ATLANTIC CITY SK: possible link to LISK and GB4?

Discussion in 'Atlantic City Serial Killer' started by dc20015, Jan 17, 2012.

  1. FindHG

    FindHG *

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    If the AC women all had a connection, and if there is a connection to the GB4, is there any chance then that all the GB4 would then have one too?

    Could there be chance that the same type of connection exists, such as having come in contact with a similar set of johns, persons in authority, as they were arrested, or doctors even, looking after them, as I doubt they would've had medical insurance, the hotels/motels or other locations out of where they worked?
     


  2. FindHG

    FindHG *

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    The seemingly careful way these women were picked then disposed of, my bet is that location is an overwhelming factor, as mentioned in "The Killing Season", in both these series of murdered women. It seems like the perp is mastering his location as he conducts his kills, dominates the men, everyone really in the hierarchy of the area, in his mind and effectively, as it were, as the cases remain unsolved.

    He marks his territory this way as part of some need to dominate and control not just the women he murders, but the area through a fiber of the society it tugs on, as part of his process, as he goes from place to place. Does that make sense, is that possible, or am I just connecting too many things?

    So what kind of person/s could go from place to place unnoticed or noticed and get away with this? The water, if not a deity, is always East for these victims, so a snowbird/s, as Levi I think mentioned, seems very possible to me too. A lawyer or in finance maybe, functioning in some realm familiar with how to deal with gummed up systems?

    Pure speculation, above.

    I'm very hopeful the great job Josh and Rachel have done, bringing out all this information, getting more people to share information and to raise awareness, will bring answers. There's only one way to go on this, sharing and knowing more to make the right connections.
     
  3. Bre1958

    Bre1958 New Member

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    Look at Joseph Brewer who moved south after Shannan Gilbert's disappearance on Long Island. Where was he during the proposed dates of these murders?
     
  4. FindHG

    FindHG *

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  5. Niamert lyrehc

    Niamert lyrehc New Member

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    I haven't had the opportunity to read this thread yet but I have to say, after following this case for many years, TO seems to me, a very viable suspect. After seeing the back door of room 101 (at the motel on TKF) I was almost convinced that TO is the killer of the AC4. He was the only person publicly called a PO by police and they have not ruled him out.

    I see many similarities to GB4 so, by extension, TO looks (to me) to be LISK also. Until, some evidence to the contrary presents itself, that is my working theory. Now, to find evidence to support or debunk that theory.

    ETA: It's interesting to note that Kim Raffo was last staying only 16 mi. (IIRC) from Gilgo beach.
     
  6. OnAccountOfRabies

    OnAccountOfRabies New Member

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    And there will be such intense darkness, That one can feel it. - Exodus 10:21 Head Pointing East: The head facing East in death is common, in Christianity the "Old Wives Tale" is as such, the star of "Babylon" rises in the East, they believe Jesus will rise from the East in his second coming, placing the remains with the head to the East will allow the resurrection of Christ and the deceased will then see the resurrection of Christ, the son of God. But, in I think what is going on here regardless of this OWT is when we see the head facing East in Oriental tradition it means very much the opposite. Feet should point to the East and the Head to the West for eternal Peace and Rest of the Soul, the human structure is done with it's life's journey and the Soul has reached the point to ascend to the Heavens or Nirvana. I feel in my opinion that the East ritual we see going on here may mean that Lucifer is rising from the Ashes. It's just my opinion as I feel the killer is working off the latter of these theories and believes in demonizing these women. As Gary Ridgeway stated in his trial, "I don't understand, they were just prostitutes, I thought I was helping." Scary! I am not certain if we have one or several killers among us. I believe this all did start with that house in Long Island. I believe the community of men out there would meet, get hookers, the Dr. Hackett was too, involved, and "Flukeyou" you are too! I feel Hackett drugged the woman and cut up the remains, I believe that Flukeyou did not participate in this and would leave and was not involved in the aftermath of Hakcetts dismemberments. The Aquarium, Gardening Store guy's that killed themselves, too- were involved. Did they really both kill themselves. Yes, as the Killer moves along the different Highway's, he doesn't have the means to keep hacking the bodies, perhaps? All I know is Dr. Hackett has moved so he can practice his bad behavior elsewhere and maybe these men travel to see him. The shooting victims, ring a bit odd. I think they were older, had their day in the sun and LISK/AC/GB4, thought he was doing them a favor, they had run their course on the streets. I agree no foot fetish. It's probably hard to put on shoes on a corpse. Serial Killer if you read this, gonna get you soon. You think these sets of four are your Disciples and the 12 are your Watchers. You think it's all fun and games. Tag you're it!
     
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  7. Niamert lyrehc

    Niamert lyrehc New Member

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    I just want to address the , "Heads facing East" part of your post, if I may.

    I just watched TKS episode 3 and noticed, for the first time, in the only press conference given by police, the individual giving the press conference(forgot his name at the moment sorry) said that one of the victims was face down in the ditch. So, head facing East is not an accurate fact in the AC4 cases. INVHO It's just another rumor to spin wild theories of radical religion.
     
  8. Tricia

    Tricia Owner Websleuths.com Staff Member Administrator Moderator

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    Hey everyone,

    Quick reminder. If you haven't seen episodes 1 thru 4 yet you can watch all of them RIGHT HERE

    Don't forget episodes 5 & 6 tonight 9:00 PM Eastern on A&E

    Join us on Twitter #TheKillingSeason tonight . Josh and Rachel will be on Twitter to answer your questions starting at 8:30 PM ET

    Episode 6 is WILD from what I am told.
     
  9. JNH

    JNH New Member

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    I haven't been able to read this whole thread, but has anyone mentioned and/or followed up on the very obvious religious connotations in these killings?

    Grave burials with such consistent parameters do indicate burial rites in line within the Christian tradition. The sex worker connection could indicate a moral angle to the motive. Last but not least, given that these women were found without shoes and socks, it would not be unthinkable the perp had/has a ritualistic MO of washing his victim's feet as Jesus washed the feet of prostitutes in scripture.

    Have people followed this line of reasoning on this site or in law enforcement?
     
  10. SW35mmDoll

    SW35mmDoll New Member

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    If this has already been addressed then I apologize. There are so many SK's out there right now, all the time, and some admitting they "compete" with one another. Not just in the states, but across the whole world. Example: Alexander Pichushkin stated that he often was in competition with his idol, Andrei Chikatilo, in the Soviet. I think it is very plausible that there are multiple SK's in our eastern area that could possibly be in the same profession and in competition with one another.
     
  11. cynical_1

    cynical_1 Member

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    Welcome to Websleuths. I think what you may be describing would be a Mission-oriented killer. These type of killers typically justify their acts as "ridding the world" of a certain type of person perceived as undesirable.

    Of course there's also the Visionary killer who suffer from psychotic breaks from reality and believe they are compelled
    to kill by entities such as the devil or God. Take your pick.
     
  12. JNH

    JNH New Member

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    Yes, exactly. However, aside from mission-oriented or psychotic motivations, there are instances of self-flagellatory impulse killing, during which the discrepancy between professed religious affiliation, complete with set of moral regulations, and sexual deviance and impulse creates lethal cognitive dissonance. These instances are less mission or vision-oriented, and more of an act of personal moral cleansing.

    I would be very surprised if law enforcement hadn't considered a missionary type profession as explanation for the transitory nature of this perp (if, that is, the GB4 can be assumed to be connected.) Are you aware of such a line of inquiry? Bible salesmen, door-to-door missionaries? People connected to a specific congregation aligned along the East Coast?

    The convenience of acquisition alone does not explain the consistency of the victim's profession.
     
  13. sadforthem

    sadforthem New Member

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    Hello everyone, I'm new here. Sorry if this has been said. I've done several searches on this site and haven't seen anything about it.

    On TKS they speak of the wind farm/mills. They speak of the noise factor from them but I noticed that the aerial view of the bodies were the same set up as the wind farm/mills at a certain angle. I'm wondering if you can see that from the burial sight.I found it odd the similar style pattern. I was thinking that was a sign from the SK that they were murdered there. Probably a grasp at straws but thought I'd put it out there.



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  14. AC_Lucky1

    AC_Lucky1 New Member

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    Hi Sadforthem,
    If you are asking if you can see or hear the wind farm from the Golden Key, you can't. The wind farm is further west.
     
  15. sadforthem

    sadforthem New Member

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    Yes that was part of it, thank you.


     
  16. cynical_1

    cynical_1 Member

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    There is an excellent article title “Beyond the Boardwalk” that was published in 2007 that gives quite a few details concerning the initial investigation of this case. One of the moderators here started a thread with the link to the article and I thought, for convenience, I'd post the link as well.

    http://www.cbsnews.com/news/beyond-the-boardwalk/

    Towards the end of the article (page 5 or so) it lists details of the various POI's that were questioned in the initial stages of the investigation. One of the individuals mentioned would appear to fit the profile of a religious motive. So the answer to your question would appear to be that police did probe the missionary angle early on.

    With new information coming to light a decade later it may be possible to theorize a bit more about the profile of the killer. In an earlier post I mentioned that a reporter for NJ.com recently published information concerning the fact that Ms. Raffo, the last victim, had left a customer in a room at The Trump Taj Majal casino at 5:00 am in pursuit of drugs.

    The importance of this new revelation (at least to me) is the fact that Ms. Raffo was probably not plying her trade at this time and possibly accepted a ride from an individual who she knew well enough to be persuaded to get in a car with. Afterall, someone did transport her, or her body, to The Golden Key. Other than a taxi cab ride, I doubt that Ms. Raffo would get in a car with a stranger unless she viewed him as a potential paying customer. But indications are that she was not seeking a customer.

    Rather, she was seeking drugs. So I'm speculating that she accepted a ride from an individual who was a regular in the area and who related to Ms. Raffo ( and possibly a few of the other victims) as kindred spirits lost in the local drug scene. An individual who would not be out of place at Papa Joe's restaurant. Nor would they be out of place at The Atlantic City Rescue Mission.

    I find it interesting that the depot for The Ocean Rolling Chairs company is located right in the area at S. Carolina Ave. Lots of shady individuals work all hours of the day (and night) pushing those carts up and down the boardwalk.

    In a recent Websleuths's podcast concerning the AC4, John Kelly, a recognized criminal profiler, made a point not often discussed. He found it interesting that, aside from all the talk about the missing shoes, all four victims were found fully clothed (sans shoes, of course). He thought it peculiar that discovering the bodies clothed may indicate that the killer didn't have sex with the victims, at least not in the conventional sense.

    So one could theorize that neither the killer nor his targeted victims were seeking sex at the point of first encounter. Which may fit with the 'personal moral cleansing' angle that you are talking about.

    As always, just my opinion.
     
  17. Salsa

    Salsa Former Member

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    What is your theory relating the windmills with the girls?
     
  18. CMC66

    CMC66 New Member

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    Those windmills were likely constructed way after the killings. You can Freedom of Information Act allows anyone access to federal permits -probably an action granted through FERC. I seriously doubt they were there when these women were killed.
     
  19. CMC66

    CMC66 New Member

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    If I were the detective working the case, I would have sought out a team of forensic biologist to examine plant material on all the bodies-same for the burlaped bodies on Gilco beach. That would possible give a clue as to where they may have been killed and placed-
     
  20. CMC66

    CMC66 New Member

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    The windmills were not there when the women were murdered. NJ didn't legalize their construction until 2013. No connection at all.
     

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