Baez - Just Lost The Trial

[KPCrimeNY]

Jose Baez stated in his opening remarks that Caylee died due to a tragic accident - a drowning in the family pool. Baez goes on to give a touching story but is it rooted in reality?

I don't think so and I'll tell you why

This is what Baez stated in his opening remarks;

"Early morning hours the exact time is not known...it could have been early afternoon...early morning...actually it was the early morning hours. George Anthony approached Casey and started yelling at her - where's Caylee, where's Caylee? They began to search the house, they couldn't find her, they searched in the bedrooms, they searched under the beds, in the closets, in the garage, then they went outside. This is a mock up of the Anthony home where you'll see they both came outside. Casey came around to the left of the house, George went that way towards the pool, they have an above ground pool with a ladder, and we'll talk about the pool and the ladder in just a moment. What happened next is as soon as Casey came around this corner and went back she saw George Anthony holding Caylee in his arms."

Keeping in mind that opening statements are not evidence but if you present them to a jury you had better hope that you can back them up and this is where Baez scores a huge fail.

There is no way there is enough time for George to...

1 find Caylee in the pool
2 climb the ladder
3 get in the pool
4 grab Caylee
5 remove Caylee and himself from the pool
6 climb back down the ladder
7 walk back to the opposite corner of the house where Casey is just returningThe corridor at the side of the house that Casey is alleged to have gone to is a small and very narrow space with a locked shed at the end of the corridor with no where for Caylee to hide - it would probably only take about 20 seconds to walk there and back to the edge of the house - so no way no how is this going to fly with a jury.

LDB crafted a brilliantly clever and concise presentation and made very sure to do this step by careful step with Cindy, to lay out the dimensions of the house, the garden and the pool area - complete with photographic evidence of how small a space they are talking about. I've no doubt this was quickly put together by the state when they heard Baez's opening remarks.

Still don't believe me, well just to put the icing on the cake when Baez attempts to throw Cindy into the mix as a possible accomplice - Cindy refutes this utterly and completely believably by thwarting him with her testimony that she removed that pool ladder.

Casey's pool story is busted as a complete fabrication.

Baez just lost the trial in the 1.40 mins it took him to tell that story.

BBM
I can't believe I am going to type this but have to...
It could have taken 2 seconds to get the child out of the pool. GA can easily reach over the side of the pool and scoop Caylee out in under 2 seconds without ever getting more then up to his elbows wet. Do it with my daughter in and out of the pool all the time she is now 5 and 50 lbs. I am also half the size of GA.

OT - GA is pretty big dude. I would love to see open a can of whoop *advertiser censored** on JB!

ETA-i am with you on the story being as rotten as a bag of garbage though.

 

[Reality Orlando]

BBM:

It almost sounded like a John Lovitz SNL skit......"yeah, that's the ticket!"

Wow, exactly! I would be furious if I'd paid a lawyer over $200,000 and he came out with that opening.

 

[darnudes]

BBM
I can't believe I am going to type this but have to...
It could have taken 2 seconds to get the child out of the pool. GA can easily reach over the side of the pool and scoop Caylee out in under 2 seconds without ever getting more then up to his elbows wet. Do it with my daughter in and out of the pool all the time she is now 5 and 50 lbs. I am also half the size of GA.

OT - GA is pretty big dude. I would love to see open a can of whoop *advertiser censored** on JB!

ETA-i am with you on the story being as rotten as a bag of garbage though.

Sorry but I'm going to have to disagree with you on this one, Cindy is 5 foot 4 and George is not that much taller, depending on where you are standing at the pool the pool comes up to Cindy's chest or neck - the story still doesn't work in the time allotted even if George does have the time to find her and scoop her up and get back to Casey - all under approximately 20 seconds. I don't believe any juror is going to find this a reasonable scenario.

 

[rbrnmw2]

Great catch on the time it would take GA to get Caylee out of the pool.

And of course the jury may not know but we all do....GA loved Caylee so much that there is no way he could have gone into work that afternoon if Caylee had just died.

I think JB has just spend too much time reading blogs and took a little bit from all the different ones he read and tried to merge them all together.

When I heard the OS I was thinking Lenny P was his advisor :waitasec:

 

[Infojunkie]

BBM
I can't believe I am going to type this but have to...
It could have taken 2 seconds to get the child out of the pool. GA can easily reach over the side of the pool and scoop Caylee out in under 2 seconds without ever getting more then up to his elbows wet. Do it with my daughter in and out of the pool all the time she is now 5 and 50 lbs. I am also half the size of GA.

OT - GA is pretty big dude. I would love to see open a can of whoop *advertiser censored** on JB!

ETA-i am with you on the story being as rotten as a bag of garbage though.

Have you felt an acutal child in distress? It's horrible, and unforgettable. I cried all the way to the hospital with the paramedic constantly asking me if I was ok, I couldn't stop crying. And all he had was a febrile seizure, but the blue lips, the seizures, and I didn't call 911 right away, I talked to him, I told him you can't do this, I need you, you aren't supposed to do this...and then I called 911. You know what they did to help me...they said we're coming and hung up. 2 seconds...they spent that long getting my address...and that's it.

 

[jen&jonhart]

Also jb cant explain why ga would want to cover up Caylee's death. Ga is former le I am sure he has seen many tragic accidents. Why would anyone cover it up? moo

 

[mysteriew]

I believe KC will get convicted of murder, though I believe that the degree and the sentence are still up for grabs. Never the less......

It ain't over yet. Was that a mistake? Yeah, I believe it was. But all the witnesses haven't been seen yet, the evidence hasn't been presented to the court with their theories, and the jury hasn't voted yet. And you never know just how the jury is going to go. They may accept everything the SA tells them, or they might have an unknown soft touch for the DT. So don't count your chickens until they hatch, and all that. This mistake (if it was a mistake) is a biggie. But hopefully it won't be the only one.

And you probably think that because GA and CA said no it didn't happen, that there are no other witnesses to dispute JB's allegations. But I am wondering if maybe JB hasn't decided to roll the dice and put KC on the stand to tell it 'her' way. She can be her own witness. And she doesn't have to tell the same story the A's told.

It he puts her on the stand that will be a real roll of the dice. It only takes one juror to 'like' her or like her story. People here have studied the case extensively. Here we have seen the 'story' develop to it's current evolution, and that helps to tell us that the story is changing and helps us with our opinions on guilt.

But the jurors, they only see the final story. And when there is conflicting witnesses, they have to decide which they feel is more believable. No one has heard a word from KC, but they have heard a lot from the A's. So even with a jury pool that doesn't follow media, it is very possible they have heard or seen some highlights or caught a little of a news broadcasts that the A's did. So which do you think the jury will believe, the grieving grandparents that have been all over the media, or the young suspect in the case?

Don't forget KC's angry face during the A's testimonies. Anger at her parents. Just the way you would expect the face of person would be who was hearing her parents tell lies against her in the witness chair.

I'm not saying this is what the jury is going to think. But IMO it is possible, just possible that at least one juror might look at it this way. So just don't think it is a slam dunk just yet, it is a little too early to tell.

 

[zippitydoda]

Not to mention what he said about Lee

How he was taking into his father's footsteps, although it didn't go that far..
He says

"It got so bad that the FBI tested his DNA to see if he was Caylee's father"

Now, how the hell does it not go as far as George, but far enough that the FBI tests Lee's DNA, which suggests a hell of a lot more than what they were saying about George?

And when did Lee ever deny the allegations, and say that when the time is right he would talk about it?

snipped by me...

See the FBI Agent Nick Savage depo - here is the link, see page 35

http://www.websleuths.com/forums/showthread.php?t=94377&page=15

 

[mysteriew]

As a former prosecutor who has tried many death penalty cases, you absolutely never know how a juror or jurors will look at the evidence based on their own life experiences. This is a very interesting case for seeking the death penalty. Normally, most domestic homicides are not prosecuted as death penalty cases. In most cases jurors do come to the truth. A guilty verdict does appear a likely outcome, however, I would be very surprised if the jury recommends death.

Welcome to WS!

What do you think the chances are of the defense putting KC on the stand?

 

[mobius99]

As a former prosecutor who has tried many death penalty cases, you absolutely never know how a juror or jurors will look at the evidence based on their own life experiences. This is a very interesting case for seeking the death penalty. Normally, most domestic homicides are not prosecuted as death penalty cases. In most cases jurors do come to the truth. A guilty verdict does appear a likely outcome, however, I would be very surprised if the jury recommends death.

BBM
Hello and welcome. Thank you for your insight. I also do not believe the jury will recommend DP. It is my opinion the jury will struggle with reconciling who they see sitting across the courtroom vs the damning testimony and evidence. But after 8 to 10 weeks they will come to the truth. KC's story is really quite pedestrian, sadly. How many times have we seen it played out in the news? Young unwed mother, no HS diploma, no job & living with parents, immature with obvious mental issues, new exciting boyfriend....would anyone have any trouble believing the mother did it if KC was unattractive and black or hispanic? <MOO>

 

[STEADFAST]

Sorry but I'm going to have to disagree with you on this one, Cindy is 5 foot 4 and George is not that much taller, depending on where you are standing at the pool the pool comes up to Cindy's chest or neck - the story still doesn't work in the time allotted even if George does have the time to find her and scoop her up and get back to Casey - all under approximately 20 seconds. I don't believe any juror is going to find this a reasonable scenario.

Plus, she would be at the bottom of the pool.

 

[Purple Iris]

What do you think the chances are of the defense putting KC on the stand?

I don't see it happening at all.

All during jury selection, they made it a heavy point to hammer home the fact that their client does not have to testify, and if she should decide not to, they cannot hold it against her.

They drilled that well dry repeatedly; over and over with each one that made it that far. Going as far as asking each one if they could put that aside and not hold it against her. And, just for good measure, slamming it down their throats one more time as they approached home plate before being accepted.

I'd be very surprised if she takes the stand.

 

[mysteriew]

I don't see it happening at all.

All during jury selection, they made it a heavy point to hammer home the fact that their client does not have to testify, and if she should decide not to, they cannot hold it against her.

They drilled that well dry emphasing that over and over with each one that made it that far.

I'd be very surprised if she takes the stand.

I didn't think he would either. And I think it would be pretty stupid to put her on. But with all the allegations he made in his opening, right now I don't see any way for him to try to show that without putting her on. JMHO

 

[LaLaw2000]

Also, the way he worded it--"They began to search the house, they couldn't find her, they searched in the bedrooms, they searched under the beds, in the closets, in the garage, then they went outside."

That is the exact opposite of what a parent with a pool would do. If your toddler, who loves the swimming pool is MISSING-- why would you check in the closets and under all of the beds BEFORE checking the pool? That makes no sense.

I have found 'missing kids' under the bed asleep and hiding in closets before, and they have been safe and sound. That is NOT the first place you need to look if there is a big
body of water out back. And I am pretty sure they both know that. And why would they both stay inside and search? Wouldn't one run outside first thing?

Well, a great big honkin' clue for them would have been if there was an exterior door unlocked! Little Caylee surely wouldn't have locked a door behind her.

We heard Cindy describe in detail how 'child-proof' the house was. Cindy even stated that Casey was the one who went out and bought the child-proofing materials. (I seriously doubt that.)

Also, there have been quite a few cases in this past year of children/toddlers going outside on their own. Cindy testified that their front door was triple dead bolted. That door is out of the question. I doubt Caylee could have found her way out through the garage and somehow gone through the fence at the side of the house. She would not have been able to open the fence gate, IMO. That only leaves three doors. Cindy stated that the master bedroom had a sliding glass door to the screened in porch. There are sliding glass doors from the living room and kitchen.

Who let the dogs out to go potty that morning? Cindy says the dogs potty in the back yard. She also said she left the house at 7:00 AM that morning. Did she secure the sliding glass doors after the dogs came back in? Is the defense going to go after her as the one leaving the sliding door unlocked? She is the dog person in the house.

Seriously, though, the very thought that little Caylee would have enough upper body strength and in her arms to slide a heavy glass door open even if it were unlocked is ridiculous. JMO.

By the end of this trial, I think the jury will find the defense theories unproven. I do not see Casey getting the death penalty. I do see her getting LWOP. JMO

What I would love to see is Casey get the death penalty and after about 3 years of sitting on death row get her sentence commuted to LWOP. That would make me happy.

MOO's

 

[Disguiseduser0308]

I don't see it happening at all.

All during jury selection, they made it a heavy point to hammer home the fact that their client does not have to testify, and if she should decide not to, they cannot hold it against her.

They drilled that well dry repeatedly; over and over with each one that made it that far. Going as far as asking each one if they could put that aside and not hold it against her. And, just for good measure, slamming it down their throats one more time as they approached home plate before being accepted.

I'd be very surprised if she takes the stand.

FWIW: The DT in the trial I served on did the same thing. The accused did end up testifying in his own defense.

 

[KPCrimeNY]

Sorry but I'm going to have to disagree with you on this one, Cindy is 5 foot 4 and George is not that much taller, depending on where you are standing at the pool the pool comes up to Cindy's chest or neck - the story still doesn't work in the time allotted even if George does have the time to find her and scoop her up and get back to Casey - all under approximately 20 seconds. I don't believe any juror is going to find this a reasonable scenario.

It's all good and we may have to agree to disagree. I am not looking to argue and be disrespectful at all. I don't have the specs for the A's pool but most above ground are 48" deep. If it is not sunk in the ground that gives somebody that is 5'4 a 1'4" over the coping of the pool. If it is sunk in the ground even more. Enough to get your armpits over the pool and scoop.

Have you felt an acutal child in distress? It's horrible, and unforgettable. I cried all the way to the hospital with the paramedic constantly asking me if I was ok, I couldn't stop crying. And all he had was a febrile seizure, but the blue lips, the seizures, and I didn't call 911 right away, I talked to him, I told him you can't do this, I need you, you aren't supposed to do this...and then I called 911. You know what they did to help me...they said we're coming and hung up. 2 seconds...they spent that long getting my address...and that's it.

Yes same story as you and we drove to the hospital. But, I'm not sure how that equates to a timeline of getting in the pool or not?

Again not looking to be rude at all. I hate discussing this just trying to present my opinion and that it really could happen much quicker without getting in and someone with GA's prior LE experience jumping right into rescue mode and acting quicker then the avareage person might. Especially when it's your granddaughter.

 

[Purple Iris]

Just had a thought - which goes to Baez telling the drowning took place either early in the morning, or early afteroon.

Does, "I dropped off Caylee between 9 and 1 ring a bell with anyone???

Maybe Caylee did drown, which has always made the most sense to my mind anyway, but the dropping off times had me going "WHAT" all the time.

If she got away from Casey early, while maybe Casey was on the computer, or doing who knows what, time can get away from you.

Anyway - it's late, my mind is numb, but, I just wanted to throw that out there for a minute.
I still think she is guilty as all get out though.

 

[Infojunkie]

I doubt they will get the DP also. But most people would be fine with her receiving LWOP I think. And I wonder if that is what they expect anyway. Like the jury might figure they are showing her mercy by not going for the DP, but giving her LIFE instead.

In your professional opinion, how do you think things are going so far?

I would like to hear this too. I would be interested to hear what a GOOD defense would be. Would you go with the same line of questioning? Can you bring up life long sexual abuse with no evidence to excuse a crime?

 

[KPCrimeNY]

Plus, she would be at the bottom of the pool.

True I was automatically thinking flaoting.
Strike that your honor.

Sincerely,
Sorry to Darnudes and InfoJunkie for even going here.

 

[gxm]

BBM
I can't believe I am going to type this but have to...
It could have taken 2 seconds to get the child out of the pool. GA can easily reach over the side of the pool and scoop Caylee out in under 2 seconds without ever getting more then up to his elbows wet. Do it with my daughter in and out of the pool all the time she is now 5 and 50 lbs. I am also half the size of GA.

OT - GA is pretty big dude. I would love to see open a can of whoop *advertiser censored** on JB!

ETA-i am with you on the story being as rotten as a bag of garbage though.

I'm unfamiliar with the Ants pool or how high it is. <TRIGGER WARNING for EXTREMELY UNPLEASANT DETAILS> I'm also unfamiliar with how long it would take for a small child to sink to the bottom. But to believe KC's story, IMO, the body would have already sunk to the bottom (and more difficult to retrieve as GA would have to go in after her). There's no way that GA would not perform CPR if she had been found floating. He'd have been shouting to KC to call 911 because there was the chance they might save her.