Allison Baden-Clay - GENERAL DISCUSSION THREAD #45

[HeartRuledHead]

So GBC was not permitted to call TM's mobile phone number, because that upset Allison. (According to the self made rules of an adulterous relationship.)

But GBC WAS able to call TM's work number. (Because that number could not be proven to be calling TM.)

And inexplicably it was OK to call using the personal mobile phone number (that USED ..past tense..to upset Allison so much) from 20th April.

From TM's statement: "I am presently employed with Blocksidge and Ferguson, a real estate company located in Adelaide Street Brisbane City as a full
time Property Manager. I have been employed with this company since the 13th April, 2012."

From the phone records: Then there was a call to Blocksidge and Ferguson, Real Estate agents in Brisbane @ 2.43pm on 19 April lasting 5.03 minutes.

All interesting....

I wonder if he would just call her and let it ring once then hang up, prompting her to call back. I know friends of mine have their children on pre-paid mobiles do that because of the price difference between their children calling and them calling their kid, also to save their child's pre-paid credit.

You would think that they would have worked out a number of "systems" to stay under the radar over the years of their "relationship"

 

[HeartRuledHead]

I have often wondered if Toni's mournful looks at Gerard at the Committal Hearing have anythng to do with the problem that everything Toni thinks she knows about Allison has one source. Gerard.

I think she is feeling "how could you do this to US (us being TM & GBC) she obviously thought they had a plan and some sort of normality in the future. I'm not saying she wouldn't be motified over what happened to Allison, and shocked that ther person she loved was capable of such evil. Though I do think she feels like he has ended more lives than one. She is probably mournful of the life she though was coming, the one he had promised. I think she is angry at him for that and as angry at what he did to Allison and her daughters.

 

[HeartRuledHead]

If I was Allison and knew TM would be there... I wouldn't go, I would kick and scream the whole way there if I was forced. I wouldn't want to see her from across the road let alone be in the same room as her.

I think in more cases than not its the person in the "wrong" who gets to go to the events, weddings etc and the person who has been wronged who misses out. Which is odd, you would think you wouldn't want to show your face when you are in the wrong, or that you would have "I didn't do it, I've got nothing to hide" attitude and not let the person stop you.

Doesn't seem to work that way from what I've witnessed.

All moo

 

[Trooper]

I think she is feeling "how could you do this to US (us being TM & GBC) she obviously thought they had a plan and some sort of normality in the future. I'm not saying she wouldn't be motified over what happened to Allison, and shocked that ther person she loved was capable of such evil. Though I do think she feels like he has ended more lives than one. She is probably mournful of the life she though was coming, the one he had promised. I think she is angry at him for that and as angry at what he did to Allison and her daughters.

I think , and there are reasonable grounds to think it, that Gerard and Toni talked endlessly about the great day when they , or it, or whatever they called this venture , would be 'normal'... Stokiing the fires of the plan, the days to come, the time when all conditions would be met, when 'unconditional' meant free, free of this torment.. it really only required Allisons 'removal'... Allisons .. well... Allison just removed. However. Whatever. A lot of talk about that, for sure.. .. there had to be, because all the plans, the 'normalisation', depended on that one obstacle, didnt it?

Everything depended on it. .. That obstacle was the one thing, the only thing that was preventing this enititlement, this reward, this goal. And for Gerard , it had the one element that trumped all others. Money.

SO I would think a lot of talk and a lot of time about how that could be achieved would be invested... no one would say murder, but lots of other words, removal, gone, out, away, disappear, all that sort of inference....

 

[BreakingNews]

My heart goes out to the Dickies this Easter. Allison spent last Easter with her parents and that was the last time they saw her alive. Allison's parting words to her mother were "Love you."

Maybe a good time for us all to make another donation to the children's fund.
:sunshine::angel2::angel2::angel2:

 

[HeartRuledHead]

I think , and there are reasonable grounds to think it, that Gerard and Toni talked endlessly about the great day when they , or it, or whatever they called this venture , would be 'normal'... Stokiing the fires of the plan, the days to come, the time when all conditions would be met, when 'unconditional' meant free, free of this torment.. it really only required Allisons 'removal'... Allisons .. well... Allison just removed. However. Whatever. A lot of talk about that, for sure.. .. there had to be, because all the plans, the 'normalisation', depended on that one obstacle, didnt it?

Everything depended on it. .. That obstacle was the one thing, the only thing that was preventing this enititlement, this reward, this goal. And for Gerard , it had the one element that trumped all others. Money.

SO I would think a lot of talk and a lot of time about how that could be achieved would be invested... no one would say murder, but lots of other words, removal, gone, out, away, disappear, all that sort of inference....

Why is it not reasonable for Toni to think GBC would so what she did, up and left her husband - whom she still maintains a civil relationship with!?

Why did it have to be talks of "removal" or any of the other words you mentioned.

Every single day people leave the spouses and moves on to a "normal" life after ex - in many cases ex-partners can maintain a relationship.

I do not believe for one second that TM thought that him coming to her unconditionally (just as she did to him, by leaving Rob 3 months into the affair) ever meant anything sinister, certainly not murder. As I have read on here "what ever happened to good old fashioned divorce" - I'm sure TM would be wondering the same thing.

MOO

 

[Trooper]

which goes to the point of premeditation, naturally.

Perhaps, Toni's 5 th Statement, delves into this a tiny bit.. its not improbable. After all, Gerard is charged with Murder, not manslaughter, or accidental death, or even criminal neglect.. there are , it appears from the charges laid, an element of premeditation, and as for the 'Interfering with a corpse'.. that s a whole other element, the inference can be drawn that Gerard was present at her death, and the discarding of her body.

See, Gerard had two things to accomplish Allisons removal from the success of his plans, and the collection of her insurance.. . a dicey combo, because, .. to collect the insurance, her body has to be found. .. and the difficult thing is, if her body was found in an obvious state of suicide, he would lose out on the collection of the insurance monies.. You dont collect the insurance payout on an obvious suicide, unfortunately.. Insurance companies take a dim view of this.

So Gerard has a three pronged problem. She has to be lost, then found , yet an accidental death.. * which may have upped the payout* .... and he has to be utterly distanced from these 3 prongs.... a 4th prong to the problem, if you will.

 

[Trooper]

Why is it not reasonable for Toni to think GBC would so what she did, up and left her husband - whom she still maintains a civil relationship with!?

* edited by me*

MOO

It would have been reasonable, IF Gerard had done this.. but he didnt, did he... he simply didnt up and leave Allison. ..he not only doesnt do it, he fires her, and tells her its over.. days go by, weeks go by, months go by, and then its years go by.. years of her life gone, gone , gone.. so its at a point where it IS unreasonable for Toni to think that Gerard is going to leave that marriage. And Gerard has told her all the barriers to this happening. He tells her a new barrier at predictable intervals. There is no reason for Toni to believe it will happen without some catalyst. No rational reason, that is.

 

[Maigret]

Quite possible a blazing row started immediately upon GBC's arrival home. When Allison learned that not only was the TM relationship still ongoing, or resumed, she would also be going to same conference.
And that's only one side of the equation.
Add to that, one angry narcissistic sociopathic (IMO) husband who was pressured from all corners.

Absolutely and I think the call to OW was either Allison calling to say GBC was scaring her or it was GBC using Allison's phone to call his dad for help

 

[Maigret]

Perhaps Toni called Allison to tell her she would be at the conference - we only have her word that she didn't call Allison ever in fact she states it very emphatically and then she deleted data from her phone ( statement number 4)

 

[emirates1957]

Lol
My ex wanted to have me as his 'bit on the side' after we separated

My ex contacted me 10 years later wondering why I had left him. I explained that I was scared. He looked at me as if he could not believe what I was saying. When somebody puts a double barrel shot gun under your chin and tells you to shut up when your gagging on a chicken bone (he was watching TV and could not hear) - I guess will do it everytime. This person was a professional - well spoken etc etc. His persona was everything to him. I laugh now - only a few months of knowing him - I found him flushing a $300.00 jumper down the toilet (yep down the toilet) - he was angry that there was a pulled thread !!!!! We ended up living in his sisters garage for 2 years to pay off his debts. Then he went out an bought a new Jaguar on hire purchase in those days. In a much happier place now fortunately.

 

[Trooper]

Why is it not reasonable for Toni to think GBC would so what she did, up and left her husband - whom she still maintains a civil relationship with!?

*edited by me*
this email, from Toni to Bruce Overland * Gerard* gives a bit of insight into how Toni was thinking that Gerard was not going to be as pragmatic and sensible as you make Toni out to be in regard to his marriage, Heart..


Taken from the Statement by the Computer Recovery, Neil Robertson..

The context of this email was as follows

'Well youll have to forgive me that I feel disappointed when this happens. Im sick of hiding ...Im sick of being second best and having to take the back seat--all so she doesnt find out . Why should I believe things are going to be any diffferent than the past. I shouldnt ...Thats the reality. She gave you an uhimatum and you honoured it ???If l were to do the same tomorrow .. I doubt you'd be able to pay me the sarne respecL Why should I accept anything less than she does? All im doing at the moment, is pacilying your ****ed Relationship!! thats not fair G..'.1

Doesnt sound to me like someone who believes this thing is going to follow the same pattern of breakup that Toni managed to achieve with her partner, Heart..

 

[Maigret]

*edited by me*
this email, from Toni to Bruce Overland * Gerard* gives a bit of insight into how Toni was thinking that Gerard was not going to be as pragmatic and sensible as you make Toni out to be in regard to his marriage, Heart..


Taken from the Statement by the Computer Recovery, Neil Robertson..

The context of this email was as follows

'Well youll have to forgive me that I feel disappointed when this happens. Im sick of hiding ...Im sick of being second best and having to take the back seat--all so she doesnt find out . Why should I believe things are going to be any diffferent than the past. I shouldnt ...Thats the reality. She gave you an uhimatum and you honoured it ???If l were to do the same tomorrow .. I doubt you'd be able to pay me the sarne respecL Why should I accept anything less than she does? All im doing at the moment, is pacilying your ****ed Relationship!! thats not fair G..'.1

Doesnt sound to me like someone who believes this thing is going to follow the same pattern of breakup that Toni managed to achieve with her partner, Heart..

So maybe she did call Allison - desperate and upset -

 

[Trooper]

So maybe she did call Allison - desperate and upset -

Its only my opinion.. but I dont think Toni had the poise to carry that off, really. Not do it, actually speak to Allison whom she has never spoken to before and then get up and go to that terribly important seminar. She was relying on Gerard to give her one damn win out of all this relentless nonsense. .. just one win.. Let me go to this seminar without Allison being there, it made her sick to think of it.

I just cant see her doing that, ringing Allison and laying out her own ultimatum. She has to believe in Gerards 'plan',,, that he is going to have it all sorted by July 1st. Really, thats all she has ...Actually ringing Allison to lay this challenge down is not flying for me... my opinion only.

I do maintain though, that Gerard didnt deliver that ultimatum to Allison either.

 

[Trooper]

its not impossible to believe that he played around with it, though. . Stuff like, Gee I dont think you should go, maybe two of you dont need to go * Toni's suggestion* .. or, gosh, Allison, I need you to do some other work tomorrow, or look, I just cant fit minding the kids into this timeline , allison, let Kate go on her own, all that kind of waffle..

Him saying to Allison, Toni says you are not to go, because she is going......... dont see that occurring.

 

[possumheart]

Personally, I don't understand what the consequences of TM and A being at the same conference would have been. Surely Allison's head would held her head high believing the affair to be over. Seemingly she would have had K by her side for support and as a distraction. TM supposedly was sick with worry. Yet we know A had the flu at the time (and wasn't shaking it) and TM went to bed sick after the conference (same flu perhaps?). And obviously G had been manipulating the truth with all concerned. I just don't see how it escalated to this????

 

[Trooper]

Personally, I don't understand what the consequences of TM and A being at the same conference would have been. Surely Allison's head would held her head high believing the affair to be over. Seemingly she would have had K by her side for support and as a distraction. TM supposedly was sick with worry. Yet we know A had the flu at the time (and wasn't shaking it) and TM went to bed sick after the conference (same flu perhaps?). And obviously G had been manipulating the truth with all concerned. I just don't see how it escalated to this????

Something about that escapes me too, Poss....

Why was it such a big deal to Toni? And it was a huge deal. SHe had been frozen in horror seeing Allison at the gym..

I think, that for Toni, it was a matter of 'respect'.. she wanted to go to this thing not as the hunted, but as the hunter.....She wanted Gerard to take on board her suggestions as to why Allison shouldnt go. .she just wanted a win.. . they were few and far between, one must admit. Just one thing, one victory, one time when she came first. How Gerard was going to accompish it, I dont think she thought thru..

madness.

 

[Maigret]

Personally, I don't understand what the consequences of TM and A being at the same conference would have been. Surely Allison's head would held her head high believing the affair to be over. Seemingly she would have had K by her side for support and as a distraction. TM supposedly was sick with worry. Yet we know A had the flu at the time (and wasn't shaking it) and TM went to bed sick after the conference (same flu perhaps?). And obviously G had been manipulating the truth with all concerned. I just don't see how it escalated to this????

Yes at those sort of things it's hard to find someone if you are looking for them

 

[possumheart]

Yes at those sort of things it's hard to find someone if you are looking for them

Do you think G knew that K would seek out TM?

Maybe they all had the 'find my friend' app?

 

[marlywings]

Taken from the Statement by the Computer Recovery, Neil Robertson..

The context of this email was as follows

'Well youll have to forgive me that I feel disappointed when this happens. Im sick of hiding ...Im sick of being second best and having to take the back seat--all so she doesnt find out . Why should I believe things are going to be any diffferent than the past. I shouldnt ...Thats the reality. She gave you an uhimatum and you honoured it ???If l were to do the same tomorrow .. I doubt you'd be able to pay me the sarne respecL Why should I accept anything less than she does? All im doing at the moment, is pacilying your ****ed Relationship!! thats not fair G..'.1

Doesnt sound to me like someone who believes this thing is going to follow the same pattern of breakup that Toni managed to achieve with her partner, Heart..

BBM

In reference to the bolded..She She She. I think the mistress was dripping with pure jealousy!! Allison had what she wanted but couldn't have.

So much of life is all about choices. TM CHOSE to hook up with a married guy. The mistress has no one except herself to blame for putting herself into that position.