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Ballistics, firearms and firearm paraphernalia

Discussion in 'Oscar Pistorius' started by Harmony 2, Mar 16, 2014.

  1. Harmony 2

    Harmony 2 Administrator Staff Member Administrator Moderator

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    link [​IMG]

    http://nypost.com/2013/02/20/blade-runner-wanted-to-build-an-arsenal-report/


    [​IMG] link

    http://www.theglobeandmail.com/news...phic-should-not-be-broadcast/article17391312/

    [​IMG]

    link

    http://www.ibtimes.co.uk/oscar-pistorius-trial-reeva-steenkamp-killed-hail-dum-dum-bullets-1439680

    http://www.mirror.co.uk/news/world-...urder-trial-paralympian-3239495#ixzz2vzO9xfvO

    http://www.timeslive.co.za/local/2014/03/13/the-oscar-pistorius-murder-trial-day-9

    http://www.bdlive.co.za/national/2014/03/13/graphic-evidence-on-tv-screens-at-oscar-pistorius-trial

    http://www.dailymail.co.uk/sport/ot...us-moments-shot-girlfriend.html#ixzz2w3IiubjJ

    The trial will eventually come around to the ballistics. Discuss the ballistics, firearms and firearm paraphernalia such as holsters, cartridges, bullets, trajectories, etc. here on this thread...

    http://www.bbc.com/news/world-africa-26579299
     
  2. AlwaysShocked

    AlwaysShocked Well-Known Member

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    Thanks for this thread. Oscar applied for permits for another SIX weapons in January, just weeks before the shooting. Yikes!

    Poor Reeva - it appears she hooked up with a controlling, reckless gun nut.
     
  3. wishIknewmore

    wishIknewmore New Member

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    In the US, most states require you to take a Gun Safety Course before getting a License to Carry. Does SA require this? Just curious because as I mentioned before, he seems to have ignored the top 4 rules. I have a hard time believing he wouldn't know them.
     
  4. Harmony 2

    Harmony 2 Administrator Staff Member Administrator Moderator

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    [​IMG]

    http://www.huffingtonpost.com/2013/02/26/oscar-pistorius-shooting-firearm-rules_n_2766376.html
     
  5. Harmony 2

    Harmony 2 Administrator Staff Member Administrator Moderator

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    I hate guns but was curious about the air rifle with silencer by the master bedroom door. I wondered if it could have made the hole in the master bedroom door. It appears from the information below that the projectile hole in the door could not have been made with the air rifle since it says that pellets or BBs are used.

    Air gun - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia
     
  6. sorrell skye

    sorrell skye Well-Known Member

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    When I heard Col Van Rensburg testify that the gun was found on the bathmat with the hammer in a cocked position, my first thought was "OMGoodness - that's dangerous!" I was thinking it could have easily been accidentally discharged during the crime scene investigation and could have seriously hurt someone. But then Van Rensburg explained that no one touched the gun except the firearms/ballistics expert, who disarmed it. So I said "Phew!"

    I then wondered why OP would have left it on the floor with the hammer cocked.

    If I take my personal bias out of the equation and just allow that particular piece of evidence to speak to me, here's what it suggests to me:

    The gun was ready to be fired again, but was put down on the floor in a hurry.

    From OP's BH affidavit (text in red added by me):

    When I reached the bed, I realised that Reeva was not in bed. That is when it dawned on me that it could have been Reeva who was in the toilet. I returned to the bathroom calling her name. [This could have been when he put the gun down on the bathmat, hammer still cocked.] I tried to open the toilet door but it was locked. I rushed back into the bedroom and opened the sliding door exiting onto the balcony and screamed for help.

    http://gretawire.foxnewsinsider.com/2013/02/19/copy-of-oscar-pistorius-affidavit-click-to-read/

    If he put the cocked gun down in a hurry, I can envision two scenarios:

    1. He's telling the truth in his BH hearing affidavit (he shot & killed Reeva in a panic, mistaking her for a dangerous burglar), and when he realized it was her in the toilet room, he dropped the gun instantly without uncocking it because he was horrified that he had shot her.

    2. He's lying in his BH affidavit (he didn't mistake Reeva for a dangerous burglar). He killed her after a heated argument that escalated (on his part) into a murderous rage. He had been ready to fire another round (the hammer was cocked), but the emotional impetus (rage) had dissipated with the four rounds he had already fired, and he dropped the gun onto the bathmat (again, without uncocking it).

    I think it could go either way.
     
  7. sorrell skye

    sorrell skye Well-Known Member

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    According to testimony by Van Rensburg on Trial Day 10, the gun holster was found on the bedside table on the left-hand side of the bed (left-hand side if one is standing at the foot of the bed, facing the bed).

    Archived trial videos can be found at this link:

    http://www.wildabouttrial.com/one_off/oscar-pistorius-trial-archive/

    In OP's bail hearing affidavit, OP stated:

    16.8 I felt a sense of terror rushing over me. There are no burglar bars across the bathroom window and I knew that contractors who worked at my house had left the ladders outside. Although I did not have my prosthetic legs on I have mobility on my stumps.

    16.9 I believed that someone had entered my house. I was too scared to switch a light on.

    16.10 I grabbed my 9mm pistol from underneath my bed. On my way to the bathroom I screamed words to the effect for him/them to get out of my house and for Reeva to phone the police. It was pitch dark in the bedroom and I thought Reeva was in bed.


    http://gretawire.foxnewsinsider.com/2013/02/19/copy-of-oscar-pistorius-affidavit-click-to-read/

    My question is this: If OP was in the state of terror he claims to have been in when he "grabbed" his gun from beneath the bed in the "pitch dark bedroom", how did he have the wherewithal & why did he take the time to place the gun holster on the bedside table where it was later found by the crime scene investigators?

    If in a state of terror in a pitch dark bedroom (too scared to switch a light on), I would find it more plausible that he would have dropped the gun holster on the floor.
     
  8. minor4th

    minor4th Verified Attorney

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    There's nothing to suggest that he put the holster on the bedside table - VR's testimony was unclear, but there is no evidence that that is where the holster was when it was actually found (it wasn't VR who found it), and no evidence that the gun was in the holster when Oscar retrieved it. I actually thought VR's testimony about it, he first said the holster and magazine were in the drawer of the bedside table.
     
  9. AlwaysShocked

    AlwaysShocked Well-Known Member

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    Magazine=found in drawer
    Holster=found where shown in picture on bedside stand up against wall (Prosecutor had to prompt witness with English words for "bedside stand" at this point in his testimony)
     
  10. sorrell skye

    sorrell skye Well-Known Member

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    VR testified that the ammunition magazine and the holster pouch for the ammo were located in the bedside table drawer on the right-hand side of the bed.

    He was quite specific that the gun holster was found on top of the bedside table on the left-hand side of the bed.

    During his testimony on Friday, I rewound the feed on WAT to make sure I had this info accurate as Zwiebel and I were transcribing it for the thread.
     
  11. strydohj

    strydohj Member

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    I could not help to think about what horse play could have been had with the air rifle. Air rifles can expell air from their muzzles at velocities op up to and even exceeding 1000ft/second. It does not need to be loaded with amunition and can 'fire' anything that can fit in the muzzle. It is fairly common knowledge that a grain or seed expelled from the muzzle can draw blood or seriously bruise skin. The inside muzzle diameter is 0.17 inches so there is lots of option for projectiles. I tested it again today by discharging an unloaded air rifle 1/2 a feet from a match box and have it propelled some distance. I will not expell the air from the rifle against my skin...
     
  12. wishIknewmore

    wishIknewmore New Member

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    I couldn't believe he left the hammer cocked either! Could he really be this reckless? He had to have out of his mind to do this or her is insanely reckless. You got a good point with your 2 scenerios.
     
  13. Harmony 2

    Harmony 2 Administrator Staff Member Administrator Moderator

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  14. Harmony 2

    Harmony 2 Administrator Staff Member Administrator Moderator

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    more at link:

    http://www.abc.net.au/news/2014-03-19/ballistics-expert-reconstructs-reeva-steenkamps-death/5332750
     
  15. Harmony 2

    Harmony 2 Administrator Staff Member Administrator Moderator

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  16. Harmony 2

    Harmony 2 Administrator Staff Member Administrator Moderator

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  17. shane13

    shane13 New Member

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    Update: No double taps
     
  18. liesbeth

    liesbeth New Member

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    Look at the testimony again. Van Rensburg is talking about the pistol's magazine that was indeed found in the right hand drawer. Roux was talking about the magazine (paper book) on the left hand bedside table. Roux eventually realizes the misunderstanding and clears it up.
     
  19. Carmelita

    Carmelita Former Member

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    I’m wondering if one of our members with more knowledge of firearms than me can tell me if this is an accurate statement about Oscar’s gun. I saw a youtube video describing a 9mm Taurus and the gun “demonstrator” said that the first pull of the trigger is a hard pull, but subsequent pulls of the trigger need a far less firm pull. The original hard pull is a “safety” mechanism to make accidental firing of the gun less likely.
     
  20. RANCH

    RANCH Well-Known Member

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    Yes, that would be an accurate statement Carm. A double action automatic pistol like the one Oscar used is designed so that it can have a round loaded in the chamber and be safely carried without the manual safety engaged. The heavy trigger pull makes it unlikely that an accidental firing of the gun will happen.

    The first shot (if the hammer is down) will be heavy and subsequent shots will have a lighter trigger pull because the slide will automatically cock the hammer.

    Most double action revolvers do not have a manual safety. They rely on the heavy trigger pull as the only "safety".
     

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