Australia Australia - Claremont SK, 1996-97, Perth, WA - #14

Discussion in 'Serial Killers' started by bessie, Jan 2, 2017.

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  1. no name

    no name Well-Known Member

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    There is plenty of info available depending on how in depth you want to delve. Theres even time lapse videos available. As I said, I personally find it distasteful so I am not keen on going through them all & I am looking on a mobile so Id imagine the amount available on full web is even greater. Im unsure why you are unable to find it. I also think that its a question that can only be answered by the person that found her and whether there was or wasnt an odour, it is clearly not something that I think she would have mentioned. She knew the person she found was female and being a mother, she refused to leave her body and sent her husband off to get help. Obviously there are many variables beside just the weather. Here is one site that has the info broken down into a time period.
    http://aboutforensics.co.uk/decomposition/

     


  2. WhyWhy

    WhyWhy New Member

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    'Why not Subi' reply to question posed by Spooks and answered also by CanningVale;
    -there weren't any really good drinking spots with 20 somethings there.
    -the Astoria, first 24hr cafe on Hay was just opening, the Subi wasn't exceptionally 'in' at the time. The Vic would have been mid reno. Hoi Polloi (?) on corner opposite station was more coffee shop like. The Rokeby Rd clubs were there but not as local a crew as Claremont. Also further from Cemetery!?
    -apologies if I've missed any epic nightspots in Subi of this time.


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  3. justified

    justified New Member

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    Anecdotally, girls complaining of drink spiking is almost always a case of them drinking too much & not understanding that effect. This has been my experience working in Emergency Departments. No, I have not gone to look for links, it is "my opinion". Drink spiking is highly suspect. I await to be chastised.
     
  4. justified

    justified New Member

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    No, you just about nailed it.
     
  5. petedavo.au

    petedavo.au Well-Known Member

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    That's why I'd wait for verification of anecdotal claims like what crabstick made in August 2015 on CSK thread number 2, that "there was a spate of drink spiking (in Claremont) at the time (in 1996)."

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  6. Canning Vale

    Canning Vale Active Member

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    Just a thought, once a drink has been spiked how long before it takes affect.
     
  7. Innerchild

    Innerchild Active Member

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  8. Sutton

    Sutton New Member

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    This is a sleuthing site. Spooks' question was well within bounds, IMO. It's a valid question that I've never considered before.

    I think 55 days in the heat is plenty of time for soft tissues to mostly decay. There are too many factors that we can't account for (humidity, was she covered, how close to the creek was she, soil conditions, etc.).

    Avoiding these types of questions is disrespectful to the victims. IMO. They deserve the truth. Discussing the details of the case is why we're all here. There is nothing shameful or overtly morbid about body decay.
     
  9. 7SJ707

    7SJ707 Active Member

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    Club Bayview was a preppy , priviliged nightspot where Perths better class went to see and be seen by their peers.
    It had none of the rampant drug culture and dealing that went on in the Northbridge and Leederville Clubs , nor did it need to employ the "heavy" doormen familiar with Perths underworld and bikie types ,that were needed to keep order further North.
    The three innocent young women who were abducted and murdered were very, very unlikely to have had any exposure to expensive , illegal, stimulant type drugs like amphetamine or MDMA ,which are not really suitable for drink spiking, as opposed to cheaper and virtually tastless prescribed sedative and hypnotic drugs favoured by spikers.
    The girls were alone, and trying to arrange safe rides home , -in the case of JR and CG quite early in the night. by prevalent nightclubbing standards .
    These respectable and well educated women who had their wits about them were instead lured into a car by a particulary effective ruse adopted by a cruel and cunning CSK offering failsafe safety and "security".
    Look at the early WAPOL investigative focus on "Taxi Drivers,"... exactly because it was recognised these poor girls were not drink or drug affected ,and they certainly did not jump into a car with just anyone.
    They were cruelly tricked by a man who fitted right into the late night fabric of the Claremont Scene and could cruise the streets unoticed amongst its regulars.
    All JMO and theory.
     
  10. justified

    justified New Member

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    Agree with almost everything 7SJ. I however lean towards blitz attack. Instant, extreme strength & speed. They never saw it coming.
     
  11. 7SJ707

    7SJ707 Active Member

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    "Do I have confidence in them (WAPOL) to conduct these high level investigations into serious crime?.....i have to say.... no I don't. "
    Michelle Roberts former WA Police Minister.

    "It seems to me that the Macro Taskforce was a situation where the Cops really mucked up and now we have got a cover up.."
    Con Bayens former Senior WA Policeman.

    The mainstream media blackout of the CSK case continues.
    For good reason.
    When the truth eventually does comes out about the WAPOL corruption and bungling that let the CSK( whover he, or she may be) roam free on Perth Streets for decades it will be enough to cause a crisis in Public confidence into Law Enforcement in Western Australia.
    All JMO and theory......
     
  12. no name

    no name Well-Known Member

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    I have no problem with body decomposition per se, and for the record, it was winter so cooler rather than warmer. To me, the question appeared flippant and one which the poster could have answered themselves had they "sleuthed it" themselves. They may well have come to the realise that, as you said, there are too many variables to draw any definite conclusions anyway so its a question I dont think can be answered. Far from it being disrespectful to the victims NOT to discuss it, I think it is disrespectful to the victim TO discuss it for that reason. Not everything needs to be voiced. What difference does it make if you had a definite answer anyway? What does that add to the discussion? I took offense to the question personally! Hence my original comment to Spooks beginning with "personally". Perhaps in a different circumstance you may see the question as I saw it, unnecessary & inconsequential.
     
  13. no name

    no name Well-Known Member

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  14. JoWa

    JoWa New Member

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  15. no name

    no name Well-Known Member

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    There was Fridays/Red Sea (or whatever it was called at the time). It was absolutely the place to go for local kids of the area along with Claremont bars, Wembley Hotel, Cottesloe. It was really popular with WCE players too. And yes, i had my drink spiked there myself back in 1999. At the time I had no idea what had happened. I felt really strange all of a sudden and left immediately, didnt tell a sole. Luckily there was a cab downstairs and I jumped straight in and went home where I slept for the next 24 hours+. I had no idea what had actually happened to me until about a year later when a group of us (2 girls/3 guys) stayed back at the Hippie Club for staff drinks one night. According to our male designated non drinking driver, a tray of shooters was delivered to us and soon after all 4 of us "lost it". It took him a ridiculous effort to get us all into the car as apparently we were all going in different directions & making no sense in both our speech or our actions. It wasnt until waking up the following evening I realised this had happened previously and figured that on both occassions my drink must have been spiked. I dont have an answer as to why someone would spike a group of girls/guys but can be absolutely certain it that on the second occassion, it was a staff member that did it. I think the drug being used at the time was Rohipnal (spelling)? It was also something that we were very very aware of and never left our drinks unattended. Im not sure if it was happening as early as 96/97 but by early 2000's, it was rampant. I know quite a few girls that had it happen to them, luckily with friends to take care of them. Its quite different to watching someone who is drunk initially, they appear quite out of control and very unpredictable, almost like they've been possessed by something. Then they pass out & I guess the amount of alcohol they consumed depends on how quickly that happens. QUOTE=WhyWhy;13401527]'Why not Subi' reply to question posed by Spooks and answered also by CanningVale;
     
  16. justified

    justified New Member

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    Would have to disagree about rampant drink spiking. Did you or any of your friends have testing to determine that your drinks were spiked? Most people (women) refuse to believe that their incapacitation could be due to the amount and type of alcohol they have had to drink. IMO.
     
  17. justified

    justified New Member

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    [h=1]Drink spiking a myth: WA study[/h]

    Thursday, 13 August 2009 12:31AMDrink spiking is largely a myth and far more likely to be an excuse young women use after they become heavily intoxicated, according to WA research.
    A Perth study of suspected drink spiking victims found claims of being given sedatives or illicit drugs without consent are exaggerated and that alcohol is often the real culprit.
    The results, published in the journal of the Australasian College for Emergency Medicine, are based on 100 patients who attended Sir Charles Gairdner Hospital and Joondalup Health Campus over 19 months with suspected drink spiking from the previous 12 hours.
    Almost nine out of 10 cases were women and almost 60 per cent of those were under the age of 25.
    QEII Medical Centre clinical toxicologist Mark Little said the findings did not support the public perception of sedatives being placed by men into the drinks of women for the purpose of sexual assault or robbing them.
    "Drink spiking with sedative or illicit drugs appears to be rare and if it does occur alcohol appears to be the most common agent used," he said.
    Dr Little said what was more concerning was the big number of people in the study who had taken illicit drugs such as cannabis or amphetamines or consumed excessive amounts of alcohol, which made it difficult to establish if a person had truly been given a spiked drink.
    On average, people in the study had a blood alcohol concentration of .096 and reported having consumed between 3.8 and 11.6 standard drinks. The researchers said they did not identify a single case where a sedative drug was likely to have been placed illegally in a drink in a pub or nightclub.
    The study also showed that many people remained in denial, with more than a third still believing they had been victims of drink spiking, irrespective of test results which disproved this.
    Only five out of the 100 patients had blood alcohol levels which did not match with how much they reported drinking, raising the possibility that alcohol had been added to their drinks.
    In an editorial in the journal, Associate Professor David Wells, from the Victorian Institute of Forensic Medicine, and Dr Maureen Phillips, from Perth's Sexual Assault Resource Centre, said the findings highlighted concerns that many young people were drinking themselves into a semiconscious state that put their personal safety at risk.
    CATHY O'LEARY



     
  18. petedavo.au

    petedavo.au Well-Known Member

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    Police investigate disturbing report that woman had drink spiked at a Quinns Rocks beach before sexual assault

    PerthNow

    February 26, 2015 6:49pm


    http://www.perthnow.com.au/news/wes...t/news-story/e23712e522d6089e1ad6b03a0ccdd3ed

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  19. petedavo.au

    petedavo.au Well-Known Member

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    source: Coroner's report on death of Gemma Thoms
    http://www.coronerscourt.wa.gov.au/_files/Thoms_finding.pdf

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  20. justified

    justified New Member

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    I can't open anything "perthnow" on my phone so please indulge me. Police "investigating" possible drink spiking. What was the outcome of the investigation? News stories as opposed to actual research studies fail to sway me . I have not seen ONE young woman's claim of drink spiking substantiated in 30 years. But hey, I will hear it all again next weekend.......
     
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