Australia Australia - William Tyrrell, 3, Kendall, Nsw, 12 Sept 2014 - #56

[stormbird]

Does anyone here know exactly what parts of Kendall are flooded and how badly? I would be very interested to know about the bush around the FGM’s previous house, the Batar Creek Road area, the area around Timothy Doyle’s house and the areas/towns FA was known to frequent, including the saw mill and where his caravan was located.

BBM. I don't know which parts of the Kendall district went under water, but it's likely that the rain has increased the erosion of every part of everywhere. It's not only flood-prone areas which might now be exposed.

 

[Loxoli]

BBM. I don't know which parts of the Kendall district went under water, but it's likely that the rain has increased the erosion of every part of everywhere. It's not only flood-prone areas which might now be exposed.

Good point. I’m not sure how much of a chance we have at getting answers due to the deluge, but I can’t help but feel simultaneously full of hope and dread, like many of you.

 

[TootsieFootsie]

No Cookies | The Advertiser

Former top cop Gary Jubelin says those behind a fake William Tyrrell fundraiser were con artists who were happy to prey on the grief of others.

I think it's behind a paywall. But there was said to be an "event" where it was said that Gary Jubelin and Liz Hayes would appear.

Police are investigating.

 

[stormbird]

I found this advertisement in a 2013 edition of The Kendall Chronicle:

"PERSON REQUIRED FOR GARDEN MAINTENANCE"
"If you have gardening knowledge and would like to earn extra income doing general garden maintenance (no mowing) in Kendall for 2-3 hours/fortnight then please phone [Ms No.30 Benaroon Drive] on [No.30's landline telephone number, last found in a directory in Feb 2016]"
- The Kendall Chronicle, 14 June 2013, volume 10, issue 6, see page 7

It's possible the position wasn't filled, or that the work was for somewhere other than No.30 Benaroon Drive (which is next door to FGM's, No.48, and across the road from AMS's, No.31, where FFC first alerted a neighbour). I don't know anything more than what's in the advertisment, so I'm not suggesting anything of anyone. If there was a casual worker at No.30 for a few hours now and then in 2013, the year before William disappeared next door, that would be something police needed to check, and something that could easily have slipped the mind of residents and neighbours. In my experience, tradies sometimes leave tools behind or have some other reason to return later and might do so without notifying the residents.

I think this post is probably not breaching privacy, because the house was sold in Dec 2015 according to realestate.com.au, shortly before the phone number was last listed in Feb 2016, according to Reverse Australia (a link won't work, sorry), and it looks like the number has not been re-used.

 

[JWSleuth]

I found this advertisement in a 2013 edition of The Kendall Chronicle:

"PERSON REQUIRED FOR GARDEN MAINTENANCE"
"If you have gardening knowledge and would like to earn extra income doing general garden maintenance (no mowing) in Kendall for 2-3 hours/fortnight then please phone [Ms No.30 Benaroon Drive] on [No.30's landline telephone number, last found in a directory in Feb 2016]"
- The Kendall Chronicle, 14 June 2013, volume 10, issue 6, see page 7

It's possible the position wasn't filled, or that the work was for somewhere other than No.30 Benaroon Drive (which is next door to FGM's, No.48, and across the road from AMS's, No.31, where FFC first alerted a neighbour). I don't know anything more than what's in the advertisment, so I'm not suggesting anything of anyone. If there was a casual worker at No.30 for a few hours now and then in 2013, the year before William disappeared next door, that would be something police needed to check, and something that could easily have slipped the mind of residents and neighbours. In my experience, tradies sometimes leave tools behind or have some other reason to return later and might do so without notifying the residents.

I think this post is probably not breaching privacy, because the house was sold in Dec 2015 according to realestate.com.au, shortly before the phone number was last listed in Feb 2016, according to Reverse Australia (a link won't work, sorry), and it looks like the number has not been re-used.

Interesting find! I’d put a tip in - as you said little things get forgotten.

 

[Warshawski]

do we know why inquest has been delayed ? also could it be because of the two Kendall males the AFP arrested ? I can still see those cars in one of the back yards that seemed very familiar to the ones reported racing around the corner..I dont have the pic.It breaks my heart that Williams case has gone so quiet

Just catching up (sadly) as I so hope every day for good news re William. ..

I don’t know why the delay but I doubt it’s to do with any new / hopeful / helpful evidence.
I think it’s more likely that the enormous time taken so far has still not been enough for the Police involved to get their s*&# ..sorry .. get their Stuff, together in order to present, so have requested additional time.

Just an ‘IMO’ comment that I would like to see an enquiry into the handling of this case from the outset.

 

[IHAVENOCLUE]

https://7news.com.au/news/court-jus...by a,boys who blamed a man named Frank Abbott.

William Tyrrell found deceased.

See link above.

 

[TootsieFootsie]

This hasn't been confirmed by Police. It's just hearsay.

"The startling claim came from two women who heard it from two boys who blamed a man named Frank Abbott"

William Tyrrell found deceased.

 

[IHAVENOCLUE]

This hasn't been confirmed by Police. It's just hearsay.

"The startling claim came from two women who heard it from two boys who blamed a man named Frank Abbott"

Oops!

Sorry!

 

[stormbird]

In case William has any biological relatives living on the NSW South Coast (and it's also relevant for South Coast relatives of any other person missing anywhere across Australia): the Missing Persons Registry will be collecting voluntary DNA samples during visits next week to Bega (Mon 3 May 2021), Batemans Bay (Wed 5 May), and Nowra (Thu 6 and Fri 7 May).
Missing Persons Registry launches South Coast familial DNA collection program, NSW Police Force: Latest News, 25 April 2021

The samples will be searched against an index of unidentified human remains to see if there are any matches or to rule out missing people whose remains have not yet been found.

The collection program started in Coffs Harbour in February 2021 - see SouthAussie's post #606. My follow-up post #610 had a link with the headline "'Our last chance: Pop-up DNA centre draws hundreds searching for missing relatives" (BBM) - but it turns out that was wrong. Only about 50 people contributed, but at least that's 50 more than there were before. It's a start.

 

[Loxoli]

Does Australia have a NAMUS or the Doe Network equivalent? I feel like we have such limited information about our missing and UIDs compared to the US. Is that what the new DNA program is trying to replicate? Or will it only be accessible by LE? Sorry just a little confused with the new roll outs.

 

[stormbird]

Does Australia have a NAMUS or the Doe Network equivalent? I feel like we have such limited information about our missing and UIDs compared to the US. Is that what the new DNA program is trying to replicate? Or will it only be accessible by LE? Sorry just a little confused with the new roll outs.

Loxoli, I couldn't even understand the media release. The "Missing Persons Registry" collects "Familial DNA" samples via "buccal swab" to be "uploaded into the Volunteer Limited Purpose Index (VOLMPU), where they will be searched against the Unidentified Bodies Index", which might or might not be "required for upload to the National Missing Persons Victim System database"... ??

This is just my guess: if Namus and The Doe Network allow volunteers to access information about unidentified human remains, I think there probably isn't an equivalent in Australia. We do have a national register of long-term missing persons which can be searched with filters such as hair colour, gender, year of birth, etc:

National Missing Persons Coordination Centre. (Here's William's profile as an example.)

But I think the register only shows profiles of named people who have been reported missing; I don't think it has information about unidentified remains. MOO

 

[Loxoli]

Loxoli, I couldn't even understand the media release. The "Missing Persons Registry" collects "Familial DNA" samples via "buccal swab" to be "uploaded into the Volunteer Limited Purpose Index (VOLMPU), where they will be searched against the Unidentified Bodies Index", which might or might not be "required for upload to the National Missing Persons Victim System database"... ??

This is just my guess: if Namus and The Doe Network allow volunteers to access information about unidentified human remains, I think there probably isn't an equivalent in Australia. We do have a national register of long-term missing persons which can be searched with filters such as hair colour, gender, year of birth, etc:

National Missing Persons Coordination Centre. (Here's William's profile as an example.)

But I think the register only shows profiles of named people who have been reported missing; I don't think it has information about unidentified remains. MOO

I’m glad I’m not the only one who is confused as to exactly what this new database is going to look like. It sounds like a step in the right direction to have a database that police can access, but I think it would be really helpful for Australia to have a publicly accessible database for UIDs. I’m sure there would be many of us who would find this useful to use alongside the missing persons register. The more eyes that are on missing and UID cases, the more of a chance we have at solving these and providing closure for the families.

 

[stormbird]

From a podcast, Something To Talk About with Samantha Armytage: Retired Homicide Detective Gary Jubelin, 02 May 2021:

(33:50)
Samantha Armytage: Do you know who killed William Tyrrell?*

Gary Jubelin: (pauses) Simple answer I say "No", because I've got suspicions on certain people. I've never said I know definitively what's happened to William, and I'd like to put this out, too: I don't want to say that if they'd left me on the case I would have definitely found out what happened to William. I led the investigation for four years; I was the longest on the investigation, and I was also the person in charge of the investigation. So, there's a lot of information that I've got that causes me to suspect certain people. Um, and I'm not saying that in plural, I'm saying individuals; there's certain individuals that I had reason to suspect. (pause) I think it's a matter that's got to be solved. I don't think we can accept that a child can be abducted** in a place like Benaroon Drive and police not come up with the answers. I know police are still working on it, I hope they're putting in the-- working at it with the same intensity that I worked on the investigation. It's a matter before the coroner and hopefully the coroner will come up with some answers, but it's a difficult investigation but... at my stage of my career, they're the investigations that I felt comfortable running. There's a lot of experience that comes into working Homicide as long as I did, and if I felt running the William Tyrrell investigation, because of the importance of it, the profile of it or whatever, and there was a better person to run it than myself, I would have gladly handed it over, it was too important, it's just... It's sad. I feel sorry for the families in so many different ways, but the fact that there's been this internal turmoil within the police about this - how do you think they [the families] feel? It must make it very hard for them."

(Transcribed by me, stormbird, taking out some of the ums and ahs.)

*The coroner's findings haven't been presented yet, so IMO we don't know whether the evidence shows that William is more likely to have died or not, or (if death is likely) how he died.

**But was William abducted? Presumably the coroner will have to decide about this too?

 

[Shadow@light]

From a podcast, Something To Talk About with Samantha Armytage: Retired Homicide Detective Gary Jubelin, 02 May 2021:

(33:50)
Samantha Armytage: Do you know who killed William Tyrrell?*

Gary Jubelin: (pauses) Simple answer I say "No", because I've got suspicions on certain people. I've never said I know definitively what's happened to William, and I'd like to put this out, too: I don't want to say that if they'd left me on the case I would have definitely found out what happened to William. I led the investigation for four years; I was the longest on the investigation, and I was also the person in charge of the investigation. So, there's a lot of information that I've got that causes me to suspect certain people. Um, and I'm not saying that in plural, I'm saying individuals; there's certain individuals that I had reason to suspect. (pause) I think it's a matter that's got to be solved. I don't think we can accept that a child can be abducted** in a place like Benaroon Drive and police not come up with the answers. I know police are still working on it, I hope they're putting in the-- working at it with the same intensity that I worked on the investigation. It's a matter before the coroner and hopefully the coroner will come up with some answers, but it's a difficult investigation but... at my stage of my career, they're the investigations that I felt comfortable running. There's a lot of experience that comes into working Homicide as long as I did, and if I felt running the William Tyrrell investigation, because of the importance of it, the profile of it or whatever, and there was a better person to run it than myself, I would have gladly handed it over, it was too important, it's just... It's sad. I feel sorry for the families in so many different ways, but the fact that there's been this internal turmoil within the police about this - how do you think they [the families] feel? It must make it very hard for them."

(Transcribed by me, stormbird, taking out some of the ums and ahs.)

*The coroner's findings haven't been presented yet, so IMO we don't know whether the evidence shows that William is more likely to have died or not, or (if death is likely) how he died.

**But was William abducted? Presumably the coroner will have to decide about this too?

Thank you Stormbird.
This saga has dragged on for so long, my heart does go out to both families. Heartbreaking.
Jubelin, I admire in what he says, he has suspicion but there is no current evidence and you need evidence and even he admit he cannot at the moment solve the case.
He is correct people still cannot believe a child can be disappear from a quiet street, as William from Benaroon Drive.
IMO from what I see, read even experienced in life one thing I had learn never think the impossible.
As it can be done.
My grandparents even informed me, even small country towns and rural areas have the darkest deepest secrets. People will go to great length to keep it that way.

 

[Warshawski]

Thank you Stormbird.
This saga has dragged on for so long, my heart does go out to both families. Heartbreaking.
Jubelin, I admire in what he says, he has suspicion but there is no current evidence and you need evidence and even he admit he cannot at the moment solve the case.
He is correct people still cannot believe a child can be disappear from a quiet street, as William from Benaroon Drive.
IMO from what I see, read even experienced in life one thing I had learn never think the impossible.
As it can be done.
My grandparents even informed me, even small country towns and rural areas have the darkest deepest secrets. People will go to great length to keep it that way.

I say thank you also to Stormbird for posting. I wasn’t aware of this podcast.
And also to Shadow for your on point comments.
William’s disappearance cannot be allowed to fade out & not be explained / solved.
We don’t know what happened & answers need to be found, not least of all for his Family, but also for the general public. So much of William has perforated the lives of our people. God Bless Him.

For me, it still defies all logic that those responsible for this investigation would not draw on Gary’s knowledge & pick his brains for any iota of a hint of anything!
Sadly however, we know of corruption within the Police Force, we see it investigated on a disappointingly regular basis. IMO, the PF is now just like every other corporate work place - one’s success is determined by one’s alignment to the culture that exists. And some cultures grow toxic pandemics.

 

[Warshawski]

Also just want to say Hello to everyone & remind myself that we are here & United. ..also remind us all of that fact.

It’s now very difficult times heaped on times that were already often difficult. In Australia we’re doing it so easy, although we think it’s tuff.
The terrible toll of this COVID & the heartbreak it’s delivering in other communities is beyond comprehension for me.

We must say safe, wise, strong & resilient; we must pray a solution & we must pray for our fellows in other nations; we must draw on a collective strength & support, and we must stay our own positive crazy wonderful selves.

I thank you for your collective company & may God please keep you all safe

 

[they'll get you]

https://7news.com.au/news/court-justice/boys-knew-williams-killer-inquest-told-c-743470#:~:text=Credit: AAP William Tyrrell was killed by a,boys who blamed a man named Frank Abbott.

William Tyrrell found deceased.

See link above.

My heart stopped!

That was first published : 13/03/2020
That claim came from two women who heard it from two boys who blamed a man named Frank Abbott.

 

[bearbear]

My heart stopped!

That was first published : 13/03/2020
That claim came from two women who heard it from two boys who blamed a man named Frank Abbott.

same! such a fright reading that!

 

[drsleuth]

From a podcast, Something To Talk About with Samantha Armytage: Retired Homicide Detective Gary Jubelin, 02 May 2021:

(33:50)
Samantha Armytage: Do you know who killed William Tyrrell?*

Gary Jubelin: (pauses) Simple answer I say "No", because I've got suspicions on certain people. I've never said I know definitively what's happened to William, and I'd like to put this out, too: I don't want to say that if they'd left me on the case I would have definitely found out what happened to William. I led the investigation for four years; I was the longest on the investigation, and I was also the person in charge of the investigation. So, there's a lot of information that I've got that causes me to suspect certain people. Um, and I'm not saying that in plural, I'm saying individuals; there's certain individuals that I had reason to suspect. (pause) I think it's a matter that's got to be solved. I don't think we can accept that a child can be abducted** in a place like Benaroon Drive and police not come up with the answers. I know police are still working on it, I hope they're putting in the-- working at it with the same intensity that I worked on the investigation. It's a matter before the coroner and hopefully the coroner will come up with some answers, but it's a difficult investigation but... at my stage of my career, they're the investigations that I felt comfortable running. There's a lot of experience that comes into working Homicide as long as I did, and if I felt running the William Tyrrell investigation, because of the importance of it, the profile of it or whatever, and there was a better person to run it than myself, I would have gladly handed it over, it was too important, it's just... It's sad. I feel sorry for the families in so many different ways, but the fact that there's been this internal turmoil within the police about this - how do you think they [the families] feel? It must make it very hard for them."

(Transcribed by me, stormbird, taking out some of the ums and ahs.)

*The coroner's findings haven't been presented yet, so IMO we don't know whether the evidence shows that William is more likely to have died or not, or (if death is likely) how he died.

**But was William abducted? Presumably the coroner will have to decide about this too?

Thanks Stormbird, listened to this today.

I really wish I was a mind reader, so I could have read Jube's mind at the inquest