the boards creak, where footfall can be heard, and has no sound proof or insulation. BK really got a bit exceptionally lucky didn't he? Not only that but a home with a dog and even then nobody even noticed for so many hours afterwards. It's unimaginable to me.
 
My personal opinion is that many of those fight back theories have been (probably unintentionally) inspired by watching action movies. I do think it's important (and by design) that the killer struck during the same early morning hours that Special Forces and SWAT often plan their raids. People are more deeply asleep, reflexes are slower, etc. By the time victim #1 consciously knew they were in trouble, I believe they were already severely injured and probably incapable of fighting back or screaming. At least imo.
RSBBM. This is exactly where I've been from the beginning. I don't know what BK's motive might have been to go into that house and murder people, but I believe his background interest (possible obsession) in military and LE is significant. JMO. I very much think it looks like he was playing Special Ops the entire time, from the planning all the way to his exit out. I'm likely 100% incorrect, but I think it's possible his motive was the thrill of carrying out a mission like some bad a * *, rather than obsessing over a girl or an ideology. Logically, I think both the latter are much more plausible than my own idea, but I just can't shake it. JMO.
 
Info Not in PCA. Deliberately or Not. Non-dissemination Order
.... what is believed to be her saying "someone is here". .... no sense of concern assigned to X saying that, so some things have been left out of the PCA at this point....
he might have challenged BK (Hey you!) and that might have been heard. Maybe X screamed as Ethan was attacked.... It's possible that quite a bit has been left out of the PCA at that point and will come out at trial. MOOooo
@maskedwoman snipped for focus Good post, agreeing,
quite a bit of info was not included in the PCA.

When drafting it, LE may have already had that ^those^ bits of info but saw no need to include them in PCA to support the arrest.

Some other "gaps" in PCA's narrative were filled by LE's further investigation. The def. team has (likely) received the info the state is obligated to provide thru discovery.
And here we are, discussing the gaps.

Question:
Between public release of PCA & judge's non-dissemination order, did LE or prosecutor release further evidentiary info re the case? TiA
I cannot recall any but may very well have missed it or may not have noted the timing.
 
This is one example of what I mean when I say I can't stand 'Trial by Tweet. There are always going to inaccuracies in re-reporting the facts. Just like in the Murdaugh (Corey Fleming) case yesterday, first it was 10 year sentence and then corrected to 20 years. But after sooooo many tweets.

Gaaaaah, it drives me nuts. :mad:
 
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