Bosma Murder Trial - Weekend Discussion #15
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InducedLogic
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I don't understand why, after hearing all the evidence, MS didn't just say they drove N past SuperSucker, then got the call and turned back South to go pick up the fake friend. It would have explained everything. I for one, from the moment MS said they went directly to the fake friend, wanted an explanation for the other sightings of the truck. Surely, TD and MS must have realized they would have to explain the other sightings of the truck.
ArianeEmory
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Don't think so. No foundation has really been laid for it, that I can recall. At least nothing that didn't end in legal arguments.
Well, in fairness, it's not really ludicrous at all. Not many people are going to plead guilty to first degree murder and throw their life away.
Even Bernardo plead not guilty, and that was after KH had made her infamous "deal with the devil."
Arnie M
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To add to that I find it a bit hard to see the killing play out in such a short time ..... pull over ... park .... shoot .... lights out .... and then according to MS DM simply gets out of truck ... holsters weapon ... walks to Yukon and tells MS to change plates .... and they drive away.
Somehow to have the shooting happen simply as a little blip in that roadside stop does not fit .... And I tend to agree the shooting happened earlier .... and I also tend to believe when MS said the shooter looked and acted like a lunatic . And I believe the conversation included yelling because of deafness from firing a gun in a closed vehicle.
Question is whether the possessed-lunatic description was DM describing MS or MS describing DM
I also think when DM said .... I AM TAKING THE TRUCK .... during the test drive it was a prearranged signal that they would enact the rest of the plan.
My apologies in advance for turning a little philosophical/reflective here...I just found myself in that mood 
This is the first trial I've followed closely from start to finish.
Ever since I first heard of the disappearance through the church grapevine/facebook, I've felt like I was a part of it.
I still cry when I remember the raw emotion of Sharlene's plea for Tim's return ("You don’t need him. BUT I DO! And our daughter needs her daddy back,” It has angered me during this trial that people knew things, but ignored that plaintive plea...a call for human compassion...for an answer...
and then there were so many geographical familiarities along the way that drew me into the case even further...
The Justice system part I have found fascinating...it has made me rethink old positions on rights of EVERYone involved...thank you to WS posters and journalists who have given me this education.
At times, the stories of the lives led by that 'entourage' quite frankly depressed me..I kept wanting this to read like a well written novel where the characters come out in the end changed and better for what they've gone through...but, for the most part, I was deprived of that luxury and had to face the fact that a RL court case isn't a place we can go for absolute truth or redemption.
Still...while I sometimes found myself mourning the evilness and selfishness of some people in this world through this case, in the next moment I found myself encouraged and proud of the goodness and compassion of many more people also who filed through the courtroom...
1. Those in the 'entourage' who DID stand up and speak at least most of the truth (thank you)
2 Dr. Tracy Rogers, the forensic anthropologist who testified about the collection of human bone and ash from an incinerator stressed her determination to give the family every tiny piece that she could. "I thought it was important for the family's peace of mind that they have all the remains," she told the jury. Her voice cracked as she spoke and she apologized.After her testimony, Tim Bosma's father Hank followed Rogers out of the courtroom and gave her a hug. (Thank you Dr Rogers and Mr Bosma)
3. Veterinarian Robert Burns who stepped up to testify against his nephew Millard.... and was reported to have smiled and nodded several times to Sharlene Bosma during his testimony. (Thank you for that )
4. The person who spent so many hours putting together the incredibly useful powerpoint presentation on the phones (thank you for your time and diligence)
5. The LE, experts, the neighbours and witnesses who stood up and reported what they saw...who chose to get involved
6. The Bosma army who support the family so faithfully each day
....
I actually could go on and on....and I guess I am just happy now that I can....and thank you all who prove in big and little ways that there is still a LOT of good in this world, lets make sure the next generation can be equally proud
This is the first trial I've followed closely from start to finish.
Ever since I first heard of the disappearance through the church grapevine/facebook, I've felt like I was a part of it.
I still cry when I remember the raw emotion of Sharlene's plea for Tim's return ("You don’t need him. BUT I DO! And our daughter needs her daddy back,”
It has angered me during this trial that people knew things, but ignored that plaintive plea...a call for human compassion...for an answer...and then there were so many geographical familiarities along the way that drew me into the case even further...
The Justice system part I have found fascinating...it has made me rethink old positions on rights of EVERYone involved...thank you to WS posters and journalists who have given me this education.
At times, the stories of the lives led by that 'entourage' quite frankly depressed me..I kept wanting this to read like a well written novel where the characters come out in the end changed and better for what they've gone through...but, for the most part, I was deprived of that luxury and had to face the fact that a RL court case isn't a place we can go for absolute truth or redemption.
Still...while I sometimes found myself mourning the evilness and selfishness of some people in this world through this case, in the next moment I found myself encouraged and proud of the goodness and compassion of many more people also who filed through the courtroom...
1. Those in the 'entourage' who DID stand up and speak at least most of the truth (thank you)
2 Dr. Tracy Rogers, the forensic anthropologist who testified about the collection of human bone and ash from an incinerator stressed her determination to give the family every tiny piece that she could. "I thought it was important for the family's peace of mind that they have all the remains," she told the jury. Her voice cracked as she spoke and she apologized.After her testimony, Tim Bosma's father Hank followed Rogers out of the courtroom and gave her a hug. (Thank you Dr Rogers and Mr Bosma)
3. Veterinarian Robert Burns who stepped up to testify against his nephew Millard.... and was reported to have smiled and nodded several times to Sharlene Bosma during his testimony. (Thank you for that )
4. The person who spent so many hours putting together the incredibly useful powerpoint presentation on the phones (thank you for your time and diligence)
5. The LE, experts, the neighbours and witnesses who stood up and reported what they saw...who chose to get involved
6. The Bosma army who support the family so faithfully each day
....
I actually could go on and on....and I guess I am just happy now that I can....and thank you all who prove in big and little ways that there is still a LOT of good in this world, lets make sure the next generation can be equally proud
brightii
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Maybe you're right about that as I don't usually follow crimes and trials, but I would think in the cases where there is overwhelming evidence against an accused, and that it would be almost impossible to overcome, that the accused would be better off in the long run pleading guilty. It would save the family the heartache of a long complicated trial and perhaps the accused would fare a bit better at the sentencing phase? DM must truly be in complete denial if he thinks he has even a faint hope of an securing an acquittal or a lesser charge, IMO. I could be wrong, but I sure hope I'm right that a conviction for first degree murder is the result for DM.
All MOO.
These are my owns thoughts on things so far.......
DM and MS collaborated and planned this "mission" of theft and murder, together.
The 2 earlier sightings of a Ram going North then South past Super Suckers are TB's vehicle. (MS is lying)
MS is lying through his teeth....far too many "cant recall"s and "I was too scared"s . He attempted to cover his tracks/prints and appears to be relatively clever, compared to DM, although to be honest that's not difficut, and has a certain amount of audacity.
Having been caught these 2 are now trying to blame each other, a pretty common tactic I believe, when there are 2 co-defendants.
Who pulled the trigger ?.....Hmm don't know about that, although I believe that they were both there and both knew it was going to happen. Therefore they are both culpable and guilty as charged.
This are all my own thoughts, IMO, MOO.
DM and MS collaborated and planned this "mission" of theft and murder, together.
The 2 earlier sightings of a Ram going North then South past Super Suckers are TB's vehicle. (MS is lying)
MS is lying through his teeth....far too many "cant recall"s and "I was too scared"s . He attempted to cover his tracks/prints and appears to be relatively clever, compared to DM, although to be honest that's not difficut, and has a certain amount of audacity.
Having been caught these 2 are now trying to blame each other, a pretty common tactic I believe, when there are 2 co-defendants.
Who pulled the trigger ?.....Hmm don't know about that, although I believe that they were both there and both knew it was going to happen. Therefore they are both culpable and guilty as charged.
This are all my own thoughts, IMO, MOO.
Arnie M
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Zactly .... to add to his credibility MS should have pointed out they drove up to SS and back and THEN he got dropped off at the Yukon ... he would have received a hundred bonus points for pointing that out considering the crown neglected to see it or show it (extra truck sightings)
BUT NO ..... he had to leave that out because maybe that is when the shooting happened .... he would have no other reason to cover it up. At least DM's lawyer pointed it out but explained it in such a lengthy muddled way the jury may not grasp the importance.
brightii
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My apologies in advance for turning a little philosophical/reflective here...I just found myself in that mood
This is the first trial I've followed closely from start to finish.
Ever since I first heard of the disappearance through the church grapevine/facebook, I've felt like I was a part of it.
I still cry when I remember the raw emotion of Sharlene's plea for Tim's return ("You don’t need him. BUT I DO! And our daughter needs her daddy back,”
and then there were so many geographical familiarities along the way that drew me into the case even further...
The Justice system part I have found fascinating...it has made me rethink old positions on rights of EVERYone involved...thank you to WS posters and journalists who have given me this education.
At times, the stories of the lives led by that 'entourage' quite frankly depressed me..I kept wanting this to read like a well written novel where the characters come out in the end changed and better for what they've gone through...but, for the most part, I was deprived of that luxury and had to face the fact that a RL court case isn't a place we can go for absolute truth or redemption.
Still...while I sometimes found myself mourning the evilness and selfishness of some people in this world through this case, in the next moment I found myself encouraged and proud of the goodness and compassion of many more people also who filed through the courtroom...
1. Those in the 'entourage' who DID stand up and speak at least most of the truth (thank you)
2 Dr. Tracy Rogers, the forensic anthropologist who testified about the collection of human bone and ash from an incinerator stressed her determination to give the family every tiny piece that she could. "I thought it was important for the family's peace of mind that they have all the remains," she told the jury. Her voice cracked as she spoke and she apologized.After her testimony, Tim Bosma's father Hank followed Rogers out of the courtroom and gave her a hug. (Thank you Dr Rogers and Mr Bosma)
3. Veterinarian Robert Burns who stepped up to testify against his nephew Millard.... and was reported to have smiled and nodded several times to Sharlene Bosma during his testimony. (Thank you for that )
4. The person who spent so many hours putting together the incredibly useful powerpoint presentation on the phones (thank you for your time and diligence)
5. The LE, experts, the neighbours and witnesses who stood up and reported what they saw...who chose to get involved
6. The Bosma army who support the family so faithfully each day
....
I actually could go on and on....and I guess I am just happy now that I can....and thank you all who prove in big and little ways that there is still a LOT of good in this world, lets make sure the next generation can be equally proud
Ashley96: What a beautiful, heartfelt and touching post! I think this is possibly the best post I've ever read here and that's indeed high praise as there are many great posts shared here on a daily basis. Your message really resonates with me and it brought tears to my eyes. It also ended on a high note of hope and your post is a wonderful expression of thoughtful words and sentiments overall. Thank you for taking the time to write this persuasive piece and for sharing it with us all!
All MOO.
brightii
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rsbm
Brilliant insight and I can totally imagine this happening as a code signal! Those words do have the ring of truth to them and that's likely why MS is able to communicate that part of the truth effectively. DM announces to TB, "I'm taking the truck". And IMO the sick plan to murder TB was confirmed and then immediately put into action by both DM and MS. Maybe MS felt twitchy and nervous and did literally jump the gun when DM gave the signal and MS shot TB prematurely inside the truck - or - maybe they then both pulled out guns in that moment and shot TB together. In any case, I'm convinced they both knew TB wasn't getting out of that truck alive.
All MOO.
You just made me tear up.
My apologies in advance for turning a little philosophical/reflective here...I just found myself in that mood
This is the first trial I've followed closely from start to finish.
Ever since I first heard of the disappearance through the church grapevine/facebook, I've felt like I was a part of it.
I still cry when I remember the raw emotion of Sharlene's plea for Tim's return ("You don’t need him. BUT I DO! And our daughter needs her daddy back,”
and then there were so many geographical familiarities along the way that drew me into the case even further...
The Justice system part I have found fascinating...it has made me rethink old positions on rights of EVERYone involved...thank you to WS posters and journalists who have given me this education.
At times, the stories of the lives led by that 'entourage' quite frankly depressed me..I kept wanting this to read like a well written novel where the characters come out in the end changed and better for what they've gone through...but, for the most part, I was deprived of that luxury and had to face the fact that a RL court case isn't a place we can go for absolute truth or redemption.
Still...while I sometimes found myself mourning the evilness and selfishness of some people in this world through this case, in the next moment I found myself encouraged and proud of the goodness and compassion of many more people also who filed through the courtroom...
1. Those in the 'entourage' who DID stand up and speak at least most of the truth (thank you)
2 Dr. Tracy Rogers, the forensic anthropologist who testified about the collection of human bone and ash from an incinerator stressed her determination to give the family every tiny piece that she could. "I thought it was important for the family's peace of mind that they have all the remains," she told the jury. Her voice cracked as she spoke and she apologized.After her testimony, Tim Bosma's father Hank followed Rogers out of the courtroom and gave her a hug. (Thank you Dr Rogers and Mr Bosma)
3. Veterinarian Robert Burns who stepped up to testify against his nephew Millard.... and was reported to have smiled and nodded several times to Sharlene Bosma during his testimony. (Thank you for that )
4. The person who spent so many hours putting together the incredibly useful powerpoint presentation on the phones (thank you for your time and diligence)
5. The LE, experts, the neighbours and witnesses who stood up and reported what they saw...who chose to get involved
6. The Bosma army who support the family so faithfully each day
....
I actually could go on and on....and I guess I am just happy now that I can....and thank you all who prove in big and little ways that there is still a LOT of good in this world, lets make sure the next generation can be equally proud
Typhoo1961
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They might have forgotten one.
Night_is_Mine
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Thank you.
i agree......see my post here http://www.websleuths.com/forums/sh...Weekend-Discussion-14&p=12557702#post12557702
brightii
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I can't help but feel grateful that the police didn't pull over DM or MS after TB was killed on their night of terror as I can imagine neither DM or MS would have hesitated to shoot a police officer in order to ensure their escape.
All MOO.
All MOO.
Tealgrove
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I have long thought that DM was the shooter and even though the evidence has been cloudy on that subject I have held fast to that belief. Tonight as I was reading through the posts BOOM it hit me.
I think that DM shot TB because he's selfish and he wouldn't relinquish the thrill and the pleasure of killing TB to anyone. It was his party. MS was just a minion. His gopher. He wouldn't let him do the most important part of the job. That was the fun part.
I realize that this is sick and twisted but that's what DM is all about.
This was just another thrilling day in his sad and pathetic pretend life.
MOO
I think that DM shot TB because he's selfish and he wouldn't relinquish the thrill and the pleasure of killing TB to anyone. It was his party. MS was just a minion. His gopher. He wouldn't let him do the most important part of the job. That was the fun part.
I realize that this is sick and twisted but that's what DM is all about.
This was just another thrilling day in his sad and pathetic pretend life.
MOO
Didn't MS say that DM was test driving before he stole one to make sure that he got one that he didn't have to put a lot of work into? Why would his plan include doing considerable damage to the thing he wanted in good condition, that doesn't make sense to me.
For someone who planned it out for a year, and aborted every time there was anything wrong, I can't imagine coming up with a whole new extremely risky plan in the time between MS getting in the truck and the end of the driveway. Without ever telling his partner in crime any part of the plan. If DM had decided to change the plan any time before that, he would have left MS behind to walk back to the Yukon alone, which would have been far more reasonable if MS following behind was the plan.
I think if the plan was to kill and incinerate a man, DM had every opportunity to bring the incinerator to the hanger at any time before the crime, and wouldn't have had to go out for gas. If they had both known that the incinerator would be needed, there was not reason not to have it at the hanger in preparation. If the one without access to the incinerator was the only one who knew it would be needed, that is the only thing that would account for it not being in place prior to the crime in preparation.
If 'I'm taking the truck' sounded like the truth, it may be because MS said it as he pulled the gun from his giant hoodie pocket.
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