Australia - Warriena Wright, 26, dies in balcony fall, Surfers Paradise, Aug 2014 #10

[MsAnais]

The young woman in this case apparently met the man whose apartment she fell from on Tinder. Police are calling the death suspicious and the investigation is continuing.

Police have positively identified a woman who died after she fell from a Surfers Paradise high-rise apartment building.

The woman has been identified as 26-year-old Warriena Tagpuno Wright from Lower Hutt, New Zealand.

Around 2.20am on Friday officers were called to the Wahroonga Place building after receiving reports that a woman had fallen from a balcony.

Police have confirmed the death is being treated as suspicious.

......The 28-year-old man who is the sole occupant of the apartment, Gable Tostee, was assisting police with inquiries on Friday afternoon. He was not formally arrested and no charges have been laid.

Tagpuno Wright was reportedly visiting Tostee after meeting him through an online dating app, believed to be Tinder, the Courier Mail reported.

http://www.stuff.co.nz/world/australia/10367377/Kiwi-dies-after-Surfers-Paradise-balcony-fall

Gable Tostee, man at centre of investigations into Surfers Paradise highrise death plunge of Warriena Wright, charged with murder

http://www.goldcoastbulletin.com.au...plead-not-guilty/story-fnje8bkv-1227025428311

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Media/Timeline Thread

 

[Coldpizza]

Gable Tostee murder trial: Jury seeks advice after struggling to reach verdict
9:39pm October 18, 2016
By Rebecca Lynch

The Supreme Court jury in the murder trial of Gable Tostee has asked Justice John Byrne for advice after struggling to reach a verdict over the past two days of deliberations.

The jury has been sent home for the night and will resume deliberations tomorrow.

[...]

"I have the power to discharge you from giving a verdict, but I should only do so if I am satisfied that there is no likelihood of genuine agreement being reached after further deliberation," he said.

Earlier, Justice Byrne told the jury that removing a person to a balcony does constitute removing them from a property.

The jury also asked "When does the acting to remove a person behaving in a disorderly manner start?", to which Justice Byrne replied that it did not matter.

Tostee must be found not guilty of both murder and manslaughter unless the jury finds the force he used was more than reasonably necessary, Justice Byrne said.

 

[Coldpizza]

Admin note:

Please continue here and discuss the case. Not each other.

Rules Etiquette & Information

 

[Estelle]

What is “Causation” in Criminal Law?

In criminal law, causation essentially describes a ‘cause and effect’ relationship between the defendant’s actions and the harm suffered by the alleged victim.

In order to establish a defendant’s guilt, the prosecution must prove beyond reasonable doubt that his or her actions were a ‘substantial and significant cause’ of the harm. This means that although other factors may have contributed to the harm suffered, the defendant can in certain circumstances still be found criminally responsible. Homicide cases are often useful to illustrate the law relating to causation.

In the important case of Royall v R [1991] HCA 27, Kelly Louise Healey died after falling from the window of a sixth floor apartment. It was alleged that prior to her death, she had been engaged in a violent argument with her boyfriend, Mr Royall.

At trial, the prosecution put forward three possible explanations for her death:

1. That Mr Royall had pushed her out of the window,

2. That she had fallen whilst attempting to avoid an attack by Mr Royall, and

3. That she died whilst trying to escape ‘life-threatening violence.’

It was held that even though Ms Healey may have directly brought about her own death by jumping out the window, Mr Royall was ultimately responsible for her death as he created a ‘well founded apprehension that she would be subjected to further violence’ if she remained in the apartment.

Accordingly, the court found that Royall’s actions were the ‘substantial or significant cause’ of Ms Healey’s death.

In criminal cases, the question of whether the defendant’s conduct ‘substantially or significantly’ brought about the deceased’s death is left to the jury. Where there are several different possibilities for the death, as was the case in Royall, the jury is not required to determine the exact cause of death – but rather, they should simply focus on whether the defendant’s actions substantially contributed towards the death.

http://nswcourts.com.au/articles/what-is-causation-in-criminal-law/

There are other cases on this link too.

 

[Makara]

What will be the outcome of the Warriena Wright Trial?

http://www.websleuths.com/forums/sh...Warriena-Wright-Trial&p=12868774#post12868774

 

[CleverKnot]

And your opinion of the charges and outcome-to-be is ....?

Murder, manslaughter, not guilty, undecided?

This cannot be considered a murder. This cannot act as a precedent setting case, lest we are all held to that standard, where you are held responsible for someone else's actions and choices unfairly, or without question when reasonable question exists.

Ideally, everyone learns from this and becomes more careful and educated when it comes to relationships, sex, drinking and a whole host of other social activities.

Ideally, he never forgives himself, expresses an honest, and heartfelt indication that somehow he gets it, and that he honestly takes responsibility for being so stupid and naive leading up to what was an unpredictable, but possibly preventable in some manner, unfortunate progression of events.

 

[Bohemian]

It's sex. You don't get to say no and not want to continue. Even if you plea for the person to let you leave.

Is this what you are saying.

It's the need for power and control, Dex. With tragic consequences for Warriena.

 

[Champaign]

Can someone tell me where I can listen to the entire recording of the events of that night?

 

[SouthAussie]

This cannot be considered a murder. This cannot act as a precedent setting case, lest we are all held to that standard, where you are held responsible for someone else's actions and choices unfairly, or without question when reasonable question exists.

Ideally, everyone learns from this and becomes more careful and educated when it comes to relationships, sex, drinking and a whole host of other social activities.

Ideally, he never forgives himself, expresses an honest, and heartfelt indication that somehow he gets it, and that he honestly takes responsibility for being so stupid and naive leading up to what was an unpredictable, but possibly preventable in some manner, unfortunate progression of events.

Can it be manslaughter?

 

[DexterMorgan]

The operative word being "feel" like you are being talked down to. You are not being talked down to.

I teach self defence. By asking how the restraint works in reality during an unplanned conflict, I'm asking you to put yourself into the reality if the situation, and possibly come to the realization yourself that it is not as easy as saying he could have easily restrained her.

It is discussion through participation. It is healthy debate, and an exchange of ideas and experiences.

You do realize that he laughed at her minor attempt to get away and told her that it doesn't hurt and he will beat her like a man.

But you still seem to think that he was powerless.

Now the poor girl tried her best to flea. And I'm sure that some of Ted Bundys victims have tried as well.

But you should realize that these monsters want their victims to fight back while they stand there and laugh.

Jmo.

He was provoking this and preying on her will to live and leave.

But he didn't want to let up. Because he obviously didn't want her to have the chance to leave.

This was a pure cat and mouse situation in his eyes. Jmo.

 

[SouthAussie]

Can someone tell me where I can listen to the entire recording of the events of that night?

It has been removed from public viewing, Champaign.

I believe the link to the recording will be posted here, once the trial is over.

The removal of the recording from public viewing is all about sub judice, I think.

 

[guruagain]

And I'm stating this.

There were 2 doors. The main door and balcony door.

Now if you are throwing someone out of your house.

Wouldn't you throw them out the main door and not the balcony.

Three doors if you include the bedroom just to the left of the balcony, sliding doors
in case you have trouble opening them whilst restraining a small drunk girl.

 

[sweetcaro]

Fingers crossed for a guilty verdict today. Those jurors sure are working hard!

Sent from my SM-T550 using Tapatalk

 

[DexterMorgan]

He received 10 months for dui/speed chase.

But some act like he should serve no time for forcing a foreigner to her death.

Wth.

 

[SouthAussie]

He received 10 months for dui/speed chase.

But some act like he should serve no time for forcing a foreigner to her death.

Wth.

I agree.

He narrowly missed killing his passengers, an innocent on the road at the same time, himself, in that high range drunk dangerous driving incident.

He contributed to/caused the death of Warriena by terrifying her and locking her in a place she could not easily escape from.

How many chances does he get with other people's lives?

 

[Dogface]

As someone who has trained extensively in self defense after a physically violent attack, I can say not once was I taught to lock an attacker in my home. In fact, the advice is to always flee when given a chance, even if it means leaving the attacker in your house, car, wherever.

 

[SouthAussie]

I, too, have attended a defence course - at a rape crisis centre. We were taught a few unique defence moves, and told to run and scream like crazy.

Seems to me that Warriena tried to scream like crazy and escape when she was choked and threatened.

 

[Bohemian]

You do realize that he laughed at her minor attempt to get away and told her that it doesn't hurt and he will beat her like a man.

But you still seem to think that he was powerless.

Now the poor girl tried her best to flea. And I'm sure that some of Ted Bundys victims have tried as well.

But you should realize that these monsters want their victims to fight back while they stand there and laugh.

Jmo.

He was provoking this and preying on her will to live and leave.

But he didn't want to let up. Because he obviously didn't want her to have the chance to leave.

This was a pure cat and mouse situation in his eyes. Jmo.

Predator-prey behaviour is also evident in human relationships. I'm currently reading an excellent paper on 'The Human Nature of Violence' by Robin Fox, which was presented at an international conference on Drinking and Public Disorder to a non-academic audience.

Although the complete paper promises to be enlightening at first glance, I think Part 5. will be of particular interest to the 'cat and mouse game'.

Source: The Human Nature of Violence

 

[Ausgirl]

It's interesting to compare his behaviour in the DUI car chase to his behaviour in this one.

I mean, there were -other people- in that car! He could've killed them.. could've killed police officers... could've killed other drivers... Gave not 1 sh_t about any of 'em, just took off and hang the consequences. Probably thought it was a real good time, lol brahs.


Coulda just pulled over for the cops.


Coulda let her leave the two tmes she said she was going... coulda put her out the front door/called police/whatever.

Coulda.. shoulda... Fact is, he just lives for the thrills and lulz of it all, in the moment. What he feels later, I don't know.. and don't particularly care.

 

[Really?]

Fingers crossed for a guilty verdict today. Those jurors sure are working hard!

Sent from my SM-T550 using Tapatalk

What time is it n Australia may I ask ?