Any Elisa Updates At All?

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LittleWing

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Is it possible she was on top of the cistern taking photos of the skyline....she has similar photos on her Instagram.....and the lid was off and in the dark she couldn't see properly (and without her glasses) ...and she stepped into the open hole and fell right inside and couldn't get out :(


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walklikeacat

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Great done Little Wing!! I really would like to read more about how they look upon all circumstances. If accidently, how could it happen? Yes, you got one theory. Of course it is some kind of a relief...but it is still very strange.
 

margarita25

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Is it possible she was on top of the cistern taking photos of the skyline....she has similar photos on her Instagram.....and the lid was off and in the dark she couldn't see properly (and without her glasses) ...and she stepped into the open hole and fell right inside and couldn't get out :(


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Good thought! Of all the theories, haven't heard of this possibility yet.
Has there been any mention of any other items in the tank with her? Plus, she was without her clothing (if that is fact or not, not certain)...
 

walklikeacat

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Can I pm somebody who can give them a call??
Of course you can pm me and I can do it. I was also thinking about costs, I don´t think this service is for free...or? But it would be best if someone in the U.S. or the West Coast could take out the report. Do you know if they can send it as an pdf?
 

walklikeacat

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Is it possible she was on top of the cistern taking photos of the skyline....she has similar photos on her Instagram.....and the lid was off and in the dark she couldn't see properly (and without her glasses) ...and she stepped into the open hole and fell right inside and couldn't get out :(
That is a one theory and I can´t really put together any other theory. If it was accidental then the lid must have been open though it was not so wide, but wide enough for her tiny body.
 

bobmeier

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Wow, I have checked this Forum regularly for updates for months, and now this... I dont know what to think yet. At least that would mean she didnt have to face a killer, I guess thats some small solace.

Sadly, I am in Europe too, so no good possibility for me to call and request the Report either, but it would definitly be interesting to know the details.
 
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Accidental? I am VERY interested to see that tox report.
 

Conductor71

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Response from la coroner's office says Elisa's death was determined an accidental drowning

I was told that we can call a number for public services and give the case reference number to obtain the public record of her autopsy report. Can I pm somebody who can give them a call???


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I called. The cost is $86 which is way more than I expected. I had seen some posts elsewhere that it was more like $26 for a corononer's report. What's odd though is the clerk had to put me on hold a couple of minutes and then gave me the price- she had the case number. I can't believe the toxicology reports cost $60 extra!

It is weird too how no reporter will touch this story, yet the clerk simply tells you the cause of death in an email? Sure, this is public domain but it makes the media thing even stranger. Now, I really want to see that tox report!

Anyway, I cannot justify parting with $90, but I will order the reports if you kind peeps can help offset the cost. If you PM me, I will give you my PayPal info and then you will have full report access. We can then decide if we want to post any details here. I can chip in up to $30 -please PM me if you want to go this route.

Any other ideas on how to make this work?
 
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Conductor, do they send the report via hard copy in the snail mail, or a digital file?

Re: the price, their site says "Fees are varied, depending on the type of autopsy/examination performed and type of report compiled". So I guess Elisa's report is of the more expensive "type".
 

walklikeacat

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I can chip in up to $30 -please PM me if you want to go this route.

Any other ideas on how to make this work?
I can go for 30 dollar too. Of course it would be greater if we were 8-9 people paying a smaller part. Shall we wait awhile - say a day - and see if someone else can join?
 

mbkerr

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LA Weekly is saying there were no drugs found in her system.

http://blogs.laweekly.com/informer/2013/06/elisa_lam_accidental_drowning_bipolar.php

The strange saga of Elisa Lam, a 21-year-old tourist whose body was found in a water tank feeding the faucets of the Cecil Hotel near Skid Row in downtown L.A., has come to an end.
And in what will surely be a disappointment for conspiracy theorists, the death was ruled accidental:

That's what the L.A. County coroner's office told the Weekly today. Coroner's Lt. Fred Corral says:

The cause of death was accidental due to drowning and other significant conditions, mainly bipolar disorder.
He said she had a history of bipolar disorder (which might explain her strange behavior in a hotel elevator that was caught on video), he said.

Were their drugs in her system? "That's not listed here," Corral said, "no."

Asked if she might have tried to commit suicide he also said no.
 

LittleWing

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I'd be willing to chip in for the report, though I doubt it will provide any satisfying conclusions.

No drugs in her system, at all? If she decided to stop taking her meds, how long would it be for traces to be completely cleared from her system??

And how do we find any other details out about the investigation, ie whether the found anything with her, etc?

I guess our emails started it all...and investigators really were keeping their eyes on this forum. It's almost like the information was fully revealed and reported on publicly begrudgingly. Like an afterthought. So weird. I honestly wonder how long they would've sat on this if that one helpful man from the coroners office didn't respond to a simple email.


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walklikeacat

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Yes, I really would like to take part of the investigation to see how everything was done. We will get the autopsy report and based on what is within it, then we can move one step further and try to get the investigation...if it is available.

I have posted a new thread in a swedish forum under the concept of psychology current her bipolar disease, I want to know what people say and think when looking at the video from the elevator by bipolar eyes. I hope to get some answers.
 

gitana1

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Is it possible she was on top of the cistern taking photos of the skyline....she has similar photos on her Instagram.....and the lid was off and in the dark she couldn't see properly (and without her glasses) ...and she stepped into the open hole and fell right inside and couldn't get out :(

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That is a one theory and I can´t really put together any other theory. If it was accidental then the lid must have been open though it was not so wide, but wide enough for her tiny body.

I think what's probable is that in a psychotic state - which every mental health professional who posted on here thought she was in, in the video - Elisa took her clothes off, climbed up as high as she could, much like the odd drawings on her social media pages, and slipped into the cistern.

It is accidental because she didn't intend to kill herself, she just didn't know what she was doing.

Good job guys for trying to keep the pressure on. I think it was sad that so few news agencies thought this was a story worthy of continuing coverage.
It was certainly a bizarre one and I never understood why no one in the media seemed to care.
 

harperluu

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I'd chip in as well. But I think this was the easy way out. We saw no witness statements. No release of other hotel footage. Very limited media coverage. I don't buy it, and if it were true I'd love to hear the investigators scenario. Frustrating.
 

Conductor71

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I disagree completely. If it wasn't suicide, murder/manslaughter or natural causes then the only option left is accidental. She had posted rooftop pics before so it is not a stretch to believe that she would make her way up there. When a person is in a manic, delusional or psychotic state it is not reasonable to expect a logical chain of events or behavior.

From I have understand there is also the option to choose "undetermined". IMO, the possibility of her having a psychotic attack, at least publicly, are no further substantiated than before. I believe the coroner's office and LAPD need to have tangible forensic proof in that they cannot explain any of this beyond her having a history of bipolar disorder. I do not want to rehash the mental health argument anymore. IF a full psychological autopsy was completed, I would be fine with the conclusion. This means that they would have interviewed family and friends as witnesses to her diagnosis and poured over police investigation reports along with her medical condition. I do not get the sense this was done. For all I know, they simply read her Tumblr. Not likely, but I think in a bizarre case like this, they could provide a bit more detail without being disrespectful.

Really at this point logic is a moot point as their is no logic involved in what she purportedly did, right? So all we really have to go on is the coroner's opinion, and I think that the division here centers on how we all feel about authority.

Determining cause and manner of death is fairly subjective and the conclusion is based on limited evidence present at the time of death. When members here discount a lack of evidence for foul play do you ever consider that nearly two weeks passed while she was in that tank. How extensive do you think this investigation went beyond searching the hotel and checking her cell phone? Given that a common response by LAPD was "I don't know" you would think that their academy taught the Ronald Reagan method of investigation.

I also discovered that the only time a body is released back to the family for burial is when there are no signs of foul play. EL was released for burial in early March, so they probably actively investigated for 3 weeks at most after she was found. We know they did not even thoroughly search the hotel. It is well documented that in cases of equivocal death very little of anything is found at the scene, yet the LAPD told the CBC they had evidence she had been harmed or was in danger- this means from her self? What ever became of her cell phone? Fingerprints are seldom viable after one week, but did they even try? With SAR dogs finding no trace of her, they should have been looking for trace evidence like fibers or something. I don't think the roof was ever treated as a crime scene.

The coroner's office itself has a checkered history. The actress Brittany Murphy's autopsy was bungled by the coroner's dept. Both she and her husband died within a few months of one another and both had acute, severe vomiting just days before dying. Ed Winter publicly admitted they collected hair samples but never saw fit to run tests for toxins or poisons! Instead her death was ruled an accident due to pneumonia, anemia, and "multiple drugs" none of them illegal. The case is now re-opened with the coroner and her family in court.

Why is that we should take everything a person whom society has conferred some degree of authority at face value without knowing his professional history or education? The diagnosis of Bipolar Disorder itself is hardly scientific and there is a large margin for error. Many coroners do not pass state boards, not all are medical doctors with some only having a high school education. Los Angeles hired an incompetent apprentice coroner a few years back who failed to disclose he had previously been fired. He was already flailing in his role, and when they found out he lied they still gave him close to a year to get his act together.

http://californiawatch.org/postmortem

I think that due to losing 2 weeks of time, they opted for the easy way out and knew they were going to go with accident all along. Her parents must be in shock. I just hope that if they are not satisfied with this they pursue the truth.
 

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BlueShoe

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At one point some people mentioned chipping in to purchase a full autopsy report. Is that still a possibility? It would be great if a group of us could afford it, because I remember it was quite pricy.
 

LittleWing

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At one point some people mentioned chipping in to purchase a full autopsy report. Is that still a possibility? It would be great if a group of us could afford it, because I remember it was quite pricy.

A few of us have chipped in for one and Conductor71 has mailed the formal request. They don't do digital copies so we will have to wait for it through snail mail.


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findinganatta

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From I have understand there is also the option to choose "undetermined". IMO, the possibility of her having a psychotic attack, at least publicly, are no further substantiated than before. I believe the coroner's office and LAPD need to have tangible forensic proof in that they cannot explain any of this beyond her having a history of bipolar disorder. I do not want to rehash the mental health argument anymore. IF a full psychological autopsy was completed, I would be fine with the conclusion. This means that they would have interviewed family and friends as witnesses to her diagnosis and poured over police investigation reports along with her medical condition. I do not get the sense this was done. For all I know, they simply read her Tumblr. Not likely, but I think in a bizarre case like this, they could provide a bit more detail without being disrespectful.

Really at this point logic is a moot point as their is no logic involved in what she purportedly did, right? So all we really have to go on is the coroner's opinion, and I think that the division here centers on how we all feel about authority.

Determining cause and manner of death is fairly subjective and the conclusion is based on limited evidence present at the time of death. When members here discount a lack of evidence for foul play do you ever consider that nearly two weeks passed while she was in that tank. How extensive do you think this investigation went beyond searching the hotel and checking her cell phone? Given that a common response by LAPD was "I don't know" you would think that their academy taught the Ronald Reagan method of investigation.

I also discovered that the only time a body is released back to the family for burial is when there are no signs of foul play. EL was released for burial in early March, so they probably actively investigated for 3 weeks at most after she was found. We know they did not even thoroughly search the hotel. It is well documented that in cases of equivocal death very little of anything is found at the scene, yet the LAPD told the CBC they had evidence she had been harmed or was in danger- this means from her self? What ever became of her cell phone? Fingerprints are seldom viable after one week, but did they even try? With SAR dogs finding no trace of her, they should have been looking for trace evidence like fibers or something. I don't think the roof was ever treated as a crime scene.

The coroner's office itself has a checkered history. The actress Brittany Murphy's autopsy was bungled by the coroner's dept. Both she and her husband died within a few months of one another and both had acute, severe vomiting just days before dying. Ed Winter publicly admitted they collected hair samples but never saw fit to run tests for toxins or poisons! Instead her death was ruled an accident due to pneumonia, anemia, and "multiple drugs" none of them illegal. The case is now re-opened with the coroner and her family in court.

Why is that we should take everything a person whom society has conferred some degree of authority at face value without knowing his professional history or education? The diagnosis of Bipolar Disorder itself is hardly scientific and there is a large margin for error. Many coroners do not pass state boards, not all are medical doctors with some only having a high school education. Los Angeles hired an incompetent apprentice coroner a few years back who failed to disclose he had previously been fired. He was already flailing in his role, and when they found out he lied they still gave him close to a year to get his act together.

http://californiawatch.org/postmortem

I think that due to losing 2 weeks of time, they opted for the easy way out and knew they were going to go with accident all along. Her parents must be in shock. I just hope that if they are not satisfied with this they pursue the truth.
Good info. I don't think this has been mentioned, but another suspicious LA coroner situation was last year's mysterious arsenic poisoning of coroner Michael Cormier, who was supposedly Anthony Breitbart's coroner. That is a creepy situation that reeks of foul play.
 
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