Found Deceased AZ - Isabel Mercedes Celis, 6, Tucson, 20 April 2012 *Arrest* #26

Discussion in 'Located Persons Discussion' started by Greater Than, Apr 4, 2017.

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  1. Gunslinging Granny

    Gunslinging Granny Well-Known Member

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    If the security cameras were installed at a low height, they wouldn't show views of Isabel's windows, but the recommended height for a security camera is at least 9 feet.

    "Burglars or peeping toms love cameras that are easily accessible, because they can just smash them and go about their business. Even worse, some thieves grab the cameras and add them to their haul. Always put your security cameras up high on the outside of the home so that they are not easy to reach. A height of 9 feet above the ground is sufficient to stop a person of around 6 feet (1.82 meters) tall or less from bashing a camera."
    https://www.cnet.com/how-to/where-to-place-home-security-cameras/
     


  2. diamond12

    diamond12 Active Member

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    I think the camera with best view was probably the Office Max one. I just couldn't understand all the importance given to the Moore security ones when it's the one with less chances to catch anything at all.
    Now it would be very important and telling if one of the cameras of the shops (side of the house) could offer a good view of the garage, at least we could understand if someone of the family took the car somewhere that night.
    I guess when they say "no activity" that includes movements of the family's vehicles?
     
  3. StrayKat

    StrayKat Meowww

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    I also noted on one of the pics in a news piece, a screen was off the boys bedroom in the front.
     
  4. StrayKat

    StrayKat Meowww

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    Even if the cameras don't see her window directly I think at least one of them gave a distinct lead to investigators. I think JM may know who probably took her, may have been a friend of his he brought to the house and feels responsible. I think he may have been told to leave town. JMO
     
  5. Gunslinging Granny

    Gunslinging Granny Well-Known Member

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    I think his attorney told him to leave town as Sergio and Becky were spinning him as the fall guy.
     
  6. Gunslinging Granny

    Gunslinging Granny Well-Known Member

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    IMO, if someone had been captured on surveillance videos outside Isabel's window, the FBI would have posted his photo like they did on the bridge guy (Abigail Williams' and Liberty German's killer).
     
  7. StrayKat

    StrayKat Meowww

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    I agree, but I have not seen a video yet that shows her window.
     
  8. Gunslinging Granny

    Gunslinging Granny Well-Known Member

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    The security camera that points at Isabel's window is shown in the left lower quadrant of the video contained in this article.
    http://www.tucsonnewsnow.com/story/...eo-shows-celis-home-on-night-of-disappearance
    This security camera in the lower left quadrant is located on the roof towards the middle of the Broadway Center strip mall. It points diagonally over the parking lot behind the Broadway Center strip mall and eventually onto Isabel's window. (Isabel's house is the first house on the left on 12th Street. It is beside Office Max.)
    [​IMG]
     

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  9. Gunslinging Granny

    Gunslinging Granny Well-Known Member

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  10. Gunslinging Granny

    Gunslinging Granny Well-Known Member

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    [​IMG]
    Party City is the big building above Office Max in this photo. If they had a security camera on the SE side of their store, it captured the Celis' garage and driveway.
     

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  11. rashomon

    rashomon Well-Known Member

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    liz,

    Interesting hyothesis about the screen possibly having been removed from inside the bedroom.

    Police sergeant Maria H. did point out that there were "some suspicious circumstances associated with the window"
    Maybe they found out that the screen was buckled from the inside out?
    This would indicate someone having removed the screen from inside the bedroom. The wording "suspicious circumstances" might point to a staged scene ...

    [SGT. Maria H.] "There were some suspicious circumstances associated with the window to the house, where we can't confirm if that's a point of entry or exit.

    Sgt. Maria H continues:

    "And so as you can imagine there's a variety of other ways to get in and out of the house, so we're examining all possible - all possibilities. "


    [video=youtube;XzZBp9d0T78]https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=XzZBp9d0T78[/video]


    But if none of the surveillance cameras could capture anything suspicious which pointed to Isabel being removed from her home on that night, then how did (whoever took her) manage to get Isabel out of the house without being seen?
    Were there any areas of the house which none of the surveillance cameras could capture in their vield of view?
     
  12. diamond12

    diamond12 Active Member

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    This. That's what I have been trying to say, there must be areas where the cameras couldn't reach, or they didn't function properly.
    Something has to be on the tapes, someone must have taken Isa to where she was found and that had to be done with a vehicle.
    I think the areas possibly left out from camera's view are the front and the left side (watching from the entrance).
    I'm still not convinced those cameras are that important in the case, of course they are but not 100%.
     
  13. rashomon

    rashomon Well-Known Member

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    Only a few weeks after Isabel's disappearance, Sergio C. seemed to have changed his mind about Isabel's bedroom window being an entry/exit point of the 'abductor'. Could Sergio have been confronted by the TPD with evidence which pointed away from his original 'hypothesis'?

    But if the 'abductor' did not get in through Isabel's bedroom window (or any of the other windows) then how did this person get into the house? Was it someone who had a key to the home?
    Even if there existed other persons who did have a key - how likely ist it that one of them managed to sneak into this house full of people, grab Isabel out of her bed without no one waking up??
    Even two of the Celises' dogs were inside the house in kennels - none of those dogs stirred, none of them barked, none of them made the slightest noise??

    Where did Sergio say he fell asleep on that night? Was it on the couch in the family room?
     
  14. rashomon

    rashomon Well-Known Member

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    http://bloximages.chicago2.vip.town...-11e1-8e9c-001a4bcf887a/4fb1dbce13254.pdf.pdf

    From Sergio's 911 call:

    Were the surveillance cameras pointing at the Celis home already switched on at 10:30 pm? If yes, their footage might provide evidence that the (complete) family did in fact arrive home around that time.

    So the removed screen was laying in the backyard, and not just left behind under Isabel's window? Why would an intruder take this extra walk round the corner of the house and place the removed screen in the backyard?




     
  15. liz b.

    liz b. Well-Known Member

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    It was amazing to me when LE said that locating Isabel's remains was not due to "happenstance"...they were saying so much with that statement. jmo I believe that there is a lot going on behind the scenes here. I have always wondered if Isabel's death was accidental. jmo
     
  16. Soulsad

    Soulsad New Member

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    But accidents don't need to be covered up.
     
  17. StrayKat

    StrayKat Meowww

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    I love that statement!
     
  18. liz b.

    liz b. Well-Known Member

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    Only consider this : CPS was involved with the family. IF there was a fight which broke out over gaming ( given the blood LE found all around the gaming chair in the boys' room ), and IF one of her siblings hit Isabel harder than was realized, causing her accidental death. it would likely have meant that the parents would have lost all of their children in one awful night. This is just ^ speculation^ about what took place that night.
     
  19. Madeleine74

    Madeleine74 Knower of Things

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    Tell that to the Ramsey family. One of the strongest theories (IMO) is that it was an act of rage of one child against another, with the rest of it being covered up by the parent.

    You are assuming family would *know* the outcome of such an event, even if it were an accident. A death is investigated, period. The thought of a family member being taken away would likely cause many families to try a coverup instead.
     
  20. Knox

    Knox Well-Known Member

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    That would explain the odd behavior of the parents (MOO).
     
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