Identified! AR - Fort Smith, Male UP2843, entangled in tree in Poteau River, Nov'01 - John Camp

Discussion in 'Identified!' started by hannavaseel, Feb 14, 2013.

  1. hannavaseel

    hannavaseel New Member

    Messages:
    9
    Likes Received:
    0
    Trophy Points:
    0
    Hi everyone, I'm new here so please correct me if I am doing something wrong or posting on the wrong place. I came across this John Doe case and it's really stuck with me since I read about it. Here is a link to the case- https://identifyus.org/en/cases/2843

    The remains were found entangled in tree about the Poteau River in Fort Smith, Arkansas. However, the Poteau only runs very briefly in Arkansas, and is mostly in Oklahoma. He was found November 2001, remains are described as "mummified" yet they've posted no range of years that he could have been missing. If a body is mummified isn't it possible it could have been there longer than 11 months? Curiously, his hands and left foot are missing. What has really peaked my interest is the contents of his pockets-

    " A hotel key with orange tag that reads (A04), 1 small quartz wristwatch, a key ring with 2 attached keys, 1 yelow metal wedding band, 1 straw, 1 pocket knife, 1 nail clipper, 1 cigarette lighter, 21 quarters, 3 dimes, 2 nickels, 2 pennies, and 1 $1 bill."

    The fact that he has a wedding band of course is says he's married, but he also has a tattoo that reads "Teresa" with a heart under with a band through that that says "one love" and what appears to be initials on the heart- J.C. T.C. It seems possible that T.C. is Teresa C. and his initials are J.C. The pocket full of quarters paired with the hotel key suggests laundry. But he also has a knife in his pocket (didn't try to defend himself if it was a homicide). The nail clippers would seem to rule out that he was adventuring on the river, though his clothes would have been suitable for such an activity, and the straw seems to rule out adventuring too. Robbery doesn't seem to be a motive as he still has his wedding ring and watch.

    I've contacted the case manager at the state crime lab for more details but he said that all the information available is in the NamUs system. What should be my next step? It seems that because he was staying in a hotel he could have traveled from anywhere. Because the Poteau is only in Arkansas for such a brief area it doesn't seem like that would have been where he was staying. Could his hands and foot be missing from natural causes? Note, his body wasn't found in the river it was found entangled in trees over the river. Any tips or insight or help at all would be much appreciated. Thank you!
     
  2. Loading...


  3. CarlK90245

    CarlK90245 UID Moderator Staff Member Moderator

    Messages:
    7,939
    Likes Received:
    122
    Trophy Points:
    63
    Welcome to WS, Hanna:
    :welcome:

    My first impression is that if he was in the trees above the river, he must have gotten there during high waters. Perhaps he accidentally slipped into the river during a storm.

    If that was the case, one would expect the wife to have reported him missing or swept away by the storm flood waters, and they should have connected the dots. But perhaps they didn't check the reports of lost storm victims from upstream jurisdictions.

    The hands and feet are the first things to disarticulate from a decomposing body, so that is not all that unusual, considering that the body is severely decomposed.
     
  4. wfgodot

    wfgodot Former Member

    Messages:
    30,162
    Likes Received:
    18
    Trophy Points:
    0
  5. killarney rose

    killarney rose Well-Known Member

    Messages:
    1,873
    Likes Received:
    41
    Trophy Points:
    48
    Welcome!

    Please forgive me if I'm not articulate enough....nursing the cold I've managed to avoid all winter and I feel as if my head is full of cotton....

    I would check for areas upriver of where he was found that were flooded at about the time it is thought he died. After narrowing the towns/areas down, I would then check their missing persons cases , especially one with his initials. It would seem this one should've been ID before now.
     
  6. killarney rose

    killarney rose Well-Known Member

    Messages:
    1,873
    Likes Received:
    41
    Trophy Points:
    48
    Is there a military base in any of those areas? He might be reported AWOL.
     
  7. hannavaseel

    hannavaseel New Member

    Messages:
    9
    Likes Received:
    0
    Trophy Points:
    0
    There is no military base that I know of. However, I've searched for every male missing person before november 2001 that had "initials" listed in the tattoo description (because nothing turned up for Teresa or T.C J.C. If he had been reported AWOL would it be in a different system then the missing person's system?
     
  8. Ausgirl

    Ausgirl Enough Is Enough!

    Messages:
    6,481
    Likes Received:
    27
    Trophy Points:
    0
    I want to know how a body gets mummified in proximity to a river.

    Mummification requires a very dry environment, no moisture in the air. Like a desert. An airy space in an attic or under someone's floorboards in Arizona. Being tangled in a tree by a river just won't do it.

    So I'm wondering whether the man was killed far from the river and then placed there after his body was desiccated.
     
  9. Shelby1

    Shelby1 Cancer Sucks

    Messages:
    4,415
    Likes Received:
    553
    Trophy Points:
    113
    I was going to suggest starting with the hotel key and trying to find out if a hotel relatively close to where he was found had keys such as the one described. From there checking to see if hotels had any unpaid for rooms...but then I realized that he would have had to have used a credit card and they would have just charged it even if he never checked out officially.

    Seems like most hotels these days use a credit card type key, not a "real" key....

    Just thinking out loud......

    This is a very interesting case.
     
  10. CarlK90245

    CarlK90245 UID Moderator Staff Member Moderator

    Messages:
    7,939
    Likes Received:
    122
    Trophy Points:
    63
  11. CarlK90245

    CarlK90245 UID Moderator Staff Member Moderator

    Messages:
    7,939
    Likes Received:
    122
    Trophy Points:
    63
    I wish they had a racial specification. I could narrow the list a little tighter.

    Looking for J.C.'s in other states, there is James Everett Corr. He is from NY, but his last contact with family was by telephone from West Virginia.
    [​IMG]
    http://www.nampn.org/cases/corr_james.html

    ... or Jesus Fabian Cardenas
    [​IMG]
    http://www.charleyproject.org/cases/c/cardenas_jesus.html

    ... or James A. Clemons
    [​IMG]
    http://www.charleyproject.org/cases/c/clemons_james.html

    ... or John Steven Conway
    [​IMG]
    http://www.charleyproject.org/cases/c/conaway_john.html

    ... or Jeremy Freeman Crocker (and he wore a wedding band)
    [​IMG]
    http://www.charleyproject.org/cases/c/crocker_jeremy.html

    There are others from other portions of the U.S., but I don't see any indication that would reasonably be expected to end up in Arkansas.
     
  12. CarlK90245

    CarlK90245 UID Moderator Staff Member Moderator

    Messages:
    7,939
    Likes Received:
    122
    Trophy Points:
    63
    I am wondering if he was missing his hands, where did they find his wedding band?
     
  13. webrocket

    webrocket New Member

    Messages:
    3,537
    Likes Received:
    7
    Trophy Points:
    0
    the straw conjures up certain images with me, but this guy is probably one of the many MPs whose reports were left with local police and never put into the national databases. that is unless he skipped out on the wife and she did not care about his whereabouts.
     
  14. webrocket

    webrocket New Member

    Messages:
    3,537
    Likes Received:
    7
    Trophy Points:
    0
    wasn't it in his pocket? a strange place for a wedding ring, unless he put it there because he was about to be robbed.
     
  15. CarlK90245

    CarlK90245 UID Moderator Staff Member Moderator

    Messages:
    7,939
    Likes Received:
    122
    Trophy Points:
    63
    Or because he didn't want anyone to know he was already married. Perhaps he was having an affair, or out on the prowl.
     
  16. Ausgirl

    Ausgirl Enough Is Enough!

    Messages:
    6,481
    Likes Received:
    27
    Trophy Points:
    0
    I am betting that only some or possibly none of those things are his.

    And if he was mummified, he could have come from anywhere, at any time - maybe his hands fell off in transit. Anyway, I'd not be discounting people missing from dry, warm climates.
     
  17. Shelby1

    Shelby1 Cancer Sucks

    Messages:
    4,415
    Likes Received:
    553
    Trophy Points:
    113
    Picture of the key from the NamUs site





    [​IMG]
     
  18. Ausgirl

    Ausgirl Enough Is Enough!

    Messages:
    6,481
    Likes Received:
    27
    Trophy Points:
    0
    .. like Jeremy Crocker. California's pretty warm, right? And my inner conspiracy theorist had a little spasm at Jeremy's being involved in some sort of plane disaster expose..

    Wonder what his wife's name is... /hits Google
     
  19. EmmaliLucia

    EmmaliLucia New Member

    Messages:
    1,173
    Likes Received:
    0
    Trophy Points:
    0
    California is warm, but it's also very humid. Esp. in the heavily populated areas on the coast. It's not unheard-of to find mummified remains in California (Example, the No Eat, No Drink MURDER girl found in Pacifica { CA CA - Pacifica - Female 593UFCA, 25-46, "No go, no eat, no drink, murder", Jun'06 - Websleuths Crime Sleuthing Community }), but when I hear the word Mummified I always think Nevada.
     
  20. killarney rose

    killarney rose Well-Known Member

    Messages:
    1,873
    Likes Received:
    41
    Trophy Points:
    48
    I have very little kknowledge of how these things come about, but I'm guessing that perhaps him being in the tree, with the air all around him, that this aided in him becoming mummified.

    Just sounds to me as if he were in the water and left in the tree when it receeded. I live in an area that is prone to floods and you see some many things left by the waters after they receed. He could've been carried from any place along the flooded route of the water.
     
  21. hannavaseel

    hannavaseel New Member

    Messages:
    9
    Likes Received:
    0
    Trophy Points:
    0
    I've read over this case so many times but I never realized that his wedding ring couldn't have been found on his hands because they weren't there!
     

Share This Page

  1. This site uses cookies to help personalise content, tailor your experience and to keep you logged in if you register.
    By continuing to use this site, you are consenting to our use of cookies.
    Dismiss Notice